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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Orc in the Playground
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    Mar 2007

    Default How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    I'm running an urban murder mystery and, while I did expect the players to go to the guard for some things, they are actually being pretty forthcoming with information and requesting more guards to do their job. I sure didn't expect this from my experiences playing with them, though they've also participated in their own illegal activities in the campaign too.
    Anyways, they've been giving the guards names and events of the suspects as they uncover information. Originally I hadn't had much more than some clues at the guardhouse (like a Speak with Dead transcript and autopsy report from a body that was later abducted). But with the frequent visits I feel the need to give the guard more presence. The PCs are speeding along the mystery at a decent clip, so I think it's fair to put the guards always one or two steps behind. But I don't want it to seem like they're completely ignoring the murders- they're understaffed, not malicious or ignorant.

    How do I put more guards into this adventure, and even help the PCs, without having the guards simply solve everything for the PCs?

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Goblin

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    Default Re: How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    Well, you said they've shared info with the guards. Have the guards follow up and investigate what they've been told. They need to verify what they've been told, and would be worried that a bunch of amateur sleuths might have missed something important.

    So have them question witnesses and suspects that the PCs already interviewed. Investigate areas the PCs already cleared out. If the PCs ask questions, explain that the guards are making sure that they didn't miss something as they are not trained invesigators, but also make it clear that the guards are grateful for their help.

    Maybe mention casually that guard patrols have increased. That might also encourage the PCs to continue to work with the guards. If there is a guard nearby when they find something important, they may immediately ask them for assistance.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    Quote Originally Posted by Parvum View Post
    I'm running an urban murder mystery and, while I did expect the players to go to the guard for some things, they are actually being pretty forthcoming with information and requesting more guards to do their job. I sure didn't expect this from my experiences playing with them, though they've also participated in their own illegal activities in the campaign too.
    Anyways, they've been giving the guards names and events of the suspects as they uncover information. Originally I hadn't had much more than some clues at the guardhouse (like a Speak with Dead transcript and autopsy report from a body that was later abducted). But with the frequent visits I feel the need to give the guard more presence. The PCs are speeding along the mystery at a decent clip, so I think it's fair to put the guards always one or two steps behind. But I don't want it to seem like they're completely ignoring the murders- they're understaffed, not malicious or ignorant.

    How do I put more guards into this adventure, and even help the PCs, without having the guards simply solve everything for the PCs?
    In your typical murder mystery, cops are usually the heavy handed idiots that are quick to leap to conclusions, arrest the wrong suspect and declare the case closed as quickly as possible. Having more cops on the case should actually be a hindrance, not help, for you players.

    Usually, guards in a medieval/fantasy setting are not much more than grunts. They are there to be a physical deterrent to crime and not much more. They wouldn't typically have the intelligence or the inquisitive nature to be investigating anything beyond "what's in this pile of hay?" *poke it with a spear a few times*

    You might have a few "higher ups", that would be the equivalent of an detective, but they are going to resent the PC's involvement (tell me how do do my job, eh? Think you can do it better than me, eh?) and will generally try to make the PC's life miserable while they investigate. They will try to be the first to a crime scene, make snap decisions based on little evidence (especially if the evidence is false or misleading) and try to keep the PC's from doing their own investigation as much as possible, even to the point of threatening to have them arrested if they keep "interfering".

    Personally, I would suggest that the more they involve the guards, the more muddled things get as the half-witted guards trample evidence, rough up witnesses for no good reason, and generally try to get things over with as fast as possible, so they can return to their usual job of holding up a wall. The "detective" in charge of the case will be competent, but resentful of the PC's involvement and do their best to hinder the PCs movements, deny access to evidence and generally make their lives miserable, all while trying to beat them to the "solution" of the case.
    Last edited by Mutazoia; 2016-07-04 at 11:39 PM.
    "Sleeping late might not be a virtue, but it sure aint no vice. The old saw about the early bird and the worm just goes to show that the worm should have stayed in bed."

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  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    Second the above in "more patrols of largely incompetent grunts and grizzled film noir detectives/Inspecter Jauvert types"

    If your running a crime show style game, the PC's would be the main detectives and the guards would be the beat cop uniform extras that sometimes show up. You might have an NPC district attorney, captain, detective from another branch or organization who dislikes them, but the rest of the guards/police are just uniform beat cops.

    Remember that while the guards can be asked to do work, the PC's are there because the guards can't solve the mystery(for various reasons). However, they can be used as grunt manpower if needed. They can help with a detailed canvas of a park, hang wanted posters/hand out missing flyers, round up all people matching x description or be on the lookout for Y individual. If you want them to be understaffed, then have these tasks be always a low priority for the guards, or something they cannot dedicate effort to(but is the key to the next part of the mystery) or something they might even think a waste of time.
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  5. - Top - End - #5
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    Mmm. Sounds like you want a LeStrade for your Sherlock. Strictly from a 'role in story' standpoint, I think the best role for the guards would be to reveal clues the PCs missed, or even just to give the PCs clues that the guards can't figure out. The PCs didn't follow up on the letter from library about an overdue book (Evil McNasty's Guide to Necromancy for Fun and Profit), so have a guard contact the PCs "hey, this book actually was returned right before victim died, but it is missing the pages on how to make a flesh golem".

    Also, think of the as a PC force multiplier: raiding a thieve's den? Station guards at all exits while PCs do the raid. Boring stakeout seeing who uses the 'Ye Olde Shoppe of EEEEvil Alchemy', let a guard do it. (Of course, this also means you can occasionally use 'guards not as good as PCs to explain "the guild leader sliced through the guards at the sewer entrance and got away" and "the guard dozed and didn't see person X enter")

    From a more simulation-ish angle, cops have fundamentally different resources than the PCs. Chain of command means their boss is someone important in the city, so the boss has better contacts with the upper crust. They have a list of 'the usual suspects'. On the flip side, PCs aren't as restrained by laws & police procedure. Do the police have a procedure for "tentacled goop fell from the sky and is taking control of people"?

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    Quote Originally Posted by SpoonR View Post
    From a more simulation-ish angle, cops have fundamentally different resources than the PCs. Chain of command means their boss is someone important in the city, so the boss has better contacts with the upper crust. They have a list of 'the usual suspects'. On the flip side, PCs aren't as restrained by laws & police procedure. Do the police have a procedure for "tentacled goop fell from the sky and is taking control of people"?
    In a medieval/fantasy setting, the guards would have less resources than the PCs. The guards are just common soldiers, and their higher-ups are just higher ranking soldiers. You wouldn't really expect them to get any training in criminology and forensics. The best you could hope for is a mid level cleric type that gets assigned to "the watch" to do cursory investigations.
    "Sleeping late might not be a virtue, but it sure aint no vice. The old saw about the early bird and the worm just goes to show that the worm should have stayed in bed."

    - L. Long

    I think, therefore I get really, really annoyed at people who won't.

    "A plucky band of renegade short-order cooks fighting the Empire with the power of cheap, delicious food and a side order of whup-ass."

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Orc in the Playground
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    Mar 2007

    Default Re: How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    It's a high magic setting off the material plane, so they probably do have procedure for mind control goop. I'm not sure what it would be at the moment, beyond aboleth sanctions, but they'd have it.

    Quote Originally Posted by SpoonR View Post
    Mmm. Sounds like you want a LeStrade for your Sherlock. Strictly from a 'role in story' standpoint, I think the best role for the guards would be to reveal clues the PCs missed, or even just to give the PCs clues that the guards can't figure out. The PCs didn't follow up on the letter from library about an overdue book (Evil McNasty's Guide to Necromancy for Fun and Profit), so have a guard contact the PCs "hey, this book actually was returned right before victim died, but it is missing the pages on how to make a flesh golem".
    Actually I do have a vestigial NPC I was thinking of cutting that slides into this role perfectly! I wish I'd thought of it earlier so I could ground them in the player's minds before too much hit the fan, but better late than never.
    I've got a list of clues that the PCs can use to inform their conclusions. This NPC (Anita) can catch them up if they're struggling with any particular conclusion, but not as quickly. They already know the targets of the murders, these free clues can arrive too late for the PCs to use them to protect the victims but still help them piece together the killer maybe.

    Either way I'm agreeing with having the guard start to antagonize the PCs. At least one PC is convinced that she knows who the murderer is and has made more than one attempt to have that NPC put under police investigation for unrelated charges (neglect of his orphanage, mostly) so I could have them place that character under arrest and become hostile if the PCs realise they had the wrong guy when someone else dies?

    Should Anita be hostile to the PCs too, or should she be the only one in the guard on their side? Something else?

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    TheYell's Avatar

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    Default Re: How can I give the cops presence in a mystery adventure?

    Have Anita be the special expert brought in to solve the crime. That way the guard can refuse to do more than patrol saying "wait for Anita, its her case now." when she arrives the pcs have to earn her respect in order to get her helpful. you could have several Paths diverge from there: Anita and the guard are extremely hostile, anita and the guard are competitors to solve the case, anita and the guard are grateful and helpful, anita deputizes the PCs and gives them some authority and resources.
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