What is your approximate Character Alignment, and why?

[2D8HP]

Some light teasing is fun (for at least some of us), but I"d prefer we stick to "I am", and "people are", statements, but stay away from "You are", as I fear feelings are being hurt.

But go ahead and slam me if you like, as I think "alignment", is a fiction for a game played for fun, and real-life human behavior and beliefs are more complex to model.

[Aedilred]

I must admit I'm not entirely sure on what level of reality this conversation is taking place. Are people talking from the point of view of their purported/assumed respective alignments, applying the principles of alignment hypothetically in relation to hypothetical realities, actually applying the alignment matrix to real people and making arguments about reality? Or some combination of the above? It seems we have a few things going on and I wonder if this is causing friction, because some people are treating the alignment system with the respect it deserves and making abstract arguments, while others are taking the alignment system seriously and talking about how actions impact the real world. And it's certainly not clear who is doing what.

I wonder if you might be conflating Donna's comments with those of two or three others if you think she was going "on and on" about this point. A word search of this page shows others discussing degeneracy earlier.

If we're going based on use of the word "degenerate" (ignoring the context, and whether it's used as a noun, verb or adjective, which can have profoundly different conotations) then...

We are more necessary than Lawfuls give us credit for. Without us to challenge them, the LNs would degenerate into Lawful Evil through self-justifying tautology.

So perhaps we ought to be a little less quick to rush to judgment, under the circumstances.

[2D8HP]

[junlogji]

saves picture and hits like button

[Spanish_Paladin]

I wish i could say i am Lawful Good, but probably i am in a middle point between LG and LN

And yes, aligment system is a oversimplifcation of the morals and human psychology, but it is fun for a RPG as dungeons and dragons or pathfinder

[Liquor Box]

If we're going based on use of the word "degenerate" (ignoring the context, and whether it's used as a noun, verb or adjective, which can have profoundly different conotations) then...

So perhaps we ought to be a little less quick to rush to judgment, under the circumstances.

Is this aimed at me?

I certainly didn't mean to suggest to judge anyone for use of that word. I just thought that, given Think Minty said Donna was going "on and on" about degeneration, but Donna had only said a few brief words about it, that Think Minty may have been conflating Donn'a comments with those of another user. I don't think anyone on the last page had said what Think Minty accused them of saying.

[Aedilred]

Is this aimed at me?

It was not aimed at you, no. Well, except that it was in reply to your post.

[jollysunflora]

What with how simplified the alignment system is...constant flux between Lawful and Neutral Good, depending on how angry I am at the current government at the time.

[2D8HP]

...constant flux between Lawful and Neutral Good, depending on...
...at the time.

Maybe some people have fixed alignment's, but I do not, as I already posted, the amount of sleep, caffeine, and alcohol I've had changes my alignment, as does what I've recently experienced.

After our annual thanksgiving party, and a day spent feasting and singing, I'm much more likely to give dollars to beggars, than I was yesterday, when I spent the day unclogging drains, first in the Public Defenders restroom, then in the 7th floor Jail, and finally my work day ended with me pulling hair out of a drain in the Autopsy Room (and it's still clogged and waiting for me Monday!).

[AnachroNinja]

I hover somewhere between Lawful Neutral and Lawful Evil. I don't care much for societies rules, but I do have very specific and structured ideas on what is and isn't correct and acceptable. I follow my own beliefs even when they are an inconvenience to me or outright detrimental. An example being that I choose not to lie under any circumstances. I may not freely give all information, I may even say something true in a manner that misleads your understanding, but I refuse to actually speak falsehoods.

As far as the evil end of it, it's an odd balance. I get enjoyment from helping people I like. I'll loan you money when you need it or do you a favor just because I find it personally satisfying to do so. Of note though it's the fact that I don't care in the slightest about doing something because it's the right thing to do. I may help you up off the ground when you fall, but it will be because I feel like doing it, not because I feel like I should. And I may not help you at all if I just don't feel like I want to at that moment. I can seem kind because sometimes being kind feels pleasurable to me. Alternatively, I also enjoy hurting people at times. I like to fight, take satisfaction from winning and almost as importantly, I take satisfaction from causing other people to lose. If you hurt my feelings, or I just feel like it, I may lash out at you emotionally.

In short, I follow the rules I set for myself and I behave in the way that seems most pleasant for me at any given time. Sometimes, even frequently, that may cause me to seem nice, but it's never for anyone's benefit but my own.

[Tiri]

Neutral. Most of the time, my actions are neither particularly good or evil and I follow rules and laws enough to not get in trouble.

[Stryyke]

Most likely Neutral Evil. I understand laws and the need for them, I just don't particularly like them. And I believe that Truth and efficiency are the only relevant concepts in the world. You might say that makes me neutral; but because I just don't care who I hurt to achieve those ideals, I think that pushes me into the evil category.

[sktarq]

Those tests baffle me. If I judge people like a head of family on an individual level (because I lean chaotic on matters of title and rank) then only using that system is going to produce junk results.

I have been called most alignments over the years-except neutral. Respect for authority? Not unless they earn it-chaotic. Best tool for messing with powers that be? Their own rules-I'll twist and skirt them all day to get what I want. Because why give them the reason to mess with you back-it is just more efficient. Creature of habit-rather lawful trait, Deeply committed to principle and to friends but by my own definition of what and who those are. I care not a whit if other people tell me something is wrong, it will only matter if there will be negative consequences for my actions. I have a deep insinct to burn it all down and start again. I have a deep support for most groups trying to achieve things like self determination-(a deep principle for me) even if it brings me into conflict with the powers that be. For me to suspend one's own moral judgment for another's (such as a military commanding officer or politician) is a deeply evil act. I have little to no problems manipulating and twisting to get results that I think benefit people. I also volunteer my time to help people out. I tend to help out and do extra work if I think I'm good enough at it to help. I try to deeply polite and tactful. I like to tactfully insult people who hurt others. I have little hope that humans are good or getting better but still try. I think any law or tradition can be challenged but only to either start work on a better replacement or to advocate such a replacement-because even the lack of a rule or law or guiding norm is a societal choice. I can be deeply brutal if I think that is the most efficient tactic at the moment. I believe deeply in looking at the situation in front of oneself as an individual issue, not one a class of similar issues, whenever possible (a chaotic trait) and then applying trained logic and argument to that problem (a lawful one).

Most people I know say they consider me Chaotic Good. Those who know me well and like me are divided between NG and CN. Those who know me moderately well but dislike me tend to say CN, or NE and lob CE at me without justification (as in won't actually explain why the few times I've been able to ask). Those who don't know me well and don't like me tend to say I'm LN or LE. Those who love me tend to say LG. (many who know me are either gamers or are at least semi-familiar with the lingo or make their alignment view very clear). All in al it makes for a semi-useful Thematic Apperception Test analogue more than anything.

So yeah. Perhaps I am to muddled to be anything but TN. Or maybe I just see alignment as irrelevant.

[TheManicMonocle]

I wish I were less boring but I'm definitely LG

[aloysius]

neutral, because I don't like hurting or doing good for the sake of doing it. But because they may help me later on

[Herobizkit]

I, too, am generally True Neutral.

I'm not dedicated to furthering Good or Evil in any abstract way, and while I do think it's better to support Good over Evil, there are times when I am wholly selfish.

On the Law/Chaos axis, I'm not beholden to needing to do things a certain way to accomplish my goals. I am a free spirit, though I sometimes crave direction.

[No brains]

No brains, no alignment, no service. *rides off into sunset*

[Simetra Irertne]

I am True Neutral, though I sometimes turn Lawful Evil. Lawful Evil is fun, but not great for connecting with other people in everyday life or making relationships. Personally, I've never been particularly Good or Evil. I dislike Chaos, so I'm closer to Lawful but not entirely. I'm maybe 75% Lawful.

[Crimsonshadow97]

I would say Chaotic good, I do what I need to to advance myself, but I also do my best to help others on the side.

[Xanyo]

I am Chaotic Neutral. In my case it partially is Chaotic Crazy. Not too much though. Definitely Chaotic. If I make a promise, I have no qualms about breaking it if I deem it necessary/advantageous. I'm perfectly willing to lie. I consider laws as guidelines. Enforced guidelines.

If I were given significant power(I would particularly like it in the form of Pugilist, Troll-Blooded, and Bone Knight), the Chaotic swings may increase. Or it may tilt.

Let's say, for example, the place I live is declared an Anarchy. While the people are not good enough to handle Anarchy, if some people take it on themselves to protect the weak, it can potentially counter the Chaotics(bullies, usually). These would be vigilantes of moral law. I would likely try to become one of them.

[Scarlet Knight]

Lawful Good; I believe in kindness over selfishness and believe rules help everyone to get along. However, like 2D8HP, I bleed into NG or LN as circumstances change.

[tschel23]

Using the Wizards of the Coast alignment test, I come out as Chaotic Good. That's where I'd label myself anyway, I think.

[minderp]

So I guess I’m about to get deep. But hey, why not?

I suffer from Bipolar Disorder, or Manic Depression if you will.
My alignment changes depending on the strengths of the incline/decline and the strengths of the medication. Strangely, DnD has helped me hash out and identify the changes in my own moral code and actions that come with the disorder. Much like the alignment system, bipolar moods are not so simple to classify.

Mania:
It’s not a simple, wow I’m on a high right now, or I’m so happy I could fly. Mania has many faces, each with their own ‘alignment’. I will try to simplify it as best I can, but to any who know the turns of such a thing, they will know how naïve it is to think it can be put it into a few paragraphs.

First, there’s the happy/creative/delusional high. I would say she was a clear cut CG. To quote: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/alignment-de...itional-rules/
“Chaos implies freedom, adaptability, and flexibility. On the downside, chaos can include recklessness, resentment toward legitimate authority, arbitrary actions, and irresponsibility. Those who promote chaotic behavior say that only unfettered personal freedom allows people to express themselves fully and lets society benefit from the potential that its individuals have within them.”
This kind of sums up the highest of highs. With freedom from order comes the openness to creativity. It’s not that rules and laws are abhorrent, just a hindrance, and one that can be rendered irrelevant in her mind. And in that state, the freeing notion of no control nor order allows the spirit of her to fly free and create with no boundaries. Create physical works of art, or create emotional pieces, better described in the Good category.
“Good implies altruism, respect for life, and a concern for the dignity of sentient beings. Good characters make personal sacrifices to help others.”
In this state, she feels deeply with an open heart. She is the most caring and sensitive soul of the lot. It is this state that works of art of emotion, complex and intertwined thoughts and loves, come alive. This is hard to put into words. Though over my time I have found that most who suffer with mania understand what I mean, without the need for explanation, it is hard to explain to anyone who does not know it on a personal level. In this state, she loves harder. She cares harder. Her heart, is open. And the way she loves is a piece of art all of its own.
This, leaves her more vulnerable to hurt, and is often the catalyst to the fall.

Second, there’s the anger mania. She, is CE.
“ Evil implies hurting, oppressing, and killing others. Some evil creatures simply have no compassion for others and kill without qualms if doing so is convenient.”
Though I would never go so far as considering killing, the main target of the anger is usually to hurt. She is not someone who intends to physically hurt you, but she is not only capable of tearing you to shreds emotionally, she is willing and ready.
The hardest part of my own struggle is this. The fact that when I am in this state of mania, my goal is to inflict as much damage with each word that I can. There is no true victory that is achievable. I do not get joy from destroying those that I love. But in that state, it is all that I know. When I come down, there is only guilt awaiting me.

Depression:
So depression paired with mania is not a simple, i'm down, i can't get out of bed, i haven't showered for three days kind of thing - if you could call that simple. Yes, all of that is relevant, but with bipolar, it's so much more. It's 'exhausting the soul' level.

First, the self loathing depression. She is harder to define, but if must, I would say she is LG.
She is the one who understands the consequences of the CG high and the CE anger. She is the one who punishes herself by her own set of rules/laws.
“ Law implies honour, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability. On the downside, lawfulness can include closed-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, self-righteousness, and a lack of adaptability.”
This sums it all up. She punishes her own failings. She understands (in her own way) that the other states have broken each value she knows she should hold dear. Closed-mindedness is a perfect description. “It is the bipolar, you are not a bad person”, that is something she cannot comprehend. You cannot talk her out of her self-inflicted punishments. You cannot convince her that she is not to blame. She is the one that will atone for the sins of the others, she is the one that will bare the blame.

Second, the every-body-else loathing depression, with the slight hint of mania. She is LE. Perhaps the most manipulative of them all, she is the one who sees the failings of everybody else. She is the smartest of them all, the most cunning, the most calculating. Revenge/Vengeance is a small and almost irrelevant ideal in today’s society, but for her, it is a constant and silent goal. She has a clearer view of society than the other states, she is the one with the least trouble to appear normal. But she does not punish herself for her failings, she punishes everyone else. She is unfeeling, cold and merciless.
She is the nasty one, the one I like the least. For me personally, I am lucky she appears only when I am at my worst, and with the right medication, that is not very often.

And finally, there is me. The in-between. The Medicated.
Would I call my CG, CE, LG or LE? Probably not. I guess I fall into TN. I am average, fairly balanced and unmotivated by much. But I share traits with each of these states. I am creative and thoughtful. I analyze everything, as you may be able to tell by the fact that I have analysed my mental illness in terms of character alignment. Yet I am paranoid beyond belief and i always harbour at least a trace of self-loathing. But I am generous, and trusting. I give with my heart, I feel with every fibre of my being, and I love without question. I can be bitter and spiteful, I can lie and mislead. I follow the laws that my country dictates, but I speed sometimes and forget my seatbelt. I feel for people who are wrongly and unjustly treated, yet I rarely do anything to change the situation.
I am a little bit of everything, just like everyone else. As I write this, I can see the reason I enjoy RPG’s so much. I get to choose who I will be. I get to be a holy crusader, fighting the injustice and stopping the tides of evil. I get to be a dark and fearsome being of evil, enforcing the hierarchy of hell and its right to all.
But most of all, I get a choice.


Well, that was far deeper than I expected. Let’s get back to the kicking goblins and telling bad jokes in taverns…

[paddyfool]

Neutral Good, for me.

I like to try and help people, to be honest, compassionate, yadayada. And I like to encourage systems of rule and law that help people but do not restrain them unduly and respect individual freedonms. Politically I become deeply suspicious of any faction showing strong authoritarian traits, such as suppressing the press, suppressing protests, advocating their own "strong, stable" rulership and the destruction of opposition etc. Also, I don't manage to maintain anything like rigid discipline, though I try to be disciplined on stuff that matters.

[TheChelaxian]

I am Lawful Neutral. I obey the law because it is the law. I do this not out of some righteous desire to"do the right thing" (LG) nor do I necessarily do it to advance myself by exploiting the law (LE).

Sometimes I feel like I'm Lawful Evil because of how frustrated by those who ignore speed limits or don't use their turn blinkers and how I wish those individuals would be caught and arrested; I know I would severely punish these "law-breakers" simply because they bother me. It those cases I use the "law" for self satisfaction and making myself feel righteous. Order through tyranny, despite the above example being little more than a pet peeve.

To me, the law was established for a reason thus, until legitimately proven ineffective in the modern day and age, must be obeyed or be punished.

Wow, this sounded much less petty in my head... Regardless, I deeply believe that the law must be obeyed if their is to be order and peace. So, LN with a lean towards LE.

[Hagashager]

I fall into the category that DnD alignments aren't great representations of morality in real life.

That being said, I had a debate with a friend back in college about this. He and I decided that the overwhelming majority of people are all, whether they like it or not, Lawful Neutral.

Most of us, in our daily lives, even those with eccentric personalities, are not so unhinged as to overtly disrupt societal mores (chaotic), nor are we so prudish in our values as to actively disregard the objective laws passed down by whatever government we happen to live under. (True Neutral).

To be *good* by our definition, means to put a broader community above yourself and your immediate connections. This sacrifice has to also be voluntary and without compensation. For example: a person who uses civil disobedience to defy a corrupt government would be considered "Chaotic Good". A person who uses legal legislation to create laws that benefit the well-being of their community would be "Lawful good". A person who helps out a friend in need would not be "good" however, because they are technically helping themselves by strengthening a personal, beneficial bond that is, ultimately irrelevant to whatever community they identify with.

to be *bad* is to actively, and with full conscience, engage in dangerous, immoral, or abusive behavior. It also applies to a conscience desire to want to hurt people in some way. A boss who's rude or unsympathetic is not enough to call them evil, they might be a jerk, but they're not actively trying to make your life worse, or kill you. Likewise, a politician who passes legislation or mandates that alter your state of being, but are not directly harmful, or deliberately discriminatory towards you is not an "evil leader". A dictator who passes laws that allow for bigotry, or worse, would be "Lawful evil". A serial killer would be "Chaotic Evil". However, a petty thief who shop-lifted once because they had no money, or sincerely felt like they had no other choice, might be more accurately described as "Chaotic Neutral".

From this angle, I'd say I'm Lawful Neutral. In the context of my immediate community, I'd say I'm Lawful Good. I take the law very seriously, and I genuinely believe I owe a duty to my friends and family to do right by them.

However, I don't really like the post I just made. It distilled deeply complex moral issues down to cheap analogies, and does not do justice to the kind of intricate motivations that drive us humans to act as we do.

[Leucis]

I'd love to say I'm a chaotic neutral, or at least chaotic good, but that's not really true of many. It would have to be lawful good. I do follow laws, of course (rules that aren't state/government laws are iffy - if I will certainly end up being punished by them, I'll follow them, if they're not really enforced then I'll just do whatever, but that's kind of normal human behavior). I'm also probably too nice and forgiving to others for my own good, and will only do things like refuse to speak to someone after they've proven themselves over and over not to be worth anyone's time. I actually don't follow very many social standards though, I never really learned how to socialize 'correctly' and don't care about it too much, but that's still okay under lawful good, I think

[Lawful Good]

I'm feeling Chaotic Evil, myself

[The Eye]

Apparently I'm chaotic evil:

Excellent Chaotic Evil roleplaying The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."

But I see myself as more of a neutral evil kind of guy. Or maybe just a huge jerk.

[Norrefve]

I like to think that I am LN, but more often than not end up LG in practice.