Has The Old Republic changed?

[NEO|Phyte]

I'm not sure how it looks for free/preferred, but some of the changes to quick travel have been amazing. With the (legacy-wide, not per-character) cooldown reducers, a sub has 0 cooldown on fleet pass/quick travel. Makes heading back to turn in a quest nice and easy, as well as making any return trips to the planet far easier.

[Cikomyr]

The class stories are designed to be played solo, to the point where you have to specifically set an option to allow other group members into your class story instances. So if you're only particularly interested in the class stories and aren't on a PVP server griefing and other players pushing you to skip things just isn't going to be a factor. The latter one might show up on some of MP required flashpoints and operations, but most of those are pretty optional, and decidedly endgame focussed (and is possible to mitigate if you're grouping with people you know rather than random strangers).

Number of mobs and general time spent getting from point a to point b can be issues though, especially the latter one if you're not spending any money on the game.

The point about griefing is not on PVP servers. Its in PvE server, where a high-level character of an opposing faction will deliverately follow a lower-level player of another faction while flagged for PvP, just for the chance that the lower level player will accidently flag itself during combat.

Also, arent elevators a bitch?

[Cristo Meyers]

The point about griefing is not on PVP servers. Its in PvE server, where a high-level character of an opposing faction will deliverately follow a lower-level player of another faction while flagged for PvP, just for the chance that the lower level player will accidently flag itself during combat.

I have never seen anything like this happen. Ever. Worst I've seen so far is uber-high level characters doing early game quests for some reason.

Also, arent elevators a bitch?

Yeah, they still haven't worked those out yet.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Now on to spoilery stuff.

Spoiler: Knight Story Spoilers

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That's not true. Before you find out your identity in KoToR you spend the whole game hearing how super special awesome Revan was. The only reason he got a second chance from the Jedi was because of a prophecy. As for Luke/Anakin...regardless which figure you interpret the prophecy to be about, you have to agree that the entire plot of all 6 movies revolves around a super special chosen one who will bring balance to the force.

There's a nuance to how these guys are shilled. You're basically saying 'chosen one equals chosen one, subtlety or tone is irrelevant'.

Spoiler: pointless off topic KotOR moaning

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Revan does not get shilled that much in KotOR 1 compared to KotOR 2. In KotOR 1 its made clear that Revan is the least powerful of the three Sith Lords to recently cause trouble in the galaxy (by character dialogue its clearly Exar Kun over Malak over Revan). KotOR 2 turns spends ages talking about how every Jedi apart from Revan and the main characters is an idiot and how Revan was the only actually competent Sith Lord.

Most of KotOR 1's shilling of Revan is by Bastilla, whose being an easily swayed by personality idiot is kind of important to the plot, while in KotOR 2 its by Kreia whose being wiser and more perceptive than anyone around her is kind of the whole plot.

Anakin is a chosen one, but he's not a 'super special chosen one'. He's talented and powerful, but he always has peers and there are always questions and doubts about him.

[Mx.Silver]

The point about griefing is not on PVP servers. Its in PvE server, where a high-level character of an opposing faction will deliverately follow a lower-level player of another faction while flagged for PvP, just for the chance that the lower level player will accidently flag itself during combat.

I have only ever seen this happening during one of the 'Event' weeks, and even then only once, since most of the PVP was confined to the zones of that event specifically designated for PVP.
Granted, this might depend on which server you're on but I haven't heard of this occurring otherwise. Fact of the matter is that a lot of the time, especially in the earlier parts of the game, planets are set-up so that contact between the factions is going to be pretty limited (in fact on several planets it's downright impossible) unless you're specifically seeking it out, and even when the do run into each other, the most I've ever seen are requests to fight a duel (and most people will happily take 'no' for an answer).

Again, maybe this is different on some servers, but in my experience it's not been an issue.

Also, arent elevators a bitch?

Oh yes. Definitely continuing in the tradition of Mass Effect 1

[Cikomyr]

There's a nuance to how these guys are shilled. You're basically saying 'chosen one equals chosen one, subtlety or tone is irrelevant'.

Spoiler: pointless off topic KotOR moaning

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Revan does not get shilled that much in KotOR 1 compared to KotOR 2. In KotOR 1 its made clear that Revan is the least powerful of the three Sith Lords to recently cause trouble in the galaxy (by character dialogue its clearly Exar Kun over Malak over Revan). KotOR 2 turns spends ages talking about how every Jedi apart from Revan and the main characters is an idiot and how Revan was the only actually competent Sith Lord.

Most of KotOR 1's shilling of Revan is by Bastilla, whose being an easily swayed by personality idiot is kind of important to the plot, while in KotOR 2 its by Kreia whose being wiser and more perceptive than anyone around her is kind of the whole plot.

Anakin is a chosen one, but he's not a 'super special chosen one'. He's talented and powerful, but he always has peers and there are always questions and doubts about him.

While i agree with the overall sentiment, i dont see how Malak > Revan anywhere. In KOTOR1. Malak is displayed on every occasion as a stupid petty brute who could only take his master by backstabing him while he was busy with a Jedi Commando.

Also, its pretty hard to determine the comparative power level of Revan vs Kun.

[Anteros]

I would definitely rank it Revan > Kun >>>>>>>>>>> Malack both by actual actions and character dialogue as well.

And of course Revan gets built up during KoToR 1. It's the biggest constant throughout the game. That's why the eventual reveal was so impactful.

[Kesnit]

The point about griefing is not on PVP servers. Its in PvE server, where a high-level character of an opposing faction will deliverately follow a lower-level player of another faction while flagged for PvP, just for the chance that the lower level player will accidently flag itself during combat.

My wife tried out the game (after I resubscribed) and is a completionist. This means she won't leave a planet until she has done EVERYTHING (including Heroic-2's). Between this and the extra XP weekend, she's LVL 49 on a LVL 25-29 planet. She's never seen high-level PCs griefing low-levels.

I have been playing (off and on) since the beta, so have characters everywhere from the starting planets to near-endgame. I've also never seen high-level griefers. In fact, the times I went to one of the open-world PvP areas, it was almost empty.

Flagging yourself for PvP is not something that can be done by accident. The player either has to do it manually (and it isn't simple keystroke that can be hit while trying to hit something else), or has to go to one of the open-world PvP areas. Those open-world areas are in the middle of nowhere, and when you enter, you have a 5-second window (with a large countdown on the screen) warning you that you are about to be flagged for PvP. Backing out anytime in that window stops the countdown, so even if someone did wander into one of those areas, they have time to get out before being flagged.

As Cristo Meyers said, there are sometimes high-level PCs in low-level areas. (I saw a LVL 49 on the starting planet for Imperial Agents and Bounty Hunters last night.) If I had to guess, they are finishing up planet-based Achievements. What they aren't doing is griefing. (Unless, of course, the meaning of griefing has become "killing mobs to keep others from killing mobs.")

TL;DR Whoever wrote that review is flat-out wrong. There aren't tons of griefers, and even if someone did decide to follow a low-bie around, the chance of the low-bie actually flagging for PvP is 0.

[Anteros]

I've flagged for pvp before on accident when I took a shortcut through an enemy base because I was lazy. That's about the only way it can happen. I've honestly never seen griefing in this game a single time and I've been playing since launch. Even on PVP servers it just doesn't happen.

Also, sometimes your class quest will take you back to a lower level area, so that's probably what those higher level players were doing.

[Cristo Meyers]

Also, sometimes your class quest will take you back to a lower level area, so that's probably what those higher level players were doing.

That and like Kesnit said, they're grinding achievements to get the Legacy XP. Though even that has only ever been a problem for my wife and I a single time.

There're plenty of criticisms about this game, 'tons of griefers' just isn't one of them.

[Calemyr]

There's a nuance to how these guys are shilled. You're basically saying 'chosen one equals chosen one, subtlety or tone is irrelevant'.

Spoiler: pointless off topic KotOR moaning

Show

Revan does not get shilled that much in KotOR 1 compared to KotOR 2. In KotOR 1 its made clear that Revan is the least powerful of the three Sith Lords to recently cause trouble in the galaxy (by character dialogue its clearly Exar Kun over Malak over Revan). KotOR 2 turns spends ages talking about how every Jedi apart from Revan and the main characters is an idiot and how Revan was the only actually competent Sith Lord.

Most of KotOR 1's shilling of Revan is by Bastilla, whose being an easily swayed by personality idiot is kind of important to the plot, while in KotOR 2 its by Kreia whose being wiser and more perceptive than anyone around her is kind of the whole plot.

Anakin is a chosen one, but he's not a 'super special chosen one'. He's talented and powerful, but he always has peers and there are always questions and doubts about him.

Spoiler: Revan

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Revan is downplayed (especially in KotOR 1) for two reasons. First, "he" was subtle and precise, and even as a dark lord he put effort into minimizing collateral damage. This was because he wanted to maintain the infrastructure as much as possible for when the Empire attacked while removing the weak points. The second reason is because, well, Malak is in charge now. Revan's assassin-centric approach has gone from terrifying to flat-out friendly in hindsight compared to Malak's tactics, which had all the elegance and effectiveness of a steamroller. Remember the last dark lord? How he would send unstoppable killing machines that brutally executed specific people and left everyone around them intact? Yeah, those where the days... Exar Kun is a similar story - they made a bigger splash in the galaxy, but it's mostly collateral damage. Revan had more of an impact, but it was usually so localized it was hardly felt. The Star Forge is a prime example of the difference. Revan refused to use it more than absolutely necessary, because it's such a powerful dark side relic it will turn you into a villainous idiot given half a chance. A few ships here and there and you're still you. More and you become Malak, with an infinite fleet and the guile of a woodworm.

And, let's be honest, Revan being awesome was retcon Obsidian made. Obsidian took what was a pretty average story (with a really cool twist) and filled in the blanks to make it pretty incredible. If KotOR 2 had been given the opportunity to be completed correctly... Well, I definitely do not blame Obsidian for how that turned out.

I've toyed with coming back to the game. SWTOR was a very interesting concept with several really cool ideas (my personal favorites include companions to add a personal touch to the story and upgradeable components to gear that allowed you to maintain a specific style while remaining competitive), but the grind and solo-unfriendly missions just made the game a chore rather than a pleasure. As with Elder Scrolls Online, STWOR tried to copy World of Warcraft and stuck to Blizzard formula in all the wrong places, tying the worst WoW has to offer around their game's neck like an anchor to make sure it never took off.

When the game first went F2P, I really hated how gutted the game felt, with all the features (which had been already been tedious to the point of torture) throttled back so far the game felt unplayable. Has this improved?

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

On RP servers, sometimes they're RPing. Or recruiting for a guild.

[Cikomyr]

Flagging yourself for PvP is not something that can be done by accident. The player either has to do it manually (and it isn't simple keystroke that can be hit while trying to hit something else), or has to go to one of the open-world PvP areas. Those open-world areas are in the middle of nowhere, and when you enter, you have a 5-second window (with a large countdown on the screen) warning you that you are about to be flagged for PvP. Backing out anytime in that window stops the countdown, so even if someone did wander into one of those areas, they have time to get out before being flagged.

What if you accidentally attack a PvP-flagged player by going "next target" in battle? Or using an AoE? Or accidentally right-clicking on him because you wanted to loot and he put himself in the way?

[Mx.Silver]

I've toyed with coming back to the game. SWTOR was a very interesting concept with several really cool ideas (my personal favorites include companions to add a personal touch to the story and upgradeable components to gear that allowed you to maintain a specific style while remaining competitive), but the grind and solo-unfriendly missions just made the game a chore rather than a pleasure. As with Elder Scrolls Online, STWOR tried to copy World of Warcraft and stuck to Blizzard formula in all the wrong places, tying the worst WoW has to offer around their game's neck like an anchor to make sure it never took off.

When the game first went F2P, I really hated how gutted the game felt, with all the features (which had been already been tedious to the point of torture) throttled back so far the game felt unplayable. Has this improved?

The XP grind has been reduced drastically and the changes to companion characters have made it a lot more solo-friendly (including the Heroic planetary missions, aside from World Bosses). The level of feature gating is largely unchanged, but I've not found it makes all that much of a difference if you're not interested in the PVP/Raiding/Space flight minigames side of things (aside from things like the sprint function and access to vehicles/mounts).

What if you accidentally attack a PvP-flagged player by going "next target" in battle? Or using an AoE? Or accidentally right-clicking on him because you wanted to loot and he put himself in the way?

It can happen, yes. It just almost never actually does, in my experience. Did this review you read mention what server they were on at all?

[Anteros]

What if you accidentally attack a PvP-flagged player by going "next target" in battle? Or using an AoE? Or accidentally right-clicking on him because you wanted to loot and he put himself in the way?

It's extremely unlikely but possible. If this happens you just wait 5 minutes for your pvp flag to go away and move on about your business.

I don't think you understand just how unlikely this scenario is. I can count on one hand the number of times I've ever even seen a player flagged for pvp on a pve server.

[rooster707]

Revan does not get shilled that much in KotOR 1 compared to KotOR 2. In KotOR 1 its made clear that Revan is the least powerful of the three Sith Lords to recently cause trouble in the galaxy (by character dialogue its clearly Exar Kun over Malak over Revan).

Really? I'm not sure if they actually said it in the game, but I think there was a loading screen that said Revan was stronger, which was why he became the master and Malak the apprentice.

[Cikomyr]

Really? I'm not sure if they actually said it in the game, but I think there was a loading screen that said Revan was stronger, which was why he became the master and Malak the apprentice.

Plus, its not true that Revan isnt shilled in Kotor 1. Just ask Cancerous about him.

[Mutazoia]

My wife tried out the game (after I resubscribed) and is a completionist. This means she won't leave a planet until she has done EVERYTHING (including Heroic-2's). Between this and the extra XP weekend, she's LVL 49 on a LVL 25-29 planet. She's never seen high-level PCs griefing low-levels.

I have been playing (off and on) since the beta, so have characters everywhere from the starting planets to near-endgame. I've also never seen high-level griefers. In fact, the times I went to one of the open-world PvP areas, it was almost empty.

Flagging yourself for PvP is not something that can be done by accident. The player either has to do it manually (and it isn't simple keystroke that can be hit while trying to hit something else), or has to go to one of the open-world PvP areas. Those open-world areas are in the middle of nowhere, and when you enter, you have a 5-second window (with a large countdown on the screen) warning you that you are about to be flagged for PvP. Backing out anytime in that window stops the countdown, so even if someone did wander into one of those areas, they have time to get out before being flagged.

As Cristo Meyers said, there are sometimes high-level PCs in low-level areas. (I saw a LVL 49 on the starting planet for Imperial Agents and Bounty Hunters last night.) If I had to guess, they are finishing up planet-based Achievements. What they aren't doing is griefing. (Unless, of course, the meaning of griefing has become "killing mobs to keep others from killing mobs.")

TL;DR Whoever wrote that review is flat-out wrong. There aren't tons of griefers, and even if someone did decide to follow a low-bie around, the chance of the low-bie actually flagging for PvP is 0.

If anything, I see a lot of high level players on lower level planets offering help to lower level players. There are some quests, like the Sith Sorcerer quest line, that send you back to the starting planet several times over the course of the story, but it's mostly an in-and-out thing that takes more time getting from the landing pad to the quest location than the actual quest (usually just some dialogue) takes.

The only time I encountered what could be called a "griefer" was a PVP flagged player from the opposite faction, on the same quest I was, killing the quest mobs that I had spawned, forcing me to wait a few seconds to re-spawn them. And since he was PVP flagged, for some reason his companion started attacking mine, but we never traded shots ourselves. (I think my comp used an AOE attack and his comp was in the affected area or something.)

[Hunter Noventa]

If anything, I see a lot of high level players on lower level planets offering help to lower level players. There are some quests, like the Sith Sorcerer quest line, that send you back to the starting planet several times over the course of the story, but it's mostly an in-and-out thing that takes more time getting from the landing pad to the quest location than the actual quest (usually just some dialogue) takes.

The only time I encountered what could be called a "griefer" was a PVP flagged player from the opposite faction, on the same quest I was, killing the quest mobs that I had spawned, forcing me to wait a few seconds to re-spawn them. And since he was PVP flagged, for some reason his companion started attacking mine, but we never traded shots ourselves. (I think my comp used an AOE attack and his comp was in the affected area or something.)

The only random PvP I got into was hunting Datacrons on Tatooine, I'd cut through the PvP zone on my way to one, and then when I went to wait for the damned jawa Balloon, there was a Bounty Hunter there who decided to attack me because I was still flagged. I won, and then we rode the balloon together, still flagged for most of the ride. That was a little tense in an amusing way.

[Mutazoia]

The only random PvP I got into was hunting Datacrons on Tatooine, I'd cut through the PvP zone on my way to one, and then when I went to wait for the damned jawa Balloon, there was a Bounty Hunter there who decided to attack me because I was still flagged. I won, and then we rode the balloon together, still flagged for most of the ride. That was a little tense in an amusing way.

LoL. That reminds me of a time in WoW when I flew my Druid onto an Ally Zep and landed behind a Ally toon. I wasn't flagged PvP, but he turned around, saw me and backed up...right off the zep and fell to his death.

There have been a few times I've kinda wished some one would try to start a PvP fight on the Jawa Balloon, just so I could push them off and make them wait for the next one.

[Anteros]

LoL. That reminds me of a time in WoW when I flew my Druid onto an Ally Zep and landed behind a Ally toon. I wasn't flagged PvP, but he turned around, saw me and backed up...right off the zep and fell to his death.

There have been a few times I've kinda wished some one would try to start a PvP fight on the Jawa Balloon, just so I could push them off and make them wait for the next one.

It reminds me of when priests could mind control people in WoW and made them jump off cliffs. Interactions like that were completely unfair, but gosh they made the world entertaining before everything got homogenized.

[huttj509]

It reminds me of when priests could mind control people in WoW and made them jump off cliffs. Interactions like that were completely unfair, but gosh they made the world entertaining before everything got homogenized.

"Oh, hey, let's duel while we wait for the Zepplin."

MC

Jump off right before zep leaves. "Have fun waiting for the next one!"

[Calemyr]

Out of curiosity, can anyone tell me how the game's romance subsystem handles the expansions? Does romancing an early (original game) character lock you out of the expansion options? If not, how does it handle that?

Also, I'm rather confused and frustrated with the legacy system? What things effect the entire legacy? I got Legacy of Crafting, but only one character seems to benefit from it, and it was rather absurdly expensive (50k).

[Cristo Meyers]

Also, I'm rather confused and frustrated with the legacy system? What things effect the entire legacy? I got Legacy of Crafting, but only one character seems to benefit from it, and it was rather absurdly expensive (50k).

I think it does specify which Legacy abilities affect the whole Legacy v just that character in the pop-up menu. I know for a fact that the Jedi Knight & Consular's Force Might/Force Valor unlock carries over. But that's not one you buy.

50K is cheap, most of them are upwards of 100K to 1.5 million.

[Calemyr]

I think it does specify which Legacy abilities affect the whole Legacy v just that character in the pop-up menu. I know for a fact that the Jedi Knight & Consular's Force Might/Force Valor unlock carries over. But that's not one you buy.

50K is cheap, most of them are upwards of 100K to 1.5 million.

Cheap for a legacy item, possibly, but that was still over half my total funds across my account (as a crafting addict, I always did hemorage coin training people up). I guess I was just lucky I unlocked it on my armormech, where the improved critical success rate is invaluable.

[Hunter Noventa]

Out of curiosity, can anyone tell me how the game's romance subsystem handles the expansions? Does romancing an early (original game) character lock you out of the expansion options? If not, how does it handle that?

Spoiler: KotFE

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Due to the events of the latest expansion, you're separated from most of your old companions. In fact, I don't think anyone who was a romancable character has come back yet, though Kaliyo is due back in the next chapter.

Spoiler: Romance

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As for romancing others, I couldn't say, I never had anyone that far with most charcters because the old affection system that gated companion progress was to grindy.

[Mx.Silver]

Also, I'm rather confused and frustrated with the legacy system? What things effect the entire legacy? I got Legacy of Crafting, but only one character seems to benefit from it, and it was rather absurdly expensive (50k).

The ones under Character Perks (such as Legacy of Crafting) only effect that character. The legacy-wide ones are the options under Global Unlocks.

[Calemyr]

The ones under Character Perks (such as Legacy of Crafting) only effect that character. The legacy-wide ones are the options under Global Unlocks.

Okay. Of course it seems obvious if you put it that way...

[Anteros]

Due to the events of the latest expansion, you're separated from most of your old companions. In fact, I don't think anyone who was a romancable character has come back yet, though Kaliyo is due back in the next chapter.

As for romancing others, I couldn't say, I never had anyone that far with most charcters because the old affection system that gated companion progress was to grindy.

Spoilers man. Some people may not want to know stuff like that.

[Chen]

So redownloaded the game and looked at my level 50 juggernaut and was completely overwhelmed. Started a new inquisitor but I still have some questions. What are good legacy unlocks? I have like 3000 cartel coins (had an authenticator on for like 3 years lol) and around 2 million credits in escrow on my level 50. Leveling seems insanely fast so twinking stuff over doesnt really seem necessary. Also should I setup a stronghold? is space combat only pvp now or are the original space missions still there too? So much to figure out again.