Age of Sigmar: Points and Handbooks

[Requizen]

Spoiler: SCE 2K

Show

Allegiance: Order
Lord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (240)
- General
- Trait: We Cannot Fail
- Artefact: God-forged Blade
- Mount Trait: Aethereal Stalker
Knight-Incantor (140)
Astreia Solbright (220)
10 x Sequitors (240)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
- 4x Stormsmite Greatmaces
10 x Sequitors (240)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
- 4x Stormsmite Greatmaces
5 x Sequitors (120)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
5 x Evocators (200)
3 x Evocators on Dracolines (300)
Celestar Ballista (100)
Cleansing Phalanx (120)

Total: 1920 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 106

So yeah I've put together a Stormcast list I'm planning on building towards. Opinions on it?

Hm, it's not bad, but I think there's some things that could change.

Solbright doesn't really bring a lot to the army, other than hanging around with the Dracolines. I think you need either her or the LA on Gryph, but not both.

With the points you save, I'd bring a bit more shooting. You want to soften targets up or clear away chaff before your big hitters get in, and while one Ballista is good, 2 or 3 would be better. Or change the min Sequitor unit to be Judicators or something.

Alternatively, dropping the Ballista could give you the points to get a Comet instead, which is super dope and you have plenty of Wizards to cast it. Give the Knight-Incantor the Staff of Focus (remember with a Battalion you get an extra Artifact), and then have her cast the Comet for extra damage!

Overall it's pretty good, though, as a first list I think you'll do quite well until you decide the things that need to change on your own. Hope that helps!

[Requizen]

LVO Q&A scuttlebutt is that this year will see something similar to 40k last year - many rapid-fire book releases with little to no models released alongside, mostly terrain/endless spells, but bringing many of the factions up to "modern" standards. The Skaven/FEC release definitely supports this inkling, as does the rumbling of a Slaves to Darkness/Darkoath/Everchosen book.

I'm excited! I'd love to see all the factions get updated into a similar point so there's less grumbling about Battletome v non-Battletome games. Then we can just have regular old "GW doesn't know how to balance" grumblings instead

[Requizen]

Apologies for the triple post, but FEC preview:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/...mepage-post-4/

[Drasius]

To save Requizen from a quadruple post, perhaps someone can point out the errors in my thinking?

I've bashed my head against a wall trying to come up with something that won't struggle too bad in our highly competative meta (one of our guys is ranked 3rd in Aus at the moment) and my old instincts of taking what I like keep trying to interfear with what feels like what I should be doing.

180 - Gaunt Summoner & Familiars, Bolt of Tzeentch, Arcane Sacrifice
380 - LoC, Mark of the Conjurer, Tzeentch's Inferno
200 - Sorceror Lord on Manticore, MoT, Shield of Fate

200 - 10x Pink Horrors, Fold Reality
180 - 10x Tzaangors
180 - 10x Chaos Warriors, MoT, Hand Weapon & Shield

420 - 9x Enlightened, Disks
200 - Mutalith

40 - Balewind Vortex

1980

Everytime I look at it, I can't help but think that the Manti lord, CW's and Mutalith could be a Tzaangor Shaman, Tzaangors and some Skyfires, at which point, the LoC and pinks just seem to be dead weight trying to make the summoning work and I might as well just go all Tzaangors all the time and double down on support instead.

Even if that's not the case, I can't help but feel that the Manti lord would be better off as a regular sorc on daemonic mount as rr1's to-hit, to-wound and saves seems like a pretty great way to ensure the enlightened mulch anything they come into contact with.

This line of thinking only seems to be reinforced when the availabliity of shrugging off mortal wounds comes into consideration.

Also, have I been looking at things wrong, or is pretty much every battalion for arcanites overcosted garbage?

[PraetorDragoon]

What is the plan with those 10 chaos warriors? They feel out of place to me.

[Drasius]

What is the plan with those 10 chaos warriors? They feel out of place to me.

Be slightly more durable chaff/charge bait than Tzaangors.

[Requizen]

Yeah I'm not super familiar with the Tzeentch book but I think in general if you're going Warriors you want a bigger brick than 10.

Honestly if you want chaff I'd just take another unit of Horrors. Free splitting and regenning is about as chaff as you can get, imo. I'd also consider swapping the Horrors and LoC's spells - remember you can Fold Reality the Enlightened for some Tzeentch-forsaken reason, so you want that to be very reliable.

But yeah, Acolyte stuff is pretty meh overall in the book. Tzaangor Battalions are pretty good thanks to Enlightened and Skyfires being dope, and Tzaangors themselves are nice once you get a big enough unit. I've not seen too many people running Acolytes outside min Battleline tho.

Also, FEC and Skaven warscrolls updated in the app. I didn't know either too well before, but I do know that Warp Fire Projectors changed a lot, which sucks if you run hordes but is great if you run elite. It's now "roll a dice for each model in the unit that is within 8", on a 4+ it takes a MW". Basically no fear for Monsters or big elite stuff, but could still pop up and clear out Grimghasts. I forsee a lot of people cutting theirs off, though.

[PraetorDragoon]

Honestly, you want Tzaangors and warriors in bigger blocks to be honest. Enlightened like having a Tzaangor Shaman around. He gives them +1 to hit by just hanging around. For chaff either grab more horrors, Marauders or Acolytes.

@Requizen: Minor changes to FEC from the looks of it. Flayers battlecry became 2d6 vs Bravery instead of d6+1 vs Bravery so thats a buff. Rest of it seems rather similiar to before. Archregent is a Ghoul King++, which is a bit boring imo. Chalice of Ushoran and the Corpsemare Stampede seem to be good spells.

[Requizen]

Pulled a 5-0 this weekend with my Anvils of the Heldenhammer! Feels good, I think I understand the list a lot better now.

So looking at the new Skaven warscrolls, all the big stuff now has a 5+ Ward save. It's gonna be really hard to focus them down now, the book is looking to be super strong.

[PraetorDragoon]

Pulled a 5-0 this weekend with my Anvils of the Heldenhammer! Feels good, I think I understand the list a lot better now.

So looking at the new Skaven warscrolls, all the big stuff now has a 5+ Ward save. It's gonna be really hard to focus them down now, the book is looking to be super strong.

Of course, it folds several subarmies together so you can cherrypick all the powerful stuff while retaining good allegiance abilities and relics. No doubt it will be strong.

The new FEC book hasn't impressed me. I hold no doubt there are some interesting and strong combos hiding in the details, but the grand changes are a bit mediocre. No changes to ghoul points, no changes to horrors and courtiers, no changes to dragons... I dunno, I expected a bit more balance changes. Monster Mash is going the way to go I think.

[Cheesegear]

Does this thread have any interest in seeing the Top 16 from LVO?

[Mystic Muse]

I'm definitely curious.

[Cheesegear]

Bear in mind none of this means anything to me. I haven't played literally two games of 2nd Ed.

Spoiler: 16. Nagash

Show

Grand Host of Nagash, Hysh (?)
Nagash; Overwhelming Dread, Amaranthine Orb, Blades of Shyish
Arkhan the Black; Fading Vigour
Necromancer; Aetherquartz Brooch, Soul Harvest

Dire Wolves (x5)
Grave Guard (x15); Wight Blades
Skeleton Warriors (x30); Ancient Blades

Umbral Spellportal
Soulsnare Shackles

1850 / 2000

Spoiler: 15. Beasts of Chaos

Show

Darkwalkers
Beastlord; Nomadic Leader, Desolate Shard
Great Bray Shaman; The Knowing Eye, Savage Dominion
Great Bray Shaman; Tendrils of Atrophy
Great Bray Shaman; Wild Rampage

Gors (x30); Blades and Shields
Bestigors (x30)
Bestigors (x30)
Bestigors (x20)

Ungor Raiders (x10)
Ungor Raiders (x10)
Ungor Raiders (x10)

Desolating Beastherd

Chronomantic Cogs
Wildfire Taurus

1990 / 2000

Spoiler: 14. Legion of Night

Show

Legion of Night, Aqshy
Mannfred; Vile Transferance
Necromancer; Morbheg's Claw, Overwhelming Dread
Vampire Lord; Flying Horror, Amethystine Pinions

Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x10)
Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears

Morghast Harbingers (x4); Spirit Swords
Grimghast Reapers (x20)

Balewind Vortex
Chronomantic Cogs

1950 / 2000

Spoiler: 13. Khorne

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Khorne, Shyish
Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore
(G) Lord of Khorne on Juggernaut; Berzerker Lord, Ethereal Amulet
Slaughterpriest; Blade of Endless Bloodshed, Blood Sacrifice
Slaughterpriest; Blood Sacrifice
Slaughterpriest; Blood Sacrifice
Slaughterpriest; Blood Sacrifice

Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes

Chaos Chariot; Greatblades

Brass Stampede

2000

Spoiler: 12. Nagash

Show

Grand Host of Nagash, Aqshy
(G) Wight King with Tomb Blade; Steed, Lord of Nagashizzar, Ignax's Scales
Necromancer; Ossific Diadem, Decrepify
Necromancer; Overwhelming Dread
Necromancer; Fading Vigour

Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears
Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears
Skeleton Warriors (x10); Spears
Grave Guard (x30); Wight Blades

Black Knights (x10)

Deathmarch

Chronomantic Cogs

1970 / 2000

Spoiler: 11. Nagash

Show

Grand Host of Nagash, Aqshy
Prince Vhordrai; Vile Transferance
(G) Necromancer; Master of Death, Ignax's Scales
Necromancer; Fading Vigour
Necromancer; Overwhelming Dread

Skeleton Warriors (x40); Blades
Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears
Dire Wolves (x5)

Grimghast Reapers (x30)
Grimghast Reapers (x10)

Chronomantic Cogs

1990 / 2000

Spoiler: 10. Khorne

Show

(G) Vorgaroth the Scarred & Skalok
Slaughterpriest; Brazen Rune, Bronzed Flesh
Slaughterpriest; Killing Frenzy
Slaughterpriest; Killing Frenzy

Bloodreavers (x10); Blades
Bloodreavers (x10); Blades
Chaos Marauders (x40); Axes & Shields, Khorne

Chaos Warshrine; Bronzed Flesh, Khorne

2000

Spoiler: 9. Slyvaneth

Show

Sylvaneth, Ghur
(G) Treelord Ancient; Gnarled Warrior, Oaken Armour, Regrowth
Drycha Hamadreth; Regrowth
Branchwych; Acorn of the ages, The Dwellers Below
Branchwych; Ranu's Lamentiri, Verdant Blessing

Dryads (x20)
Tree-Revenents (x5)
Tree-Revenents (x5)

Kurnoth Hunters (x3); Greatswords
Kurnoth Hunters (x3); Greatbows
Sisters of the Thorn (x5)

Gnarlroot Wargrove
Household

Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

1990 / 2000

Spoiler: Tzeentch

Show

Tzeentch, Hysh
(G) Great Summoner and Chaos Familiars; Arcane Sacrifice, Aspect of Tzeentch, Tzeentch's Firestorm
Fatemaster; Aetherquartz Brooch
Chaos Sorcerer Lord; Steed, Runestaff, Runesword, Arcane Suggestion
Great Bray Shaman

Tzaangors (x30); Pairs (x15), Greatblades (x12), Blade & Shield (x3)
Kairic Acolytes (x10); Blade & Shield (x7), Glaives (x3), Vulcharc & Scroll
Kairic Acolytes (x10); Blade & Shield (x7), Glaives (x3), Vulcharc & Scroll

Tzaangor Enlightened on Discs (x9)
Tzaangor Skyfires (x3)

Tzaangor Coven

Balewind Vortex

1970 / 2000

Spoiler: 7. Legion of Sacrament

Show

(G) Arkhan the Black; Overwhelming Dread
Necromancer; Fading Vigour
Guardian of Souls with Mortality Glass
Lord Executioner; Azyrbane Standard

Chainrasp Horde (x10)
Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x5)

Grimghast Reapers (x30)
Grimghast Reapers (x30)
Grimghast Reapers (x30)

Umbral Spellportal

1990 / 2000

Spoiler: 6. Nagash

Show

Nagah, Shyish
Arkhan the Black; Overwhelming Dread
Prince Vhordrai; Vile Transferance
(G) Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon; Lance & Shield & Chalice, Aura of Ages, Ethereal Amulet, Amethystine Pinions
Necromancer; Decrepify

Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x5)

Grimghast Reapers (x30)

Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

1990 / 2000

Spoiler: 5. Deepkin

Show

Dhorn-Hain, Hysh
(G) Vulturnos
Isharann Soulscryer; Aetherquartz Brooch
Drycha Hamadreth
Spellweaver; Heartwood Staff

Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x9)
Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x3)
Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x3)
Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (x6)
Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (x3)

Malevolent Maelstrom

2000

Spoiler: 4. Deepkin

Show

Dhorn-Hain
(G) Akhelian King; Born From Agony, Cloud of Midnight
Isharann Soulscryer
Isharann Soulscryer

Namarti Thralls (x20)
Namarti Thralls (x20)
Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x12)
Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (x3)

Eternal Guard (x20)
Khinerai Heartrenders (x5)

2000

Spoiler: 3. Stormcasts

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Hammers of Sigmar, Ghur
Gavriel Sureheart
Knight-Azyros; God-Forged Blade
Knight-Vexillor; Pennant of the Stormbringer
(G) Lord-Arcanum; We Cannot Fail, Azyrite Halo
Lord-Castellant

Liberators (x5); Warblades and Shields, Grandblade
Liberators (x5); Warblades and Shields, Grandblade
Sequitors (x20); Mauls & Shields (x11), Greatmaces (x9)

Evocators (x10); Celestial Blades
Evocators (x5); Terrifying Aspect
Evocators )x5); Celestial Blades

2000

Spoiler: 2. Stormcasts

Show

Ghur
(G) Lord-Celestant on Stardrake; Staunch Defender, Celestine Hammer, Shardfist Pelt, Keen-Clawed
Lord-Castellant
Knight-Incantor; Azyrite Halo
Knight-Incantor; Celestial Blades
Knight-Heraldor

Judicators (x5); Skybolt Bows, Shockbolt Bow
Judicators (x5); Skybolt Bows, Shockbolt Bow
Liberators (x5); Hammer & Shield, Grandhammer

Sequitors (x20); Mauls & Shields (x11), Greatmaces (x9)

Everblaze Comet
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

2000

---

Undeafted for 8 Rounds

Spoiler: 1. Flesheater Courts

Show

Crusading Army, Ghur
(G) Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist; Majestic Horror
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist; Grpyh-Feather Charm
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Zombie Dragon
Crypt Ghast Courtier; The Flayed Pennant

Crypt Ghouls (x20)
Crypt Ghouls (x10)
Crypt Ghouls (x10)

Ghoul Patrol

Chronomantic Cogs
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

2000

I hope I didn't miss anything. I'm not totally sure what I'm writing.

[PraetorDragoon]

Hmm... Grimghasts might be a tad too good.

Always good to see a "weaker" army score high.

[Requizen]

Of course, it folds several subarmies together so you can cherrypick all the powerful stuff while retaining good allegiance abilities and relics. No doubt it will be strong.

The new FEC book hasn't impressed me. I hold no doubt there are some interesting and strong combos hiding in the details, but the grand changes are a bit mediocre. No changes to ghoul points, no changes to horrors and courtiers, no changes to dragons... I dunno, I expected a bit more balance changes. Monster Mash is going the way to go I think.

The secret sauce is in the combos. There are lots of ways to fight first or fight extra times, get lots of extra attacks, get extra mobility, etc. If you're interested, Facehammer podcast has a rundown of the Battletome, there's some real power in there. If your army doesn't have a way to deal with 3-4 combat Monsters flying down your throat on Turn 1, you're going to have a bad time. I'm already thinking of how to adjust my lists, but my dudes are pretty good at popping big monsters as is.

Bear in mind none of this means anything to me. I haven't played literally two games of 2nd Ed.

My first impressions were that Legions of Nagash is way highly represented here. 6/16 isn't quite half, but it's still a lot. However, it's interesting to me that each one is fairly different. Obviously there are some similarities - 4/6 have Grimghast, 3/6 have Arkhan - but it's not a netlist that's showing up. Clearly the book is quite strong (having a lot to do with returning units for 1CP being good for 40 Skellies or 20/30 Grimghasts), but it's not monobuild. It obviously needs to be touched, though, and Grimghasts and Nagash would be good places to start (even though he wasn't here a lot, he's still a big power piece).

No Daughters is surprising, I wonder if that's because of their matchups (a bit rough into LoN and Stormcast, to say the least), or because people are starting to figure out how to fight them (figuring out how to kill the Heroes), or just because they're not popular. For whatever reason, I expect to see more at Adepticon and/or SCGT.

Overall, there's an ok spread here. Obviously LoN dominates numerically, but good showing from other armies as well. And of course, it's worth noting that even outside the top 16, there were 8 other 4-1 armies, only separated by Strength of Schedule, which included DoK, Nurgle, and Slaanesh (as well as another SCE, 2 more LoN, another Deepkin, and another Khorne).

As far as Battletome armies go, BCR, Bonesplitterz, Gitz, KO, and Nighthaunt aren't in the 4-1 or better category, but you don't have to go down much further to find BCR, Nighthaunt and Gitz. Bonesplitterz have their share of woes (mainly points issues caused by Kunnin Rukk making them a boogeyman, as well as lack of variety), and KO are just sad at the moment. Other non-Battletome factions and GA lists pop up in the top 50, giving a pretty good spread but it's clear that SCE and LoN are the ones to beat right now, with other armies having some solid builds as well.

Anyway, I'll give thoughts on lists.

Spoiler: 16. Nagash

Show

Grand Host of Nagash, Hysh (?)
Nagash; Overwhelming Dread, Amaranthine Orb, Blades of Shyish
Arkhan the Black; Fading Vigour
Necromancer; Aetherquartz Brooch, Soul Harvest

Dire Wolves (x5)
Grave Guard (x15); Wight Blades
Skeleton Warriors (x30); Ancient Blades

Umbral Spellportal
Soulsnare Shackles

1850 / 2000

Speaking of the big man himself. This is an interesting take on LoN, really depends on Nagash and Nagash Jr Arkhan to do the damage. 30 Skellies and 15 Gravegaurd are ok hitters, but they're clearly not the full backbone of the list. With Spellportal + Hand of Dust or Curse of Years, you have a good chance at obliterating things before they get across the board, and then mopping up with the skelebros + Nagash. Solid.

Spoiler: 15. Beasts of Chaos

Show

Darkwalkers
Beastlord; Nomadic Leader, Desolate Shard
Great Bray Shaman; The Knowing Eye, Savage Dominion
Great Bray Shaman; Tendrils of Atrophy
Great Bray Shaman; Wild Rampage

Gors (x30); Blades and Shields
Bestigors (x30)
Bestigors (x30)
Bestigors (x20)

Ungor Raiders (x10)
Ungor Raiders (x10)
Ungor Raiders (x10)

Desolating Beastherd

Chronomantic Cogs
Wildfire Taurus

1990 / 2000

I'm so hyped to see straight up Beasts of Chaos here, it's the first big event where they've been legal and people have also had time to get their feet wet with the book. As for the list itself, well, if you get Cogs off, blasting 80 Bestigors across the table is about as terrifying as BoC can get imo. Bestigors are super strong, very fast, and if they get to alpha into the opponent's territory, then the Desolating Beastherd exploding attacks are going to be absolutely brutal. And with 1 drop? Yes, please.

Spoiler: 14. Legion of Night

Show

Legion of Night, Aqshy
Mannfred; Vile Transferance
Necromancer; Morbheg's Claw, Overwhelming Dread
Vampire Lord; Flying Horror, Amethystine Pinions

Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x10)
Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears

Morghast Harbingers (x4); Spirit Swords
Grimghast Reapers (x20)

Balewind Vortex
Chronomantic Cogs

1950 / 2000

Mannfred? In my AoS? It's apparently more likely than you think. He's by far the worst Mortarch in my estimation, but he's still a hard to kill Death General with 20 Grimghasts and 40 Skeletons, so that's a thing. Morghasts are an interesting choice, but their inclusion makes sense since it helps the mobility of the army and gives multi-threats, all of which are fast and Fly. LoN is strong.

Spoiler: 13. Khorne

Show

Khorne, Shyish
Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore
(G) Lord of Khorne on Juggernaut; Berzerker Lord, Ethereal Amulet
Slaughterpriest; Blade of Endless Bloodshed, Blood Sacrifice
Slaughterpriest; Blood Sacrifice
Slaughterpriest; Blood Sacrifice
Slaughterpriest; Blood Sacrifice

Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes
Mighty Skullcrushers (x3); Axes

Chaos Chariot; Greatblades

Brass Stampede

2000

YES. I mean, it's so one-note, and it clangs against anything that has a 2+ save (looking at you #2 Stardrake), but the theme is so good, and the speed and board mobility you can get out of this type of list is really interesting. Multicharge into one unit, using your speed to hit flanks and mess up pile ins. Hit multiple small units at a time, preventing them from getting easy activations. Can threaten multiple Objectives at a time, forcing them to play very defensively lest they just explode. I love it.

Spoiler: 12. Nagash

Show

Grand Host of Nagash, Aqshy
(G) Wight King with Tomb Blade; Steed, Lord of Nagashizzar, Ignax's Scales
Necromancer; Ossific Diadem, Decrepify
Necromancer; Overwhelming Dread
Necromancer; Fading Vigour

Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears
Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears
Skeleton Warriors (x10); Spears
Grave Guard (x30); Wight Blades

Black Knights (x10)

Deathmarch

Chronomantic Cogs

1970 / 2000

Deathmarch is a very interesting LoN variant because it gives a surprising amount of mobility to Deathrattle units, especially when you combo it with Cogs. It differs from the other LoN lists here by not having Grimghasts (though the Grave Guard do a good approximation of it) and not having a big monster. No, as the name suggests it just marches forwards and drowns the opponent is bodies before they really have a chance to move out on the board. I played a version of Deathmarch this past weekend (dropped 2 Necros and 30 Skellies for an Ethereal VLoZD), and it's really kind of terrifying to see the wall of dudes converging on you. If you're an army that can't kill the Wight King quickly, you get surrounded before you know what happens. Free move + Cogs = 10" moving Grave Guard and Skeletons, 18" moving Black Knights. That's a bunch of hard to kill dudes (double Death save with the Diadem!) in the middle of the board! And It's only 4 drops!

Spoiler: 11. Nagash

Show

Grand Host of Nagash, Aqshy
Prince Vhordrai; Vile Transferance
(G) Necromancer; Master of Death, Ignax's Scales
Necromancer; Fading Vigour
Necromancer; Overwhelming Dread

Skeleton Warriors (x40); Blades
Skeleton Warriors (x40); Spears
Dire Wolves (x5)

Grimghast Reapers (x30)
Grimghast Reapers (x10)

Chronomantic Cogs

1990 / 2000

This is about what I would consider the closest to the "meta" or "netlist" LoN build. Big monster (usually Nagash, sometimes VLoZD) + 2/3 chunky units to drown the opponent in dice and cover the board. Killing a Necromancer is also not easy - it's low Wound count sure, but you also have to deal with Look Out, Sir! and shrugging wounds to a unit, not to mention Death saves. This type of list is quite oppressive, since there's so many threats and if you can't pop the General (basically impossible without heavy shooting or a really solid anti-Hero Wizard), you have to kill them multiple times. Without a Double Turn, that's quite hard.

Spoiler: 10. Khorne

Show

(G) Vorgaroth the Scarred & Skalok
Slaughterpriest; Brazen Rune, Bronzed Flesh
Slaughterpriest; Killing Frenzy
Slaughterpriest; Killing Frenzy

Bloodreavers (x10); Blades
Bloodreavers (x10); Blades
Chaos Marauders (x40); Axes & Shields, Khorne

Chaos Warshrine; Bronzed Flesh, Khorne

2000

1200 point Khorne Dragon behind a wall of chumps. Alright, I guess that's a thing now. He beat a 15 Eel list and a 15 Enlightened on Disc list? What the heck?

Killing big monsters is becoming really, really important. 30 wounds with the Warshrine save, AND it can start in Reserves? Watch out for this one.

Spoiler: 9. Slyvaneth

Show

Sylvaneth, Ghur
(G) Treelord Ancient; Gnarled Warrior, Oaken Armour, Regrowth
Drycha Hamadreth; Regrowth
Branchwych; Acorn of the ages, The Dwellers Below
Branchwych; Ranu's Lamentiri, Verdant Blessing

Dryads (x20)
Tree-Revenents (x5)
Tree-Revenents (x5)

Kurnoth Hunters (x3); Greatswords
Kurnoth Hunters (x3); Greatbows
Sisters of the Thorn (x5)

Gnarlroot Wargrove
Household

Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

1990 / 2000

Gnarlroot continues to be a strong contender, even though it was the first "real" Battletome to come out. Surprised to see the Bows on Hunters now - it's still strong to have that long shooting, multidamage unit, but overall I've found melee versions to be much stronger. Still, 2 big monsters, 6 Kurnoths, bonus casting, and smart placements of trees is a very tactical list and one that you can make a strong argument for in basically any situation.

Spoiler: Tzeentch

Show

Tzeentch, Hysh
(G) Great Summoner and Chaos Familiars; Arcane Sacrifice, Aspect of Tzeentch, Tzeentch's Firestorm
Fatemaster; Aetherquartz Brooch
Chaos Sorcerer Lord; Steed, Runestaff, Runesword, Arcane Suggestion
Great Bray Shaman

Tzaangors (x30); Pairs (x15), Greatblades (x12), Blade & Shield (x3)
Kairic Acolytes (x10); Blade & Shield (x7), Glaives (x3), Vulcharc & Scroll
Kairic Acolytes (x10); Blade & Shield (x7), Glaives (x3), Vulcharc & Scroll

Tzaangor Enlightened on Discs (x9)
Tzaangor Skyfires (x3)

Tzaangor Coven

Balewind Vortex

1970 / 2000

Enlightened are good. 30 Tzaangors is basically impossible to take off the table easily. It's good at playing the mission, even if it's not overpoweringly dominant in the way LoN is, or the way Changehost used to be.

Spoiler: 7. Legion of Sacrament

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(G) Arkhan the Black; Overwhelming Dread
Necromancer; Fading Vigour
Guardian of Souls with Mortality Glass
Lord Executioner; Azyrbane Standard

Chainrasp Horde (x10)
Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x5)

Grimghast Reapers (x30)
Grimghast Reapers (x30)
Grimghast Reapers (x30)

Umbral Spellportal

1990 / 2000

Do I need to say anything? If #11 was the "meta" LoN build, this is the "boogeyman" LoN build, the one that everyone really fears the most but doesn't want to talk about because, well, no one would really bring 90 Grimghasts with Arkhan to an event, would they?

...would they?

But yeah, it's crazy. If you can't dish out the weight of dice to drop a Grimghast unit quickly, it goes downhill fast. Arkhan isn't that difficult to take out if you can reach him... but you have to reach him. That's not super easy when there's 90 ghosts wagging scythes in your face.

Spoiler: 6. Nagash

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Nagah, Shyish
Arkhan the Black; Overwhelming Dread
Prince Vhordrai; Vile Transferance
(G) Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon; Lance & Shield & Chalice, Aura of Ages, Ethereal Amulet, Amethystine Pinions
Necromancer; Decrepify

Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x5)
Dire Wolves (x5)

Grimghast Reapers (x30)

Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

1990 / 2000

Last LoN list. Phew, almost done.

This one feels more tame initially than the one above because it only has 1/3 the amount of Reapers, but it trades those for 2 VLoZDs. If you play this into Duality of Death, you just cry. And it's not like the VLs are chumps either, plus they can't get strung out like the Grimghasts can. The lower body count makes it a bit worse at objective play, but you don't really give your opponent much breathing room when you chuck down two giant monsters and a bunch of ghosts. LoN monsters and blobs continue to do good, and probably will until they do something about Grimghasts and/or the Command Ability rez.

Spoiler: 5. Deepkin

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Dhorn-Hain, Hysh
(G) Vulturnos
Isharann Soulscryer; Aetherquartz Brooch
Drycha Hamadreth
Spellweaver; Heartwood Staff

Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x9)
Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x3)
Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x3)
Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (x6)
Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (x3)

Malevolent Maelstrom

2000

I don't even want to talk about this one. You have to be a special type of evil/crazy to take 3 units of Morrsarr in the first place, but to then follow up those 15 Eels with 9 more Eels? Absolute madman. I'm not even sure how to approach this type of list, everything is just so fast and there's just a lot of wounds. If you get doubled, you basically die, though 9 drops isn't super low. Not to mention the outflanking possibilities, which can just be brutal by themselves. Scary.

Spoiler: 4. Deepkin

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Dhorn-Hain
(G) Akhelian King; Born From Agony, Cloud of Midnight
Isharann Soulscryer
Isharann Soulscryer

Namarti Thralls (x20)
Namarti Thralls (x20)
Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (x12)
Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (x3)

Eternal Guard (x20)
Khinerai Heartrenders (x5)

2000

Double deepkin in the top 5. Two very different lists, too. Well, 12 Morrsarr isn't too different, but this has a lot more boots on the ground and is bringing allies. It's obviously designed to be a bit sneakier and tactical, the Thralls are good foot units that you can also outflank with the Soulscryers, creating a lot of flexibility in deployment and objective play. I would have a lot more fun playing this one than the previous one, in general, but obviously there's lot of room for variance in the Deepkin book.

Spoiler: 3. Stormcasts

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Hammers of Sigmar, Ghur
Gavriel Sureheart
Knight-Azyros; God-Forged Blade
Knight-Vexillor; Pennant of the Stormbringer
(G) Lord-Arcanum; We Cannot Fail, Azyrite Halo
Lord-Castellant

Liberators (x5); Warblades and Shields, Grandblade
Liberators (x5); Warblades and Shields, Grandblade
Sequitors (x20); Mauls & Shields (x11), Greatmaces (x9)

Evocators (x10); Celestial Blades
Evocators (x5); Terrifying Aspect
Evocators )x5); Celestial Blades

2000

Gav Bomb. Looking around, there were a double handful of Gav lists running around LVO, and this one is... perhaps not what I would consider the best of them, but it is a version that has just as much teeth as any others you'd see. 20 Evos is obviously very strong, and shoving it behind 20 Sequitors is nothing but a good time. I'm not sure I'd consider Gav Bomb to be the best Stormcast build (and indeed, it didn't make it quite as far as the next one), as it has a rough matchup into LoN due to the bubble wrap power those lists usually take.

Spoiler: 2. Stormcasts

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Ghur
(G) Lord-Celestant on Stardrake; Staunch Defender, Celestine Hammer, Shardfist Pelt, Keen-Clawed
Lord-Castellant
Knight-Incantor; Azyrite Halo
Knight-Incantor; Celestial Blades
Knight-Heraldor

Judicators (x5); Skybolt Bows, Shockbolt Bow
Judicators (x5); Skybolt Bows, Shockbolt Bow
Liberators (x5); Hammer & Shield, Grandhammer

Sequitors (x20); Mauls & Shields (x11), Greatmaces (x9)

Everblaze Comet
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

2000

"Stop hitting yourself" Stardrake. Any successfully rerolled save is a MW. Any natural 6 to save is a MW if you put on Azyrite Halo. Any 6+ to save (+1 for Staunch, +1 for Castellant Lantern, so often on a 4+ or 5+ against Rend-) is a MW from the Artifact. And 20 Sequitors to hide behind, plus Judis and Comet to pop some ranged damage.

At first glance, this list doesn't seem as oppressive as other lists above - indeed, it lacks a hard Hammer unit, the Stardrake itself doesn't hit hard and there's not much to kill Monsters unless you get a solid charge with the Sequitors. But, look at the field. Lots of low rend/no rend attacks (Skeletons, Grimghasts, Bestigors, Eels if they don't charge/have already used their Zap), so basically anything you throw the Stardrake into is just going to kill itself, and the Heraldor is running around keeping it from getting locked in bad places. It's a solid anti-meta pick when the meta is built around buckets of dice.

Undeafted for 8 Rounds

Spoiler: 1. Flesheater Courts

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Crusading Army, Ghur
(G) Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist; Majestic Horror
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist; Grpyh-Feather Charm
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Zombie Dragon
Crypt Ghast Courtier; The Flayed Pennant

Crypt Ghouls (x20)
Crypt Ghouls (x10)
Crypt Ghouls (x10)

Ghoul Patrol

Chronomantic Cogs
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh

2000

"Non-Battletome armies can't hang"
"FEC is too one note"
"You need shooting or hard shooting counters"

Nah, turns out if you can summon 4 extra units to the table, outflank the units you have, and punch people in the face with 3 big monsters casting Cogs, you can generally do just fine. This will change a bit with the new Tome (from what I hear, the double summoning Trait is no longer there, though I'd wait to confirm that), as will tactics around which spells and Battalions to take. But Bill proved that if you understand the meta, understand your army, and have a list that can play mindgames with your opponent, you can go 8-0 at a huge event with an army that for a majority of AoS was considered "fun and cool mid-tier".

Great event to watch and keep up with, can't wait to see some of these people at Adepticon!

[PraetorDragoon]

The secret sauce is in the combos. There are lots of ways to fight first or fight extra times, get lots of extra attacks, get extra mobility, etc. If you're interested, Facehammer podcast has a rundown of the Battletome, there's some real power in there. If your army doesn't have a way to deal with 3-4 combat Monsters flying down your throat on Turn 1, you're going to have a bad time. I'm already thinking of how to adjust my lists, but my dudes are pretty good at popping big monsters as is.

Oh, definitly. Buffed AGKoRT attacking twice is going to hurt. I just hoped that Ghouls would drop in points, because they're coming up short compared to Chainrasps and Skeletons imo despite being more costly in points.

"Non-Battletome armies can't hang"
"FEC is too one note"
"You need shooting or hard shooting counters"

Nah, turns out if you can summon 4 extra units to the table, outflank the units you have, and punch people in the face with 3 big monsters casting Cogs, you can generally do just fine. This will change a bit with the new Tome (from what I hear, the double summoning Trait is no longer there, though I'd wait to confirm that), as will tactics around which spells and Battalions to take. But Bill proved that if you understand the meta, understand your army, and have a list that can play mindgames with your opponent, you can go 8-0 at a huge event with an army that for a majority of AoS was considered "fun and cool mid-tier".

Great event to watch and keep up with, can't wait to see some of these people at Adepticon!

Its a bit weird why people instantly write off armies or compendium stuff without even trying them, despite that those tend to do decent in most cases.

[Cheesegear]

Its a bit weird why people instantly write off armies or compendium stuff without even trying them, despite that those tend to do decent in most cases.

It's an issue - IMO - of Factions being bad, but cherry-picked units, being good.
Except when your average player thinks about starting Flesh-Eaters, they're not thinking about picking up three Dragons.

Same thing happens in 40K - a good example is an Astartes list also made Top 8 at LVO. 'Space Marines are competitive u gaiz!' ...Well, they're not. The guy just cherry-picked out the most anti-meta units he could and played against the meta, knowing the kinds of armies he would play against because of the format. And it paid off.
Same thing happened at CanCon (the LVO, but for Australia). 'Sisters are competitive', well, sure...When you take ~50 Storm Bolters and enough Deny the Witches (Unbinds) to choke a whale.

But say, placings #4, 3 and 2...They seem like 'normal person' armies. Like, a casual player might accidentally end up making the same list just by buying units that they happen to like.

[9mm]

It's an issue - IMO - of Factions being bad, but cherry-picked units, being good.
Except when your average player thinks about starting Flesh-Eaters, they're not thinking about picking up three Dragons.

The classic advice for starting FEC is get two Start Collecting boxes; which would give you two dragons. Infact fastest way to build that army is 3 Start Collecting and an extra box of ghouls.

I'd debate the claim that FEC was considered Middle of the Road though, everyone was surprised when no one showed up with FEC at the last tourney.

[Requizen]

So I've listened to the two Facehammer podcasts for the new books, they go through basically rule by rule and warscroll by warscroll.

FEC are going to be absolutely bonkers. There seems to be a multitude of ways to get extra pile ins (Allegiance CA, one of the Hosts can pile in after dying, etc), as well as extra attacks (spells, CAs, Artifacts). One of the Hosts has Run + Charge on a CA or Artifact, and the Ghoul Host has a CA to bring back a Ghoul unit that died on a 4+. With summoning, high speed units, and multiple volleys of attacks, I think FEC are going to become one of the new standards for melee-only armies to be held to.

Skaven are hard to judge as I don't have the points in front of me, but hearing the rules makes me quite terrified. They've got some teleporting (Skitterleap is a Lore spell now, though it's a lesser version only 9" away from enemies, and Gnawholes look amazing), some very good spells, and a whole host of units that give out buffs. Not to mention many of the shooting units got better, which is generally a good indicator of a strong book as it has been for SCE, Sylvaneth, and Tzeentch (and KO before they got a big nerf bat). I don't think they'll be a pure shooting army that tables people with bullets, but they definitely have ways to snipe important units with Warp Lightning Cannons (now available to teleport and supercharge for 12 dice!) and Jezzails (also teleporting and do MWs on unmodified 6s!).

I can easily see both becoming armies to fear in the next few months. They'll be legal for Adepticon and I can only hope to get some games in against them before then so I don't go in blind to all the tricks.

[The_Admiral]

so tournament confirmed to be 1000+500, here's the list

Spoiler

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Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: Hammers of Sigmar

Leaders
Lord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (240)
- General
Knight-Incantor (140)

Battleline
10 x Sequitors (240)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
10 x Sequitors (240)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields

Units
3 x Evocators on Dracolines (300)
5 x Evocators (200)

War Machines
Celestar Ballista (100)

Total: 1460 / 1500
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 200
Wounds: 89

any major issues with it? cut the catvocators for more foot dude?

[Requizen]

so tournament confirmed to be 1000+500, here's the list

Spoiler

Show

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: Hammers of Sigmar

Leaders
Lord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (240)
- General
Knight-Incantor (140)

Battleline
10 x Sequitors (240)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
10 x Sequitors (240)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields

Units
3 x Evocators on Dracolines (300)
5 x Evocators (200)

War Machines
Celestar Ballista (100)

Total: 1460 / 1500
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 200
Wounds: 89

any major issues with it? cut the catvocators for more foot dude?

Hm, I think it's fine overall. I wonder if a Comet wouldn't be better than a Ballista - while the Ballista is good, as a singular shooting unit it's not anything phenominal. The Comet would give you a long range disruption/nuke piece that softens multiple units, which I think would be better overall.

What spells you thinking for the Heroes? I think one should have Halo for sure, but there are plenty of other good options.

[The_Admiral]

Hm, I think it's fine overall. I wonder if a Comet wouldn't be better than a Ballista - while the Ballista is good, as a singular shooting unit it's not anything phenominal. The Comet would give you a long range disruption/nuke piece that softens multiple units, which I think would be better overall.

What spells you thinking for the Heroes? I think one should have Halo for sure, but there are plenty of other good options.

I'm thinking about replacing the catvocators with more on foot. Spells is yeah Halo and Speed of Lightning

[Requizen]

I'm thinking about replacing the catvocators with more on foot. Spells is yeah Halo and Speed of Lightning

Foot are more points efficient, Cats give speed. Both are solid, though if you take more foot put them in one unit so you get more out of the combat activation.
Also don't forget Evos get a spell. I almost always give them Speed of Lightning and the Heroes get something else.

[The_Admiral]

Foot are more points efficient, Cats give speed. Both are solid, though if you take more foot put them in one unit so you get more out of the combat activation.
Also don't forget Evos get a spell. I almost always give them Speed of Lightning and the Heroes get something else.

huh fair, I'm more worried about being chewed up by ranged attacks because I /think/ I can kill most things that get in melee?

[Requizen]

huh fair, I'm more worried about being chewed up by ranged attacks because I /think/ I can kill most things that get in melee?

Oh yeah, Sequitors and Evos will brutalize anything in melee. There aren't really any spells to prevent shooting, though. Staunch helps, and with the 100 you save going from mounted to foot Evos you could grab a Castellant tho.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

So I hit 4k pts with my 40k models, and am considering picking up an AoS army instead of expanding my Necrons more. Any tips for beginners? I'm looking at Idoneth Deepkin rn, and I know they just announced a decent looking Start Collecting. I know Idoneth meta is go all-in on either Eels or Namarti/Isharran, but the LVO list below had mixed, so would picking up 2 Start Collecting Boxes + 1 King be an acceptable start?

Also, any drastically different mind-set things not obvious switching from 40k to AoS? I know Mortal Wounds look much more important, and it looks like Pile In is a big deal too, but also looks like armour saves are lower and ward saves might not be a thing anymore? Last time I looked at Fantasy must have been, oh, 5th edition?

[Requizen]

So I hit 4k pts with my 40k models, and am considering picking up an AoS army instead of expanding my Necrons more. Any tips for beginners? I'm looking at Idoneth Deepkin rn, and I know they just announced a decent looking Start Collecting. I know Idoneth meta is go all-in on either Eels or Namarti/Isharran, but the LVO list below had mixed, so would picking up 2 Start Collecting Boxes + 1 King be an acceptable start?

Also, any drastically different mind-set things not obvious switching from 40k to AoS? I know Mortal Wounds look much more important, and it looks like Pile In is a big deal too, but also looks like armour saves are lower and ward saves might not be a thing anymore? Last time I looked at Fantasy must have been, oh, 5th edition?

Heavy Eel Deepkin is the FotM right now, but I wouldn't go all-in on them like the #5 at LVO. It's a gimmick that'll win a lot of games for sure, but I'd bet a good amount of money that Morrsarr (the offensive Eel version) will get a big points hike in the next General's Handbook and might even lose their conditional Battleline (just a guess, don't quote me). Still, they're absolutely bonkers on the charge and that's probably not going to change, so getting a unit or two of them is basically a must for Deepkin. Ishlaen (defensive Eels) are ok too, just don't expect them to do the heavy lifting.

I think Namarti Thralls are solid even if you don't go all-in on them. 10-20 Thralls will make short work of most units in the game if they get to swing first, especially Heroes and lighter Monsters since they get those Damage 2 attacks against high Wound counts. Reavers don't really light my fire, but they're fast and if you get the multi-shot off they put out quite a bit of dice so that's nice. Between the two I'd lean towards Reavers but a mix is fine.

I personally like a mix of all units for Deepkin - Eels for running and punching, Thralls for holding down objectives, maybe a unit of Reavers for some flexible range support. You can easily go heavy in either direction, but I personally think you and your opponent will get more enjoyment out of a balanced build. And then you can get the most out of the new Start Collecting box, too!


As for general AoS tips, there's a few things I'd point out to new players. I haven't dug into 40k's nuances too much, so I don't know how different it is, but here's a couple pointers:

-Mortal Wounds are both more and less important. More important, in that there's more ways to get them in general so being aware of them in a big difference. Less important, in that saves are (broadly speaking) lower in AoS and things die much faster - obvious excpetions being things designed to survive like Fyreslayers and Nurgle. So even without MWs you'll chew through units fairly quickly once combat starts, especially since most armies have at least 1 or 2 units that are designed to wipe an enemy per turn. Some armies have little to no MW access and can table opponents quite quickly, while other armies have easy access to MWs but don't rely on them for one reason or another.

-Ward Saves very much exist, but like everything else in AoS there's no "USR" for it. Nurgle Daemons have Disgustingly Resilient, Fyreslayers have Berserk Fury, Verminlords have Protection of the Horned Rat, Legions of Nagash have Deathless Minions, etc. Just have to read the Warscrolls to find out (Daughters of Khaine get it as a faction ability too, if I'm not mistaken)

-Piling in is a very important rule to master. Since it's always a 3" pile in, but has to be towards the closest model, you can do lots of cute things. Charge one unit (you don't have to declare charge targets in AoS, and Overwatch is only on a few units), but then end some models 3.1" away from another unit. That second unit can't pile in yet, but when your charging unit piles in they have to pile towards the second unit since it's the closest, letting you engage multiple units with varying activation times. Additionally, though your pile-in move has to end closer to or equidistant to the closest enemy model, you can "wheel around" that model and get better positioning, very important due to weapon ranges in melee.
Stopping this is just as important. If you get two models in base-to-base contact with an enemy model, that model can't move since it can't get any closer to those two models, and can't remain the same distance if it piles away. Learning the ins-and-outs of holding things in combat is super important.

-Tangentially, positioning to pile in and receive charges is just as important. You are engaged in combat if you're within 3" of an enemy, so if you place unit B 2" behind unit A, and unit A gets charged (on 25mm bases), you're in combat and can pile in to fight over the top of unit A's head, while the enemy unit can't reach unit B unless they have 3" weapons. That sort of thing.

-Zoning is a big deal. You can't move within 3" of an enemy unit outside charging (and a couple other abilities), so you can "bubble wrap" important units or objectives much more efficiently than in 40k (though 1" coherency changes things as well). Practice using the minimal amount of units to get the most space possible. All objectives in AoS (outside of Duality of Death, Three Places of Power, and Places of Arcane Power) are held by having the most models within 6", and since combat is the majority of the game, spacing out objectives is tantamount to winning.

-Heroes can be targeted by enemy shooting at any time unlike 40k, but incur a -1 to be hit (shooting) if they're near a big enough unit. Shooting is not as prevalent in AoS as it is in 40k for obvious reasons, but positioning your buff Heroes and using LoS is still a big deal against many armies.

-There are also a lot of little differences between AoS and 40k mechancially, like the above mentioned coherency and engagement ranges. For instance, Hero Phase (which is essentially Psychic Phase + other stuff) comes before Movement, so using short range spells can be quite tricky, and you have to deploy to be in range of abilities on your first turn rather than moving into range. Cover counts in melee for AoS (not sure it does for 40k), so a unit on an objective might want to just sit in cover and receive charges. Get used to using the Mysterious Terrain rules as well, as Mystical and Arcane really influence deployment and what not.

Hope that helps! Feel free to ask more questions too.

[The Robot Goat]

Hey, with somebody talking about moving over from 40k, I figured I'd jump on the bandwagon and ask a question. Would it be worth splitting Soul Wars with somebody (stormcast side)? I assume so due to sheer number of models, but the units you get are also worthwhile, yeah? Specifically, would the units combo at all well with the Heldenhammer traits (that's how I've painted the rest of my army).

Also, on a similar topic, I have Blood & Thunder (the middle-of-the-run old Stormcast vs Khorne set) and I'm looking to expand. In terms of depth, does the Stormcast Vanguard or the new(er) Magic Chamber that I've forgotten the name of have more depth? I have a problem where I tend to be attracted to armies with impressive statlines and get left in the dust when they are fairly one-note, strategically speaking (looking at you, Ironjawz).

Edited:
Also, thank you, Requizen, for the handy AoS vs 40k cheat sheet you've provided.

[PraetorDragoon]

Soul Wars is a tricky beast. While it is a nice set, there are some odd numbered models in there, which can be awkward. (for example, only 4 of the Reapers while they are pointed in blocks of 10).

In terms of depth... what is your definition of depth? Stormcast have shooting, melee, magic, prayers and monsters, so can cover all the bases well.

[Requizen]

Soul Wars is a tricky beast. While it is a nice set, there are some odd numbered models in there, which can be awkward. (for example, only 4 of the Reapers while they are pointed in blocks of 10).

In terms of depth... what is your definition of depth? Stormcast have shooting, melee, magic, prayers and monsters, so can cover all the bases well.

Yeah, Soul Wars actually works best if you get two copies of your side (each person buys a Soul Wars and swaps), because while it's good for the price, you end up with those half-units. For SCE specifically, you get enough Sequitors for one 5 man unit, and then a Prime with Shield (which you'll never, ever use) and two extra dudes. You get 3 Evocators... when they come in units of 5, and 5 Castigators... when they come in units of 3!?

But, that's actually not really that big of a problem. The Sequitors are fine, and you can expand it a bit by buying a few of the easy-build ones. The Evocators suck, but if you get the Nightvault box, they have 2 Evocators and a Knight-Incantor (and no one will care if you use them as generic versions). Two extra Castigators is fine, especially if you kitbash a prime out of random SCE parts. The Heroes and Ballista are great, and honestly if you're splitting the box then the price of a mounted Hero, a foot Hero, and a Ballista pretty much covers the split cost.

Overall I'd say go for the split with those caveats, but also remember than a billion people did the same thing, so finding extra Evos, Sequitors, and Castigators in a pre-used pile is pretty likely, so that's another way to easily fill the gaps.


Stormcast do have all those things, but just be careful you don't become a "Jack of all trades, master of none" list by taking a little bit of shooting, a little bit of punching, a little bit of elite, a little bit of magic... and then end up with a half-baked army. @Robot Goat, if you find the base Stormcast stuff a bit one-note, then definitely mix in some other stuff. What kind of things are you looking for? SCE definitely have some of the better statlines in the game, and they can play a tricky list but not necessarily as tricky as other armies.