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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Cheyenne, Wyoming.
    Gender
    Male

    Default (GM Help) I am need of assistance in making challenging boss battles

    So, for anyone who saw my weird breakdown over on the Homebrew thread, I have been desperate to make fights that challenge my players because I'm afraid I might not keep their interest. I had concepts for these battles, but am unsure how to set them up, crank them up, etc. Obviously this part is important: This is a high-power game. The characters are powerful and influential (One of them owns a successful business that's starting to spread across the continent and single-handedly accelerated the technology level of the setting), and the threats are supposed to be as powerful or even greater so (There have been only 4 types of Lycanthropes for hundreds of years, now there's a 5th, Demons are gearing up for the biggest invasion in history, etc, etc). Everyone has told me they enjoy the combination of power fantasy and in-depth storytelling (They took the time to help a brainwashed bodyguard get away from her cruel mistress), but as I have stated, they keep using clever tactics and methods I couldn't think of to overcome every encounter and obstacle I throw at them, so I'm upping the ante. I request the assistance of both storytelling GMs and min-max specialists to not only design these bosses, but make them work not only as powerful challenges but also interesting aspects of the world (Which is homebrewed and purposefully not completed so that I can add things in on the fly if need be).

    TL;DR: I am not good at dealing with clever players and need min-maxed bosses.

    Here is the group:
    -Human Inquisitor specializing in gunfighting and offensive power
    -Kitsune Crossbowman Fighter/Ranger/Rogue/Musket Master Gunslinger who is the team's Sniper
    -Ratfolk Wizard who keeps a balance of damage spells and utility spells (And always seems to have the right spell at the right time. Trust me, I keep an eye on his prepared spells, he's just that forward-thinking. I might get him ESP tested at some point.)
    -Kitsune Bard specializing in Debuffing and Support
    -Half-Elf Cleric (Charm-Lust, Luck-Imagination) who also specializes in Support and Debuffing)
    They're all 14th level, I suspect they'll be close to 15th after this next session (We meet every monday night)

    Here are the concepts as follows:
    1: Incorporeal Warrior-type specializing in Hit-and-Run tactics in a maze-like dungeon with tight spaces for this guy to utilize to *mess* with the group. Demonic abilities will add to both story and gameplay as some *donkey* dungeon delver accidentally (no, really, it was an accident) unleashed a demon in that dungeon, and the ghostly guardian within got hit with some of that corruption.
    2: 16th-level Human Evocation Wizard, straight-up. I am deliberately avoiding 9th-level spells because the temptation to give him Wish and *Back-based verb involving something very uncomfortable* the party hard would be too great. Brief backstory is he wasn't allowed to become a Chronomancer due to his Psychological issues (Abuses power as soon as he gets it, WAY too ambitious for his own good), and decided the reasonable response would be to try to slay the god of time with the unintentional backing of demons (They are loving how *screwed* up this guy is).
    3: 20th-level Barbarian (Custom race using Race Builder that gives him +2 Str/+2 Con/-2 Int, Fearless, Cornered Fury, Cold Resistance 10, and Mountain-Born) (Also given demonic powers) and his pet Dire Winter Wolf, barbarian specializes in Axe-and-Shield. He's the King of the Northern Tribes, and if it wasn't for the backing of an evil chronomancer he would be dead and the demonic invasion would be easily stopped by the rest of the continent. But, because he is backed by a chronomancer, he has enough *jacked* up bonuses to give him a significant advantage, and the party is sent back in time to slay him before he starts the 100-year ritual to summon enough demons to *jack* the continent upside-down.
    4: Human Tyrant Antipaladin 17, Two-Handed Fighter 9. One of the many guardians of the evil chronomancer set up in his mansion to guard against intruders. Supposed to be a large, powerful intimidating figure with a Greatsword (And a really cool voice that I created for him).

    Make these bosses scary. If you need more information, feel free to ask.
    Jesus saves, everyone else takes 4d6.


  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Tennessee
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: (GM Help) I am need of assistance in making challenging boss battles

    Well, at level 14, you'll have trouble challenging most parties, anyway. That said, there are still ways.

    1. Solo boss fights are a no-no. Every boss needs some kind of assistance, be that in the form of allies or cleverly placed battlefield hazards (who expects a bunch of decorative statues to be Advanced gargoyle fighters?).
    2. Again, battlefield hazards. The standard pit trap or tall cliff face doesn't do it anymore, at least not alone. Have your boss sitting behind a wall of force and buffing up/being buffed by an ally while he monologues. The wall is invisible, and he can use ventriloquism or something to "throw" his voice around it, making the party completely unaware the wall is even there. If you want to be even more sadistic, have the roof be easily collapsible, and have the villain do just that... right on top of the PC's.
    3. Travel around! If the villain is getting his butt kicked, he should retreat into a more secure location, one with more allies or locks between him and the PC's. Instead of one boss room, have a half-dozen rooms that the villain can retreat to, turning a single boss fight into a boss gauntlet.
    4. Did I mention traps? Have the door that the villain has no problem going through turn out to be an advanced mimic, or have him utter a strange word in an unknown language before teleporting away - a word activating a symbol of stunning and opening a hidden door revealing a boulder or something rushing towards the paralyzed party.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: (GM Help) I am need of assistance in making challenging boss battles

    I agree with the suggestions of assistance, barriers, and a backup plan if things don't go his way. Environmental issues can make the party change tactics, too; for example, a room full of tall stone columns makes it hard for the archer to get a clean shot, or for the wizard to get line of sight for damage spells. Spells like Reverse Gravity, Magnetic Field, and Antimagic Field can throw off their plan too, especially if it isn't obvious where these effects are or the party is unprepared for them.

    I've also had good results with boss fights that challenge the players to be more creative with their action economy. It's easy to kill the big bad guy when you spend your full round nuking him down. But if the party has to balance the fight itself with tasks, challenges, or puzzles, it becomes much more interesting and difficult. I recently put my (low-level) party in a room that summoned elementals every round. There were levers throughout the room that when pulled, would destroy one type of elemental. They had to figure out how to spread out safely, which character to position at each lever, and who would save their round to fight non-elementals that could not be dealt with by pulling levers or heal anyone who got injured during the fight.

    You can also give them simultaneous responsibilities they have to juggle during the fight. Do I fireball the bad guy or cast sleep on the henchmen who are about to kill civilians? Do I charge the boss or disarm the indestructible golem that's raging around the battlefield? The floor (and / or ceiling) is slowly crumbling away but I have the bad guy right where I want him, do I try to finish him off or run away before the environment kills me?

    Lastly, give the henchmen something interesting or surprising beyond big damage rolls. Archers with improved initiative and Hushing or Sleep Arrows can really mess up the casters game plan. Guards use trip and disarm instead of straight damage rolls, and each one of them chugs and Enlarge potion as soon as the good guys show up. Tag on some completely unexpected powers or potions to really surprise them, too. I ran a session with experienced players once and they laughed in the face of approaching kobolds and prepared their traditional "wipe out all the wimpy enemies at once" tactics. The players gasped in shock when the first kobold used his firebreathing attack and the mage's fireball was completely ineffective. Maybe some demon or god or whatever gave your henchmen some extra powers or resistances that will throw a monkey wrench in the player's plan, or a counter to their go-to strategy.

    -JonathanPDX

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Goblin

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Here
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: (GM Help) I am need of assistance in making challenging boss battles

    If you've never read this, then you need to.
    Last edited by Nibbens; 2017-02-19 at 03:55 PM.
    Roll some dice, make some stuff up!
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    This guide!

    A reading of notable information in The City of Progress, here.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: (GM Help) I am need of assistance in making challenging boss battles

    As the GM, with plot devices as backup, you can bend the rules to amp up an encounter's challenge in the face of action economy.

    Starting the enemies with short duration prebuffs saves the time to cast them in combat. This is fairly standard.

    However, if you have devices like chronomancers and demonic possession, you can go further to give your bosses extra actions.

    The barbarian could have a permanent super-haste spell that gives him an extra move action each round, or a free combat maneuver (e.g. trip, disarm or dirty trick). The tyrant as an epic enemy could outright receive extra turns (or a Synchronicity effect). A demonically haunted boss can have the demon act as a (3.5) schism effect, using lower level mental spells or powers independently of its host's actions. And so on.
    Last edited by Bucky; 2017-02-20 at 02:39 PM.
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