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    Default Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    So, with this, I have a question for the playground: You are tasked with killing a character known as Satima. Satima is a commoner of infinite level, with Infinite physical stats, an infinite will save, is considered mythic for things that only affect mythic creatures, Epic for things that only affect epic creatures, and to have a divine rank of 21 for things that only affect creatures of a certain divine rank. He has Infinite HP, and infinite DR/-. He does not fail automatically one a 1. His to hit is infinite, as is his damage. He has a Int of 13, a wisdom of 9, and a charisma of 5. He has infinite ranks in Jump, Tumble, and Escape Artist and a speed of 400 feet. He has Evasion for Will Saves.

    What can a level 20 character do to kill this monster? Not defeat, but permanently kill?

    Spoiler: Rounds
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    R1: 3.5 materials only.

    R2: 3.5 with 3.0 and Pathfinder.

    R3: The wizard gains mythic tiers. At what Tier can he kill him?

    R4: The Wizard gains divine ranks, in addition to 10 mythic ranks. At what Rank can the Wizard kill him?
    Spoiler: Solutions so far:
    Show


    Trap the Soul:
    • Use Archmage to get rid of the Focus component, when he touches the "Nothing," his souls is stored in "Nothing", meaning it no longer exsists.
    • Optimized Shades, so it's 100% real, so no escape via force of Will, Trigger Object Method replicated, hand him the shadow gem, bluff into accepting trigger object, use the gem to make a bicycle, soul is used, he's dead.

    Kill the Parents.
    Trap, then Water:
    • Make Forcecage Permanant, or surround him with shaped walls of force. Use a Decanter of Endless water to lock him down. Wait until there's too much water for him to survive in. Wait 1 billion years until he dies or the water forms a black hole.

    Kill everyone he loves until he dies of despair.
    Wish for Sphere of Anniahlation right on top of him.
    Use the Yuan-Ti brew to turn him into a broodguard.
    Lure him into Pandorym's prison.
    irresistible spell necrotic cyst irresistible spell necrotic termination?
    Drive him mad in his dreams
    Last edited by The Vagabond; 2015-11-22 at 05:06 PM.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Level 20 Wizard vs Satima/One Punch Man

    So the character has infinite HD, so Holy Word can't do anything. Has infinite AC, so anything with a to hit roll misses. Has infinite on all three saves, so anything with a save fails, has infinite HP, so anything that does HP damage fails, Has immunity to everything except HP damage and HD effects, because **** you.

    Spoiler alert, the answer is nothing. Until you let them be a God, and then they can just make up and cast the spell "kill stupid idea, no save" and then he dies from anywhere in the universe.

    Also limiting it to Wizard 20 is stupid.

    Also, your statement that he has "godlike" immunities is meaningless. God immunities depend on Divine Rank.

    I guess since things now have infinite HD, even though that it literally incoherent you can wish for a gem of infinite value and the cast trap the soul and win. Except you can't, because a gem of infinite value is incoherent, just like infinite HD. But that is a problem with the poor throught process put into the challenge than anything else.

    EDIT: Nevermind, you just become an Archmage and choose trap the soul as your SLA, and then you have no focus component for trap the soul, so when he touches the nothing that you use as a trigger, his soul is trapped in the gem. Of course, none of this works if he has 6 Divine Ranks, but it does if he has 1-5.

    Also, "evasion" for will saves is meaningless. Because Evasion only applies to Ref/Half effects, and there are no Will/Half effects, there are Will/Partial effects.
    Last edited by Beheld; 2015-11-22 at 02:56 PM.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Permanent forcecage makes him useless forever, then place a permanent shaped wall of force around a decanter of endless water on full blast and have it inside the cage. Within a few billion years it will become a black hole and he will die.

    Or teleport through time to his parents childhoods and commit murder.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Since force cage not a valid target for permanency and walls of force can only be made vertically, no sure how you permanently trap someone who can jump over anything or burrow through anything.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by The Vagabond View Post
    So, with this, I have a question for the playground: You are tasked with killing a character known as Satima. Satima is a commoner of infinite level, with Infinite physical stats, an infinite will save, is considered mythic, epic, and considered to have 21 divine ranks for the purpose of your opposition trying to attack him, has Infinite HP, and infinite DR/-. He does not fail automatically one a 1. His to hit is infinite, as is his damage. He has a Int of 13, a wisdom of 9, and a charisma of 5. He has infinite ranks in Jump, Tumble, and Escape Artist and a speed of 400 feet. He has Evasion for Will Saves.

    What can a level 20 character do to kill this monster? Not defeat, but permanently kill?

    R1: 3.5 materials only.

    R2: 3.5 with 3.0 and Pathfinder.

    R3: The wizard gains mythic tiers. At what Tier can he kill him?

    R4: The Wizard gains divine ranks, in addition to 10 mythic ranks. At what Rank can the Wizard kill him?
    Quoting, as you appear to edit based on feedback.

    Optimize Shades, so it's at least 20% more real than normal (putting it at 100%, so that Evasion for will has no effect). This is straightforward, and is left as an exercise to the reader.

    Use Shades to duplicate Trap the Soul, using the trigger object method to avoid the save (you'll need to research Satima's True Name). Shades doesn't need the material component, so his specific HD count is irrelevant.

    Bluff him into accepting the trigger object (He's got a Sense Motive of -1, so this shouldn't be too hard even with some skill bonuses from Divine Ranks and Mythic tier - Moment of Prescience is good for +CL Insight on the opposed check, Limited Wish up some Glibness for +30 untyped, and maybe limited wish up an Improvisation for a quick +10 Luck as well... plus any cross-class ranks and Charisma bonus that the wizard might have - this is simple skill optimization), and now his soul is stuck in a shadow gem.

    Use the shadow gem containing his soul as an optional material component in a spell. Soul is consumed, he's very very dead.
    Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Take some levels of Spellguard of the Silverymoon, find a way to get Transcend Mortality added to your list and trick him into letting you touch him with the spell.

    Last one is the weakest part of the plan. The spell will kill him, but if he is suspicious of you, it'll be impossible. Though in the manga, he often just takes hits since he can't take damage, so I imagine his touch AC might actually be low unless he got serious.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Beheld View Post
    Since force cage not a valid target for permanency and walls of force can only be made vertically, no sure how you permanently trap someone who can jump over anything or burrow through anything.
    Shaped wall of force should do it. If not then stronghold builders guide, build a wall of force covered cube, put the decanter in the cube, wait for it to destroy the planet.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Aegis013 View Post
    Though in the manga, he often just takes hits since he can't take damage, so I imagine his touch AC might actually be low unless he got serious.
    "Infinite physical stats". For this exercise, his dex is "all of it", which means his touch AC is "Neener neener"
    Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Research an epic level spell to summon Power-Man, the Most Powerful Man in Fiction.

    Or figure out what the hell is giving him his powers, and use it to stop that power source, or take it for yourself.

    Or just kill all that he knows and loves and hope he will eventually fall to despair.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Ice Assassin him! Which brings us to the age-old question: what happens when a monster with infinite HP takes infinite damage?

    Also, you can Wish for a Sphere of Annihilation to appear in his location.

    Or perhaps just hit him with an Irresistable (KoK) Implosion.

    Or Bluff him into drinking the concotion Yuan-Ti use to make broodguards. If he succeeds on the DC 16 fortitude saving throw... he dies.

    Or lure him to Pandorym's prison, covering it with illusions so that it seems like an ordinary wall. Now create an illusion of yourself walking through the wall. If he touches the prison, he is either disintegrated or erased from existence altogether.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Simth View Post
    "Infinite physical stats". For this exercise, his dex is "all of it", which means his touch AC is "Neener neener"
    Right, but Aegis is also correct - he has a tendency to tank hits, which means he might allow himself to be touched.

    Do we know if he can ignore magic, or if that might be a possible achilles heel? What about mental attacks?


    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    Right, but Aegis is also correct - he has a tendency to tank hits, which means he might allow himself to be touched.

    Do we know if he can ignore magic, or if that might be a possible achilles heel? What about mental attacks?
    Well for the purposes of this scenario he is at least immune to mind affecting effects, anything with a will save, ability damage, ability drain, and energy drain. So that covers... every single mental attack in the game.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Why? This is a pointless thought experiment that shouldn't even be called an experiment because the conclusion is foregone.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    Right, but Aegis is also correct - he has a tendency to tank hits, which means he might allow himself to be touched.

    Do we know if he can ignore magic, or if that might be a possible achilles heel? What about mental attacks?
    I know he treats magic as any other physical attack. But I do know he has resisted mind affecting affects.

    To be fair, I probably shouldn't have given him mental evasion- He has been shown in the Webcomic to be affected by psychic attacks, but the effects were miniscule compared to the intended effect. It was intended to literally rip him apart, atom by atom. Instead it just made his muscle twitch. So he's still affected by stuff that has an effect on a succeeded save.

    And he isn't actually immune to mind-affecting effects. Just has a +Infinity will save.

    Quote Originally Posted by stanprollyright View Post
    Why? This is a pointless thought experiment that shouldn't even be called an experiment because the conclusion is foregone.
    Not for me, actually. A lot of neat ideas I never thought of, and a sizable number of solutions to the problem at hand.
    D&D, nothing is impossible.
    Last edited by The Vagabond; 2015-11-22 at 04:19 PM.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    Right, but Aegis is also correct - he has a tendency to tank hits, which means he might allow himself to be touched.

    Do we know if he can ignore magic, or if that might be a possible achilles heel? What about mental attacks?
    Sorry, but I don't think this is a healthy thought progress.

    OP defined a "Satima" of his own, with 3.5 rules. This is not the manga "Saitama". You cannot go from one to another as you wish.

    If you are dealing with OP defined version, it has infinite dex, therefore infinite touch AC. There is no reason for him not to use it.

    For manga Saitama, his exact powers are unknown. Nothing so far harmed him, nor he did not need to punch a guy more than once, and yes I know there is a guy who survived a single punch, but Saitama went light on him for the first impact. Therefore trying to create him in 3.5 rules are meaningless, because he does not have a clear definition even in his own universe (it might be related to that it is a god-damn-parody.)

    For 3.5 created (flawed) version, I am sure if you think hard enough you can come up with something, but I find this thought progress unnecessary to apply.

    P.S: Eventhough I frigging love OPM so far, people really should stop taking Saitama seriously. It is a parody of guys like Goku or Superman.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Hal0Badger View Post
    P.S: Eventhough I frigging love OPM so far, people really should stop taking Saitama seriously. It is a parody of guys like Goku or Superman.
    Yeah, I know, but the idea here is, mostly, to just see if it's physically possible to do so, and the creative solutions for this. I'm just using One Punch Man because he's slightly more limited than Superman or Goku in his powers (No flight, primarily, but also far, FAR fewer secondary abilities to pull out of his rear. Just an infinitely strong punch, being incredibly fast, and being unlimitedly tough) and the fact that he inspired this idea.
    Last edited by The Vagabond; 2015-11-22 at 04:45 PM.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Strategy to beat One Punch Man:

    - Buff up your Diplomacy and Bluff checks, especially Diplomacy.
    - Prepare the spell Hero's Feast.
    - Don't be evil.

    Tactics:

    - Offer Saitama a discount on dinner via Hero's Feast.
    - Offer Saitama a discount on future meals if he doesn't kill you.
    I want you to PEACH me as hard as you can.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    irresistible spell necrotic cyst irresistible spell necrotic termination?

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by The Vagabond View Post
    And he isn't actually immune to mind-affecting effects. Just has a +Infinity will save.
    You gave him immunities as if he was godlike. All gods are immune to mind affecting effects as one of the many things they get for free for DR 1, so if you don't want him immune to those, you should change other things too.

    EDIT: Oh wait, you went back and gave him 21 Divine Ranks... Because you got mad that someone beat him so you retroactively added abilities so that he can't be beaten. Yeah, you are officially the worst. This thread is now double worthless instead of just the single worthless it was before you started retroactively negating successful tactics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anlashok View Post
    irresistible spell necrotic cyst irresistible spell necrotic termination?
    Doesn't that just add +10 to the DC after errata, and therefore completely worthless?
    Last edited by Beheld; 2015-11-22 at 05:01 PM.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Does this bad boy sleep?

    Quote Originally Posted by Heroes of Horror, p. 54
    Alternatively, a curse or punishment might involve a limited number of nightmares rather than an ongoing plague. If the bestowing entity is powerful enough, the events of these nightmares might bleed over into reality—for example, the character might take actual wounds if he is injured in the dream. If you prefer that dreams deal mental damage only, the character takes 1 point of Wisdom or Charisma damage for every 10 points of damage dealt within the nightmare. If he reaches 0 in either, he begins to go mad (see above). Bestowing this sort of nightmare requires an extremely potent force, such as a deity or perhaps a caster with access to wish or miracle.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Beheld View Post
    You gave him immunities as if he was godlike. All gods are immune to mind affecting effects as one of the many things they get for free for DR 1, so if you don't want him immune to those, you should change other things too.

    EDIT: Oh wait, you went back and gave him 21 Divine Ranks... Because you got mad that someone beat him so you retroactively added abilities so that he can't be beaten. Yeah, you are officially the worst. This thread is now useless.
    No- I meant, for effects that say "Non-Mythic creatures have no save" or similar things, he is considered Mythic, or, in this case, to have a Divine Rank of 21. I'll try to edit it to make it make sense. As it is, I do not believe I negated any tactics with my edits.

    And look, it's not worthless: There has come up a full DOZEN of proposals for how to actually get it to work: So, in this case, it is not worthless at all, as I have stated above.
    Last edited by The Vagabond; 2015-11-22 at 05:25 PM.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by The Vagabond View Post
    No- I meant, for effects that say "Non-Mythic creatures have no save" or similar things, he is considered Mythic, or, in this case, to have a Divine Rank of 21. I'll try to edit it to make it make sense.

    And look, it's not worthless: There has come up DOZEN of proposals for how to actually get it to work: So, in this case, it is not worthless at all, as I have stated above.
    Except that if he has 21 Divine Ranks then you are wrong. Divine Rank 1 makes him immune to ability damage, energy drain, ability drain, and mind affecting effects. Divine Rank 6 makes him immune to trap the soul, which negates two of the solutions.

    Divine Rank 21 means that he has 21 Salient Divine Abilities. It means he has abilities to see the future. It doesn't matter how many successful methods there are to solve the problem (especially because several of them are not valid, like the Wall of Force one) if you retroactively change the character to be immune to each successful version.
    Last edited by Beheld; 2015-11-22 at 05:23 PM.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Now that you have removed diefic immunities, take leadership, have a Psion Cohort. Have him manifest EgoWhip to knock him out. Cast Wall of Stone to create a basin, cast Wish to summon a bunch of water, drown him while your Psion manifests Ego Whip every round (have him use infinite PP bull**** #30). Also you can metamagic Mindfrost until you burn out his Int. Or just cast it over and over while he fails to do anything to you. Whatever.
    Last edited by Beheld; 2015-11-22 at 05:40 PM.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Beheld View Post
    Except that if he has 21 Divine Ranks then you are wrong. Divine Rank 1 makes him immune to ability damage, energy drain, ability drain, and mind affecting effects. Divine Rank 6 makes him immune to trap the soul, which negates two of the solutions.

    Divine Rank 21 means that he has 21 Salient Divine Abilities. It means he has abilities to see the future. It doesn't matter how many successful methods there are to solve the problem (especially because several of them are not valid, like the Wall of Force one) if you retroactively change the character to be immune to each successful version.
    my apologies, I didn't mean to give him literal divine ranks, I MEANT to give him stuff so that effects that he can prevent "Creatures without Divine Ranks get no Save" like effects (I'm not too familiar with Salient Abilities, but I remember a few to that effect in there), NOT to give him the listed immunities. I intended ONLY to do this so that, in the listed round 4, the character couldn't just go "I'm a God! ZAP PUNNY MORTAL!" and end it (Primarily because I wanted more interesting solutions).

    My apologies for the misinformation provided.

    Also, Evasion for Will Saves. Also, I have removed the class limit a while ago (Good recommendation).
    Last edited by The Vagabond; 2015-11-22 at 05:43 PM.
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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by The Vagabond View Post
    Also, Evasion for Will Saves. Also, I have removed the class limit a while ago (Good recommendation).
    You said he didn't get Evasion for will saves earlier too. Even if you changed your mind, Mindfrost does the same thing. If he isn't immune to ability damage, you can just kill him by dropping his scores until he can take no actions.
    Last edited by Beheld; 2015-11-22 at 05:46 PM.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Requirements:
    • Diplomacy: Yes
    • Surge of Fortune spell
    • Transcend Mortality spell
    • Spellguard of Silverymoon prestige class


    Method:
    • pre-cast Surge of Fortune
    • cast Transcend Mortality on OPM using Spellguard, discharging Surge of Fortune for an auto-hit
    • use Diplomancy to convince OPM that his soul finally needs to rest for good (i.e. it will refuse all Rez attempts)


    Quote Originally Posted by Beheld View Post
    Doesn't that just add +10 to the DC after errata, and therefore completely worthless?
    Errata isn't 1st party from what I hear.
    Last edited by ben-zayb; 2015-11-22 at 06:16 PM.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Aegis013 View Post
    Take some levels of Spellguard of the Silverymoon, find a way to get Transcend Mortality added to your list and trick him into letting you touch him with the spell.
    Also, spellblade of Transcend Mortality. Redirect it to him.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Limited Wish yourself 10 times to automatically hit on your next ten attacks.

    Cast Ray of Stupidity, Split Rayed, Twinned, Maximized, Empowered, use a staff if you need to. Use a Belt of Battle, Do it again. Hit on all your touch attacks. Leave him unconscious, make basin, fill with water.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    Quote Originally Posted by Beheld View Post
    Limited Wish yourself 10 times to automatically hit on your next ten attacks.

    Cast Ray of Stupidity, Split Rayed, Twinned, Maximized, Empowered, use a staff if you need to. Use a Belt of Battle, Do it again. Hit on all your touch attacks. Leave him unconscious, make basin, fill with water.
    Not water. Transmute Rock to Mud, toss him in, and Transmute Mud to Rock.

    The water will evaporate eventually, after all.
    Last edited by Rubik; 2015-11-22 at 06:44 PM.

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    Default Re: Level 20 character vs Satima/One Punch Man

    People, the solution to this is simple. You can solve it with a single Wish spell; "I wish for Punpun to come and destroy you"

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