New Fiends

[Shinn]

Hi everyone,
As a DM with a Demonologist PC (the Mongoose class), I had to create some new Fiends for the concerned player.

Wanting to have something quite different from the classical Fiends, such as the flaming Balor-like, winged piglets, or bubbling things, I tried to base myself on our abyss. Yeah, our ocean's abyss.

None of these demons are named, but they can be quite powerful (and deadly) in hands of a creative DM ; we have a Corruptor demon, an Overlord/Assassin demon, and three Brute demons to begin with. Soon I will add new demons and devils, if you don't see anything wrong with these first ones.

The Mialoch family Mialochs is a family of lesser demons, led by more powerful beings of Azuvidexus, and trained for combat. They're cannon fodder for the Voracious Maw, but can handle themselves quite good against adventurers. Sometimes, they can even ally themselves with Aberrations such as Aboleths, as they seems to have the same origin : Bards tales about time where Azuvidexus took some Aboleths to create the first spawns of Mialochs. Specific features : - They're both Outsiders, with the Evil and Chaotic subtypes - It smells like a fish. Attacks with fire are more efficient, as they seems to be part-melting, part-vaporising with fire : they have Fire Vulnerability [Ex] - A Mialoch use twice his CR as a bonus to Intimidate checks, but don't add his Charisma modifier : they have an aura of fear assisting a disturbing appearance - Every Mialoch have immunities to poison, cold, and drowning damage (underwater only). Plus they have a DR 20/Acid.

 

Vepch (CR 1)

Spoiler: Vepch

Show

XP 400
CE Medium Outsider (evil)
Initiative : +3 ; Senses : Perception -1

Defense
AC 23, touch 13, flat-footed 17 (+5 natural, +3 Dexterity, +2 Shield)
HP 6 (1d8+2)
Fort +2, Ref +3, Will -1
SR 12

Offense
Speed 20 ft.
Melee Shield bash, +1 (1d4)

Statistics
11 Str, 16 Dex, 15 Con, 9 Int, 9 Wis, 12 Cha
ABB +1, CMB +1, CMD +1 (+5 against Bull Rush)
Skills Intimidation +2, Knowledge (Planes) +3
Languages Aquan, Abyssal

Special abilities
A Vepch is proficient with any shield, but not with any armor or any weapon.

Ecology
Environment evil-aligned plane, underwater, abyss
Organisation solitary, pair or compagny (5-20)
Treasure Standard, plus a Shield or Tower Shield

A Vepch looks like an anthropomorphic scaly dragonfish (just look some pics), but more twisted and infernal ; a fishy humanoid with scales, devious grin constelled with jaws, and a little goatee that glows a little. The main troops of the Mialoch Family are the Vepch, demons born and trained since years and centuries to use shield ; they work with phalanx moves, blocking the way to help some more dangerous demons. They're also used by other demons to jobs like bodyguards, or suicide troopers.

Ceimar (CR 2)

Spoiler: Ceimar

Show

XP 600
CE Medium Outsider (evil)
Initiative : +2 ; Senses : Perception +2

Defense
AC 20, touch 12, flat-footed 18 (+2 Dexterity, +8 armor)
HP 9 (2d8)
Fort +2, Ref +3, Will -1
SR 13

Offense
Speed 40 ft.
Melee 4 great maces, +2/+2/+2/+2 (2d4+3)

Statistics
17 Str, 15 Dex, 10 Con, 16 Int, 15 Wis, 15 Cha
ABB +2, CMB +5 (+9 in a Bull Rush), CMD +2
Skills Intimidation +4, Knowledge (Planes) +8
Languages Aquan, Abyssal
Feats Multiattack (4 crab-like arms)

Special abilities
Multi-legged : With many legs, such as centipede, Ceimars are really fast (40 ft), and are deadly rams in a bull rush : it helps them to charge, with a +4 to CMB in a Bull Rush attempt.
Chitin : The chitin exoskeleton of a Ceimar are, sadly, conductive. So they take 10% more damage on electric attacks (rounded down). However, it helps supporting any armor without any speed penalty.
A Ceimar is proficient with any armor, and with any type of martial bludgeoning weapon.

Ecology
Environment evil-aligned plane, underwater, abyss
Organisation solitary or pair
Treasure Standard, plus heavy armor, and four bludgeoning weapons.

Part crab, part centipede, a Ceimar is like a centaur being, but more heavily armored ; “a crab mounted on a batonym with glowing eyes” is actually a good example of the demon’s description. Troop soldiers of the Mialoch family, they are used as rams or devastating chargers who can reverse the story of a battle.

 
Tausihr (CR 3)

Spoiler: Tausihr

Show

XP 800
CE Medium Outsider (evil)
Initiative : +2 ; Senses : Perception +1

Defense
AC 12, touch 12, flat-footed 10 (+2 Dexterity). Can't be touched by melee attacks while in the sky.
HP 16 (3d8+3)
Fort +4, Ref +5, Will +4
SR 14

Offense
Speed Fly 70 ft (perfect).
Melee Take things and make it fall on the battlefield (1d6 damage per 100 lb or 10 ft fall), +5

Statistics
27 Str, 15 Dex, 13 Con, 12 Int, 12 Wis, 08 Cha
ABB +3, CMB +11, CMD +4
Skills Intimidation +6, Knowledge (Planes) +6
Languages Aquan, Abyssal
Feats Weapon proficiency (Falling objects), Greater Weapon Proficiency (Falling objects)
Treasure None.

Special abilities
Tausihrs are neither proficient with armors nor with weapons. They only have proficiencies in falling objects (with a +2 proficiency bonus).

Ecology
Environment evil-aligned plane, underwater, abyss
Organisation solitary, pair or flocks (3-5)
Treasure None.
Intelligent beings despite their bestial, non-humanoid appearance, Tausihrs are master of the battles, commanding legions of lesser demons, such as Lemures or Vepchs. They looks like our real abyss chimeras, holding whatever they find to throw it on their opponents. Unlike Vepchs or Ceimars, they can be proud enough for being true leaders of demons, despite their leadership is only gained by terror.

Matulor (CR 4)

Spoiler: Matulor

Show

XP 1200
CE Medium Outsider (evil)
Initiative : +3 ; Senses : Perception +0

Defense
AC 13, touch 13, flat-footed 10 (+3 Dex)
HP 14 (4d8-4)
Fort +3, Ref +7, Will +4
SR 15

Offense
Speed 40 ft. (run, swimming, burrowing, climbing)
Melee Bite +4 (1d6+1)

Statistics
12 Str, 17 Dex, 09 Con, 15 Int, 11 Wis, 10 Cha
ABB +4, CMB +4, CMD +4
Skills Intimidation +8, Knowledge (Planes) +9
Languages Aquan, Abyssal, Common

Special abilities
Sneak attack : Matulors have a sneak attack feature : if the demon strikes a flat-footed opponent, he does an extra 2d6 damage.
Apt to every situation : A Matulor is trained to scout his unit to every terrain : it can have every move (except flying) at a 40 ft speed, and give this ability (speed AND move type) to up to 4 CR of creatures following him.
Spy of the Mialochs : A Matulor, as the scout of the Mialochs, should be able to hide itself in many situations : he can use the spell-like “Invisibility” ability at will, and give it up to 4 CR of creatures, as long as they’re at close range.
Matulors are not proficient with any weapon (except it jaws), and prefer to use it invisibility to avoid attacks. It also uses cannon fodder when available.

Ecology
Environment evil-aligned plane, underwater, abyss
Organisation Solitary
Cunning member of the Mialoch family, a Matulor is perhaps the most “humanoid” demon of the whole demonic family : even if it looks like an anthropomorphized moray, with an only arm, it can be considered by most adventurers as something related to a rogue or a scout. That’s his demonic role : it brutally slays whatever come too close from it, or from it lesser demonic slaves. He especially loves when some mortal tries to outsmart him, and enslave him for his natural scout and assassin talents. These mortals souls are excellent source of bargaining for enslaving lesser entities.

 
Creir (CR 5)

Spoiler: Creir

Show

XP 1600
CE Medium Outsider (evil)
Initiative : +0 ; Senses : Perception +14 to see any sentient soul (immune to darkness penalties)

Defense
AC 14, touch 10, flat-footed 14 (+4 Armor), plus penalties (see below)
HP 32 (5d8+10)
Fort +7, Ref +5, Will +9
SR 16

Offense
Speed 30 ft.
Melee Touch of the soul +5 (melee attack, triggers an Attack of Opportunity if miss) (6d6, DC 15 Fort 2d6+1d4)

Statistics
13 Str, 11 Dex, 14 Con, 14 Int, 19 Wis, 17 Cha
ABB +5, CMB +6, CMD +7
Skills Intimidation +10, Knowledge (Planes) +9, Perception +14
Languages Aquan, Abyssal, plus the language of it most common prey.

Special abilities
Mockery of the Divine : During it mortal life, a Creir had been either deceived by deities, or disappointed. Now each time someone want to cast a Divine spell on 30 feets around a Creir, he have to pass a Spellcraft check (DC 20+Spell level) or lose the prepared spell without any benefit. Even if the Spellcaster wins the check, each numeric part of the spell will be halved (an Inflict Minor Wounds spell will only deal 1d4 damage). It works as long the Creir is concentrating.
Shaping by Souls : Each time a Creir slays a sentient being with it touch, he gains the ability to change it form to fit the shape of the victim : for example if it kills a troll, the demon gain the ability to have a troll-shape body. Each time the demon changes shape, every sentient seeing it with less HD have to make a Will save (DC 15) or be staggered for two turns.
Planar traveler : A Creir is able to render itself more bound to its plane, and less to the Material plane. As a full-round action of concentration, which triggers an attack of opportunity, he has 50% of chance to automatically avoid a hit, but a 20% chance to automatically fail his own attack. If it victim can either see or touch incorporeal creatures, the 50% penalty is halved ; if he can do both, then the strike have no penalties (his own penalties can never be halved nor negated).
See the inner light : Creirs can see both the material world and the souls within ; it cannot be flanked if it pass a Perception vs Stealth check, see perfectly in every darkness, and can detect sentient life at will with a Perception vs Stealth check. They can see alignment, but only the presence of an alignment (it only detects unaligned or True Neutral creatures).

A Creir is not proficient with any weapon, except his soul touch ability, but is proficient with any armor a Cleric could use without penalty.

Ecology
Environment evil-aligned plane, underwater, abyss
Organisation Solitary
Treasure Standard, plus a parody of Divine symbol (usually a twisting version of a Good-aligned god). 1d4 lb of Thinuan jewels (part tainted glass, part metal, fully useless for weapons).
Maybe the deadliest of the Mialoch demonic family, the Creir is part-darkness, part-soul. The whole head of it humanoid shape, the hands and the feets are made of pure soul, while the lower body seems made of pure black (think about barreleye fishes). Rumours says that each time a Good-aligned Cleric sacrifies himself to a demon for saving someone else, his soul is corrupted to create a new Creir.

Do you have any tips ? Critics ? It would be good for me to know if I these demons are balanced enough to be given as enemies and bound allies to the demonologist PC.

(I can try Devils equivalents too)

[inuyasha]

I definitely like the ideas behind these, I've always thought that aquatic demons needed more representation, but I do have a few critiques for now (I'll probably come back later for more though )

Beginning:
The Mialoch Family

• If they are to be considered demons, then I believe they should have the chaotic subtype as well, which is also appropriate given their strange and unnatural forms.
• Remember, Charisma isn't how good you look, it's about how well you can convey feeling, enforce your will, and communicate. Even with that bonus to intimidate (addressed later), having a charisma of only four for each one means that they are very close to catatonic, which not only creates a weakness (only four points of Charisma damage will effectively put them in a coma), but it also doesn't make very much sense to me, I'd think of these things as being terrifying and monstrous, some using lure tactics of deep sea fish like anglers (which would take some charisma I think). I'd look at the Aboleth as an example here, with a Charisma of seventeen, but a really bizarre and hideous appearance.
• The fire-damage thing is cool fluff, and can be written as just [Fire Vulnerability (Ex):], otherwise this is pretty standard
• This intimidation ability is interesting... but I think it would make more sense to have some sort of fear aura like a lot of creatures have. I would also consider lessening it if you want to keep it, just so things don't get too powerful if you want to increase Charisma
• Other considerations: It's missing a few things that other Outsider types have, namely immunities and resistances, which, if this is to become its own subtype, I would make the following:
• Immune to poison and cold (because of living in the deep oceans of the abyss), and resistance to acid 20. I was thinking some sort of fire resistance to account for hydrothermal vents may be in order, but the fire vulnerability thing makes sense too, so that's your call.

Now I'm going to critique each creature individually. The CR adjustments also aren't accounting for any changes above that I think should be made, because I don't want to take over your project

Spoiler: Overview

Show

Overview

• Your stats are out of order! This makes it a little tougher to read, normally they go in order of Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma.
• They speak Infernal, when they should probably be speaking Abyssal due to being Chaotic Evil demons, Infernal is usually reserved for Devils

Spoiler: Vepch

Show

Vepch

• This thing is very weak, with no special attacks, and only a shield bash for 1d4, I'd honestly put the CR at 1/2 with what its stats are right now
• The Armor Class however, is very high for something of this level, at 23, even the most focused fighters are going to struggle with this thing at a low level, and if they're supposed to be used en masse as mooks, then this is definitely going to become a problem.
• These things don't have any feats, which could become important for many reasons...

Spoiler: Ceimar

Show

Ceimar

• Oh man, I'd probably put this thing at CR 1/2 as well, with few it points, no special attacks, two vulnerabilities, and a lower AC than the Vepch, this creature is fairly weak.
• The ability you described for Multi-Armed isn't really a special ability, but I believe there is a feat for it called Multiattack, now I've never actually looked at it, but I'm pretty sure that's what it does, so I'd recommend giving it that as a bonus feat
• Multi-Legged doesn't have much to make it a special ability either, a lot of creatures have a speed of 40ft. or higher, and this is good fluff, but it doesn't really belong in the stat block.
• Chitin: I think the extra proficiencies and the speed boost in armor won't affect CR much, but the extra vulnerability is going to help your PCs slaughter these things! With these ones being vulnerable to both fire and electricity, they can be swiftly butchered by two first level spells that will completely bypass their AC of 20. Again, good fluff, but nigh lethal to this poor creature.

Spoiler: Tausihr

Show

Tausihr

• This creature is again, dramatically underpowered, I'd put it at a CR of 1, for low hit points, a very low AC (especially compared to the above creatures), no special attacks, and still having a vulnerability.
• The falling damage ability is interesting, but I think it needs more definition, especially with the fact that I don't think those rules are addressed much.

Spoiler: Matulor

Show

Matulor

• Again, very underpowered, with low AC and hit points, I'd put this one at CR 1.
• Sneak attack, a nice, standard ability that is useful to someone in this position. No real complaints here
• overland speed boost: I feel that these need more definition, they can give 4 CR of creatures this ability, what does that mean? If three work in unison, can they give one CR 12 creature this ability? Does it work on things that aren't demons or outsiders? What if the creature moves faster than 40 feet?
• Invisibility: Nice, but see my above complaint.
• Jaws: Not really a special ability, just a bite attack

Spoiler: Creir

Show

Creir

• I don't really know what to CR this one as... it's dramatically overpowered for its CR in some areas, and underpowered in others, but I'm fairly certain a combat with a level 5 party would just be rocket tag
• Low AC again, but that could be fixed with equipment
• The touch attack! No fifth level party can survive a touch attack for 12d6 damage! Even with a save for quarter, I'm pretty sure that every barbarian within a 12 foot radius would be filling their hide armor if they saw the damage this thing could do. It'll also kill spellcasters very, very fast.
• Mockery of the Divine: Interesting ability, but a really nasty debuff to all healers in the party without even denting this thing's ability to take actions, I'd be careful with this one, maybe changing it from a 30ft passive aura to some sort of concentration ability
• Shaping By Souls: Is this merely a cosmetic change? Is it like a polymorph spell? This ability definitely needs more clarification.
• Plane Shifting: Interesting, but as a swift action I think there should be a limit to how often it can be used, and for how long it lasts. Also, what if this thing gets a ghost touch weapon and the ability to see an incorporeal creature, is its own penalty halved?
• See the Inner Light: Killing rogues too! This thing can completely negate most of the tactics used against such a powerful monster at this level, and it can detect alignment auras to go after the paladins and clerics that can damage it the most.
• Rest in Pieces: With a small chance to either nullify all resurrection attempts or totally resurrect the target once this creature dies, I'm not sure what to say on this one. It won't affect things much in the middle of combat, but your player(s) may get angry to find their character is permanently dead just because of a single bad die roll. I'm just not too sure how I feel about this one.

So, in finale, I love the idea for sure, but it just needs some more polishing to make it viable I think. Should you make more, I think you should work more on the fact that these things are demons and not devils. Should you need a decent reference while statting these things out, an ancient hero made a formula for calculating CR that I use all the time, which may help you gauge power a little easier.

Spoiler: VT's CR Calculator

Show

#1. Divide creature's average HP by 4.5 to 6.5.
4.5 for 5 HD or lower, 5 for 6-10 HD, 5.5 for 11-15 HD, 6 for 16-20 HD., 6.5 for 20-25 HD.

#2. Add 1 for each five points above 10 its AC is, subtracting 1 for every 5 below.

#3. Add 1 for each special attack (+2 to +5 or more if its got a decent number of spells in its spell-like abilities).

#4. Add 1 for each quality unless you deem it worthy of more. Add 1 for each resistance and 10 points of DR it has, and 2 for each immunity. Subtract 1 for each vulnerability.

#5. Add 1 for every two bonus feats it has.

#6. Divide total by 3. This should be its rough CR

[Shinn]

Thanks for replying.

[*]If they are to be considered demons, then I believe they should have the chaotic subtype as well, which is also appropriate given their strange and unnatural forms.

Yeah, but I used to think "Theyr'e demons, so they have automatically the Chaotic subtype, no need to tell it again".

[*]Remember, Charisma isn't how good you look, it's about how well you can convey feeling, enforce your will, and communicate. Even with that bonus to intimidate (addressed later), having a charisma of only four for each one means that they are very close to catatonic, which not only creates a weakness (only four points of Charisma damage will effectively put them in a coma), but it also doesn't make very much sense to me, I'd think of these things as being terrifying and monstrous, some using lure tactics of deep sea fish like anglers (which would take some charisma I think). I'd look at the Aboleth as an example here, with a Charisma of seventeen, but a really bizarre and hideous appearance.

I thought it was with only three that a character was comatose. And to be honest... My first idea about the Mialochs were that they only get a -4 penalty to Charisma. But working with the Pathfinder race builder generator (as I didn't find the rules), I desesperately needed some points to add new things.

Other considerations: It's missing a few things that other Outsider types have, namely immunities and resistances, which, if this is to become its own subtype, I would make the following:
Immune to poison and cold (because of living in the deep oceans of the abyss), and resistance to acid 20. I was thinking some sort of fire resistance to account for hydrothermal vents may be in order, but the fire vulnerability thing makes sense too, so that's your call.

I know, but as I said previously, I didn't had enough points for buying every thing.
Overview

• Your stats are out of order! This makes it a little tougher to read, normally they go in order of Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma.
• They speak Infernal, when they should probably be speaking Abyssal due to being Chaotic Evil demons, Infernal is usually reserved for Devils

• Oops, sorry ! It was a mistake, and I'll edit as soon as possible !
  

• This thing is very weak, with no special attacks, and only a shield bash for 1d4, I'd honestly put the CR at 1/2 with what its stats are right now
• The Armor Class however, is very high for something of this level, at 23, even the most focused fighters are going to struggle with this thing at a low level, and if they're supposed to be used en masse as mooks, then this is definitely going to become a problem.
• These things don't have any feats, which could become important for many reasons...

[inuyasha]

I think your changes are pretty good, but I'm really having trouble looking over them as I type right now...!

For some reason my browser is having a hell of a time looking at this page. Anyone else in this thread seeing a really funky looking webpage? All of the other threads on this site seem fine for me...

[Shinn]

Yep, I have some trouble too. It seems my overdose of quoting destroyed the classic form of messages.

I'm working on two new Créatures, a devil and a démon.
The first one is exceptionally Lawful, leader of many Experts NPC, working in top of the hierarchy of a tyrannic Kafka-ish bureaucracy.

The second one is a beguiler, making itself look at a Chaotic Good creature, to force people to follow their feelings... Only for feasting on their future despair.

Do you know of there's anything wrong in these first teasers ?