The True Murder Hobo; A one-trick Nova Build

[PeteNutButter]

The basis of this build is an Assassin that DOESN'T sneak attack.

Race: Half-Orc
Stats: 16, 14, 14, 8, 8, 13

The first 8 levels need to be fighter 5 and rogue (assassin) 3. The order in which you take them is largely preference. If you take fighter first you get con saves instead of dex which is better and a few hps, but rogue first nets you an extra skill. Your first ASI whenever you get it will be GWM, and pump str from there. Take the great weapon fighting style with fighter 1. Let's say for simplicity you go fighter 1, rogue 3, fighter 4+

Lvl 1: You weild a greatsword or axe for flavor, though it is worse at this point. Wear medium armor, but don't invest in any that give stealth disadv
Lvl 2-4: You switch now to rapier and shield, using the rapier with str still allows sneak attack.
Lvl 5-6: Now you have action surge so when going for an assassinate you want to use a greataxe for 3d12+3 dmg twice (average dmg 48.9 w the fighting style.) The rapier would only deal 4d8+4d6 +6 plus 1d8+3 (average only 38 ) You'll still be better off dropping the axe and going fork and board for any subsequent nonsurprise rounds.
Lvl 7:Now you have GWM. This is good. Important to note that the second part of it doesn't specify the weapon, so a normal assassin rogue should take this feat. Now whenever you crit you get to take a bonus action attack. Making that greataxe even better compared to the rapier taking the axe damage to 3d12+3 thrice. (avg 74.7) But wait theres more! You can pretty easily use the -5 +10 since you have adv on the attacks so that's average dmg 104.7.
Lvl 8+: Extra attack? Greataxe please. Now you can pretty safely use the axe always. Your nova action surge consists of 5 attacks. Thats 124.5 Average damage, or 174.5 if you take the -5 and hit with all.

Spoiler: At higher lvls

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From here you have options. Rogue 4 for str boost might be nice. I'd strive for fighter 11 for 3 attacks, 7 on your nova. I took a 13 cha so I can go warlock for hex and possibly lvl 3 for invis if party and/or adventure are making it hard for me to get my assassinate off. Hex adds 7 dmg per auto crit so with 7 attacks this lvl one spell adds, 49 damage to your nova. Important that you have hex already cast(like before even sneaking ahead) and designate the hexing before entering combat or you lose out on the bonus action attack. (If you don't plan on taking warlock dumb your cha at creation.)

Example build at lvl 16 4 rogue, 11 fighter, 1 warlock would nova for (3d12+15+2d6)* 7 times on his surprise round. That's an average of 315.7 damage with no magic items.

Spoiler: Additional Tips and Options

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As for fighter archetpye champion would be tempting for crit farming on normal combat rounds, but BM for the precision attack is likely your best bet, ensuring you hit with all those attacks.

Sneaking a couple lvls of paladin for smite could work, but its not as uesful since the build relies on a number of attacks instead of a few big ones.

Barbarian would be decent, but its tough to balance bonus actions, it would help you once the normal combat start though, because lets be real: 315 damage is amazing IF you can get it off and it will still not kill everything. 9th lvl barbarian would be great if you could get it in, but it seems like a bridge too far.

Ranger could be good option instead of warlock if you want to take hordebreaker and help you nova two guys at once. Hunters mark easily replaces hex, and you just have to swap your 13 cha for wis. Three levels deep is a tough investment though.

I'd look to my teammates for ways to buff and help me be sneaky. At high levels invisibility is useless against a lot of foes, especially since you are going for melee. Many monsters are equipped with a short range blindsight preventing just this tactic.

The build is heavily invested in its one-trick pony style, but the levels in fighter will make it comparable to a pure fighter just behind a few levels on extra attacks. You will be far from useless when you can't assassinate, and you could essentially break any encounter that doesn't have a way to spot you.

[Lines]

Add 5 levels of mystic for 5d10 on attacks and 2 paladin levels for d8s and you're set.

[PeteNutButter]

Add 5 levels of mystic for 5d10 on attacks and 2 paladin levels for d8s and you're set.

I plan most build for AL where things aren't allowed unless they are in an actual book. :(

I discussed paladin and I don't know if its enough slots to make it worth while. When you're making 7 attacks, two smites for 2d8 doubled to 4d8 for a total of 8d8 is only 36 damage once per long rest. It's in the spirit of the nova theme for sure, but you wouldn't get it until so late that it might just feel like a grain of sand.

Ranger's hordebreaker gives more damage since you get another attack if you can get it off.

Best pick would probably be something to make it better at sneaking/shore up defenses and weaknesses. Are there any spells that block blindsight?

[Degwerks]

I was just thinking of this last night but using a Way of Shadows Monk & Assassin & either ranger or warlock for hex/hunters mark. A 5th lvl monk with ki points can have 4 attacks using his bonus action. Add in hex/huntMK for another possible 4d6 dmg in a round plus 2d6 SA dmg. So 10d6+ dex x4 not counting crits by 10th level using a shortsword. Maybe +4 dmg if you took ranger dueling style.

[PeteNutButter]

I was just thinking of this last night but using a Way of Shadows Monk & Assassin & either ranger or warlock for hex/hunters mark. A 5th lvl monk with ki points can have 4 attacks using his bonus action. Add in hex/huntMK for another possible 4d6 dmg in a round plus 2d6 SA dmg. So 10d6+ dex x4 not counting crits by 10th level using a shortsword. Maybe +4 dmg if you took ranger dueling style.

I considered monk as well, but the combination of the extra d12 dmg dice and the +10 to damage on GWM, and the ability to reroll all ones on the 4 seperate dice for each attack via the fighting style all more than make up for that monk's extra punch, especially after fighter lvl 11.

The monk stategy isn't bad by any means though. I was just going for MAXIMUM cheese.

[PoeticDwarf]

I've seen these builds as snipers. Deadly range and still superb damage. 11 battle master, 3 assassin, 3 hunter and 3 battlerager would be best for your build I think. Having a greataxe and a bonus action attack

[bid]

Race: Half-Orc
Stats: 16, 14, 14, 8, 8, 13

And that's only 24 bp, you can get Wis11 too.

You could skip extra attack and go sorcerer 3 for twin BB and an extra 4d8 damage.

And pile on paladin 2, you'll have enough slots for 5 smite and 13d8 more damage.

[PeteNutButter]

And that's only 24 bp, you can get Wis11 too.
You could skip extra attack and go sorcerer 3 for twin BB and an extra 4d8 damage.
And pile on paladin 2, you'll have enough slots for 5 smite and 13d8 more damage.

Just used the point calc, had one point left. 9 wisdom doesn't help much i guess.

I could go sorc paladin i guess... trying to do something different. Twinned BB has to hit different targets though.

[PeteNutButter]

I've seen these builds as snipers. Deadly range and still superb damage. 11 battle master, 3 assassin, 3 hunter and 3 battlerager would be best for your build I think. Having a greataxe and a bonus action attack

I'm familiar with the sniping build, was going for a way to use the half orc racial to fullest potential. Battlerager is dwarf only, and besides I get a free bonus attack when novaing via GWM from the crits.

Otherwise you are likely right on your build suggestions.

[Corran]

I've toyed around such a build, relatively recently I even posted it in an arena challenge thread. Anyway, let me share my thoughts on it.

You must aim for either

a) fighter (battlemaster) 3/ bladelock 5/ rogue (assassin) 3

or

b) Fighter (BM) 5/ bladelock 3/ rogue (ass) 3

In the first case, your best bet is to take the remaining levels as a warlock, or at least go up to warlock 13 and take a 4th level in rogue or fighter for a feat, though I think warlock 14 has more valuee in it. In the second case, well, fighter 11 seems like a good choice, but to be honest, I have no idea what is the best way to use the remaining 3 levels. Personally, I prefer the first option, as I really like spells like etherealness and scrying on an assassin. I like feylock for gr invisibility as an alternative to darkness, but fiendlock is arguably the better choice.

The problem of this build is that it takes some time to flourish. My personal advice is to aim for rogue 2/ warlock 3 asap, but you have to either start or throw an early fighter level for medium armr proficiency. Thus being fighter1/rogue2/warlock3 at level 6. The you take 2 more warlock levels for extra extra attack and 1 more rogue level for assassinate, the order is completely up to you, and it depends on if you want to improve your assassination or your fighting during normal encounters first, putting you at fighter1/rogue3/warlock5 at level 9. Then you take 2 more fightr levels, so you have finally the majority of the tricks you can hope for, being a fighter3/warlock5/rogue3 at level 11.

At this point you only have 1 ASI/feat from warlock 4, which you will take according to my suggested progression at characer level 6 or 7. GWM is a must, but so are feats like alert and lucky. Actor is also a very cool feat for an assassin with your talents, though you might just not have enough room for it. Between these feats and more that I didnt mention, and pumping your ability scores, I would suggest starting vhuman for this much all needed feat, rather than halforc for some minor cool racial features. You need that feat man, you need all the feats you can get. And since warlock 2 offsets the biggest drawbacks of humans in regard to being an assassin (lack of darkvision), we are cool. My starting stats would be (with the racial increases): STR 16, DEX 14, CON 12, INT 8, WIS 10, CHA 13 with 2 more points remaining. I would invest those 1 of my two remaining points to pump con to 13 if I pwas planning on taking the resilient feat, alternatively I would put those 2 points in either int or wis, if I planned on taking the actor feat, or most cammonly, I would put those 2 points to charisma and be done with it. Yeah, with alert, lucky and GWM, and assuming vhuman, you only have room for one more feat/ASI, it is tough to spend it on a feat like actor in good consciense, however funny that might be. Resilient could be a good choice for a feat taken at hight level, in which case resilient con is what you have to plan for, as it will also raise your hp and help with some other stuff as well. Or just pump your str to 18 as your last feat. Too many feats that are useful, so little room. Perhaps I should have gone with the fighter route, though that way I would miss on the warlock spells. On a last note, it is really a shame to lose on master of myriad forms (warlock 15) by just 1 level, but the BM maneuvres are very much worth it.


The trouble with almost all multiclassed assassin builds, is that contrary to a pure assassin rogue, they stay behind the power curve for a long part of their careers. This build is marginally excluded from this category, though there is an uneven distribution of power level-wise, meaning that there are still those very big levels that you have to hit in order to be good at what you are supposed to do, and those levels come a bit later than expected.

The truth is, that as assassination goes, there are builds with better damage output, and as far as usefulness in things besides assassination goes, there are other assassin builds that are more powerful. What I personaly like about this particular assassin build, in regards to other assassin builds, is that it gets an easy and painless access to the scrying spell, and that funny enough it is the only assassin build that uses a heavy weapon (greatsword), as opposed yo the other dex-oriented assassin builds.

Would I call it a one-trick pony. Probably yes, but the trick would be that it uses GWM very efficiently, especially when darkness is on. There is some worrying lack of synergy and some overlap or rather antithesis in regard to the functionality of this build, but oh well...

[PeteNutButter]

Spoiler: Lock Assassin

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I've toyed around such a build, relatively recently I even posted it in an arena challenge thread. Anyway, let me share my thoughts on it.

You must aim for either

a) fighter (battlemaster) 3/ bladelock 5/ rogue (assassin) 3

or

b) Fighter (BM) 5/ bladelock 3/ rogue (ass) 3

In the first case, your best bet is to take the remaining levels as a warlock, or at least go up to warlock 13 and take a 4th level in rogue or fighter for a feat, though I think warlock 14 has more valuee in it. In the second case, well, fighter 11 seems like a good choice, but to be honest, I have no idea what is the best way to use the remaining 3 levels. Personally, I prefer the first option, as I really like spells like etherealness and scrying on an assassin. I like feylock for gr invisibility as an alternative to darkness, but fiendlock is arguably the better choice.

The problem of this build is that it takes some time to flourish. My personal advice is to aim for rogue 2/ warlock 3 asap, but you have to either start or throw an early fighter level for medium armr proficiency. Thus being fighter1/rogue2/warlock3 at level 6. The you take 2 more warlock levels for extra extra attack and 1 more rogue level for assassinate, the order is completely up to you, and it depends on if you want to improve your assassination or your fighting during normal encounters first, putting you at fighter1/rogue3/warlock5 at level 9. Then you take 2 more fightr levels, so you have finally the majority of the tricks you can hope for, being a fighter3/warlock5/rogue3 at level 11.

At this point you only have 1 ASI/feat from warlock 4, which you will take according to my suggested progression at characer level 6 or 7. GWM is a must, but so are feats like alert and lucky. Actor is also a very cool feat for an assassin with your talents, though you might just not have enough room for it. Between these feats and more that I didnt mention, and pumping your ability scores, I would suggest starting vhuman for this much all needed feat, rather than halforc for some minor cool racial features. You need that feat man, you need all the feats you can get. And since warlock 2 offsets the biggest drawbacks of humans in regard to being an assassin (lack of darkvision), we are cool. My starting stats would be (with the racial increases): STR 16, DEX 14, CON 12, INT 8, WIS 10, CHA 13 with 2 more points remaining. I would invest those 1 of my two remaining points to pump con to 13 if I pwas planning on taking the resilient feat, alternatively I would put those 2 points in either int or wis, if I planned on taking the actor feat, or most cammonly, I would put those 2 points to charisma and be done with it. Yeah, with alert, lucky and GWM, and assuming vhuman, you only have room for one more feat/ASI, it is tough to spend it on a feat like actor in good consciense, however funny that might be. Resilient could be a good choice for a feat taken at hight level, in which case resilient con is what you have to plan for, as it will also raise your hp and help with some other stuff as well. Or just pump your str to 18 as your last feat. Too many feats that are useful, so little room. Perhaps I should have gone with the fighter route, though that way I would miss on the warlock spells. On a last note, it is really a shame to lose on master of myriad forms (warlock 15) by just 1 level, but the BM maneuvres are very much worth it.


The trouble with almost all multiclassed assassin builds, is that contrary to a pure assassin rogue, they stay behind the power curve for a long part of their careers. This build is marginally excluded from this category, though there is an uneven distribution of power level-wise, meaning that there are still those very big levels that you have to hit in order to be good at what you are supposed to do, and those levels come a bit later than expected.

The truth is, that as assassination goes, there are builds with better damage output, and as far as usefulness in things besides assassination goes, there are other assassin builds that are more powerful. What I personaly like about this particular assassin build, in regards to other assassin builds, is that it gets an easy and painless access to the scrying spell, and that funny enough it is the only assassin build that uses a heavy weapon (greatsword), as opposed yo the other dex-oriented assassin builds.

Would I call it a one-trick pony. Probably yes, but the trick would be that it uses GWM very efficiently, especially when darkness is on. There is some worrying lack of synergy and some overlap or rather antithesis in regard to the functionality of this build, but oh well...

Your build is a bit of neat balance. It's good to see that I'm not the only one that realizes with GWM a 2hander can be better than a finesse (or more often a ranged) weapon.

Going heavy into warlock gives you a lot more options and makes it a solid gish, but at the cost of a significant amount of damage, early on especially. As an aside can you explain why you have to go for lvl warlock so early?

By going hard on fighter, getting to 5 as fast as possible and eventually 11, being just fighter rogue by 14... the pay off is a lot sooner. The reason I didn't plot builds past that is that in all my years of playing D&D I think I've only ever gotten a character from lvl 1 to 15 at max.

Also I think you are discounting the Half-Orc racial. Would you take a feat if it said, " +1 to str, add 1d12 to all your assassination attacks and crits, 60 ft darkvision, once per long rest you can avoid death like the death ward spell"? Seems like a good feat for build focused on assassinations.

Don't get me wrong though, I respect the gish assassin lock. It's got more options which would ultimately make it more fun to play in most scenarios.

[Corran]

Your build is a bit of neat balance. It's good to see that I'm not the only one that realizes with GWM a 2hander can be better than a finesse (or more often a ranged) weapon.

Thank you for the kind words. I am not sure if two hander with GWM is better than a finesse or ranged weapon for assassination purposes, but there are ways to go about it, as you showed. That's for sure.

Personally my favourite assassin build uses a rapier (or scimitar if I want to press on style) and a free hand, however strange that may sound.

Going heavy into warlock gives you a lot more options and makes it a solid gish, but at the cost of a significant amount of damage, early on especially.

True, a more fighter-tailored build with 3 attacks and GWM brings more damage to the table. Going the warlock route brings more utility I would say, and it is completely out of personal prefference.

As an aside can you explain why you have to go for lvl warlock so early?

Darkness + devil's sight + cunning action hide (requires rogue 2 and warlock 3, assuming vhuman). You want to set this up as early as possible. This combo is why I would be tempted to call this build a one-trick pony, as it is so good for you and you have no alternative strategies of ''equal value'' (assassination is a powerful side feature, but THIS, this is your combat strategy). This combo is useless against opponents with special senses, but at low mid levels there are not many such opponents, so you want this up asap, that's why I am rushing it and I am delaying a bit the extra attack. This combo works well with both a Booming blade rapier, and a GWM greatsword. And there is some very nice synergy between the benefit this strategy offers you and features like GWM/BB, cunning action, and maneuvres like riposte. Now that I think about it,about the build I posted, I would definitely start as a fighter for the con save proficiency, since I will not be able to devote any feats at least not until very late game to improve my concentration. So I would start as a fighter in my build, and then take 2 rogue and 3 warlock levels.

By going hard on fighter, getting to 5 as fast as possible and eventually 11, being just fighter rogue by 14... the pay off is a lot sooner. The reason I didn't plot builds past that is that in all my years of playing D&D I think I've only ever gotten a character from lvl 1 to 15 at max.

What I do is plan the whole progression from a 20 level perspective, and then break it down in tiers (and more analytically in every level eventually) after I figure which is the best route of level progression, and see if I am happy with the ''power'' the build has during the several levels of play. If I am not happy, I usually abandon the idea, and place it in the drawer with the rest of the builds that activate at level X.

Edit: Going hard on fighter, I think you need to take at least 1 warlock level straight after you level up to rogue 3. Hex will play well with you many attacks (extra attack/attacks and action surge and bonus action attack) and with the enemy's initiative. I would probably go for fighter5/rogue3/warlock1 in this case, but that ofc depends on if you want to tailor your build more towards assassination or not during these levels.

Also I think you are discounting the Half-Orc racial. Would you take a feat if it said, " +1 to str, add 1d12 to all your assassination attacks and crits, 60 ft darkvision, once per long rest you can avoid death like the death ward spell"? Seems like a good feat for build focused on assassinations.

That would be one good feat. Though I would still not take it over alert and lucky probably, considering that I would already nab darkvision from devil's sight. And with GWM being essentially the backbone of the build, there are simply not enough feats, that is why I would value vhuman more. That is all about the warlock-route build.

With a fighter-route build like the one you mentioned, that offers more feats, I think you have it nailed down with the halforc.

Don't get me wrong though, I respect the gish assassin lock. It's got more options which would ultimately make it more fun to play in most scenarios.

It has some nice utility. A heavy sorcerer assassin build has even better utility imo and there are some other nice aspects to it. The heavy-fighter build brings a lot of pain though, so there is that to consider as well. All valid choices imo too.

[Trancekat]

You're missing a lot here. The biggest thing is your chance to hit. You cannot assume you will hit 100% of the time.

Also, your damage calc at level 16 - Example build at lvl 16 4 rogue, 11 fighter, 1 warlock would nova for (3d12+15+2d6)* 7 times on his surprise round. That's an average of 315.7 damage with no magic items.

You're assuming surprise, playing AL exclusively, I've had 3 surprise rounds since starting in July 2014. Your target will likely have an AC of at least 20 at this level.

Why is your damage 3d12? You cannot assume you're going to hit every swing. Also, why are you adding +15 to each attack? I assume it's supposed to be strength (+5) for each attack. The +2d6 I assume is the rogue's sneak attack dice, usable only once per turn, so that should not be multiplied by 7. You should have Hex in there (again I am assuming you're dipping warlock for hex). Am I mistaken with these assumptions?

If I am correct, then we should look at it this way. Chance to hit AC 20. +5 Str, +5 Prof. Assuming you're going before your target, and that you are surprising the create (super rare in AL).

Chance to hit AC 20 with Advantage: .7975 (.7000 Hit, .0975 Crit) <--Including Superiority Dice for Precision; without Precision, it's .51 (.4125 Hit, .0975 Crit)

Basic calculation (and I have an entire spreadsheet for Nova DPS optimization for a variety of builds):

With Precision (4 Attacks), GWM
Attack1
(Chance to Hit*(Average Weapon Damage+Sneak Attack Dice+Hex+GWM+str))+(Chance to Crit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Sneak Attack Dice+2*Hex+GWM+str)
(.7*(7.33+2d6(7)+3.5+10+5)+(.0975*(21.99+2*2d6(7)+ 2*(3.5)+10+5)
22.98+5.65=28.63
----No more sneak attack dice
Attack2
(Chance to Hit*(Average Weapon Damage+Hex+GWM+str))+(Chance to Crit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
(.7*(7.33+3.5+10+5)+(.0975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+10+5)
18.08+4.29=22.37
Attack3
(Chance to Hit*(Average Weapon Damage+Hex+GWM+str))+(Chance to Crit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
(.7*(7.33+3.5+10+5)+(.0975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+10+5)
18.08+4.29=22.37

---Action Surge---

Surge1
(Chance to Hit*(Average Weapon Damage+Hex+GWM+str))+(Chance to Crit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
(.7*(7.33+3.5+10+5)+(.0975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+10+5)
18.08+4.29=22.37
----No more precision dice, so we drop GWM
Surge2
(Chance to Hit*(Average Weapon Damage+Hex))+(Chance to Crit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex)
(.7*(7.33+3.5)+(.0975*(21.99+2*(3.5))
7.58+2.83=10.41

Surge2
(Chance to Hit*(Average Weapon Damage+Hex))+(Chance to Crit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex)
(.7*(7.33+3.5)+(.0975*(21.99+2*(3.5))
7.58+2.83=10.41

No GWM attack since you used your bonus action on Hex.

Not bad at all at a total of:
116.56


If you assume that you will surprise and attack a create which hasn't gone yet:

With Precision (4 Attacks), GWM
Attack1
Chance to Hit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Sneak Attack Dice+2*Hex+GWM+str)
.7975*(21.99+2*2d6(7)+2*(3.5)+10+5)
46.25
----No more sneak attack dice
Attack2
Chance to Hit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
.7975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+10+5)
35.08
Attack3
Chance to Hit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
.7975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+10+5)
35.08

---Action Surge---

Surge1
Chance to Hit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
.7975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+10+5)
35.08
----No more precision dice, so we drop GWM
Surge2
Chance to Hit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
.7975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+5)
27.11

Surge2
Chance to Hit*(3*Weapon Damage+2*Hex+GWM+str)
.7975*(21.99+2*(3.5)+5)
27.11

No GWM attack since you used your bonus action on Hex.
Total: 205.7075

EDIT: Can't use sneak attack dice w/Great Axe, so the calculation for the first attack in each set is slightly higher than it should be, but otherwise is accurate.

[bid]

You're missing a lot here. The biggest thing is your chance to hit. You cannot assume you will hit 100% of the time.

Just a minor quibble here : hit doesn't matter.
- you hit on 11+? fine, multiply the damage by .5
- you hit on 15+? fine, multiply the damage by .3
Even crit can roughly be considered as +1 hit.

The only distortion is SA and other once-per-turn damage who will actually do more than a mere multiplication does.

Of course, if you add GWM/SS or archery, then you need to account for that direct impact on hit.


There's no true damage, just additional assumptions to muddle the result. That assumed target will have the same AC for both attackers.

[Coyote81]

Have you guys thought about mixing in Ranger/Hunter for horde Breaker and Hunter's Mark? It's effectively the same thing as the Bladelock 5 idea but you get it sooner.

My idea:

Half-Orc:16,14,14,8,13,8

Battelmaster4: GWM Style, Sweeping Strike/Precision Strike, GWM Feat, Action Surge

Hunter3: Horde Breaker, Defense Style, Hunter's Mark

Assassin4: Assassinate, Magic Initiate Feat - Green Flame Blade

The idea is too maximize the damage you can do 2 two targets in the same turn.

Action 1 GFB->sweeping->hordebreak->sweeping
BA Attack->sweeping
Action2 GFB->sweeping

What do you think?

[Degwerks]

I kinda like the Infernal Bladelock 5/ Assassin 3/ fighter 2.
Use scorching ray on action 1 and action 2 with 2 bladepact attacks. If all the rays hit that's 16d6. More if you could hex the guy before you got in the surprise round.

[Trancekat]

Just a minor quibble here : hit doesn't matter.
- you hit on 11+? fine, multiply the damage by .5
- you hit on 15+? fine, multiply the damage by .3
Even crit can roughly be considered as +1 hit.

The only distortion is SA and other once-per-turn damage who will actually do more than a mere multiplication does.

Of course, if you add GWM/SS or archery, then you need to account for that direct impact on hit.


There's no true damage, just additional assumptions to muddle the result. That assumed target will have the same AC for both attackers.

Agreed and I did take into account GWM for the proposed level 16 build. Otherwise, we agree.

[Trancekat]

I've posted this before, but not too many people were interested.

Here's a murder hobo I came up with. Allowing 1 pre-combat self buff (Haste). Not assuming a surprise round, The GWM damage would be removed if it's necessary to use Vow of Enmity to gain Adv. Alternately, we could use trip attack on the opening hit, but I haven't done the math on that.

Anyway, here's the build:

Spoiler

Show

1	Target AC:	Roll Needed:		Attack 1	Crit #	Weap Die	# Weap Dice	Prof Bonus	Ability Mod	# Smt Dice	Smite Die	# Misc Dice	Misc Die	Adv/Dis	Lucky?	# Super Dice	Super Die	GWM?	GWF?	Attack1
	20	10			20	6	2	5	5	5	8	0	8	1	3	4	8	1	1
	Chance to Hit *	Chance to Crit *	Total ToHit %	Total Damage	Weapon	Ability Mod	Smite Dice +	Misc Dice	Static Bonus
	0.7663	0.1426	0.9089		8.33	5	22.5											10
	35.1198	10.9346		46.0544
2	Target AC:	Roll Needed:		Attack 1	Crit #	Weap Die	# Weap Dice	Prof Bonus	Ability Mod	# Smt Dice	Smite Die	# Misc Dice	Misc Die	Adv/Dis	Lucky?	# Super Dice	Super Die	GWM?	GWF?	Attack2
	20	10			20	6	2	5	5	5	8	0	8	1	2	3	8	1	1
	Chance to Hit *	Chance to Crit *	Total ToHit %	Total Damage	Weapon	Ability Mod	Smite Dice +	Misc Dice	Static Bonus
	0.7663	0.1426	0.9089		8.33	5	22.5											10
	35.1198	10.9346		46.0544
3	Target AC:	Roll Needed:		Attack 1	Crit #	Weap Die	# Weap Dice	Prof Bonus	Ability Mod	# Smt Dice	Smite Die	# Misc Dice	Misc Die	Adv/Dis	Lucky?	# Super Dice	Super Die	GWM?	GWF?	Surge1
	20	10			20	6	2	5	5	4	8			1	1	2	8	1	1
	Chance to Hit *	Chance to Crit *	Total ToHit %	Total Damage	Weapon	Ability Mod	Smite Dice +	Misc Dice	Static Bonus
	0.7663	0.1426	0.9089		8.33	5	18											10
	31.6717	9.6510		41.3226
4	Target AC:	Roll Needed:		Attack 1	Crit #	Weap Die	# Weap Dice	Prof Bonus	Ability Mod	# Smt Dice	Smite Die	# Misc Dice	Misc Die	Adv/Dis	Lucky?	# Super Dice	Super Die	GWM?	GWF?	Surge2
	20	10			20	6	2	5	5	4	8			1	0	1	8	1	1
	Chance to Hit *	Chance to Crit *	Total ToHit %	Total Damage	Weapon	Ability Mod	Smite Dice +	Misc Dice	Static Bonus
	0.7000	0.0975	0.7975		8.33	5	18											10
	28.9333	6.5975		35.5308
5	Target AC:	Roll Needed:		Attack 1	Crit #	Weap Die	# Weap Dice	Prof Bonus	Ability Mod	# Smt Dice	Smite Die	# Misc Dice	Misc Die	Adv/Dis	Lucky?	# Super Dice	Super Die	GWM?	GWF?	Haste
	20	10			20	6	2	5	5	4	8			1	0		8		1
	Chance to Hit *	Chance to Crit *	Total ToHit %	Total Damage	Weapon	Ability Mod	Smite Dice +	Misc Dice	Static Bonus
	0.7000	0.0975	0.7975		8.33	5	18											10
	21.9333	5.6225		27.5558
6	Target AC:	Roll Needed:		Attack 1	Crit #	Weap Die	# Weap Dice	Prof Bonus	Ability Mod	# Smt Dice	Smite Die	# Misc Dice	Misc Die	Adv/Dis	Lucky?	# Super Dice	Super Die	GWM?	GWF?	Bonus (GWM)
	20	10			20	6	2	5	5	3	8			1	0		8		1
	Chance to Hit *	Chance to Crit *	Total ToHit %	Total Damage	Weapon	Ability Mod	Smite Dice +	Misc Dice	Static Bonus
	0.7000	0.0975	0.7975		8.33	5	13.5											10
	18.7833	4.7450	0.7796	18.3415
7	Target AC:	Roll Needed:		Attack 1	Crit #	Weap Die	# Weap Dice	Prof Bonus	Ability Mod	# Smt Dice	Smite Die	# Misc Dice	Misc Die	Adv/Dis	Lucky?	# Super Dice	Super Die	GWM?	GWF?
	20	10			20	6	2	5	5	3	8			1	0		8		1
	Chance to Hit *	Chance to Crit *	Total ToHit %	Total Damage	Weapon	Ability Mod	Smite Dice +	Misc Dice	Static Bonus
	0.7000	0.0975	0.7975		8.33	5	15.75											10
	20.3583	5.1838	********	25.5421
	Character Build	Human (Lucky)	Prof +5
	Fighter 4	GWF	Action Surge	Crit 20	ASI:Str
	Paladin 6	Divine Smite	Protection	Vow of Emnity	ASI:Str	Extra Atk	Spell Lvls	2x Lvl4	3x Lvl3	3x Lvl2	4x Lvl1
	Sorcerer 5	Metamagic	ASI:GWM	5 SP					Haste
	Attack			Ability Score	Value	Modifier	Save
	1		46.0544	Str	20	+5	+13	HP	114
	2		46.0544	Dex	10		+3	AC	19
	3		41.3226	Con	14	+2	+10	Init
	4		35.5308	Int	08	-1	+2
	5		27.5558	Wis	08	-1	+2
	6		18.3415	Cha	16	+3	+6
	7		25.5421			Save Total	36
	6 Attacks		214.8596