Doctor Who - Series 10

[Quiver]

Since I've only watched Eccleston and Capaldi, I thought I'd go ahead and ask: Just what are the in-universe rules for meeting yourself while time travelling? I understand that you can't go back in time to prevent an event you've witnessed, because then how would you go back in time to prevent it? But I also know that DW has multiple instances of the Doctor meeting himself. How does that work, without completely screwing up timelines?

Generally with the fact that, if the Doctor is willing to cross his own timeline, time is getting pretty screwed up anyway

Well, more seriously: The Three Doctors (the First, Second and Third) were able to meet because the Time Lords bent time to allow it. Same for The Five Doctors (First through Fifth). The Two Doctors featured a crossover between Second and Sixth, but that one... yeah, was more or less an ordinary adventure, so not quite sure what happened. Then Day of the Doctor featured ancient Gallifreyan artifacts, so...

Basically, it's a loose rule, and you can't do it unless you can. Much like time travel rules in general on Who

[Jeivar]

Generally with the fact that, if the Doctor is willing to cross his own timeline, time is getting pretty screwed up anyway

Well, more seriously: The Three Doctors (the First, Second and Third) were able to meet because the Time Lords bent time to allow it. Same for The Five Doctors (First through Fifth). The Two Doctors featured a crossover between Second and Sixth, but that one... yeah, was more or less an ordinary adventure, so not quite sure what happened. Then Day of the Doctor featured ancient Gallifreyan artifacts, so...

Basically, it's a loose rule, and you can't do it unless you can. Much like time travel rules in general on Who

But in Who, do you basically get away with being in the same time as yourself, as long as you're not in the same place? So, say, Ten can go to a concert in Rome while Nine is in a café in Rome, as long as Ten is careful not to meet Nine?

[factotum]

In "Father's Day" (the episode where Rose saved her own father from death and thus caused a massive paradox) I'm pretty sure that Ecclestone says that his people (e.g. the Time Lords) would have done something to prevent that if they'd still been around. In their absence those weird time-eating things turned up and started destroying everything to seal the time wound instead.

Anyway, it's pretty clear that problems arise when people actually *meet* a time-shifted version of themselves--the Brigadier met himself in one of the later episodes of old Who, which the Doctor had been trying to prevent for most of the serial. So long as the two versions of the Brigadier weren't in the same location everything was fine.

[Pex]

"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually, from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint, it's more like a big ball of wibbly-wobbly... timey-wimey... stuff."

[Quiver]

But in Who, do you basically get away with being in the same time as yourself, as long as you're not in the same place? So, say, Ten can go to a concert in Rome while Nine is in a café in Rome, as long as Ten is careful not to meet Nine?

Yes. As long as the two Doctors don't interact with one another to cause a paradox, it's generally okay.

Though, on the note, there also seems to be certain ways you can... stretch it. I remember one of the old novels -which may or may not be canon anymore- mentions that the Brigadier's funeral is attended by every incarnation of the Doctor. Given this isn't followed by "And then time exploded", it seem's as though there is a certain range of things you can do in crossing your time stream.

Overall though... yeah, crossing your own timeline is a general no-go, and kind of seen as a thing to avoid.

[Eldan]

There's a number of Big Finish stories where that happens. Sometimes even more direct. Things like the seventh Doctor leaves behind a hint for the sixth Doctor to find. Or the Eight Doctor storms into some base to free some captured expert, only to find out that that expert left in a hurry, since he was the Fifth Doctor and meeting would be bad.

[Jeivar]

There's a number of Big Finish stories where that happens. Sometimes even more direct. Things like the seventh Doctor leaves behind a hint for the sixth Doctor to find. Or the Eight Doctor storms into some base to free some captured expert, only to find out that that expert left in a hurry, since he was the Fifth Doctor and meeting would be bad.

Is there a reason given why Eight didn't remember being Five at this time and place?

[dps]

New episode is great. Not terribly original, but very well executed IMO.

[Pex]

Spoiler

Show

Alright! It's not the first time we see the Ice Warriors in Nu Who, but it's great to see them again. They tug at the heart strings of Classic Who fans with a cameo of Alpha Centauri! The origin story of how the bad guy Ice Warriors of Classic Who joined the Galactic Federation. A most satisfying punch line.

[Jeivar]

Okay.

How the heck do I watch new episodes of Doctor Who? I would be happy to pay money for it, but Netflix doesn't feature the new season, and Amazon.com and Amazon.co.uk demand a local address for buying episodes on Stream. I resorted to watching the new episodes on a free site, but it seems to be on the fritz.

What are my options?

[dps]

Okay.

How the heck do I watch new episodes of Doctor Who? I would be happy to pay money for it, but Netflix doesn't feature the new season, and Amazon.com and Amazon.co.uk demand a local address for buying episodes on Stream. I resorted to watching the new episodes on a free site, but it seems to be on the fritz.

What are my options?

Is Direct TV available in Iceland?

[BWR]

That was actually pretty fun.
I have long had a soft spot for Ice Warriors and it was fun to see them back in action and done well. My only gripe would be the captain's excessively aggressive and overconfident attitude in the face of obviously superior technology and unknowns in general.

[Androgeus]

Okay.

How the heck do I watch new episodes of Doctor Who? I would be happy to pay money for it, but Netflix doesn't feature the new season, and Amazon.com and Amazon.co.uk demand a local address for buying episodes on Stream. I resorted to watching the new episodes on a free site, but it seems to be on the fritz.

What are my options?

I'm not sure on availability in Iceland, but have you checked google play or itunes? I know they have the latest episodes soon after broadcast.

[Hopeless]

In "Father's Day" (the episode where Rose saved her own father from death and thus caused a massive paradox) I'm pretty sure that Ecclestone says that his people (e.g. the Time Lords) would have done something to prevent that if they'd still been around. In their absence those weird time-eating things turned up and started destroying everything to seal the time wound instead.

Anyway, it's pretty clear that problems arise when people actually *meet* a time-shifted version of themselves--the Brigadier met himself in one of the later episodes of old Who, which the Doctor had been trying to prevent for most of the serial. So long as the two versions of the Brigadier weren't in the same location everything was fine.

Mawdryn undead I think it was called and had the Brigadier not met his earlier self Five would have had to sacrifice his remaining regenerations to resolve that situation if I recall properly?!

[BWR]

Mawdryn undead I think it was called and had the Brigadier not met his earlier self Five would have had to sacrifice his remaining regenerations to resolve that situation if I recall properly?!

That is indeed the one.

[dehro]

Spoiler

Show

oooh, this captain really needed a punch in the face.
also, that one soldier.. black AND showing the picture of your fiancee?.. that's a sure recipe for getting killed... it would have been nice to see him survive and subvert the trope.

that said, a fairly decent episode, I think.

[BWR]

Spoiler

Show

oooh, this captain really needed a punch in the face.
also, that one soldier.. black AND showing the picture of your fiancee?.. that's a sure recipe for getting killed... it would have been nice to see him survive and subvert the trope.

that said, a fairly decent episode, I think.

Frankly I was surprised to see a black face there at all. I'm pretty sure the British army didn't have racially integrated troops until much later.

[random11]

It was... Okay, I guess.

Spoiler

Show

The officers' behavior considering where they are and the reaction to an obvious superior enemy is a bit distracting.
It's not funny enough to be taken as a joke, and too weird to be taken as a serious criticism.

The bar of when to use Missy and what to give her in return for her help just keeps going down every episode, and it's hard to understand considering the problems the Doctor already solved alone for several seasons and what we know about her.

The wink to the classic Doctor fans was okay. I'm not a fan myself, but I don't mind a reference if it doesn't feel forced into the story itself.

[Jeivar]

Frankly I was surprised to see a black face there at all. I'm pretty sure the British army didn't have racially integrated troops until much later.

I'm no historian, but wasn't Britain a good deal less racist than America at this time?

[jayem]

Frankly I was surprised to see a black face there at all. I'm pretty sure the British army didn't have racially integrated troops until much later.

It was set in Victorian times.

Definitely had coloured troops under in the East Indian Company Army (cref Indian mutiny, for how not to treat them), which sometimes wore standard uniform.
White officers were superior (in rank) to any Indian officers, but were present in regiments (then of course you'd expect to see more).

Also he was very young. Which leads to other backstories, such as being a servant picked up in the wars.
It could be that they've deliberately left it vague so all of "historically-unlikely but comfortable" and "historically-likely but politically incorrect" and "we'll use whatever excuse you used for Prince of Egypt" are possible

[dehro]

Nu-Who has been fairly consistently colourblind in these things, minus that episode in which Martha went undercover as a maid when the Doctor played hide and seek with his memory/identity. Minor characters can be and often are of all colours of the human race.

[BWR]

I'm no historian, but wasn't Britain a good deal less racist than America at this time?

Well yes, but that doesn't mean they weren't. It could be I'm confusing things with colonial regiments. A brief look online gave no useful information on the subject.

[Pex]

That was actually pretty fun.
I have long had a soft spot for Ice Warriors and it was fun to see them back in action and done well. My only gripe would be the captain's excessively aggressive and overconfident attitude in the face of obviously superior technology and unknowns in general.

It's a Classic Who trope. There is always a "That Guy" who stubbornly refuses to cooperate and through his greed and/or lust for power makes things worse. It was so familiar to me I didn't find anything odd about it. The only thing that was surprising was The Empress finally relenting to peace and stop the fighting. In Classic Who the Bad Guy Aliens of the Episode would continue their rampage, and the Doctor has to stop them anyway. The cameo just reinforced the idea to me that they purposely went with a Classic Who vibe. There were some NuWho elements I won't get into due to their personal bias cynical nature, but the episode would fit right in between Hartnell and McCoy.

[dps]

It could be I'm confusing things with colonial regiments. A brief look online gave no useful information on the subject.

That's certainly possible. I don't know much about British Army recruitment during that era (or any era, TBH), but I would think that any man living in England would have been eligible to be recruited into the regular army, and there has been a small black minority in England for centuries (though smaller than you might gather from watching NuWho).

[Pex]

That's certainly possible. I don't know much about British Army recruitment during that era (or any era, TBH), but I would think that any man living in England would have been eligible to be recruited into the regular army, and there has been a small black minority in England for centuries (though smaller than you might gather from watching NuWho).

Considering it's NewHu and how soldiers around him were being killed off with him not even getting shot at, I was actually surprised he was killed off after all. I was expecting him to be the only soldier survivor at the end with him, Bill, or The Doctor monologueing a moralizing speech against hate.

[Friv]

That's certainly possible. I don't know much about British Army recruitment during that era (or any era, TBH), but I would think that any man living in England would have been eligible to be recruited into the regular army, and there has been a small black minority in England for centuries (though smaller than you might gather from watching NuWho).

There was apparently some backstage discussion at the BBC about it when the actor was hired. Short version - it was incredibly rare, but not entirely unheard of; technically, any native Englander could be in the regiment, but in practice there'd be a lot of racism keeping them out.

[dps]

Yeah, that's pretty much what I thought.

If RN recruitment policies were anything like USN recruitment polices during that era (and I think that there were some similarities), I suspect you'd be more likely to see a black sailor in the Navy than a black soldier in the Army.

[Pex]

There's also real world reality. They would be yelled at if they didn't hire minority actors whatever historical accuracy, so they make snide comments about "whitewashing" on the frozen Thames.

[random11]

Considering it's NewHu and how soldiers around him were being killed off with him not even getting shot at, I was actually surprised he was killed off after all. I was expecting him to be the only soldier survivor at the end with him, Bill, or The Doctor monologueing a moralizing speech against hate.

Oh come on, black guy in a monster setting, wearing red uniform, and showing pictures of his family.
He never had a chance.

[Jeivar]

One of the things I did like about this episode was the Doctor's respect for the Ice Warriors, in spite of their often violent ways. I don't entirely agree with his general ethics, but one thing I do appreciate about the character is how he doesn't discriminate between species, at all.

Now... what do we think of Missy? Elaborate mind games, or genuine character development?