Age of Sigmar: Points and Handbooks

[Requizen]

Expensive characters at small point values are a trap, unless they're something that can table the opponent by themselves like Beastclaw stuff. One hero is enough for us Stormcast at that level (other armies that rely on combos such as Bloodbound are different). The exception is something cheap like the Lord Relictor.

I think for that point level the Lord Celestant on Dracoth is enough hitting power, probably drop the Knight-Venator. You'll also have to be careful with the Dracoth hero since he'll get separated by speed really quickly.

Honestly the best Stormcast build for that point level (imo) is something like this:

Spoiler

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LC on Dracoth
Judicators
Judicators
Prosecutors with Javelins
Prosecutors with Javelins
700

Where your Lord Celestant just runs around smashing faces while everything else jumps around in back doing damage from a range (which they're quite good at). If you want to run more punchy dudes you probably want something like this:

Spoiler

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Lord Celestant
Liberators
Liberators
Protectors
Retributors
720

Note that this list is slow as crap, but anything you reach you should either tie up with Libs or obliterate with everything else. Lord Celestant's +1 to hit bubble makes the Retributors deal 2MWs on 5+ to hit which is nuts, and the Protectors can help a reasonable amount against shooty lists with their -1 to hit.

At low point levels (aka 1000 or less) you need every unit to work well together. I feel like your lists were a bit scattered - Liberators want to tie up things but were too slow to keep up with the LC on Dracoth and the Venator is quick and ranged enough to not need bodyguards at most times. Celestant-Prime is probably too expensive for a pure SE army at 740.

[Yaktan]

ok. Good to know.

It turns out out tournament is comming up, and the battalion boxes are not out yet, so I went ahead and got the other boxes I wanted since my FLGS had a nice black friday sale, so I have this list:

Spoiler

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Lord-celestant

Judicators
Judicators

Protectors
Prosecutors

700 points.

I probably could get away with building the two Retributors from the Start Collecting box and the other paladins without arms, to run them as Retributors here (I want protectors for building up to skyborn slayers). Especially with the Lord-celestant the retributors seem much nicer.

[Closet_Skeleton]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/...m-blood-glory/

Looks like Goblins are still one of the top lists.

While the winning army is two heroes and no monsters or artillery.

So much for Age of Sigmar ruining warhammer where basic infantry always sucked.

[Requizen]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/...m-blood-glory/

Looks like Goblins are still one of the top lists.

While the winning army is two heroes and no monsters or artillery.

So much for Age of Sigmar ruining warhammer where basic infantry always sucked.

Req's analysis of the top Blood and Glory Lists:

Spoiler: #1 - Stormcast Eternals sorta standard

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Warrior Brotherhood is the hotness for Stormcast. If you're not running this or Skyborne Slayers (though WB seems to be preferred at the moment), you're likely doing it wrong.

Interesting to note that he's utilizing double Knight-Azyros. While it makes sense, I'd also not really thought of it since you generally prefer to have a smashy Hero in there as well - but they're cheap and you get pinpoint strikes at two separate instances. And they're no slouches in combat, though nothing overly special.

I personally don't agree with Maces on the Protectors, but honestly it's pretty meta-dependent. Both are good against Monsters, though the Glaives have a higher ceiling. If you're not going against Monsters that often, the Maces are better in general. When you're running 4/10, you'll have enough of both, though.

The list is pretty obvious - start with nothing on the board, use the Azyroses (Azyri?) to put the Retributors and Protectors where they can kill things, and then everything else does objective things and/or body blocking. 10 man Paladin bricks are good, but so are 5 man bricks, so that's just preference.

I don't understand the Prosecutors, though. The axes are doing an approximation of Decimators, I suppose, though I'd still prefer either other big weapon for that sweet damage 2 against anything that's not hordes. But paired hammers? Not even shields? I get that the 3d6" charge range is nice for the 9" Lightning Strike bubble, but they're just kinda... ok at best? There's a reason people take Javelins, and it's not just for the 20 points saved. But what do I know, I'm not the 1st place winner.

Spoiler: #2 - Chaos 3/5 of the Gods in attendance

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I'm a relatively big fan of this list. People love to complain about Stormfiends (and they are a bit of a pain), but in this case I'll give it a pass since he's not running Skyre shenanigans.

The Nurgle core is something I will always give a thumbs up to. Plaguebearers will likely see a point bump in the next edition, because for 100 points they're harder to kill than most army's purported durable units. And that makes sense for Nurgle, but I've seen them tie up things quadruple their cost because 5+++ and the Banner is just silly.

I like the triple threat list here. Stormfiends, Fatey, and the GUO are all things that can ruin your day. Maybe Fatey a bit less so depending on your army, but Gift of Change goes off 3/4 of the time and blasts out d6 MWs, and then he can still Arcane Bolt on top of it. Lynchpin armies like Bloodbound will cry when faced with that.

So a strong wall of cheap Nurgle dudes with WLCs behind and the triple God threat (sorry Khorne and Slaanesh, you're not wanted here) punching your face. It's just a solid army. Sayl + Stormfiends in the only thing I'd consider a "gimmick", the rest is just a solid force. Love seeing armies like this.

Spoiler: #3 - Destruction is for bad people

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Ugh.

Uuuuuughh.

You can combat this list. It's not broken and blowing out power levels in the way that things do in other games. But there's few things in AoS I hate as much as a Frostlord Stonehorn healing 3d3 wounds per turn with Battlebrew on top of it. And 3 Thundertusks blasting out d6 MWs each, even after they run. Just disgusting.

I'm glad to see the Grots though. Big blobs of dudes is a fun way to play the game, and they're effective at their job in this case as well. Blob in front of/around the monsters, keep them safe until the Stonehorn can charge. You need really good positioning and a modicum of luck to combat this setup, though strong shooting lists should be able to drop the Thundertusks sorta quickly.

Spoiler: #4 - Sylvaneth big angry trees

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I generally expect to see more Wood summoning when it comes to Sylvaneth. The list that people like to complain about with Sylvaneth is "cover the board in trees, laugh at people trying to move", but this isn't that list. This is just Alarielle the wrecking ball being supported by two big monsters and Kurnoth Hunters from a range. The Tree Revenants are pretty interesting, since they sorta suck (100/5 for 1W, 5+ models is generally bad), but threatening backline objectives with their teleport makes them relatively tactical.

I'd like to find a VOD of this army being played - it's a pretty atypical Sylvaneth list. I imagine it's a bit straightforward with monsters running up the field while the Battleline sits on objectives and the Hunters stand in back with their great 30" range, but that can be countered pretty easily by other top lists so I'd like to see how it plays out.

Spoiler: #5 - Destruction for less bad people

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Nnneyyyhhh. Alright, it's only 2 Beastclaw monsters so I'm somewhat less annoyed.

152 Grots is a lot. Like, a lot a lot. "I don't even know how to fight that" a lot. And up to a 3+ save on them, with wounding on 2s, and -1 to hit them if everything goes off. Hot dang. If you can chunk them down and take out the Shamans, it's a bit easier to fight, but that's a big brick that's going to sit in the middle of the table and just fite things.

I like it in general, because I'm glad a fluffy blobs of Grots list is viable in this game.

The variety in these armies is nice. We have a tactical list, a straightforward multithreat with well rounded core list, two monster mashes, and a blob list. That's awesome.

Sad that there's no Death though. Would have liked to see each GA represented.

[Felhammer]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/...m-blood-glory/

Looks like Goblins are still one of the top lists.

While the winning army is two heroes and no monsters or artillery.

So much for Age of Sigmar ruining warhammer where basic infantry always sucked.

That is a lot of fanatics. I know they hit hard but they are really fragile.

[Requizen]

That is a lot of fanatics. I know they hit hard but they are really fragile.

They don't need to hit at all, to be honest. They charge at the beginning of any charge phase, including your opponents.

"Oh, I see you're about to charge Nagash into my unit. Would be a shame if he got stopped cold by a single Fanatic cannonballing into his ankle".

[Yaktan]

So, our Sigmar tournament is next week. I mostly have my army put together for it.

However, today I am picking up the battleforce, and realized I could change my army around a bit, since I still have a week to get stuff put together.

Here is my current list:

Hammertime!

Spoiler

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Lord-celestant 100

Judicators 160
Judicators 160

Prosecutors 80
Retributors 220

Total: 720

Here is my tweaked list:

Spoiler

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Lord-celestant on Dracoth 220

Judicators 160
Judicators 160
Liberators 100

Prosecutors 80

Total: 720

I also briefly considered just replacing the Retributors from the first list with Fulminators, but decided that would leave me with too few bodies.

The advantage of the first list is the retributors form a mighty fine brick, especially when boosted by the Lord Celestant.

The advantage of the second list is my general is more durable, has more speed to get places, and has the really nice no-battleshock bubble.

What do people think? If it matters, my lord on dracoth would have the glaive, since long term I want fulminators.

[Requizen]

So, our Sigmar tournament is next week. I mostly have my army put together for it.

However, today I am picking up the battleforce, and realized I could change my army around a bit, since I still have a week to get stuff put together.

Here is my current list:

Hammertime!

Spoiler

Show

Lord-celestant 100

Judicators 160
Judicators 160

Prosecutors 80
Retributors 220

Total: 720

Here is my tweaked list:

Spoiler

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Lord-celestant on Dracoth 220

Judicators 160
Judicators 160
Liberators 100

Prosecutors 80

Total: 720

I also briefly considered just replacing the Retributors from the first list with Fulminators, but decided that would leave me with too few bodies.

The advantage of the first list is the retributors form a mighty fine brick, especially when boosted by the Lord Celestant.

The advantage of the second list is my general is more durable, has more speed to get places, and has the really nice no-battleshock bubble.

What do people think? If it matters, my lord on dracoth would have the glaive, since long term I want fulminators.

I like the second list a lot! You'll have a solid backline with the Judicators and some mobility to do objectives and rush opponents. I think it'll do well.

[Requizen]

If you want some background noise for today, Warhammer TV will be doing a stream for the next 6 hours or so from this post. Stream link: https://www.twitch.tv/warhammer

Playing AoS, first Narrative and then Matched.

[Yaktan]

I am going to run the second list, and got my Lord on Dracoth put together yesterday, so I have all the guys for it ready to go.

I must say, I do really like how the Dracoth riders look in person. Though putting on the weapon arm is a little tricky since the spots to glue on the arm are angled such that it is tricky to hold it in place when you glue both at once.

[Requizen]

They're wonderful models, for sure.

So I learned that Adepticon's AoS events are going to have you roll for random Traits and Artifacts. That sucks a bit, especially since the Order traits are about half not great. The Artifacts aren't bad, though, but I'd much rather get to choose mine.

Had a test game against Beastclaw Raiders last night. I was running the list from yesterday's stream to try it out, he was running pure Beastclaw.

Spoiler: My List

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Celestant-Prime
Lord-Celestant
Knight-Venator

Liberators (Shields, Grandhammer)
Liberators (Shields, Grandhammer)
Judicators (Crossbows, Shockbolt Bow)
Judicators (Bows, Shockbolt Bow)

Protectors x10 (4 Starsoul Maces)
Decimators (2 Starsoul Maces)
Prosecutors with Javelins
Prosecutors with Javelins

Skyborne Slayers

1980/2000

Spoiler: Beastclaw Raiders

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Frostlord on Stonehorn
Huskard on Thundertusk

Thundertusk Beastriders
Stonehorn Beastriders
Mournfang Cavalry
Mournfang Cavalry

Yhetees

2000/2000

Spoiler: BatRep

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We rolled and got Gift from the Heavens, which is one I haven't played too much. He rolled his traits, getting reroll 1s to hit on the charge and add 1 damage to a weapon on his General. I got Reckless, yay! And then on my Lord-Celestant I got Phoenix Stone (meh) and the Knight-Venator got the Talisman of Blinding Light (pretty good for him).

He won the roll to deploy, and put his Mournfang and Yhetees on one side, Stonehorns on the other, and Thundertusks dead center. I had the Knight Venator, a unit of Prosecutors, and some Liberators on one side in a corner and the other Prosecutors in the other corner, everything else up in the sky.

I let him have first turn, knowing there wasn't too much for him to do. Everything moved up, but the Thundertusks were out of range for their breath and the Stonehorn were too far to charge. This is why you take Destruction allegiance. Also, I don't think he knew you can run and charge with Stonehorn, or run and use the breath weapon with Thundertusks. I don't think it would have changed too much of the game, but it was worth noting that he didn't do either.

I decided not to come down on Turn 1, instead just taking some potshots and positioning my Liberators for a charge. I shot off 5 wounds from a Mournfang and failed the charge.

We rolled for priority, which ended with my choice. I didn't know where the objectives were yet, so I let him have first again. His dropped on the side of the board with the Mournfang, and he moved up to charge. The only Thundertusk in breath range failed on a 1, lucky for me. That side all charged into the Liberators and Prosecutors, while the General on Stonehorn charged the lone Prosecutor unit, obliterating them. The Liberators and Prosecutors on the other side were slain by the Yhetees and Mournfang.

My metor came down in my center zone. Then, the Skyborne Slayers arrived! I positioned the landing zone between the two objectives. Only one part of the unit has to be in the bubble, not all models, so even though the objectives are nearly 3' apart and I only have a 2' diameter, I could chain out the Judicators into the 6" holding bubble, giving me both Objectives. The Protectors set up to charge the Huskard, the Decimators moved toward the Yhetees and Mournfang. The remaining Liberators set up to try and screen out the Stonehorns, and the Lord-Celestant just positioned himself to give charge rerolls to everything. Shooting dropped the weakened Mournfang unit, and charges obliterated the Huskard and cut down one of the remaining Mournfang. The Yhetees with their silly jump pile in were able to bring the Lord-Celestant to a single wound remaining, which hurt.

I won the priority roll again, taking the double turn. The Celestant-Prime came down (Prime Time!) behind the Thundertusks to support the Protectors. The Knight-Venator earned his paycheck, dealing 6 wounds to the Thundertusk that was still alive thanks to his Star Fated Arrow. I finished it off with the Prime's Comet and the Crossbows, which was wonderful. The Bows and the Celestant's Hammer Cloak killed the Yhetees. Charges saw me kill the remaining Mournfang and put the non-General Stonehorn down to 4 wounds left (that halving power is strong).

His turn 3, I've already racked up 10 points to his 0 and he has 2 Stonehorns left. He charged the Protectors, killing all but one Starsoul Mace. "Take a Battleshock to kill it off". "I'm Immune with Skyborne Slayers". "Let's just call it here then, shall we?".

Quick game, but fun nonetheless. Maybe not for him, especially since right before I got there he lost to Clan Skryre with their tunnelling shenanigans. So two games in a row with alpha strike lists is pretty brutal, but we had some laughs and rolled dice. Sad the Prime didn't get to charge, though.

I think he could have won if he didn't take my bait with the Stonehorn General. Peeling off his most powerful dude to kill 3 Prosecutors (80 points!) was exactly what I wanted, and exactly not what he should have done. I think if he had stuck together as a big 4 Monster wrecking ball, I would have had a lot of trouble killing things off. My initial charge only got the Thundertusks in combat (who aren't as scary as the Stonehorns), but if he had clumped them up in a blob, I would have probably been locked with 3 monsters by virtue of 10 Protectors taking up a lot of space. Spreading out to prepare for Objectives when you don't know where they'll be is bad, and his General ended up on the opposite side of the board from the one in his DZ.

I tend to like Skyborne Slayers over Warrior Brotherhood, though I haven't played the latter yet. Battleshock immune, no reliance on Azyros for deep striking, cheaper buy in - I think the Slayers are just fine, especially when you bring the Prime for the 1-2 punch.

[Yaktan]

Nice to hear the report. Especially since that list is quite similar to the one I am putting together. (I suppose there are only so many things to do with Skyborne Slayers + Celestant-Prime) The main difference is I will have Fulminators instead of 5 of the protectors and one prosecutor unit. The battleforce came with dracoths, so I am using them. Also they look really cool.

UPDATE:

Had the tournament today. Went quite well. I managed to win all 3 games.

My list was:

Spoiler

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Lord-Celestant on Dracoth

Liberators
Judicators
Judicators

Prosecutors

First game was against Tzeench deamons, with Fateweaver, a Prince and two squads of Horrors. We had the mission with an objective in each quadrent. Fateweaver got distracted chasing after my prosecutors while my Lord took down the prince with some archery help. Since it was the first game of Sigmar for both of us, we only got through turn 2. We both held 2 of the objectives, so I got a victory with the more valuable unit destroyed (prince vs. prosecutors).

Second game was against some generic Chaos. Sorcerer on Mainticore, chariot, cavalry, and a big blob of chaos warriors. My judicators whitled his chariot down a bit, but then I whacked it for 12 damage or so with my lord when he charged. Then I got double turn and put 7 wounds or something onto his manticore with my lord. We only got through turn 3 I think, but my Lord was almost dead from his chaos warriors coming to help the manticore. The mission was the one with objectives in your base and on the border, with different values. I won this since we both held our home objectives, but I had my prosecutors on one of the side ones.

Third game was against a nurgle list. We got the comet mission. He managed to take down my Lord when I tried charging into his unit of Plauge Drones, but my liberators then took out the hearld who was trying to hide behind them and held up his drones and a unit of plague bearers for most of the game. His comet came down in one corner, and he got nurglings on it for a turn before my prosecutors got there and the two units sat there slap-fighting for the rest of the game, denying him any more points from that. My objective came down really lucky right where I had my two units of Judicators, so they sat there while he sent a 20 man squad of plague bearers at them. Since they were slow, I managed two turns on the objective before he got there, and started whittling down my crossbow squad. He got two 1's for battleshock in a row as he came in, and got back 10 guys total. Made it really slow to whittle him down. Ultimately I was about to finish off his squad when the rest of his army finished off my liberators and came to join the party. But by then it was turn 5 and I pulled off the win from back in turn 3 when I was holding the objective before he got there. I think after the first turn both of us kept on getting double turns, which made things interesting.

[Requizen]

Glad to hear it went well! That's a solid low point list - if I end up doing the 1000 point AoS games at Adepticon I'll probably run something similar. Small points really are their own game, I hope more people embrace them for tournaments to shake up the meta and stuff.

[Yaktan]

Yeah, it did well. Though I now think I know part of why the winning list from a tournament that got posted earlier in the thread went with 6x Hammer Prosecutors instead of Javalin Guys. My Javalins were slap fighting with nurglings for 3 rounds or so, because noting else I had could get over to the objective to deny him getting points from it every turn. Hammers could have done better slugging it out on the objective, especially with a special weapon to get 3 swings for 2 damage from the prime.

[Requizen]

New FAQ updates for AoS: https://www.warhammer-community.com/...age-of-sigmar/

Goblin Congalines are dead but Fanatics and Skulkers are still quite good, Ring of Immortality is (mostly) dead, Chaos Talisman got a nice buff, Escalation got oddly reworked, and Damage rolls were made way more confusing in an FAQ change that will probably be mostly ignored because it's dumb.

Pretty good overall from GW I think, but they couldn't update a FAQ without causing some amount of confusion haha.

[Yaktan]

That was how I was already doing damage rolls; I think it is errata because they did not actually specify which way to do it before (1 roll for all the hits vs. 1 roll per hit).

[Requizen]

Yeah I should have edited it: they had a first draft up that said when you make an attack with D3 or D6 damage, you only roll once for the weapon and apply that to all hits from that weapon. Which meant that if you shot with Kurnoth Hunters (who deal D3 damage per arrow), you would have to roll each one separately. If a single Hunter got 2 arrows through, they would deal (D3)x2, rather than 2D3 damage, which is separate from the other hunter who got only one shot through and does it's own (D3)x1, which is not only more confusing, but more swingy.

The Facebook group got slammed with responses and questions so they switched it to what you see now.

[Yaktan]

Ah, yes, that would be annoyingly painful.

[Killer Angel]

An AoS thread?

wow, I'm neglecting this forum too much.

And about the new faq... yeah, goodbye Ring of Immortality, you served us well, but it's time to let you go.


Actually, my armies are:

Order:
Seraphon
Dwarves
(plus some units of empire and Sylvaneth)

Death:
Tomb Kings
(plus some units of Vampire Counts)

[Requizen]

I think the ring may be useful on ~100 models still - if your Necromancer or Wight King is the General, it means you can bring him back and retain the Command Trait, which is better in some cases than just buying a second version of that leader. But yeah, it's no longer an autoinclude.

I've got a tourney practice game on Wednesday and a 1000 point event in a couple weeks, hoping to get some good games in for batreps!

[Requizen]

Last week I played against a Mourngul for the first time. Since it was a very low point game, the conversation basically went like this:

"Mind if I bring my fancy new model?"
"Sure, mind if I bring a countering unit?"
"Wouldn't have it any other way."

We played a 800 point Three Places of Power (recently found a store that's doing an escalation campaign), and the thing was nearly half his points. I managed to pop his Vampire Lord with my Knight-Venator, and so thought that I could win since he couldn't score anymore, but it turns out that Fly lets you charge over blocking unit and his Mourngul walked up and murdered the Bird Knight. My Protector squad got vengeance, though, since 400 points of Protectors with 4 Starsoul Maces will make short work out of even the most terrifying monsters.

I could see that thing being extremely terrifying for an army that can't put out the same amount of damage as my SE can against big nasty things, especially thanks to that -1 hit debuff.

We've got a 1000 point tourney on Saturday, in preparation for Adepticon in March, so I'll probably be running something like this:

Knight-Venator
Lord Celestant on Dracoth (Tempestos)

Judicators (Bows)
Judicators (Crossbows)

Prosecutors (Javelins)
Fulminators
1000/1000

It served me well against Sylvaneth last week, and I think any of the Dracoth units are absolutely brutal at low point values, though you'll generally only get a unit of them at most. I feel that at any point value, you can't bring only one Hero in a TAC list just due to Three Places of Power being a thing. Which is good, I think the variety of game types makes it difficult for one type of cheese list to be good at everything.

[Drasius]

Our AoS tourney was/is short 1 player to max it out, so I offered to bring my old 8th Ed Skryre Army (and a pair of borrowed WLC's). Am I a bad person for running this:

Spoiler: No Stormfiends

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Leader
140 - Arch Warlock
100 - Warlock Engineer
100 - Warlock Engineer
100 - Skaven Warlord

Artillery
180 - Warp Lightning Cannon
180 - Warp Lightning Cannon
180 - Warp Lightning Cannon
180 - Warp Lightning Cannon

Battle Line
60 - 10x Clanrats
60 - 10x Clanrats
60 - 10x Clanrats

Other
280 - 20x Stormvermin
60 - Poisoned Wind Mortar
60 - Warpfire Projector
60 - Warpfire Projector

200 - Clan Skryre Battalion

2000/2000 points

The Skryre Battallion allow each of the WFC's to fire in the hero phase, but must take a get's hot test for d3 wounds afterwards. They may also fire normally in the shooting phase.

It's not thaaaaat bad, right?

[Drasius]

Not that anyone cares because AoS, but the list above:
- Won game 1 vs a mixed Khorne Daemon/Mortal army with a sprinkle of Tzeentch casters and a burning chariot. Won on objectives, but was robbed of my turn 5 and I rolled it out and would have won a major :'''(
- Tabled a mixed Khorne Bloodbound/Daemons army turn 4, but I lost on objectives 15-7. Claimed all 3 secondary objectives though, so at least it was 4 points for a los instead of 1.
- Conceeded against a frosthorn(?)/stonetusk(?) list as I did a skaven and backstabbed myself with a bunch of stuff blowing itself up turn 1 and playing on the only board with big LoS blockers large enough to hide the giant rape mammoths

Not the worst outing for my 2nd/3rd/4th games ever. Ironically, I played my 2nd/3rd/4th ever games of 40k in a tourney with my Sons and went 2/1 instead of 1/2. Overall it wasn't huge fun to play as it was mainly just cannons pointing at stuff and deleting it with little to no interaction with my opponent. I don't think my opponents had that much fun either, but they said it wasn't too bad when asked. Personally, I'd keep 2 cannons but drop the others and the battalion. The Stormvermin have the potential to be crazy and just obliterate anything they touch when buffed by a Skaven warlord with Gnaw gnaw on their bones and lord of war. 3 attacks each, hitting on 2's if you outnumber your opponent, wounding on 3's, -1 rend 1 damage. I was routinely rolling 30-40 attacks while some models were still out of range (and the 2" range really helps, combined with the fact that they're still on square bases so 3 ranks can attack). The warpfire thrower had a shocker of a game, blowing itself up trying to overcharge first turn in 2/3 games and then doing a single mortal wound (on a d6 roll) and then getting evaporated by bloodletters. The poisoned wind mortar didn't get a single wound on anything across all 3 games. I think I'd drop them both for more clanrats as charge blocker / chaff, though maybe with all the spare points from dropping 2 cannons and the formation, I'd have enough chaff that I could just park the weapons teams behind 3 or 4 layers of rats. The 2 warlocks and the arch warlock did OK, generally casting mystic, arcane, warp lightning and howling warpstorm with fair consistancy, though I wouldn't say they were worth 340 points. I think the arch warlock and maybe 1 engineer would have been enough for a more normal list. The Skaven warlord got sniped in the face at the earliest opportunity every game and there was little to nothing I could do about it. I need to learn to play him better, but because gnaw gnaw is such a massive, massive buff to stormvermin, everyone just points a cannon at him until he goes away (which was first time all 3 games). Having only 5 wounds sucks (he says as he was sending 8 cannon shots a turn into his enemies characters...). Clanrats did surprisingly well. Generally held up things in time for my stormvermin to come over and obliterate it and even won a couple of combats by some minor miracle. I can't ever see myself taking them in units of more than 10 unfortunately since bravery 4 and losing 20+ models a turn means that a unit of 40 evaporates just as fast as a unit of 10 against real opposition.

So, if I ever play again, I'd keep:
100 - Warlord
140 - Arch Warlock
100 - Warlock Engineer
280 - Stormvermin
60 - Clanrats
60 - Clanrats
60 - Clanrats
60 - Clanrats
180 - Warp Lightning Cannon
180 - Warp Lightning Cannon

1120/2000

I have no idea how to fill out the remaining 880 points without buying a bunch of models I hate. Maybe another block of stormvermin, maybe expand into some Tzeentch daemons for some flamers or burning chariots, possibly some screamers. The skaven are reasonably fast for infantry, but still too slow when other stuff moves 12 or 16 a turn. That's why I need more chaff I think, to hold things up and pin them in place so I can charge my stormies in and wreck up the place. Might look into some Chaos warriors or something too, but I think I have enough 40k on my plate as well as a 30k Sons army to buy/build/paint that more fantasy is quite low on the list. Who know. I had some fun at the tourney though, but more rats and less cannons would have made it better.

[Requizen]

Interesting, that's probably a level of shooting that many players aren't used to handling at this point in AoS. I can see you instagibbing many important units with a list like that, but Skaven can be finnicky. I don't think it's too mean or filthy, but that depends on the opponent. That BCR player definitely had the tools to deal with you, but footslogging Khorne without Sayl or other shenanigans would probably just cry (as it seemed they did).

I think getting some sort of solid frontline might be a good idea. Blobs of Plaguebearers are always good in my book, as is a big block of Chaos Warriors with some buffs thrown on. Something to run towards/between the opponents and keep them away from your pew pew. The ability to shoot into combat is great for Skaven.

I was doing some list planning of my own, but then they announced the Stormcast book and I have to restrain myself until I get it in my hands and know what to bring. I'm still a huge Skyborne Slayers proponent, but the new book and new rules could shake things up significantly. Hoping they make Stardrakes better for their steep price, been looking for a reason to buy one.

[Drasius]

Interesting, that's probably a level of shooting that many players aren't used to handling at this point in AoS. I can see you instagibbing many important units with a list like that, but Skaven can be finnicky. I don't think it's too mean or filthy, but that depends on the opponent. That BCR player definitely had the tools to deal with you, but footslogging Khorne without Sayl or other shenanigans would probably just cry (as it seemed they did).

I think getting some sort of solid frontline might be a good idea. Blobs of Plaguebearers are always good in my book, as is a big block of Chaos Warriors with some buffs thrown on. Something to run towards/between the opponents and keep them away from your pew pew. The ability to shoot into combat is great for Skaven.

With any luck at all, I think I could have beaten him. I lost a WFT weapons team and a Cannon 1st turn due to overheats as well as massive damage to 2/3 remaining cannons due to overheat as well, followed by a buffed up unit of 20x stormvermin failing a 4" charge on a full health mammoth thing then getting charged and losing priority. That plus being on the only table with big enough LoS blockers meant it was all downhill.

Regardless, yeah, more chaff and another combat block is the way to improve the list I think. 20x Chaos warriors and a Chaos sorc (he's the one that hands out that huge buff to hit and to wound, yeah?) would probably be enough, though I'm fairly sure I've got another block of 20x stormvermin hangnig around somewhere and I've definately got a handfull of skaven warlrods from the various Island of Bloods that I bought. Some Rat Ogres would also be an interesting choice, but this was always meant to be a Clan Skryre list without any Stormfiends, so yeah. No mixing the impure lesser races or clans with our mighty best Clan forces. They'd only get jealous and betray us.

Thank you for the feedback and suggestions though, I do kinda like that there's some tactical elements just like old fantasy, but it's definately harder to see than in 8th. Lots about being the right distance away to try and minimise the results of a bad priority roll but able to make the best of a good one too. Or just, ya know, alpha strike peoples faces off and not worry about that tactics business.

[Cheesegear]

I do kinda like that there's some tactical elements just like old fantasy, but it's definately harder to see than in 8th.

QFT. People who don't read good, don't play AoS good. Which is weird for such a 'simple' system. Almost like it's not simple at all.

Or just, ya know, alpha strike peoples faces off and not worry about that tactics business.

Or that.

[Grim Portent]

New Duardin faction is coming soon.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/...mortal-realms/

Basically steampunk sky pirates. Have to admit I love the one with a top hat and monocle built into his helmet.

[Theodoric]

Squats!

They look pretty neat, really have their own theme going on with those ballloons/ball-shaped-science-contraptions.

[Erloas]

On one hand I think they look pretty cool. But on the other it just seems like GW decided they needed to jump on the Steampunk bandwagon that is gaining strength right now (has been for a while).
So its something new for GW but not actually original at all (which has sort of been the whole GW thing since it started, I guess I just expect more from a company that has been around for 30 years than one that is just starting up).

I guess it doesn't actually matter, at this point I have no intention of ever going back to GW.

[LCP]

The one with the top hat just looks like the sculptors are testing what they can get away with.

This is the kind of thing where if it was someone's converted army I would be blown away, but when it's being put out as the base kit by GW it just feels... eh.