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  1. - Top - End - #691
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemmy View Post
    I gotta be honest here: The first part is cringe-worthy bad...><'
    Eeeh, it still has it's moments...all of which are near the end when it actually gets to the point. The first 2-or-so episodes don't do it many favors though.
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  2. - Top - End - #692
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    I always got the impression that being cringey was the point of JoJo's first season.
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    Imagine if the combat system was as well thought out and explained as the skill system. You could cut it down to a page and a half, monsters would be about three sentences long. Best of all you don't have to remember any tables for conditions or detail the special abilities because you've got rulings instead of rules.
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    I'm going to be honest, "the Welsh became a Great Power and conquered Germany" is almost exactly the opposite of the explanation I was expecting

  3. - Top - End - #693
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    JoJo is at its best when it's balls to the wall nuts. The first two episodes are....not that.

    They DO give you a good feel for how ****ing evil Dio is, and possibly the most memetic line of our generation, but it's a weird slice of life segment where our protagonist is shown up both in and out of universe by another character and takes it like a bitch.

  4. - Top - End - #694
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    JoJo is at its best when it's balls to the wall nuts. The first two episodes are....not that.

    They DO give you a good feel for how ****ing evil Dio is, and possibly the most memetic line of our generation, but it's a weird slice of life segment where our protagonist is shown up both in and out of universe by another character and takes it like a bitch.
    As someone still trying to get into JoJo I still can't quite put my finger on its appeal. Like, it is very cheesy and instead of trying to hide it they parade it gloriously.
    I'm not sure I'd call "it was I, Dio " the most iconic line of our generation but Takehito certainly delivers it with a lot of gusto.
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  5. - Top - End - #695
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    I'm certainly enjoying Part 2 much, much more.

    Save for very few scenes, Part 1 got me either bored or cringing all the whole time.
    Last edited by Lemmy; 2017-02-27 at 05:00 PM.
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  6. - Top - End - #696
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemmy View Post
    I'm certainly enjoying Part 2 much, much more.

    Save for very few scenes, Part 1 got me either bored or cringing all the whole time.
    Part 1 was a blatant Hokuto no Ken ripoff, as admitted by Togashi himself. With part 2 he really starts to hit his stride. Part 3 is hit or miss, but very innovative, part 4 is amazing, part 5 has probably the least likable protagonist in the whole series, and I dunno about part 6-8.

    JoJo's even numbered seasons tend to be the better ones (not that part 3 is BAD, but it's hella clunky in parts).

    Part 2 is tied for my favorite with part 4of all the arcs I've seen in detail. Joseph's branch of the Joestar line is just so god damn great.

    The ending climax scene to part 2 is something I show to people who are really on the fence wondering whether they should get into JoJo or not.

    Did you get hyped here? If yes, watch more.

    If not, get a heart transplant because that sucker clearly isn't pumping your blood right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kato View Post
    As someone still trying to get into JoJo I still can't quite put my finger on its appeal. Like, it is very cheesy and instead of trying to hide it they parade it gloriously.
    I'm not sure I'd call "it was I, Dio " the most iconic line of our generation but Takehito certainly delivers it with a lot of gusto.
    The appeal is sheer creativity in powers, chaarcters, and action. With the exception of part 1, every conflict is an intense battle of wills. "I have these defined and very limited powers, they have others, how do I overcome theirs while using mine?"

    Stands particularly are all about how smart their user is. Okuyasu's Stand, The Hand is brutally powerful and potentially devastating in the right hands. Okuyasu is an idiot. He never does much.

    On the other hand one other dude's stand is basically just a magic ****ing fishing pole and he wrecks shop.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2017-02-27 at 10:27 PM.

  7. - Top - End - #697
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    For my own opinion on Jojo's (just the anime, anyway) part 1 was the best. Part 2 was great. Its pacing wasn't as tight, but it has lots of great characters to hold it together. Part 3 had some horrible episodes in a good way. Basically give up on pacing. Part 4 was an absolute chore. No pacing. The plot doesn't go anywhere. Every character is an awful person, or treated in an awful way.

    It's no secret that the internet has no taste though.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    If it makes you feel better Zalabim, I kind of feel the same way.

    I just gave up on part 4 because nothing drew me in. I liked part 3, but it was too long. Part 2 is probably my favorite.
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  9. - Top - End - #699
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Yes, of course, it's everyone else who has bad taste, not you.

    Even Araki doesn't like part 1 (and his favorite is part 4, coincidentally).

    Preferences are preferences and all but part 1 especially has some gaping flaws, and you're really downplaying them.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2017-02-28 at 04:19 AM.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Yes, of course, it's everyone else who has bad taste, not you.
    You almost understand how this works. Everyone has bad taste.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Even Araki doesn't like part 1 (and his favorite is part 4, coincidentally).
    Everyone has bad taste.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Preferences are preferences and all but part 1 especially has some gaping flaws, and you're really downplaying them.
    I'm really not interested in arguing which arc is worse. I just wanted to offer some additional perspective.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Part 1 is definitely the worst. Objectively it's not horrible, I still love it, although I spent a lot of part 1 waiting for Dio to show up again. There's nothing wrong with liking part 1 the best, it does have a couple of things over the latter parts (a simple story with no filler for one thing).

    I personally love Part 4, but it is a bunch of mainly unrelated stories with a 'find the killer' plot occasionally raising it's head. To me part 3 has been the worst so far because of all the filler, despite part 4 having a lot of stand alone episodes I don't have the same problem there as it's part of the point (we aren't watching people try to reach Egypt to kill a vampire who's the main character's great great great uncle).
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  12. - Top - End - #702
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Part 3 is filler done right. Stands are a perfect monster-of-the-week, the characters are varied enough that their interactions are entertaining even when the plot is not moving forward, and the final fight against Dio is awesome.
    Quote Originally Posted by Telok View Post
    Imagine if the combat system was as well thought out and explained as the skill system. You could cut it down to a page and a half, monsters would be about three sentences long. Best of all you don't have to remember any tables for conditions or detail the special abilities because you've got rulings instead of rules.
    Quote Originally Posted by Artanis View Post
    I'm going to be honest, "the Welsh became a Great Power and conquered Germany" is almost exactly the opposite of the explanation I was expecting

  13. - Top - End - #703
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Well... I finished Part 2 today. It's far better than part 1... Although the incessantly narrating of EVERY. SINGLE. LITTLE. THING. still annoys me.
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  14. - Top - End - #704
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    So... I used today to watch Part 3 of Jojo...

    It's... Uh... Not bad, but kinda tiresome.

    It feels like it'd be pretty good if it had no more than half as many episodes as it actually has. I found myself skipping scenes in the a number of episodes because I just didn't care ("Oh, look, another stand user with zero personality that doesn't add anything relevant to the story... How fun..." *skips a minute or two*).
    Flickerdart called it "filler done right", which isn't too far off the mark, but unfortunately, "done right" doesn't make it any less filler. Part 3 definitely overstayed its welcome, but at least it's still better than Part 1 (although that's a very low bar to reach, IMHO).

    So far, part 2 is the only one I actually enjoyed, although I could do without the endless narration and I didn't really like the final battle against Kars. Still, Joseph was a really fun protagonist, there're plenty of creative action scenes and the story doesn't last more than it has to.
    Last edited by Lemmy; 2017-02-28 at 07:53 PM.
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  15. - Top - End - #705
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Did you watch ALL of part 3 today? While I'll agree it's really stretched out (more the fault of the manga than anything...IMO the anime actually feels better paced, somehow), there are quite a few really good bits that justify its existence. Maybe it watches better week to week though. I couldn't really imagine watching all 48 episodes in one sitting.

    If nothing else, I think everything in season 2 of part 3 is great. The first part's "road trip" aesthetic is really hit or miss (and is actually borne of the author's simultaneous love of travel and paranoia that every friendly person he meets has some sinister motive, apparently.) but the second half is pretty much gold IMO. Everything starts tying together better (the Egyptian god named Stands are more organized together than the Tarot Stands) and there's some excellent moments like Iggy vs Pet Shop and both D'Arby battles (besides my absolute burning hatred of Joseph's idiot ball in he first fight...) that are great. Not to mention the whole final battle.

    Part 3 is definitely only solidly near the middle of my favorite parts though. Above part 1 (and everything I've seen of part 5) but below parts 2 and 4. The best moments of part 3 are when the Crusaders are being buddy buddy (like Kakyoin and Polnareff's goofy ass handshake) which, coincidentally, you get a lot more of in part 4 with the whole Duwang Gang having so many great moments together.

    Part 3 is also mostly notable for being an unstoppable MEME MACHINE, even moreso than the other parts.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2017-02-28 at 09:27 PM.

  16. - Top - End - #706
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Did you watch ALL of part 3 today? While I'll agree it's really stretched out (more the fault of the manga than anything...IMO the anime actually feels better paced, somehow), there are quite a few really good bits that justify its existence. Maybe it watches better week to week though. I couldn't really imagine watching all 48 episodes in one sitting.
    I watched one half yesterday and one half today (It's a holiday here, but not one I celebrate or even like, so I just stayed home playing games and watching anime, because that's what mature 29-years old engineers do in their free time! ).

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    If nothing else, I think everything in season 2 of part 3 is great. The first part's "road trip" aesthetic is really hit or miss (and is actually borne of the author's simultaneous love of travel and paranoia that every friendly person he meets has some sinister motive, apparently.) but the second half is pretty much gold IMO. Everything starts tying together better (the Egyptian god named Stands are more organized together than the Tarot Stands) and there's some excellent moments like Iggy vs Pet Shop and both D'Arby battles (besides my absolute burning hatred of Joseph's idiot ball in he first fight...) that are great. Not to mention the whole final battle.

    Part 3 is definitely only solidly near the middle of my favorite parts though. Above part 1 (and everything I've seen of part 5) but below parts 2 and 4. The best moments of part 3 are when the Crusaders are being buddy buddy (like Kakyoin and Polnareff's goofy ass handshake) which, coincidentally, you get a lot more of in part 4 with the whole Duwang Gang having so many great moments together.

    Part 3 is also mostly notable for being an unstoppable MEME MACHINE, even more so than the other parts.
    The second half is a bit better... But still meh. I like the final battle, but I didn't really enjoy the "I win by suddenly having this super-power I never had before, which, coincidentally, is the same super-power the villain has". I suppose Time Stop is too overpowered for creators to make defeating it achievable and/or believable without the hero using time stop himself, some random bull**** happening or the good ol' deus ex machina power ups (See: The Flash TV series. Flash doesn't have stop time, but gets close enough to it that the only any villain poses a threat to him is either by being a speedster themselves or by having Flash hold the idiot ball).

    There are too many episodes where nothing of consequence happens, sometimes it feels someone took the worst parts of DBZ and made a whole show about it, but without the benefit of nostalgia. The characters don't even learn anything useful from their battles... At least during the first half they got new allies. During the Egypt arc, they defeat the guy and forget it ever existed. If they had skipped from episode 5 to the final battle against Dio, the fight would have gone exactly the same way.

    I guess the series is just not for me.

    Quite a few people told me Part 4 is the best, but at this point, I'm not not sure if I should bother watching it. I mean... How much better can it be than Part 2?
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    It's vaguely hinted that the time stopping power is Star Platinum's to begin with. Dio seems to be able to use Joestar Stands as what his potential "real" Stand power is (he uses Hermit Purple at some point in the series).

    Basically Dio found time stop by accident, and Jotaro seeing it/feeling it in action awakened his own version of the power. Even without the other explanation, the official-er explanation is that Star Platinum and The World are the same Stand in almost every regard besides appearance. They have the same speed, power, durability, and range (with The World edging it out slightly in all of those regards...maybe).

    As for the comparisons to DBZ...yeah, it hasn't aged well. Just like DBZ hasn't. Remember, Stardust Crusaders takes place in the year Araki started writing it (1988), which is a bit before DBZ aired (so it was being written around the same time as the Frieza arc was ongoing in the manga, IIRC). Edit: Correction, it was written before the Dragonball Z stuff ever existed. The Piccolo Jr. arc of Dragonball was the current one at the time. It ENDED around the same time the Cell saga did. TBH it's miraculous it didn't take more than 48 episodes.

    As for how part 4 is better than part 2...let's just say Josuke is a chip off the old block (minor spoiler, he's Joseph's son). His Stand power, unlike Jotaro's, doesn't rely on brute force (indeed, all JoJos after Jotaro tend to have really weird and progressively weaker, physically speaking, than Star Platinum). So you get to see stand powers combined with a Joseph-like ballsy planning, prediction, and sheer bull**** luck to win fights.

    Sstardust Crusaders is part 1 of a new type of series in the same way Phantom Blood was. Diamond is Unbreakable is to Stardust as Battle Tendency is to Phantom Blood: Better paced, better realized ideas (Stands are more interesting and weird, battles take more planning and strategy), better characters (even Jotaro grows a personality), and a more focused plot (since it all takes place in Morioh it doesn't have to juggle a new setting and plot every week).

    Now, it is very much almost a supernatural slice of life anime, which may not be everyone's cup of tea, but it's great at what it does.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2017-02-28 at 10:36 PM.

  18. - Top - End - #708
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    It's vaguely hinted that the time stopping power is Star Platinum's to begin with. Dio seems to be able to use Joestar Stands as what his potential "real" Stand power is (he uses Hermit Purple at some point in the series).

    Basically Dio found time stop by accident, and Jotaro seeing it/feeling it in action awakened his own version of the power. Even without the other explanation, the official-er explanation is that Star Platinum and The World are the same Stand in almost every regard besides appearance. They have the same speed, power, durability, and range (with The World edging it out slightly in all of those regards...maybe).
    I got that, but still doesn't change the fact that Jojo never displayed that power at any point in the series other than stopping bullets in the first episode, but since pretty much everyone apparently moves at super-speed all the time (and narrates even faster!), it doesn't really work as foreshadowing... Specially when his "visible" power isn't just super-speed, but super-powerful physical attributes in general. It's like giving Goku the power to stop time and say that it was foreshadowed because he moves really fast during the whole series.

    But I don't want to diss on the series too much... It isn't bad, it's just... Not good. I might have liked it if it were 12 episodes long.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    As for how part 4 is better than part 2...let's just say Josuke is a chip off the old block (minor spoiler, he's Joseph's son). His Stand power, unlike Jotaro's, doesn't rely on brute force (indeed, all JoJos after Jotaro tend to have really weird and progressively weaker, physically speaking, than Star Platinum). So you get to see stand powers combined with a Joseph-like ballsy planning, prediction, and sheer bull**** luck to win fights.

    Sstardust Crusaders is part 1 of a new type of series in the same way Phantom Blood was. Diamond is Unbreakable is to Stardust as Battle Tendency is to Phantom Blood: Better paced, better realized ideas (Stands are more interesting and weird, battles take more planning and strategy), better characters (even Jotaro grows a personality), and a more focused plot (since it all takes place in Morioh it doesn't have to juggle a new setting and plot every week).

    Now, it is very much almost a supernatural slice of life anime, which may not be everyone's cup of tea, but it's great at what it does.
    I might check it out... But probably not this week. Starting tomorrow, my days will be really freaking busy until Friday (at least).
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  19. - Top - End - #709
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemmy View Post
    But I don't want to diss on the series too much... It isn't bad, it's just... Not good. I might have liked it if it were 12 episodes long.
    Like I edited in, this is 100% an artifact of the time it was written. It is literally 2/3 as long as the entirety of DBZ, and started before that did. Cramming that into 48 episodes is a pretty good feat in itself.

  20. - Top - End - #710
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Like I edited in, this is 100% an artifact of the time it was written. It is literally 2/3 as long as the entirety of DBZ, and started before that did. Cramming that into 48 episodes is a pretty good feat in itself.
    True... But while DBZ had long fights, it didn't have nearly as many pointless battles (other than the filler episodes and some moments of the Majin Boo saga, which are the weakest parts of the show, IMO), so it didn't feel like it was wasting my time. We don't have 12 episodes of Goku fighting 12 different members of the Ginyu Forces. I actually think the Freeza saga still holds pretty well, with the whole 3-way cat-and-mouse game going on (Freeza - Vegeta - Krillin and Gohan) where our heroes had to fight guerrilla style. The Cell saga is similar, but not as well-done, IMO.

    IMHO, the real problems with DBZ are:

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    1- Filler episodes.(Goddamn False Namek still hurts my soul).
    2- Everybody has exactly the same powers. All that changes is the intensity ("my laser beam is stronger than your laser beam!" - but the fight scenes are still really cool to watch because of how well-animated they are).
    3- Most of the time, technique is irrelevant. Power level is all that matters (although they kind merge power level with training and technique, so sometimes it's not too bad).


    The problem with Jojo (Part 3) is:

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    1- While technically not filler, most episodes are just as irrelevant. In Part 2, we had clear enemies and every time we saw or fought one of them, there was some investment. In part 3, I simply can't be bothered to remember any "villain of the week" name because they don't matter. The heroes don't learn or gain anything from fighting them, and the defeated enemies are completely forgotten as soon as the episode ends, never to be mentioned again. Even the toughest opponents, like that guy who had a water Stand, are completely irrelevant.
    2- There's no real sense of danger or urgency. I mean... There's Jojo's mom being in coma, but we barely see her and her condition is rarely mentioned, to the point where I had already forgotten about it by the time they reach Egypt.
    3- The villain doesn't do anything. Everyone says how amazing and badass he is, but we never see he actually doing anything until the last 6 episodes or so. Say what you will about DBZ, but every villain had their scenes showing just how terrifyingly powerful and cruel they could be. Even Nappa had a full episode of him (easily) destroying innocent cities just because he could. Freeza and his men were a constant threat not only to Krillin and Gohan, but to everyone else on Namek. And Cell, even when he was weaker than the Z-warriors managed to escape and kill thousands of innocents, and there was nothing the heroes could do about it. Hell! As bored as I was with Jojo Part 1, at least the villain actually did things and felt like a constant threat.
    4- Save for a couple fights, there's no sense of risk. Because we see Jotaro defeat a dozen (supposedly skilled) enemies without much effort, there isn't really any tension when he fights the 13th (supposedly skilled) enemy. It's as if Goku spent 18 episodes fighting a dozen different Nappas before finally being able to fight Vegeta.
    5- The narrating. Oh, gods, the narrating! Everything is narrated! EVERY. SINGLE. THING. I know this is a common issue in many animes, but by the gods, I have never seen a show where it's nearly as bad as in Jojo (this is an issue in all seasons I watched, sadly).


    tl:dr: Aside from the common flaws of the time period it was created (endless narrating, needlessly long storyline), the main problem with Jojo Part 3 is that it doesn't give me a reason to care... But still expects me to suffer through the endless filler. Sure, the Freeza saga was long, but I was always invested because the victories and defeats of our heroes had consequences (and were usually hard-earned).
    Last edited by Lemmy; 2017-03-01 at 12:44 AM.
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    I can agree with all of those flaws, though I still thought even the irrelevant battles were largely fun. Things like The Sun are largely forgettable (except for Joseph's great Engrish) but ones like The Empress, the Emperor and The Hanged Man (the former seemingly killing off a main character no less!) and N'Doul for examples make great moments in themselves, even if they're only tangentially related to the plot.

    Really it's all in the first adversary's words: "This world is full of Stands that surpass even your wildest imaginings! Those loyal to DIO will follow you at every turn!"

    So it at least delivers on exactly what it says it will.

    Really, it's your fourth complaint I can happily agree basically ruined a lot of conflicts. Jotaro ORAORAORAORAORAs his way through any problem he comes across, for the most part. All of the most memorable battles involve...anybody but Jotaro.

    The show would be better without its main character. Which is kinda sad.

    Happily, most of part 4's Stand users are at least tangentially connected in the second part, or serve to add to the overall mystique of Morioh in the first part. There are memorable, cool moments in EVERY conflict.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2017-03-01 at 12:03 AM.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    The show would be better without its main character. Which is kinda sad.
    When you think about it, a lot of shonen anime would:
    -One Piece would be better without Luffy being this creepy predatory not-hero who is also as dumb as a sack of bricks
    -Bleach would be far better if Ichigo didn't exist and everyone had to win without his pure force attacks
    -Naruto in particular would be better, because Naruto is the most blatant of them all when it comes to his lack of ninja-ness in a world of not-ninjas. everyone else at least tries to be politically savvy and be full of lies and subterfuge.
    -Pokemon would be better without Ash Ketchum constantly keeping everything around him in stasis while he fails at winning a tournament for the umpteenth time.
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    I disagree with most of those. Luffy especially keeps One Piece interesting. His enthusiasm drives the plot, and it's hard to see any of the other characters captaining the ship and it remaining a lighthearted adventure series. Luffy's stupidity also kicks off most of the plots. The series would be a lot shorter and a lot less fun without him.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    I'd say about one in three jojo part 3 fights are interesting (including the fight against Duo, at least he was surprised when Jotaro pulled a power out of his arse). It's just the first half had a lot of the uninteresting ones and they drag on a bit. If the series had been half as long o I'd likely have enjoyed it as much as part 4.

    I'm going to agree that Jotaro isn't really working in this part, he works a lot better in Part 4 where he doesn't have to carry the story and can just stand around looking badass (although I'll agree he does have more personality, despite still barely taking). I'm looking forward to him in part 6, how he interacts with Jellyfish Cujoh should be interesting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
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    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    . The series would be a lot shorter and a lot less fun without him.
    if by "less fun" you mean "less stupid annoying bull", then yes your right and it would be so much better that way.
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    When you think about it, a lot of shonen anime would:
    -One Piece would be better without Luffy being this creepy predatory not-hero who is also as dumb as a sack of bricks
    -Bleach would be far better if Ichigo didn't exist and everyone had to win without his pure force attacks
    -Naruto in particular would be better, because Naruto is the most blatant of them all when it comes to his lack of ninja-ness in a world of not-ninjas. everyone else at least tries to be politically savvy and be full of lies and subterfuge.
    -Pokemon would be better without Ash Ketchum constantly keeping everything around him in stasis while he fails at winning a tournament for the umpteenth time.

    Dumb as a brick I give you. But Luffy as creepy? Predatory? I don't follow.
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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    When you think about it, a lot of shonen anime would:
    -One Piece would be better without Luffy being this creepy predatory not-hero who is also as dumb as a sack of bricks
    -Bleach would be far better if Ichigo didn't exist and everyone had to win without his pure force attacks
    -Naruto in particular would be better, because Naruto is the most blatant of them all when it comes to his lack of ninja-ness in a world of not-ninjas. everyone else at least tries to be politically savvy and be full of lies and subterfuge.
    -Pokemon would be better without Ash Ketchum constantly keeping everything around him in stasis while he fails at winning a tournament for the umpteenth time.
    I have to disagree about Bleach. The only good arc in my opinion was the first Soul Society Rescue Arc, and Ichigo was great during it.

    I'll disagree about Naruto too, because without him it would just be the Sasuke show, and I don't think anyone wants that.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    So... sorry for derailing the thread by being part of the people talking about JoJo. But can we cut this short? I can totally see where the most recent posts are going and a) we've done this again and again and again, and b) this is not the thread for that (nor for "what makes JoJo good/bad" but as I said, that's in part my fault)


    Anyway, new battle.
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    I can't say I care much either way. I did grow up reading a lot of Scrooge's stories (in German, which is why to me he will alway be Dagobert, so screw you English speakers ) but I can't claim I still feel attached enough to him to say anything. Not towards Shovel Knight.I guess it does make a lot of sense for a physic ignoring cartoon duck to beat a realistic-ish knight, though.


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    VENOM! It is time for one of Spidey's most iconic enemies (former. Kind of. Depends on the story) to make his appearance. My first thought for an enemy was spawn but mostly because for some reason I'm blanking on evil parasite things... though, maybe a symbiote could also be a proper enemy? (Get it, "symbiote"? Okay, I'll leave.)
    "What's done is done."

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    Spoiler: McDuck v Knight
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    When they started sourcing The Life and Times of Scrooge McDuck, I knew he'd win. Shovel Knight is most certainly impressive, but Scrooge has fought and beat worse. I had forgotten about the minefield thing. And out-roaring a lion. I need re-read that story sometime soon, if I can find it. I am somewhat amused they found a feat bigger than wrecking a steamboat with his bare hands to calculate his strength from.

    This episode has proven one thing to me, though: I should play Shovel Knight. That game looks like something I'd enjoy.

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    Huh. Venom? You could make some really lopsided fights with him against a weaker foe with a sonic weapon, but I'll assume they're going to find someone more fitting. No clue on who to call in for "vs. slimy alien symbiote monster", though. Venom is a little unique in that, along with the other symbiotes.

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    Default Re: Death Battle II - I don't THINK Gara got robbed I KNOW he did.

    So...is it just me, or is this the first time that the person who attacked before the fight officially started is the one who won?
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