Simple RAW for Pathfinder Thread V: Golarion Strikes Back

[Coidzor]

Q224: Do creatures produced by a Bag of Tricks leave permanent corpses or do they disappear upon death?

[Elysiume]

Q224: Do creatures produced by a Bag of Tricks leave permanent corpses or do they disappear upon death?

It disappears.

This small sack appears empty. Anyone reaching into the bag feels a small, fuzzy ball. If the ball is removed and tossed up to 20 feet away, it turns into an animal. The animal serves the character who drew it from the bag for 10 minutes (or until slain or ordered back into the bag), at which point it disappears. It can follow any of the commands described in the Handle Animal skill. Each of the three kinds of bags of tricks produces a different set of animals. Use the following tables to determine what animals can be drawn out of each.

Additional explanation: Bag of Tricks uses Summon Nature's Ally as a crafting prerequisite. Summon Nature's Ally is Conjuration (Summoning), which, per the relevant section:

Summoning: A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower, but it is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can't be summoned again.

When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire. A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have.

[VonMuller]

Q225:

The Web(Ex) special ability/attack of monsters, like the Giant Spider, reads:

"... Web spinners can create sheets of sticky webbing up
to three times their size. ..." (Bestiary 1, p. 305)

Do you interpret this as:

a. They can create webs of three times its size (so a Medium Giant Spider would create 3 squares of web)
b. They can create webs of three times its size category (so a Medium Giant Spider would create a 4x4 gargantuan web)

Thank you!

[Yomega]

Q226: What methods are there to increase stats by 1 or any odd number? but specifically looking to boost a 15 to 16.

[Calthropstu]

A226:
Raw? Adding a level bonus, using a wish, using the manual.
You can also extrapolate from the custom item formula.

[Coidzor]

A226: Addendum It's traditionally frowned upon in the culture, but the magic item creation guidelines can be used to compute an estimated price for an odd Enhancement Bonus to an ability score. 1 * 1 * 1000 gp would yield an estimate of a 1000 gp market price, but the existence/legality/possibility of this is entirely GM purview.

There is also, of course, the increase to a single ability score every 4 HD that any creature gets and the other methods already mentioned.

[Elysiume]

A226: Addendum 2 The FAQ states:

Enhancement Bonus: Can I craft an item that gives an odd-numbered enhancement bonus to an ability score, such as a +1 belt of giant strength?
Technically the item-pricing formula in the Core Rulebook allows for items like that, but officially the game should only have even-numbered enhancement bonuses to ability scores. If you want an odd-numbered ability score bonus, you'll need to pay for an inherent bonus, such as a manual of gainful exercise +1.

If you consider the FAQ to extend RAW, RAW does not allow for +1 stat bonuses (or other odd bonuses) on items.

[Psyren]

A225: 3 times their size would be at most one size category up. 3 size categories up would be many times that.

A226 addendum: It's worth pointing out that that FAQ is only clarifying what the official stance would be. Custom items, as the name implies, can do anything - of course, they aren't quite RAW since you're homebrewing at that point.

[Elysiume]

A226 addendum: It's worth pointing out that that FAQ is only clarifying what the official stance would be. Custom items, as the name implies, can do anything - of course, they aren't quite RAW since you're homebrewing at that point.

Agreed; I just wanted to point it out, as it's sort of an out-of-the-way slice of RAW. Personally, my group plays with odd bonus items.

Q227: How does Circle of Death handle saves? Let's say you have three enemies, all with 5 HD, standing in a 15' line, having rolled to kill 10 HD of creatures. If one of the two nearer enemies makes their save, will the spell then "continue" on and have the third enemy roll to save? I ask because of the specific phrasing:

Circle of death snuffs out the life force of living creatures, killing them instantly. The spell slays 1d4 HD worth of living creatures per caster level (maximum 20d4). Creatures with the fewest HD are affected first; among creatures with equal HD, those who are closest to the burst's point of origin are affected first. No creature of 9 or more HD can be affected, and HD that are not sufficient to affect a creature are wasted.

Emphasis mine on "slays" rather than "targets."

Question rephrased: Does Circle of Death:

1. Target creatures until X HD of creatures have been targeted and rolled to save, or until all valid creatures have been targeted.
2. Slay enemies until X HD of creatures have been slain, or until all valid creatures have been targeted.

[Cieyrin]

A 227 Circle of Death uses the same language as Sleep does, neither of which rolls to the next target if a valid target resists. Essentially, the order of operations is select valid targets, those targets attempt to save. Failure means they're affected, success means they resist but those HD to select them are still used.

[Slithery D]

A 227 Circle of Death uses the same language as Sleep does, neither of which rolls to the next target if a valid target resists. Essentially, the order of operations is select valid targets, those targets attempt to save. Failure means they're affected, success means they resist but those HD to select them are still used.

A227 dispute: I'd actually say the language of Sleep is sufficiently ambiguous to leave it open to keep trying until you've either hit the HD cap or everything in range has saved. Similarly for illusion pattern spells, I think a strong case can be made that as written if one of the freeing conditions happens it can still reattack with the freed up HD cap. Compare Loathsome Veil, which has a HD cap but a limited duration of effect and can be made permanent; theres is a very strong implication that it is intended to keep forcing saves as long as anything is within range and it isn't currently maxing out its HD cap, otherwise permanency wouldn't be a very valuable option.

I'd play Circle of Death as continuing until it has killed its cap or everyone makes their save.

[Calthropstu]

A227:
Having to make a saving throw by a spell is being affected by the spell. Successfully saving negates the effects, not moves it on. As it says "save negates" the portion of the spell affecting those who made the save is negated. This applies to Sleep and Slay Living similarly.

[unseenmage]

Q228

How would one price putting both Animate Objects and Fabricate into the same magic item? Would it be considered Multiple Similar Abilities or Multiple Different Abilities?

Am looking at making a single item that casts both spells, first one then the other, with a single use. I know putting one spell in costs SL*CL*2,000(*2 if unslotted).
Just not sure how adding the second spell (or more!) works.

[Florian]

A228:

Actually, this type of item will break the regular pricing formula. You will want to have one of these spells as quickened to get it done in a single action, and so on.

[Calthropstu]

A228:
For the more expensive spell, use the formula as normal. For the second, and future, abilities multiply the cost of adding it by 1.5.
I don't see any way, RAW, to link the two abilities. As previously mentioned, you would have to quicken one to get them both off in the same round.

You might be able to argue a cost reduction since you would be adding a target restriction on the animate object of "the fabricated object" and if you add a restriction of a particular type of object to be created, it could be reduced further. But that is up to GM adjudication.

[Florian]

A228:
For the more expensive spell, use the formula as normal. For the second, and future, abilities multiply the cost of adding it by 1.5.
I don't see any way, RAW, to link the two abilities. As previously mentioned, you would have to quicken one to get them both off in the same round.

You might be able to argue a cost reduction since you would be adding a target restriction on the animate object of "the fabricated object" and if you add a restriction of a particular type of object to be created, it could be reduced further. But that is up to GM adjudication.

Nah. In the end, it would be a custom wondrous item as the intended effect doesn´t really exist.
At that point, it doesn´t matter that there two spells that can, when cast in a row, lead to a certain result, that only means that both spells should be included in the item creation prerequisites.

Going from there, you want to compare similar effects (and cost) with already existing items and adjust them accordingly.

[Calthropstu]

Nah. In the end, it would be a custom wondrous item as the intended effect doesn´t really exist.
At that point, it doesn´t matter that there two spells that can, when cast in a row, lead to a certain result, that only means that both spells should be included in the item creation prerequisites.

Going from there, you want to compare similar effects (and cost) with already existing items and adjust them accordingly.

Ideally, yes. But since this is the RAW thread, I can only state how this could be done RAW. I agree, and yhat is how I would handle it personally, but RAW putting the two spells into an item, one quickened, is guaranteed to do the trick.

[Florian]

Ideally, yes. But since this is the RAW thread, I can only state how this could be done RAW. I agree, and yhat is how I would handle it personally, but RAW putting the two spells into an item, one quickened, is guaranteed to do the trick.

And that actually is the RAW answer.

The abilities that are asked for actually exclude everything besides a wondrous item (or potentially rod), as it does not use the specific rules that cover wands, staves, rings, and so on.

Reread the actual rules on gauging the final pricing and comparing to existing items. That's why a permanent True Strike item does not cost 2K gp.

[Psyren]

Reread the actual rules on gauging the final pricing and comparing to existing items. That's why a permanent True Strike item does not cost 2K gp.

You probably didn't intend to be this brusque (I recall that English isn't your first language) but just wanted to point it out for your benefit.

Calthropstu is correct though - if he wants both spells to go off in a single activation, pricing them both as standard action spells isn't exactly doing the item justice. One of them would have to be quickened, which at a minimum should increase the price substantially. The "look at similar items" clause is absolutely the best way to go, but since there isn't a similar item for this, pricing based on the individual spells and any assumed metamagic is the next best thing.

[Florian]

You probably didn't intend to be this brusque (I recall that English isn't your first language) but just wanted to point it out for your benefit.

Calthropstu is correct though - if he wants both spells to go off in a single activation, pricing them both as standard action spells isn't exactly doing the item justice. One of them would have to be quickened, which at a minimum should increase the price substantially. The "look at similar items" clause is absolutely the best way to go, but since there isn't a similar item for this, pricing based on the individual spells and any assumed metamagic is the next best thing.

The main problem in this discussion is, that unseenmage did mention the components, but not the end result. That can be guessed at: *Puff* instant animate object.
Now there is a family of items that does that: Figurines of wondrous power.

[Firechanter]

Q229
a) What happens if, as a Human, Non-Wizard character, you sleep only four hours or less per 24h-day?
b) What if you keep this up for, say, 7 or 14 days in a row?

Q230
_Assuming_ the answer to (a) and/or (b) is "you become fatigued" -- what would this mean for characters that can negate Fatigue? Don't they have to sleep at all?
Such as Lame Oracle or a Paladin with Mercy (Fatigue). The latter might sacrifice a LoH per day and always be fresh?

[unseenmage]

You probably didn't intend to be this brusque (I recall that English isn't your first language) but just wanted to point it out for your benefit.

Calthropstu is correct though - if he wants both spells to go off in a single activation, pricing them both as standard action spells isn't exactly doing the item justice. One of them would have to be quickened, which at a minimum should increase the price substantially. The "look at similar items" clause is absolutely the best way to go, but since there isn't a similar item for this, pricing based on the individual spells and any assumed metamagic is the next best thing.

Thank you all for your help. My apologies for the lack of specificity. Vagueness was never my intention.

I didnt even think of the need for Quicken. Seriously, thank you all.

[Sayt]

Q229
a) What happens if, as a Human, Non-Wizard character, you sleep only four hours or less per 24h-day?
b) What if you keep this up for, say, 7 or 14 days in a row?

Q230
_Assuming_ the answer to (a) and/or (b) is "you become fatigued" -- what would this mean for characters that can negate Fatigue? Don't they have to sleep at all?
Such as Lame Oracle or a Paladin with Mercy (Fatigue). The latter might sacrifice a LoH per day and always be fresh?

Q229-230
Wizards don't need eight hours of sleep, they need that much rest, which is different.

But the rules stop at fatigue.

That said extreme sleep deprivation has effects beyond fatigue, which your GM may decide are appropriate, and could be implemented as sanity damage, ability damage or drain, or even negative levels.

[Psyren]

b) What if you keep this up for, say, 7 or 14 days in a row?

A229b: Most things that inflict fatigue on an already-fatigued character inflict exhaustion instead, but I don't recall offhand if this is a general rule.

A230: Yes, if you're immune or have some way of negating it repeatedly (e.g. a wand of Lesser Restoration) you can go without sleep for quite a long time. You can even do this as a wizard or other caster (as noted, the requirement is rest, not sleep.)

Put another way, if Vaarsuvius had had a Lesser Restoration potion, he'd have had no penalties at all.

[Coidzor]

Q231: What happens when a creature under the effects of an Anthropomorphic Animal spell dies? Does this change if Anthropomorphic Animal was made permanent with Permanency?

[upho]

Q231: What happens when a creature under the effects of an Anthropomorphic Animal spell dies? Does this change if Anthropomorphic Animal was made permanent with Permanency?

A231: RAW, it appears that such a spell would immediately cease to function, since the subject is no longer a valid target of the spell (has to be an animal, which according to the the game definition is also alive). In effect, permanency does not change this in any way.

That said, I believe a "permanently anthropomorphized" animal might still be so when brought back from death, depending on the spell used to return the animal to life.

[unseenmage]

A231: RAW, it appears that such a spell would immediately cease to function, since the subject is no longer a valid target of the spell (has to be an animal,
...

Doubtful this functions in this way or else the spell wiuld invalidate itself as soon as it took effect.

[upho]

Doubtful this functions in this way or else the spell wiuld invalidate itself as soon as it took effect.

Nope, since the spell says: "The animal‘s size, type, and ability scores do not change."

[Cieyrin]

Q 232 What's the price for a broom or mop?

Q 232b Would using a broom or mop as an improvised weapon be statted as a quarterstaff?

[Calthropstu]

Q 232 What's the price for a broom or mop?

Q 232b Would using a broom or mop as an improvised weapon be statted as a quarterstaff?

A232:
1cp I would assume. I do not think it is actually statted, but it would cost less than a shovel.
B: It would be statted as an improvised weapon. The mop/broom portion would throw weight and balance off. You could, however, make that portion detatchable and treat it as a quarterstaff proper.