EMPIRE2!-CWBG-IV-In-Swan-Form-They-Resemble-Swans

[moossabi]

And while I'm sure you were joking, I will point out that we weren't "out to get" Way; indeed, he declared war on us! There was an early IC misunderstanding which was never really cleared up, then there was a brief showdown over disputed land, which we backed down from, and then we got invaded.

Indeed, I was joking. I actually thought that everyone was trying to kill him.

Thanks for correcting me!

[QuintonBeck]

Are faith investigations a thing? I see that Dark is doing one, but I wasn't aware it was possible. I suppose it does make sense, but I rather doubt it's always appropriate to approach matters from a theological standpoint.

An action can be taken to "investigate" something with Faith but there won't be any "Investigation!" results in the Round Opener related to the faith action taken. If the action taker wishes to proclaim a religious connection or answer in the following round's action that's their business but Faith is not a substitute for Curiosity when it comes to discovering things.

[Elemental]

An action can be taken to "investigate" something with Faith but there won't be any "Investigation!" results in the Round Opener related to the faith action taken. If the action taker wishes to proclaim a religious connection or answer in the following round's action that's their business but Faith is not a substitute for Curiosity when it comes to discovering things.

That makes sense then. I just got a bit confused.


Also, just so you all know, the renovations of my capital aren't just me copying Reggie. I'd been planning to do this for weeks but I just never had the actions.
Further, my diplomacy action in regards to Shafarstan isn't expected to accomplish anything. I just rolled in case Quinton wanted to do something with it, but if he doesn't, that's okay as it's also excuse fodder for my getting involved in that region of the world.

Final point, Grand Princess Jovana, heiress apparent of the Empire of Anceris is of marriageable age and so in the market for a suitable consort.

[Aedilred]

I'm away for the weekend and this time am not taking my computer with me, insane as that proposal no doubt sounds, so I'll be afk for the next couple of days. I'll be back better than ever probably on Sunday evening, for anyone who has pressing business with me (Mary, most notably).

[HalfTangible]

I'm going to a funeral today, and will be missing most of tomorrow and Sunday because of other RL stuff. I'll try to keep in touch when I can but it will be sparingly done.

[woolli264]

Wait what do people write on?

AHHHHHH!

Edit: I just spent a great project making books but paper is a specific resource that everyone doesn't automatically have

Edit again: I will have animal skin scrolls.

[TheDarkDM]

Wait what do people write on?

AHHHHHH!

Edit: I just spent a great project making books but paper is a specific resource that everyone doesn't automatically have

Edit again: I will have animal skin scrolls.

Bow to our paper mastery! Mwahahahaha!

[Catrus]

Wait what do people write on?

"animal" hides mostly, for my peoples.

[BladeofObliviom]

Edit again: I will have animal skin scrolls.

It's okay to say Papyrus. It's not a dirty word unless it's in the actual font.

[woolli264]

It's okay to say Papyrus. It's not a dirty word unless it's in the actual font.

Oh. I was trying to avoid people making Under tale references as much as possible since they seem to plague the internet at this point but have yet to creep their way into this fine establishment.

[BladeofObliviom]

Oh. I was trying to avoid people making Under tale references as much as possible since they seem to plague the internet at this point but have yet to creep their way into this fine establishment.

...

You're the only one making the reference here, Woolli. Though now that you've said that Tychris will be along any moment.

[woolli264]

...

You're the only one making the reference here, Woolli. Though now that you've said that Tychris will be along any moment.

Now you listen here mister. I was trying to avoid it by not explicitly mentioning the word papyrus then you went and did it anyways, not to mention, in a way that made me feel the need to explain myself, so I did.

[BladeofObliviom]

Now you listen here mister. I was trying to avoid it by not explicitly mentioning the word papyrus then you went and did it anyways, not to mention, in a way that made me feel the need to explain myself, so I did.

?

I was just cracking a joke, assuming that either you did not know that papyrus is just animal skin or that you did know but did not believe others would. I did not mention Undertale until just now and am unsure why you are taking a hostile tone with me.

[moossabi]

It's okay to say Papyrus. It's not a dirty word unless it's in the actual font.

I really have no idea what's wrong with that font. This one is far more ridiculous.

[Tychris1]

...

You're the only one making the reference here, Woolli. Though now that you've said that Tychris will be along any moment.

WHO NEEDS A NAVY WITH LEGS LIKE THESE!

*Pulls out a massive spear and starts wailing on the piano*

Japed once again! Nyeh heh heh!

[HalfTangible]

WHO NEEDS A NAVY WITH LEGS LIKE THESE!

*Pulls out a massive spear and starts wailing on the piano*

Japed once again! Nyeh heh heh!

You're begging for a bad time, boy.

[woolli264]

?

I was just cracking a joke, assuming that either you did not know that papyrus is just animal skin or that you did know but did not believe others would. I did not mention Undertale until just now and am unsure why you are taking a hostile tone with me.

Making a joke about others perceived knowledge seems a little smart-alecky as does the poking fun at me for bringing up the one subject I wanted to avoid (though to a far lesser degree) and my complete inability to hear your voice or see your face when you said that does make it difficult for me to tell if you were joking or not.

I will admit my second remark was too sensitive and I would like to apologize. I am sorry for the confusion and will try to take things lighter in the future.

[Catrus]

Papyrus is not animal skins. It is a form of paper made from plant material, particularly the papyrus plant.

Parchment is the paper made from animal skins. Unless it is calf skin, in which case it is vellum.

[woolli264]

Papyrus is not animal skins. It is a form of paper made from plant material, particularly the papyrus plant.

Parchment is the paper made from animal skins. Unless it is calf skin, in which case it is vellum.

oh sadness...

[BladeofObliviom]

Making a joke about others perceived knowledge seems a little smart-alecky as does the poking fun at me for bringing up the one subject I wanted to avoid (though to a far lesser degree) and my complete inability to hear your voice or see your face when you said that does make it difficult for me to tell if you were joking or not.

I will admit my second remark was too sensitive and I would like to apologize. I am sorry for the confusion and will try to take things lighter in the future.

That's fair. You're right, I can see how snarking might not have been the best approach to that conversation. Apologies.

Papyrus is not animal skins. It is a form of paper made from plant material, particularly the papyrus plant.

Parchment is the paper made from animal skins. Unless it is calf skin, in which case it is vellum.

Ah, so it is. My bad; I got them mixed up in my head.

[woolli264]

Papyrus is not animal skins. It is a form of paper made from plant material, particularly the papyrus plant.

Parchment is the paper made from animal skins. Unless it is calf skin, in which case it is vellum.

Aww nuts...

[Zayuz]

Papyrus is not animal skins. It is a form of paper made from plant material, particularly the papyrus plant.

Parchment is the paper made from animal skins. Unless it is calf skin, in which case it is vellum.

Goat parchment, anyone?

[Elemental]

On the topic of paper, I think that's one of the difficulties of the one resource per region system we've employed for this game. If we assume everyone needs access to a specific resource of paper or other writing sources then heaps of regions end up with that kind of resource which gets a bit ridiculous. We had the same problem last game when gunpowder was invented and deposits of sulphur and nitrates sprang up everywhere and it would be even worse this game.

[Gengy]

I think it's a way to encourage the creative use of your Curiosity 5 action. And in the case of 'Paper', specifically, the Courts were... "forced" into turning one of our Wood resources into Paper, due to the changed needs of the Gesh, while Murgen was still playing the Gesh, shortly before he stopped doing so. It was a good move, and one that I would have liked quite a bit more, had it happened to anyone else

That said, it was an easy fix for us to change a Wood resource into a Paper resource, and as 'Wood' was increasingly common in the early part of Empire 2, there were several regions that gave us that option. Now, we're employing our C5 expenditure to better effect technologies. And, quite frankly, if gun powder were introduced in some manner, I would probably end up using a C5 on some region that has another 'duplicate' resource to get it... or another needed resource for a tech that I would find extremely useful.

I'm not disagreeing with you about one resource per region being a little odd, but in the scope of things, in order to track this stuff? One resource per region is perfectly acceptable. And being able to change that resource is the way to ensure that a newly discovered region doesn't end up with a duplicate of a resource you don't need.

[Elemental]

I just worry about the inevitable result. I'd rather interesting trade goods that a dozen or so sources of sulphur and guano. So as such, I'm kind of opposed to any techs that have pointlessly specific resource requirements when they're either something that should be reasonably ubiquitous, make no sense as the sole product of the industry of several hundred thousand people or ultimately have a bunch of obvious alternatives that shouldn't warrant a C5 to uncover.
We've managed to avoid that for the most part so far, though I am a bit annoyed that there's a requirement for Woodblock Printing, but I can live with that because wood is easy to come by. Celestial Navigation on the other hand is a bit pointlessly punitive. Cloth, parchment, leather and wood are all reasonable materials on which to record star charts and maps, so why is paper the only one that works?

[Gengy]

Dark may have a different reason here, but my own head-cannon is that Celestial Navigation is less about the maps, and more about the math. There are maps involved, but you've got to work out figures and plot courses, and it changes frequently based on your position and the position of the stars/sun/the day of the week/the week of the year, etc. With this constant change, you're doing quite a lot of math, and unlike cloth, parchment, and leather, writing on the resource Paper is writing on something that is in ready enough supply as to be able to make plenty of corrections, mistakes, and do the complicated equations needed to make Celestial Navigation work.

For this particular tech, though, it was Dark and Blade talking it out. I'm glad to trade it to anyone who wants it, for the right price, but my involvement in it's creation was minimal. So again, the explanation I've given is just my head-cannon. There are already other techs that exist that do something similar things (with their resource requirements), such as Witch's Sleep, Bear Calvary, or (to a lesser degree) Cobblestone Roads. Some of these are techs that interest me, but gaining access to their resource is more difficult than a simple trade. I've got a couple in game alternatives, as far as I see it: [1] Discover a region that has this resource I need or is (Undefined) and I can get the resource I want, [2] Use a C5 to get the resource I want, or [3] Create a tech that is similar to what some of these techs do, but use a different resource (like many of the existing military technologies).

[Elemental]

That's fair, but one can still make calculations on parchment etc. which in different circumstances may actually be of greater availability. In fact, a reusable slate or wax tablet would be the best choice. Ultimately, I just don't want to give my regions over to producing resources that don't fit with the vision I've created for them, so that's why I'm pushing for alternatives to be recognised.

[Zayuz]

The solution is simply to adapt the technology with a curiosity 5 and give it a resource requirement that's easier to obtain, no?

[Elemental]

Please wait ten to twenty rounds for my ruler to die of old age so someone can figure out how to write out calculations on parchment, linen, or Lady forbid it, a writing slate. I mean, I know why the rule is the way it is. It's to prevent technologies that are meant to be restrictive from being stolen and altered to work with any old thing, but in this instance it's just ridiculous.

[Catrus]

If you wanted to balance multiple resources per region, you could do it simply enough. Restrict the number of resources per region to three. While also having the quality of the resources capped. So you could have a single great, a good and a minor, or three minors. But that really does not seem to be a required measure.

In my understanding, you have more resources than just the one already. You just only have the one in such a large quantity that you can trade it to others. So people have paper, without having a paper resource. They just do not produce a large amount of paper, unless they have paper as a resource.