Results 211 to 240 of 298
Thread: Erfworld 65, Page 59
-
2007-07-02, 05:56 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2006
- Location
- I am living, this should anwser any ambiguously worded questions about my location.
- Gender
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Tarfu is U Fart backwards. Any1 else catch that?
"Yea, though as I walk through the valley of Roy being really pissed, I shall fear no thwacking, for my lute and my Banjo comfort me." - Elan
-
2007-07-02, 06:02 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
- Location
- Santa Cruz, CA
- Gender
-
2007-07-02, 06:07 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2006
- Location
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
I do disagree with that. Yes, Jensen was able to overwhelm 3 dwagons. But they were not 3 strong dwagons, and he could only do this by throwing his entire available forces at them.
If he had thrown his entire forces against a stronger force (4 of 5 mixed-strength dwagons), he would have been able to croak some of them, if he focused his attacks on the weakest ones. But the remaining strong, healthy dwagons would have done severe damage during their defence rounds. There would not have been much left of his forces after the first round. I would predict TPK in a few rounds. That means the loss of his entire forest-capable force. Including himself: remember that the mass charge was only sucessful because half his forces attacked the first target, the other half attacked the second, and HE took out the third.
Jetstone would simply not have attempted it.
Parson chose 4 or 5 because that was the minimum numbers required to ensure defence. It would have been successful: Jetstone would have been kept out of the centre hex. Parson would have lost 3 to 4 low-move dwagons.
1 hex with 3 dwagons was not strong enough. So it was a fine bait.Last edited by kabbor; 2007-07-02 at 07:53 PM.
Verigated Opinionator of the Polls Fan Club
To do a spoiler, surround it in spoiler tags like this:[spoiler]Darth Vadar is Skywalker's Father[/spoiler]. To show someone else how to do a spoiler, use noparse tags like this: [noparse][spoiler]Miko will stay Dead[/spoiler][/noparse]. To show someone else how to demonstrate spoiler tags, use multiple noparse tags like this [noparse][noparse][spoiler]Recursion is like recursion, only shorter[/spoiler][/noparse][/noparse]
-
2007-07-02, 06:19 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
- Gender
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
I see her coming for help, going, "Ooooooo. Dwagons!", attacking, getting her ass whipped, and then captured again. She seems to like getting her ass whipped, actually. (Extra bonus: Ansom uses his remaining move to rescue her. He gets captured, too. The Arkenpliers are obtained and turn out to be attuned to... Bogroll. Okay, kidding on the last one. I do hope Sizemore gets the Arkenshovel, though.)
-
2007-07-02, 06:19 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Just "spoiler" between square brackets, like on most boards. There's always the possibility of just quoting a post with BBcode you want to learn to look at it, by the way.
Well, duh. The only way to hide units is to put them in a hex where the enemy won't scout. Vinny has now scouted each of the seven hexes of the Dwagenburg, if only to find out that it was actually a donut (empty center) rather than a party platter (with a creamy center full of wounded dwagons and recroakable warlords).
Many games have both internal and external resources just to make siege tactics possible. For example, Heroes of Might & Magic's mills and mines and unit spawners. Controlling them (by sending a unit visit it every seven turns, in HoMM) not only gave you an immediate boost during the visit, but also increased automatic production. Also, there are (in HoMM still) other "resources" like trainers or sanctuaries that can give temporary bonuses to your troops.
There's no guarantee that similar mechanics exist in Erfworld, but it would make sense (to give an incentive to controlling territory). And in fact, when Sizemore trained with the Hippiemancer in the Magic Kingdom shows that there are external trainers like in HoMM.
Another point to consider in matter of siege is teleportation. To be efficient, a besieging army needs a way to block the use of portal parks. Is that even possible? We don't know.
And many other games don't allow you to stay holed up infinitely without repercussion. In Sid Meier's Civilization, for example, cities get resources from the surrounding squares (the bigger the city, the more squares you get); but if an enemy unit occupies one of these squares you lose the associated resources. If you don't get enough resources to sustain the city, population decreased because of famine, and this decrease meant a decrease in tax and production, which meant that unit and building upkeep could no longer be met, provoking their automatic disbanding, etc.
In short, we don't know if siege serves a strategic purpose in addition to the tactical purpose of surrounding the enemy; but we don't know that it doesn't.Hark! An avatar drawn by Kate Beaton!
-
2007-07-02, 06:21 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
- Gender
-
2007-07-02, 06:28 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
- Location
- Santa Cruz, CA
- Gender
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
[QUOTE=kabbor;2821392]If that was true, then Parson didn't have to bother with the ring o' death at all. He could simply have max-stacked dwagons next to the road in the woods. Even if they were discovered, Ansom couldn't do anything to them.
I've said it before: Ansom has the capability to smack even a max-stack of dwagons. Has to. Will it cost him a lot? Certainly. But he has to be able to do it, because if he can't, deceptive tactics are stupid.
-
2007-07-02, 06:29 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
-
2007-07-02, 06:35 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
We know that at least part of that is in effect--comic 1. Marbit miners use a one-time resource they caught to purchase an extra squad for a key battle.
Even ignoring the bit PLOT tags on that little coincidence, that means there are marbit mining squads and a mechanism for converting non-city-produced resources into troops. We definitely have the foundation for external resource nodes.
-
2007-07-02, 06:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Last edited by DGM; 2007-07-02 at 06:43 PM.
-
2007-07-02, 07:36 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2006
-
2007-07-02, 07:38 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
-
2007-07-02, 07:50 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2007
- Location
- Arizona, USA
- Gender
-
2007-07-02, 08:12 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2007
- Gender
-
2007-07-02, 08:16 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2006
- Location
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Yes he could: He could go around them. The wheel, being round, could not be out-flanked. A single stack of dwagons in the forest could not be conquered by the forces that Jensen has available at this time - Limited air and forest capabilities. (If he could bring his open range troops to bear, or had most of his air cover still in the column, Jensen could beat the dwagons.)
We don't yet know why the deception is being used. It could be to launch an attack on Jensen himself, or to pull what little defensive forces he has available away from the column. Time will tell.Last edited by kabbor; 2007-07-02 at 08:16 PM.
Verigated Opinionator of the Polls Fan Club
To do a spoiler, surround it in spoiler tags like this:[spoiler]Darth Vadar is Skywalker's Father[/spoiler]. To show someone else how to do a spoiler, use noparse tags like this: [noparse][spoiler]Miko will stay Dead[/spoiler][/noparse]. To show someone else how to demonstrate spoiler tags, use multiple noparse tags like this [noparse][noparse][spoiler]Recursion is like recursion, only shorter[/spoiler][/noparse][/noparse]
-
2007-07-02, 08:59 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2007
- Location
- Cloud 10, bubba
- Gender
-
2007-07-02, 09:13 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Why do people think that either Jillian or Ansom are capable of croaking large numbers of dwagons? There is reasonable proof that warlords are not incredible combat troops. I mean the whole reason the trap worked was because the Allience didn't want to attack any of the nearer hexes (which would mean they would still have some moves) because they were unsure if attacking the stronger hexes would leave them sufficient force to deal with even heavily wounded dwagons. Granted, the higher level warlords may be decent in small scale out and out combat but they are meant to be strategic assets, not combat troops. (Combat as in them alone verses other units. Their stratigic value is obviously directing the troops they command in combat.) Given that the woods force is already wounded from taking on 3 weaker dwagons, attacking another hex would probably lead to a win, but the force would be decimated and left uterly helpless,to defend itself, even with airborn reinforcements. As opposed to their current situation where if they get air cover, they will still be no match for a full swarm of dwagons, but strong enough that attacking them would cause Parson to lose enough dwagons as to make the remaining seige look like a better target. As I mentioned before, using the air Ansom can protect either his group or the collum, not both.
-
2007-07-02, 09:30 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
-
2007-07-02, 11:09 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Actually, thinking about it some more I doubt it would be as much of a problem as I first thought. If you look at Ansom's map on page 62, you see he apparently gets to see any hex that's only one or two hexes away from his units without having to send a scout. As long as the view isn't blocked by terrain like heavy forest, anyway.
Since the column occupies a thin line of hexes, Parson may only need to send a single dwagon down each side of the column to get the intel he needs. Then the rest can spend their move attacking.
Of course he'll still need to make his saving throw against self-righteous fury or be disbanded immediately, but that's another issue.Last edited by DGM; 2007-07-02 at 11:20 PM.
-
2007-07-02, 11:17 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
A quick note as to why Parson didn't just max stack the dwagons. As someone pointed out, a ring is a heck of a lot harder to surround as opposed to a single hex. But I think another reason is that if it was a single hex, the forest force could just attack the wounded dwagons selectivly, the retreat, just like Parson did with the seige. Also, I'm willing to bet that the wounded dwagons are only a couple of hexes away from Ansom's troops, so that if they had not wasted moves circling the fort and then moving into the weak hex, they would have been able to reach and croak the wounded dwagons. (and of course, circling the hex used up enough moves for them to ensure that they wouldn't be able to rejoin the rest of their forces before Parson's turn)
-
2007-07-02, 11:25 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Ansom isn't getting enough credit for being skeptical here. He still has some not-terrible options before he signals end of turn, and he has options because he was cautious enough not to commit everything to his guess that GK had all their wounded dwagons in the center hex.
Parson can't attack the elves and gumps as long as Ansom and Vinnie are with the stack. The cost would be too high. I have a feeling that not only are Ansom and Vinnie going to stay with their forest-capable units as insurance against attacks from the nearby dwagons, they're all going to move back (one hex at most, presumably) to where Vinnie's doombats are, so that they're also insured against attack.
That leaves Jillian and her gwiffons, and Charlie's Archons. Parson has no real reason to attack Jillian. She's more useful out in the field, according to Wanda, and if he makes a point of avoiding her stack that might seem even more suspicious to the Allies. The Archons are an unknown quantity; I'm assuming for the sake of argument that taking them on head to head would result in unacceptable losses for GK, so as long as he's doing tactical strikes from a base outside of GK itself he'll avoid them, except to try and bait them away from whatever target he has in mind for a tactical strike.
Parson doesn't have to defeat Ansom's army. He merely(!) has to break off the seige. There are a number of ways he can do that, many of which will call upon the sort of psychological warfare that seems to be Wanda's specialty. If he can fracture the alliance in critical ways and/or wipe out Ansom's seige engines completely then it doesn't really matter if Ansom still has most of his warlords and all of his most powerful flying units.
-
2007-07-02, 11:40 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Actually, it could matter. Unless something prohibits Ansom's fliers from attacking into the city itself, Ansom can hoist Parson on his own petard by making massive, warlord-lead air raids into GK. The more I think about this, the more I think whittling down Ansom's fliers should be Parson's next goal after eliminating the siege.
Last edited by DGM; 2007-07-02 at 11:41 PM.
-
2007-07-03, 01:26 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
- Gender
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
If that was so feasible, he might have done it already. Perhaps the attacking-from-your-own-city bonus with large number of archers and other fun possibilities prevents it. Surgical strikes may be possible, but I wouldn't assume an all-out attack is viable. (Also, there's no backup if you fail.)
-
2007-07-03, 01:48 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
I doubt he's close enough to the city yet. Parson's dwagons have more move than gwiffons, and he still has to worry about counter-attack.
Surgical strikes may be possible, but I wouldn't assume an all-out attack is viable.
Parson need not - and probably can not - gain the kind of air superiority he would need to hit the column with impunity again before Ansom reaches the city. But he does need to reduce Ansom's air superiority enough to prevent that tactic from being used the other way.Last edited by DGM; 2007-07-03 at 01:48 AM.
-
2007-07-03, 07:57 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2005
-
2007-07-03, 09:14 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Sure we know why the deception was being pulled. To protect the 19 wounded dwagons and 3 warlords. Sacrificing 3 dwagons to save 19 is a fair trade.
Parson knows the move of enemy units. He knows how much move it takes to get through each hex. He knows the location of every enemy unit that could have reached the dwagon hex and attack. He worked out all the potential paths and placed the dwagon stacks to force the enemy units that could reach the wounded dwagons to use up so much move that they can no longer hit the wounded dwagon hex.
The only units left are Jillian's flyers and the 3 archons. But poor Ansom may play it conservatively and protect himself. He's got 24 dwagons near him, a force that's injured, a guesstimated 2 dozen more dwagons on the way...
That's probably why he held Jillian in reserve. Because he knew that, on the next turn, he and his forces would have been too weak to protect themselves against the remaining 2 dozen dwagons surrounding them. Jillian's forces would have provided that extra 'oomph' to make a counterattack unpalatable.
-
2007-07-03, 09:41 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Algarve (The West)
- Gender
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Ansom's forest units have only 7 to 8 move. If you put the plater of doom 5 hexes deeper in the forest those units could not reach the center, only flyers. Parson wanted Ansom there, it had nothing to do with the wounded dwagons.
I think he'll finish siege, bears and anything capable of moving units inside the column. Then he'll kill something like the last 10 hexes in the column with his spidews.
By the way, the fog shows the edges of the hexes, the center really looked like forest in the map, and three hexes down, to the right of the center hex, there is something which looks like a water hex. I think the wounded dwagons are there. That would be fun, Ansom was just beside the warlords when he attacked the three dwagon hex.Last edited by teratorn; 2007-07-03 at 09:45 AM.
Avatar: ruthless Parson (Erfworld).
-
2007-07-03, 10:14 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
- Location
- Arlington, VA
- Gender
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Interesting to note that Vinny's bat in this strip has only one fang showing on the outside with its mouth closed, like Vinny.
BTW thanks to whomever for pointing out that Vinny has a full mouth of fangs on all 4 corners.
I think Parson's plan was 2 fold:
1. protect the injured dwagons and 3 warlords
2. get Ansom's forest units way out of position for next turns onslaught.
Now I don't know what Parson will do next turn, we shall see. But since things have turned up as he planned, his symphony will really start to play some music. Also losses as painful as they are, are a fact of war. 3 dwagons I guess was an acceptable price to pay for this operation.
Parson has a lot of options, however I doubt that Ansom's flying units will stay idle before the end of the turn.Last edited by Monan; 2007-07-03 at 10:31 AM.
-
2007-07-03, 10:16 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Erfworld 65, Page 59
Which would have eaten up move Parson could have used to assault the column. And where do you get that 7 to 8 move value? We know it would take a minimum of 7 move to reach that center hex from the closest road position, but that's hardly an indicator that that's the maximum move for those kind of units.
Parson wanted Ansom there, it had nothing to do with the wounded dwagons.
And nothing to do with the wounded dwagons? He protected 19 wounded dwagons. They're his heavy hitters. They go down, he loses a significant offensive force.
I think he'll finish siege, bears and anything capable of moving units inside the column. Then he'll kill something like the last 10 hexes in the column with his spidews.
By the way, the fog shows the edges of the hexes, the center really looked like forest in the map, and three hexes down, to the right of the center hex, there is something which looks like a water hex. I think the wounded dwagons are there. That would be fun, Ansom was just beside the warlords when he attacked the three dwagon hex.Last edited by sihnfahl; 2007-07-03 at 10:17 AM.
-
2007-07-03, 10:21 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
- Location
- Northern Virginia
- Gender