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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Asmotherion's Avatar

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    Default The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    There is a running gag on every single table I play. Both as a player and as a DM; -Manuel (that's my real life name) is a warlock- This is true in both 3.5 and 5e, even in games that do not have a warlock class, I get something similar (for example, in d20 classless: Bleach, I play a hollow). As a player I won't nececerally play a full warlock, even if I play an other class however, I'll dip into warlock... I once even played a warlock barbarian wich, from an optimisation point of view, is far from optimal. As a DM I will create a warlock NPC that is meant to be my Avatar in the game, and players will have a chance to chat with him... He doesn't really have an impact in the scenario, he's more of an easter egg I leave to the players. Overall, I like having the ability to blast things. That being said, I can be self-proclaimed a Warlock specialist of some sort. On that doctorat, I will attept to create a guide on warlocks.

    The guide will be made in 3 steps:

    Step 1: A take on all the (interesting) Warlock options, as well as when they go in play. This will be updated casually, so if you don't see a viable option on board, you might see it next week. If you don't see it for a long time, mention it to me via pm; I'm only human and the option might have sliped past me, or I might intend to work on it latter.

    Step 2: A tier system. This will rate different Warlock options according to how good they are. Ratings might change at higher levels. I will also list when each option comes into play, from what levels it is viable, and when is the peack of the multiclass.

    Step 3: A mini guide for the more popular options, explainations, pact choices, spell choices etc.

    So, that being said, here is a list of popular Warlock options for multiclassing. It is far from complete, and will latter be categorised by tiers:

    1) The (un)famous Sorclock (or as I like to call him, Eldritch Sorcerer)
    This is a golden build. It comes into play at a verry low level, and only gets better and better. You will start being able to use it's potential by level 5, and it never peaks till level 20. You are still SAD as Charisma is the Casting Trait for both Warlock AND Sorcerer, and you get a lot of amazing synergysing with metamagic; You can quicken your Eldritch Blast to get 4/6/8 ranged spell attacks per turn (as much as a two weapon-fighting fighter by level 20) at levels 5/11/17, you can twin Hex in order to deliver more dammage in a group... and all that, wile you are still a full caster, who will eventually get access to Wish.

    The build is Warlock 2/Sorcerer X. There is however a school of thought about the Sorcerer having better saves, which makes the build Sorcerer 1/Warlock 2/Sorcerer X. Other options include taking one more level of Warlock, in order to get a pact gift (usually pact of the tome). You can do that, but personally, on an optimisation standpoint, I think that, if you are going to take one more level outside of Sorcerer, go Barbarian 1 or Monk 1. This way you'll have an amazing AC due to unarmored deffance. I usually prefear Barbarian, since Constitution is a stat you'll never dump either way, but monk is a totally viable option as well, since you might want a good Will Wisdom save.

    Invocations: The invocations you want are Agonising blast and then one more. My personal favorite is Repelling blast, since it gives you at-will crowd control, and, let's be honest, if you are making a blaster, you want your blasts to have impact.

    If not, Eldritch spear could be synergised well with Distant metamagic, and Spell Sniper, effectivelly making you the best sniper in the game. If you spend most of your time outdoors, you can fly high in the sky (as a Dragon Sorcerer you eventually get wings, and blast things from 600-1200 feet in the sky, wile your targets will never have a chance to get to you. If however your DM uses more of indoors combat (most DMs do), you are perfectly fine with 120 feet, which eventually may get to 240 with spell sniper (you are getting this to ignore half/and 3/4 cover) without needing to use up an Invocation on this.

    If you are not fond of Repelling Blast, and Eldritch Spear seems useless for your DM, I'd look at the at-will spell options as a second Invocation. Silent Image is gold, as it gives you so many options. The one that allows you to see in magical Darkness is also pure gold, effectivelly making you "that thing that lurks in darkness"; If Unearthed Arkana is available to you, you can substitude this with taking Shadow Sorcerer instead. This is one more example on how well the Warlock and Sorcerer Synergise.

    2) The Wizlock(Eldrich Wizard)

    You have a couple negatives for a million possitives. Usually people forget/do not mention the Wizlock as an optimised option, mainly for a couple reasons:
    A) The Sorclock blasts better. True, he will be able to blast better than you for most of the game, but this is not true at the higher levels (that depends how far your campain will take you). I'll analyse this more latter.
    B) You are getting MAD. You are a caster, and yet you are going to focus on both Int and Cha. My opinion on this varries: You can either do that, witch, end game is totally worth it; after all you won't be the only MAD character around, or you can be a utility wizard, and focus on Charisma for your blasting. In any case, Cha should be your priority.

    If you can work around that issues, here is a character that will almost literally be a god by level 20.

    You get more options: You can forego your hex for Wall of Flames or Flaming sphere, and then use your Repelling Blast to hurl your foes on your persistant AOEs. By level 9, you'll have access to Mordenkainen's Faithfull Hound.. a Persistant AOE that needs no concentration. This means you can keep your Hex active, and hurl things with Repelling Blast towards the Hound. The Hound then Attacks the target for and aditional 4d8 piercing damage. This means that, by level 17 (where you get your 4th eldritch blast) you will (potentially) be dealing 4d10+4d8+4d6+20 dammage. If that's still not good enough, by level 19 you get to cast Prismatic Wall, witch is also a persistant AOE that requires no concentration. And, you can push a creature through the wall, by means of your repelling blast, wile the hound is next to the wall, and wile you have your hex active. The math is quite insane, allowing you to deal 4d10+4d8+54d6+20 and a chance of making the creature restrained (potentially petrifying it as well), blinded, and to banish it to an other plane of existance. By level 16 you also get to make a simulacrum, who will be able to blast with you adding an other barage of Eldritch Blasts, and a Hex. It will eventually loose access to Hex, as it's spell slots are not unlimited, but at least it will be able to Eldritch blast with you forever. By Level 19 this is not an issue, as you will be able to simply wish for an other simulacrum, effectivelly renewing it's spell slots every time you need to. That's an other 4d10+4d6+20 to your regular attacks, effectivelly keeping up with the Sorlock. And that's without allowing the well-known Exploit simulacrum is known for. With a simulacrum to cast one more Prismatic Wall (let's say it was made without using Wish), you destroy all charters for dammage, effectivelly able to deal 8d10+4d8+108d6+40... What's even more disturbing it that this can be repeted every single turn for one full encounter. Other nice combos include (but are not limited to) takining the Abjuration school, and casting Armor of Agathys and False Life on yourself with high spell slots (perhaps 5 and 6 for a nice balance), effectivelly granting you Barbarian-like HP, and by the time you hit level 19, you even get at-will shield as a reaction, granting you good AC as well; Getting a lot of zombies with finger of death, and then true polymorphing them into something more usefull: they remain obedient to you, as that is their original personality and a lot more. In any case, this is one of the most difficult class combinations to pull, but it's definitely worth the effort.


    [To be continued]
    Last edited by Asmotherion; 2016-09-25 at 08:14 AM.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

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    Last edited by Asmotherion; 2016-09-25 at 08:13 AM.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    So I see sorlocks most commonly, then paladin multiclasses followed by barbarian then rogue.

    Barbarian is almost exclusively fiend pact for playing with temp HP and damage resistance. Palading seems to be a slight dip for a ranged attack some invocations and some short rest spells.

    For me the rogue is the more interesting as I have seen a few different breakpoints between the tow classes.

    Other than the sorlock all of these have been fun and interesting at the table.

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Fighter/lock must also be very common, or so I imagine from what I read around here. I played one for a few sessions in place of my regular character who had to take a side job for the party, and thus had to be away from some in-game time, translated to 3 sessions (I enjoyed the fighter/lock for that time, it was rather powerful, especially compared to my regular character, so it was a nice change of pace).

    ps: Also I have seen a barbarian/lock and a sorlock, but none of them impressed me terribly (though yeah, I understand why some people like them). Surprisingly I have not seen a pal/lock, which seems to be so popular and is certainly so infamous to many. And I agree with MrStabby in that the rogue/lock definitely seems a very interesting option to me as well. Unfortunately I have not explored it in actual play yet, perhaps some time in the future.
    Last edited by Corran; 2016-09-25 at 09:33 AM.
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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    SwashbucklerGuy

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    I have played Pally/lock, Fighty/lock and Barby/lock, all as melee specialists and all were very satisfying indeed!

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    HalfOrcPirate

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    I'm looking forward to how you approach this. It's always nice to see different takes on classes.

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    BlueWizardGirl

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    I don't believe I have ever seen someone mention Barbarian/Warlock (you can't cast while raging) before today but I have seen tons of Bard/Warlock, Paladin/Warlock, and Sorcerer/Warlock.

    I think Rogue/Warlock could be cool if you take the second SCAG option for Rogue.

    Warlocks synergize best with other classes that favor Charisma because of the build being SAD. You can quickly and easily cap out Charisma and then focus on other stats like Dexterity or Constitution as you please.

    The guide is Uncomplete atm, so I can give some slack but I don't know why you'd mention Wizlock before Bardlock or Pallock.

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    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost Nappa View Post
    I don't believe I have ever seen someone mention Barbarian/Warlock (you can't cast while raging) before today but I have seen tons of Bard/Warlock, Paladin/Warlock, and Sorcerer/Warlock.

    I think Rogue/Warlock could be cool if you take the second SCAG option for Rogue.

    Warlocks synergize best with other classes that favor Charisma because of the build being SAD. You can quickly and easily cap out Charisma and then focus on other stats like Dexterity or Constitution as you please.

    The guide is Uncomplete atm, so I can give some slack but I don't know why you'd mention Wizlock before Bardlock or Pallock.
    Well there is the cheese with abjuration wizard and filling up your wards and with Armor of Agythis.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost Nappa View Post
    I don't believe I have ever seen someone mention Barbarian/Warlock (you can't cast while raging) before today but I have seen tons of Bard/Warlock, Paladin/Warlock, and Sorcerer/Warlock.

    I think Rogue/Warlock could be cool if you take the second SCAG option for Rogue.

    Warlocks synergize best with other classes that favor Charisma because of the build being SAD. You can quickly and easily cap out Charisma and then focus on other stats like Dexterity or Constitution as you please.

    The guide is Uncomplete atm, so I can give some slack but I don't know why you'd mention Wizlock before Bardlock or Pallock.
    It's just a matter of personal preferance; I wanted to analyse my favorite options before the rest, just to get them out of the way. A secondary reason might be because it's not as usual to hear about wizlocks, and I wanted to put it out there for people to see it as soon as possible. All will be mentioned in due time however.
    Last edited by Asmotherion; 2016-09-25 at 12:03 PM.

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    MonkGirl

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Necro/Lok is a pretty exploitive build at mid/high levels

    In general I see more Warlocks dips than I see dips as a Warlock... though I did have fun with a Sorcerer 1/Warlock 4/Sorcerer +3/Fighter 1/Rogue 3/Fightyer +1/Warlock +7 'extreme eldrich bladt sniper' build

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    Imp

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Quote Originally Posted by Arial Black View Post
    I have played Pally/lock, Fighty/lock and Barby/lock, all as melee specialists and all were very satisfying indeed!
    What were the pros and cons of each?

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    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Warlock 3 get that pact of the tome for extra cantrips

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    NinjaGuy

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost Nappa View Post
    I don't believe I have ever seen someone mention Barbarian/Warlock (you can't cast while raging) before today but I have seen tons of Bard/Warlock, Paladin/Warlock, and Sorcerer/Warlock
    Barbarian works in a melds build because you us your spell slots for Fire Shield and Armor of Agathys and then Rage. None of your spells have concentration or are responsive they are just prebuffs. Synergy with Reckless attack because you do damage when you are hit and your resistances make your temporary hit points last longer. Fiend temporary hit points tend to help you keep upright in a really long fight.

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    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    monk/warlock is something i see suggested occasionally. usually shadow monk for a more mystical ninja kind of feel.

    what i see depressingly infrequently is people playing a single-classed warlock.

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    SwashbucklerGuy

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Quote Originally Posted by imaginary View Post
    What were the pros and cons of each?
    The barby multiclass has certain features you need to know. You want to rage so that incoming damage is halved making armour of agathys last much longer while still doing full damage. You're happy to Reckless Attack because you want the baddies to hit you and take the cold damage.

    Hex is useless to you, as are all concentration combat spells (out of combat they are fine). Instead, your two slots will be for armour of agathys (cast pre-combat because it lasts an hour. When it runs out when you're not in combat you'll have your slots back so cast it again) and the other slot will be for a pre-asskicking fireball or whatever, then start Raging as a bonus action.

    The fighter multiclass means you have weapon and armour proficiency (unlike the barby multiclass, the fighter must come first in this combo), proficiency in Con saves (for concentration), some self-healing and a fighting style. Only one fighter level is needed until you get at least 5 (or maybe 9) levels of warlock. Armour of agathys and hex take your (in combat) spell slots. Heavy Armour Master is good for keeping AofA going for longer. Once you hit Ftr 1/War 5, your hex will last 8 hours so after the first combat you will have a spare slot for another spell.

    The Pally multiclass is similar but you need 2 levels of pally to get Divine Smite, then you can power your smites with your Pact Magic slots and regain them on a short rest, giving you lots of smiting throughout the day.

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    Halfling in the Playground
     
    Imp

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    See this thread as well.

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    EvilClericGuy

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    Default Re: The (Un)complete Warlock Multiclassing Guide

    Mixing a bit of lock into a bard gives an offensive boost through eldritch blast or scag cantrips.

    Going all the way to 3 gives greater utility from tome.

    1-3 bard on a Lock gives some martial weapons to a lock and 1-4 skills plus expertise and other utility.

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