Question on sliding enemies via powers...

[samcifer]

So powers like Positioning Strike allow me to slide the targeted enemy a certain number of spaces. I've looked through the glossary on forced movement and saw nothing to say I couldn't do so, but can these powers allow me to slide a foe to squares that are difficult terrain like mud or ice or even off the edge of a cliff to their death as long as it's within the number of squares I can slide them?

[georgie_leech]

Yup. That's one of the standard tricks of Zone abuse in fact. Note that forced movement will actually ignore difficult terrain. Further note that when you try to force someone over pit or cliff or whatever, the target can immediately make a Saving Throw to catch themselves and not go over the edge.

[samcifer]

Yup. That's one of the standard tricks of Zone abuse in fact. Note that forced movement will actually ignore difficult terrain. Further note that when you try to force someone over pit or cliff or whatever, the target can immediately make a Saving Throw to catch themselves and not go over the edge.

Cool! :D Thanks for the fast reply. :)

[georgie_leech]

Cool! :D Thanks for the fast reply. :)

I was in the neighborhood

This was especially hilarious with the original PHB powers. A lot of them were written kinda poorly. If you squinted, a lot of the slide adjacent powers technically let you slide targets forever so long as you ended the slide next to you.

[Kurald Galain]

Further note that when you try to force someone over pit or cliff or whatever, the target can immediately make a Saving Throw to catch themselves and not go over the edge.

Bear in mind that dangerous features that are part of the battle map give a saving throw (e.g. a cliff), but anything dangerous generated by your powers does not (e.g. a Wall of Fire spell).

Also, an enemy that succeeds at this saving throw still ends up prone.

[georgie_leech]

Bear in mind that dangerous features that are part of the battle map give a saving throw (e.g. a cliff), but anything dangerous generated by your powers does not (e.g. a Wall of Fire spell).

Also, an enemy that succeeds at this saving throw still ends up prone.

Right. This is because the Saving Throw isn't part of the Forced Movement rules, but the Falling rules.

[ThePurple]

Right. This is because the Saving Throw isn't part of the Forced Movement rules, but the Falling rules.

No, it's part of the Forced Movement and Terrain rules (I couldn't find a reference to saving throws to avoid getting pushed over the side of a cliff anywhere in the Falling rules):

"Targets forced into hindering terrain receive a saving throw immediately before entering the unsafe square they are forced into."

Also, it's in the hindering terrain rules (which is defined as any terrain which punishes creatures that are in it or try to enter it, so it's not just pits; it mentions lava, extremely deep water, and electrifying runes, specifically).

"A creature can make a saving throw to avoid being forced into hindering terrain, whether it is pulled, pushed, slid, teleported, or otherwise moved against its will."

Interestingly, while teleportation doesn't count as forced movement, if you attempt to teleport a target into hindering terrain, they still get a saving throw. That was news to me.

[georgie_leech]

No, it's part of the Forced Movement and Terrain rules (I couldn't find a reference to saving throws to avoid getting pushed over the side of a cliff anywhere in the Falling rules):

"Targets forced into hindering terrain receive a saving throw immediately before entering the unsafe square they are forced into."

Also, it's in the hindering terrain rules (which is defined as any terrain which punishes creatures that are in it or try to enter it, so it's not just pits; it mentions lava, extremely deep water, and electrifying runes, specifically).

"A creature can make a saving throw to avoid being forced into hindering terrain, whether it is pulled, pushed, slid, teleported, or otherwise moved against its will."

Interestingly, while teleportation doesn't count as forced movement, if you attempt to teleport a target into hindering terrain, they still get a saving throw. That was news to me.

While I knew about the teleportation part, I can't seem to find the rules on the rest of it. Do you have a page number?

[Kurald Galain]

No, it's part of the Forced Movement and Terrain rules

Sure. The point is, a power doesn't create terrain unless its textblock explicitly mentions that it does so.

Similarly, while many monsters would consider a square next to the party fighter to be "unsafe", they don't get a saving throw for that either.

[ThePurple]

Sure. The point is, a power doesn't create terrain unless its textblock explicitly mentions that it does so.

I wasn't discounting that at all. I was simply saying what part of the rules it falls under.

[NomGarret]

Sure. The point is, a power doesn't create terrain unless its textblock explicitly mentions that it does so.

Similarly, while many monsters would consider a square next to the party fighter to be "unsafe", they don't get a saving throw for that either.

This mental image makes me giggle.