Optimize this Weapon: EtherBlade from Fiend Folio p.68

[daremetoidareyo]

Etherblade:

Resembling a short glaive topped with a hollow barrel, this favored weapon of the ethergaunts can fire a ray of force as a ranged touch attack for 1d6 points of damage. The etherblade ray has a range increment of 40 feet. The weapon can fire 50 times before it is exhausted. It cannot be recharged.
An etherblade can be used as a two-handed weapon in melee combat to deal 1d10 points of slashing damage. A fully charged etherblade has a market price of 800 gp.

Ethergaunts have developed a number of technological marvels. Because the race shuns art or pleasure, most such devices facilitate one of two activities: genocide or the eradication of religious devotion. Though the features of these objects resemble those of magic items, the objects are in fact technological and are not affected by spells such as antimagic field. Only ethergaunts have the knowledge and skill to build or maintain these devices.

Besides being the Called Weapon ACF for PsyWar, what can we do with this bad boy?

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Spoiler: optimize this weapon master list

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Lasso
Caber
Locking Garotte

[Inevitability]

It seems useful against the typical caster tactic of a selective AMF combined with incorporeality.

[Venger]

due to fiend folio's just phenomenal editing, this weapon is neither simple, martial, nor exotic, so that's just awesome.

for the purposes of this challenge, what're we considering it? if exotic like all similar weapons, such as the sun giant's sandblaster, then a mom dip will allow you to use this stupid thing.

force damage as a ray is pretty amazing, though a tiny bit more expensive than a wand of sonic snap. it working in an amf is very tasty.

consequently, one of the things to do is use these as things to channel precision damage and turn it into force damage (as a touch too) which is comparatively difficult otherwise.

handedness for using it as a gun isn't mentioned, and I don't see why you couldn't use two, like hand crossbows and double your fun. even if the challenge restricts you to one, you can deal a fairly respectable amount of damage that does all the good stuff force can do (kill ghosts, bypass dr, slip through an amf, etc)

if a mom dip is blockaded because this thing is ruled to be neither simple, martial, nor exotic, then just have the guy use master's touch first and do all the stuff I said. if that's out, UMD to emulate an ethergaunt. (what maintenance? the things can't be reloaded)

[Gemini476]

Being non-proficient isn't too big an issue - it's a touch attack, so the -4 to hit is a bit less relevant. It's nice to be rid of it, though.

[Beheld]

Yeah, looks like the optimal use of this weapon is to buy a pile of them and hand them to a TWFing Rapid Shot flask rogue build. It's a Force Touch Attack that can be twfing rapid shoted, is super cheap, and the -4 penalty for non proficiency hardly matters. It's 16gp per shot, if you can craft it with the craft skill, you can get it down lower. Basically, using it exclusively is going to cost less than half your consumable budget at every level.

Lose out on the ability to do energy damage with flasks to exploit vulnerability, gain the ability to hit ethereal/incorporeal, but otherwise, pretty similar.

[Gemini476]

Remember, though, you can't craft them unless you're an Ethergaunt. "Only ethergaunts have the knowledge and skill to build or maintain these devices."

Not to mention that, well, as nonmagical devices they'd presumably go with the slow-as-molasses mundane crafting rules.

[daremetoidareyo]

Twf is a good suggestion. The return to the temple of the frog has technological items too. Maybe there is something in there to guide our hand as far as adjudicating the most likely weapon category.

We will be assuming that exotic weapon proficiency is necessary unless you're a natural born ethergaunt.

[Venger]

Remember, though, you can't craft them unless you're an Ethergaunt. "Only ethergaunts have the knowledge and skill to build or maintain these devices."

Not to mention that, well, as nonmagical devices they'd presumably go with the slow-as-molasses mundane crafting rules.

that's what umd is for.

[Zaq]

that's what umd is for.

Does Use MAGIC Device help when crafting NON-magical items?

[Venger]

Are we ruling that this thing is a mundane item? Again, like its weapon category (simple/martial/exotic) it is silent. In the absence of information, while it doesn't specify a caster level or any spells you need to make it, I assumed that like the doubt bomb immediately below it, a blowgun I use to shoot mind bullets was at the very least an alchemical item, which I think is kosher to use UMD on to emulate a race.

[Bucky]

It looks like the only way to gain proficiency with an Etherblade is to be a cleric that worships an Ethergaunt.


I cannot imagine what such a cleric would actually believe.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Does Use MAGIC Device help when crafting NON-magical items?

UMD an item of fabricate? That'd work, but it may not be what Venger meant.


An elan can easily turn into a red ethergaunt with alter self, as they are medium 5 HD abberations. Though dubious from an in-universe perspective, that may allow you to craft etherblades by RAW.

[daremetoidareyo]

Let's assume that you can buy a new one every level. Can't you planar bind you some crafters?

Dwarven urgrosh mind blade + warblade dip can get etherblade added to a soulknifes mind blade list...theoretically.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Let's assume that you can buy a new one every level. Can't you planar bind you some crafters?

Dwarven urgrosh mind blade + warblade dip can get etherblade added to a soulknifes mind blade list...theoretically.

You would lose the etherblade's main ability (to function in an antimagic field without trouble). It'd still be a slightly improved Soulbow dip, which isn't bad (from the soulknife's perspective anyway), but I wouldn't go for it.

[Venger]

It looks like the only way to gain proficiency with an Etherblade is to be a cleric that worships an Ethergaunt.


I cannot imagine what such a cleric would actually believe.

Sounds good to me.

He'd probably just think ethergaunts were cool and want to have powers like them and would square the cognitive dissonance away somehow, like ocular adepts.

UMD an item of fabricate? That'd work, but it may not be what Venger meant.


An elan can easily turn into a red ethergaunt with alter self, as they are medium 5 HD abberations. Though dubious from an in-universe perspective, that may allow you to craft etherblades by RAW.

As clever as that is, I can't pretend that's what I meant. That certainly works too. Not really dubious, you're an ethergaunt, so you can make these dumb things.

[Inevitability]

It looks like the only way to gain proficiency with an Etherblade is to be a cleric that worships an Ethergaunt.


I cannot imagine what such a cleric would actually believe.

Even if using divine magic is against an Ethergaunt's code of conduct, Heretic of the Faith allows one to still use it. Maybe look in that direction?

[Darrin]

The description in the Fiend Folio doesn't give this weapon a weight. However, it does say it's like a short glaive, and glaives do have a weight: 10 lbs. It's a mundane non-magical object, so one jug of shapesand (100 GP, Sandstorm p. 102) gives you a fully-charged etherblade. Even better, when you run out of charges, unform it then create it again for another fully-charged etherblade.

However, most DMs are not going to allow that without inflicting upon you some degree of serious head trauma. So let's say you've got a drained etherblade. Other than stab people with it, what else can you do with it?

Spoiler

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Yeah, ok, not exactly the right kind of glaive. Actually, I'm going to borrow a neat trick from the Viscount's Devil and the Deep Blue Sea build:

Race: Human.
1) Fighter 1. Feat: PB Shot. Human: Power Attack. Bonus: Rapid Shot.
2) Fighter 2. Bonus: EWP Etherblade.
3) Fighter 3. Feat: WF Etherblade.
4) Fighter 4. Bonus: WS Etherblade.
5) Warblade 1.
6) Exotic Weapon Master 1. Feat: Quick Draw. Stunt: Throw Exotic Weapon.
7) Bloodstorm Blade 1.
8) Bloodstorm Blade 2.
9) Bloodstorm Blade 3. Feat: Brutal Throw. Bonus: Power Throw.
10) Bloodstorm Blade 4.
11) Fighter 5.
12) Fighter 6. Feat: Precise Shot. Bonus: Far Shot.
13) Peerless Archer 1.
14) Peerless Archer 2.
15) Peerless Archer 3. Feat: Ranged Weapon Mastery. Power Shot.
16) Warblade 2.
17) Warblade 3.
18) Warblade 4. Feat: Penetrating Shot.
19) Warblade 5. Bonus: Stone Power.
20) Warblade 6. Avalanche of Blades.

Instead of using Waverider's Superior Mounted Archery, we're using Exotic Weapon Master. Take a close look at the first sentence of the "Throw Exotic Weapon" stunt:

"The character can throw an exotic weapon with no penalty on the attack roll, even if it isn't designed to be thrown..." (emphasis added)

The type of penalty isn't specified, so we could argue that it applies to *all* penalties (wear a helmet for this one): the -4 penalty for throwing a melee weapon, range penalties, -2 penalty for Rapid Shot, Power Throw penalty, Power Shot penalty, and of course Thunderous Throw + Power Attack penalty (applied in that order, of course). At ECL 20, that's at least +80 damage just from Power Throw/Power Shot/Power Attack.

Penetrating Shot is there mostly for giggles. You may get lucky enough to have your opponents line up, in which case you can throw your etherblade right through their ribcages in a 60' line. Technically, this feat doesn't work with thrown weapons... but the etherblade is actually a projectile weapon, and you're making a ranged attack with it, so it counts (sorta). Stone Power is also mostly giggles, but then again, you can ignore the -5 attack penalty for 10 free temporary HP per round. If you like, you can sub in some more Fighter levels for Combat Expertise and Improved Combat Expertise, cranking up your AC by +20. But if you stick with Warblade 6, then you have just enough IL to get Avalanche of Blades.

Activating Thunderous Throw lets us treat our thrown weapon attacks as if they were melee. This means we can throw our etherblade as part of Avalanche of Blades... and when it hits, we can ignore the -5 penalty on subsequent attacks. So we can keep making attack rolls at +80 damage until we miss. Too bad it has to all be on the same opponent, otherwise you could clear the battlefield in a single round.

[Venger]

excellent use of the devil and the deep blue sea.

darn, I was waiting on a ruling on whether the thing was mundane before saying shapesand. well done on that, although like turning it into a chaos flask, I suspect it would be dubious in actual play.

the penetrating shot trick is very good, but the fun never has to end. . if you partnered with an ally who was immune to damage (in a way of their choice, but for simplicity's sake let's say a bone knight who has season passes to the shriver) you could have him stand in line with multiple enemies and target him indefinitely with avalanche of blades until you killed everyone else. have him tank his AC (I mean why wouldn't he? perhaps he does something with masochism/karmic strike/etc since he can get hurt forever) and you can pretty much attack all day

[Darrin]

the penetrating shot trick is very good, but the fun never has to end. . if you partnered with an ally who was immune to damage (in a way of their choice, but for simplicity's sake let's say a bone knight who has season passes to the shriver) you could have him stand in line with multiple enemies and target him indefinitely with avalanche of blades until you killed everyone else. have him tank his AC (I mean why wouldn't he? perhaps he does something with masochism/karmic strike/etc since he can get hurt forever) and you can pretty much attack all day

Dagnabbit... this would be the damage trick I kept looking to combine with Pain Mastery but couldn't find!

Well, actually not quite true... my Pain Mastery idea involved stacking a few hundred applications of Blister Oil and then voluntarily failing the save... and then maybe doing something involving share pain with a psicrystal or whatnot. Couldn't quite bring it all together.

[mabriss lethe]

Hmm: Would weapon augment crystals do double duty here? applying extra damage to both ranged and melee attacks?

[Venger]

Hmm: Would weapon augment crystals do double duty here? applying extra damage to both ranged and melee attacks?

if they didn't specify melee/ranged, yeah. which ones just add bonus damage again?

[Soranar]

A fully charged one costs 800 gp right?

Just take ancestral relic , every time you run out of charges you can just reinvest value into it so that it regains its charges. I usually do that with a dorje but it works just as well with this thing.

Add a crystal against undead and you'll be able to sneak attack undead with that thing.

[Venger]

A fully charged one costs 800 gp right?

Just take ancestral relic , every time you run out of charges you can just reinvest value into it so that it regains its charges. I usually do that with a dorje but it works just as well with this thing.

Add a crystal against undead and you'll be able to sneak attack undead with that thing.

I don't think ancestral relic will actually work, since the thing doesn't become useless when it reaches 0 charges like a wand, so you can't go from 0-800 (unless we're assuming partially charged etherblades exist costwise)

very good call on adding a truedeath crystal. I assume you meant "you can sneak attack incorporeal undead" but that's clever.

[Menzath]

It's Ray is force damage, that can hit incorporeal regardless.

[Dagroth]

A Greater Truedeath Crystal allows for sneak-attacking Undead... but requires a +3 Weapon to attach to.

[Menzath]

Are we classifying this as a glaive equivalent weapon? Or can it be dual classified as a ranged and meele weapon?
What kind of weapon enchantments does this thing even qualify for?

[daremetoidareyo]

I think it is classified as a rare ranged/melee polearm. I'm excited to see what enchantments would work on it.

[Menzath]

Also, looks like we can get around crafting them with the shadow Smith class, technically makes it an SU though.

I forgot, anyways to change an SU to EX?

Would also allow us to change weapon enchantments whenever we needed. To bad the class overall isn't that good. Would the psy power call weapon also work for just "making" one of these?
Or even that spell, summon weapon.

[ExLibrisMortis]

I think it is classified as a rare ranged/melee polearm. I'm excited to see what enchantments would work on it.

Well, splitting would be good, but it only works on bows, crossbows, and their ammunition. The hank's energy bow enchantment would be good (+1 size increase and Power Attack), but as a unique item, it can't be readily applied to other weapon types. It is in any case debatable whether the ranged and melee function should be enchanted separately.

There are non-magical enchantments: Dragon 358's Master's Forge article, plus all the various bits and pieces spread across setting books. They go nicely with this weapon's AMF-penetrating function. Razor Sharp increases the damage by 1. Thinaun allows soul trapping incorporeal creatures in an antimagic field, if the weapon's material affects the ranged attack (I'm not sure it should).

[Deadline]

Also, looks like we can get around crafting them with the shadow Smith class, technically makes it an SU though.

I forgot, anyways to change an SU to EX?

Would also allow us to change weapon enchantments whenever we needed. To bad the class overall isn't that good. Would the psy power call weapon also work for just "making" one of these?
Or even that spell, summon weapon.

I'm not sure that's accurate. There's plenty of room to argue that a technological beam weapon staff thingy has moving parts in it, which nixes the Shadow Smith ability entirely.