GrrlPower III: Crisis Of Infinite Filler Comics

[Traab]

She has eight laser swords as wings. That's in D&D?

I'm not convinced that the "fight" with Vale was more than setting up Vale. I think there is every sign that Sciona is going to give Max trouble. I still want to know who or what Deus is. I think that (one day, but not today) Vale is going to give Max a pounding, that it will take all of Arcswat to pull it around, and then Deus is going to turn out to be a still bigger threat.

I dont mean tell me a direct analogue, I just meant, give me a random hybrid caster/melee class to serve as an example of my point. Which is, she has decent melee capabilities, but not good enough to take on pure melee types, however, she also has dangerous magic to work with that could make up the difference in the right scenario.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Doesn't happen in D&D. Gish suffer the same way all non-casters do. In a competition between sword and spell, spell is going to win pretty much every time past the first couple levels.

[AvatarVecna]

Doesn't happen in D&D. Gish suffer the same way all non-casters do. In a competition between sword and spell, spell is going to win pretty much every time past the first couple levels.

For more or less exactly the same reason that Dabbler is one of two people who have fought Max to a standstill: Dabbler has a million different ways to go about fighting you, all she needs to do is figure out which 10 of those or so she has to combine for you to be completely and utterly ****ed.

[lord_khaine]

I agree that sciona might be a real opponent in a matchup where she gets prep time. But so far in a direct confrontation, she has been doing really really badly. Backing down in the reliquary, backing down against vale, using golems and robots and other such hands off tactics to do her fighting for her. It all points to her not being all that personally strong or skilled as a combatant. She is, quick, tell me a decent hybrid class of caster and melee in d&d. Not willing to stand toe to toe with the melee powerhouses and swing away, and she needs room and time to use her magic.

I dont think that taking it as a annoyance when your punched though reinforced concrete is doing badly. What it most of all shows is that Sciona dont want to fight if she has a chance to lose.
She is extremely intelligent, as shown by how she played everyone to gain access to the vault.
Both of the places she has backed down, has been against an unknown opponent where she did not really have anything besides pride on the line.
This is the person who survived for god knows how long as ½ a head. Pride takes second string to survival.

[Traab]

I dont think that taking it as a annoyance when your punched though reinforced concrete is doing badly. What it most of all shows is that Sciona dont want to fight if she has a chance to lose.
She is extremely intelligent, as shown by how she played everyone to gain access to the vault.
Both of the places she has backed down, has been against an unknown opponent where she did not really have anything besides pride on the line.
This is the person who survived for god knows how long as ½ a head. Pride takes second string to survival.

I agree, she isnt stupid, but the fact remains that she isnt confidant enough in her own strength to continue the fights which tells me direct confrontations arent her cup of tea. At this point, lets see what the next few comics do before we bother continuing to argue. Maybe if we can get an actual protracted fight to happen we can learn a bit more about her limits.

[lord_khaine]

Well yes and no? She struck back at Vale after being punched though a wall. She brutally assulted Wyrter. So she is clearly not a stranger to violence. At least when she have the upper hand. But she also clearly flee whenever the odds are uncertain. So yes she is a lot less confident than Max or most other supers. But that can also just be her being smarter.
The next comic should tell us a lot though. If she can evade Max then she is a viable threat. Not to Max perhaps. But to everyone else.

[AvatarVecna]

Today's comic strip brought something to my attention about webcomic pacing that I hadn't previously thought very much about: the general rigidity of the format can sometimes make it difficult to both have proper pacing panel-to-panel while still fitting one "beat" into a single page. Like, the longer I look at today's comic, the more I think that reading this comic as part of a comic book would be better served by panel five moving to the next page and panel four being stretched to take up the space (letting us see the whole of the bridge and giving a better scope of things)...but then today's strip would just be a very short action beat minus the comedy, and would make this particular update of the webcomic less impactful. I'm also unsure how to feel that we now have confirmation that Sydney's imagine-spot was perhaps more grounded in reality than it was made out to be at the time, but that's a different issue entirely.

Today's update isn't bad, I don't wanna give that impression. It just...looking at it, it feels kinda...smooshed? Cramped? There's a lot of small panels for a large-scale outdoor scene, but I'm not really sure how one would go about fixing that without making this update just kinda bland?

[HandofShadows]

I think "Opps" is the theme of todays page.

[Rogar Demonblud]

There's a lot of small panels for a large-scale outdoor scene, but I'm not really sure how one would go about fixing that without making this update just kinda bland?

Trust your audience to not wander off if you don't have a "New Shiny!!" every strip?

Frankly, I think the joke is wasted. It isn't very funny and it undercuts the drama involved (that Max just turned a suspension bridge into a slow-rolling disaster--without that support, the whole thing is coming down very soon).

[Traab]

Its funny, everyone assumed sydney would be the public relations disaster. But it turns out max is the one running around blowing up roads and bridges and such. I bet arianna is already developing a migraine over trying to spin this so it doesnt reflect badly on archon (good luck) Also, anyone else thinking of the justice league episode where green lantern went on trial for blowing up a planet because his shot bounced off of alien shields? I mean sure in this case its actually happening, but still, the parallel is impressive.

Another thought that just popped into my head. It looks to me like max is once again going to be sidelined for most of the fight, pulling a superman as she holds the bridge up. This is a bit of a trend really. In the super brawl she hung back to supervise, in the council fight she flew the exploding dummy out of the chambers and was gone for most of that fight. And now of course there will be this.

[Forum Explorer]

Another thought that just popped into my head. It looks to me like max is once again going to be sidelined for most of the fight, pulling a superman as she holds the bridge up. This is a bit of a trend really. In the super brawl she hung back to supervise, in the council fight she flew the exploding dummy out of the chambers and was gone for most of that fight. And now of course there will be this.

Get used to it, it's SOP for characters like Maxima. By being stronger then everyone else, either they need to have a villain who is stronger then them (AKA the Big V), or be otherwise distracted/disabled/not there, in order for other characters to even do anything.

[lord_khaine]

Hmm.. i think this shows that Sciona is a lot stronger than Max expected, but still weaker than Max.
And it means that yes, Max will be stuck holding up the bridge. She is like a level 10 NPC with a level 5 party. Something has to be done to keep her occupied. Or else she will solve everything herself.

Im just glad its done with minimal use of idiot balls. Max did come along for the mission to catch Sciona. And Max did try and prevent her from sabotaging the bridge.

Honestly i am getting a little curious about if the Author is regretting that he made Max so strong at this point.

[Nettlekid]

Honestly i am getting a little curious about if the Author is regretting that he made Max so strong at this point.

I've been wondering that too. Like we've spent most of Max's characterization establishing her as ultimately powerful, totally unbeatable, on another level from everyone else, we haven't even seen her use close to full power, yadda yadda yadda strong strong strong. There's nowhere to grow.

[Rogar Demonblud]

I'm guessing the Arabic speaking individual we saw on the villain reaction page will probably be the one where Max really cuts loose on the destruction side. Vehemence showed us how much she could tank, and this scenario is ripe for Maximum Strength.

[lord_khaine]

I've been wondering that too. Like we've spent most of Max's characterization establishing her as ultimately powerful, totally unbeatable, on another level from everyone else, we haven't even seen her use close to full power, yadda yadda yadda strong strong strong. There's nowhere to grow.

Yeah.. or at least.. there is as such always room to grow. DBZ has taught us that. The problem is that it would leave the entire remaining cast as little more than cheerleaders.
Of course Max can always grow as a leader or as a person.

[Ibrinar]

Worst comes to worst you could introduce her equivalent of Kryptonite but that would mostly add another way to side line here. I guess it could only weaken her. Bud yeah if she was only strong flying and durable you could introduce something magical that penetrates her defenses or something. But add her speed and the options are limited if you don't want it to also crush the rest of the team or really be a Kryptonite equivalent that only works on her.

But yeah there is always room to grow by just adding more powerful enemies but the problem is not making the rest increasingly useless .

[lord_khaine]

Worst comes to worst you could introduce her equivalent of Kryptonite but that would mostly add another way to side line here. I guess it could only weaken her. Bud yeah if she was only strong flying and durable you could introduce something magical that penetrates her defenses or something. But add her speed and the options are limited if you don't want it to also crush the rest of the team or really be a Kryptonite equivalent that only works on her.

But yeah there is always room to grow by just adding more powerful enemies but the problem is not making the rest increasingly useless .

Well.. there is a reason for why Supermans speed is the superpower thats most often forgotten. It just trivialises defeating most opponents, because they really should be defeated before they even had a chance to react, unless they poses super speed of an equal degree.

[Traab]

Well.. there is a reason for why Supermans speed is the superpower thats most often forgotten. It just trivialises defeating most opponents, because they really should be defeated before they even had a chance to react, unless they poses super speed of an equal degree.

In all reality, his speed even trivializes his weaknesses if used properly. Lets face it, unless kryptonite killed him an attosecond after it gets in range of him, there would be literally nothing stopping him from traveling at mach 35 right through metallo and his power core. He can feel queasy for a few seconds afterwards. Super speed is the most broken super power ever once it reaches a certain level. Especially when it gets combined with the secondary abilities needed to use it properly. Aside from black adam, is there anyone with magical powers even remotely fast enough to clip superman in blitz mode? (I think he has magical lightning he can use)

[Rogar Demonblud]

Shazam probably is. With a chance to arrange the battlefield, Doctor Fate likely could as well.

[lord_khaine]

In all reality, his speed even trivializes his weaknesses if used properly. Lets face it, unless kryptonite killed him an attosecond after it gets in range of him, there would be literally nothing stopping him from traveling at mach 35 right through metallo and his power core. He can feel queasy for a few seconds afterwards. Super speed is the most broken super power ever once it reaches a certain level. Especially when it gets combined with the secondary abilities needed to use it properly. Aside from black adam, is there anyone with magical powers even remotely fast enough to clip superman in blitz mode? (I think he has magical lightning he can use)

He does not even need to travel through Metallo, or for that matter Batman and his stupid piece of kryptonite. All that needs to be done is to jump upwards and away. Then there are plenty of times to considder an apropriate response. Like water ballons filled with glue. Or a molten lead bath.

Black Adam and Shazam, as previously mentioned, likely can do so with a bit of luck. Perhaps even Wonder Woman, she is magical in this incarnation as i recall. And there are a modest amount of other people with the reaction speed and toughness to handle a Supeman in blitz mode. But thats because DC is a world of gods among mortals. That still repeatedly have to forget some of Supermans power whenever he teams up with others.

Thats just kinda hard when heroes in GrrlPower meanwhile are meant to act more competent. Especially since they are more soldiers or Swat officers than super heroes.

[Traab]

He does not even need to travel through Metallo, or for that matter Batman and his stupid piece of kryptonite. All that needs to be done is to jump upwards and away. Then there are plenty of times to considder an apropriate response. Like water ballons filled with glue. Or a molten lead bath.

Black Adam and Shazam, as previously mentioned, likely can do so with a bit of luck. Perhaps even Wonder Woman, she is magical in this incarnation as i recall. And there are a modest amount of other people with the reaction speed and toughness to handle a Supeman in blitz mode. But thats because DC is a world of gods among mortals. That still repeatedly have to forget some of Supermans power whenever he teams up with others.

Thats just kinda hard when heroes in GrrlPower meanwhile are meant to act more competent. Especially since they are more soldiers or Swat officers than super heroes.

Nah, the biggest problem is maxima skews the average too much. Her stats are just too high for the setting, narratively speaking. I dont think anyone else approaches that range. Even sydney is marked as well below max in every category, barring maybe defense with her shield. And she is the freaking protagonist! Everyone else is in the beatable range without requiring a vehemence to take part. If it wasnt for maxima, I think the way the rest of the crew acts and reacts would be sensible. Max is honestly an anachronism in the setting. Someone of her power should only be showing up as the big bad type of villain that takes a group effort to defeat. Not the front line combat type who is always there to trivialize everything until she is conveniently removed from the battle scene.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Well, Sydney at trainee level is less powerful than Max. But she's gotten two power ups so far, and is probably about due for yet another.

[Traab]

Interesting. Max ISNT removing herself from the fight. She tossed on a super speed patch and told her crew to hurry the heck up and let THEM take care of the bridge/evacuation. Also, that wasnt an easy deflection for sciona. If max spotted that, she knows a little more power = cored out sciona.

[Rogar Demonblud]

So instead of Max using Strength to hold up the bridge, she's using Speed for a quick lash job and then hunting down Sciona?

[Traab]

Makes sense. She has eyes on sciona, the bridge isnt going to move, so its best for her to continue pursuit or else they will lose her. meanwhile the rest of the crew can work on evacuating the bridge, if not repairing it a bit better so it isnt in imminent danger of collapse. If they can. Maybe dabbler has some sort of bridge repair beam weapon she can use.

[Rogar Demonblud]

If they have Heatwave, they can weld. If they have Harem, they soon will have Heatwave.

[Traab]

If they have Heatwave, they can weld. If they have Harem, they soon will have Heatwave.

Harem cant teleport people. They weigh too much.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Yes, she can. She just needs to un-pop one or two of her clones to make room.

[Traab]

Yes, she can. She just needs to un-pop one or two of her clones to make room.

She was barely able to handle the 50 cal rifle. Even doing a gear run she had to unpop a clone to let her handle carrying it all. The only time she has teleported a person was with varia sharing her power.

[tyckspoon]

Harem cant teleport people. They weigh too much.

Was that specified as an actual limit of her teleport, or was it just the result of what she personally can carry? IIRC she doesn't like to do it because she's used to being a multiple person, but she can temporarily gain a modest level of super-strength by de-existing her other bodies (like she did when one was significantly injured until the doctor could address the injury) so that the energy/strength/whatever they would normally carry is concentrated in a single one. 'Not strong enough to carry along a human bodyweight' is a fixable problem for her if the situation demands it.