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  1. - Top - End - #91
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    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by georgie_leech View Post
    So between the people I've met online going for one date and then vanishing...
    ....Vague, broad advice would be helpful, as I have no idea where to start.

    Since I have little idea about you other than "male and 25", and I have no idea what your "type" is, I'll just quote myself on answers to other who asked similar questions:

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    IIRC you're about twenty years old?

    This worked in the late 1980's and early 1990's:

    Be an artist, a poet, or just someone who has friends that let them (and a guest) slip into galleries, movies, nightclubs etc. for free.

    So be part of a "scene".

    For what it's worth I met my future wife through Subway Guitars in Berkeley, California (she played bass).

    My real advice would be to ignore romance for now and concentrate on becoming a man who's attractive to women in their 30's (not the same as what most girls in their 20's want in boys).
    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Get a great coat, and work it.

    See here (scroll down).
    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    ..Young women typically want guys who look more like David Bowie than a body-builder.

    Men seeking men usual do like more musculature though.

    Both prefer some facial hair, women usually like short to long stubble, guys full beards.

    It's no accident that so many young guys seem to be trying to look like Paul Bunyan ("lumbersexuals").

    Wear red.

    Back in the 1990's (before I looked like a Goblin), when I walked, women strangers would offer me rides when I wore leather boots or shoes, dark pants, oval sunglasses, and a mostly red plaid shirt.

    Get yourself a greatcoat:


    (Not for the summer!)

    Unfortunately the main way to look attractive to most women is to be tall, and while a few sartorial tricks can help a little bit, there's not much you can do.

    Fortunately most women regard the majority of men as not looking attractive.

    Manner and voice are more typically more important to women.

    Women value intelligence, wit, and sanity more than men usual do.

    So think before you talk.

    Talk low and slow, without mouth breathimg (if you're not saying something, close your mouth).

    A deep voice is important.

    Think Sean Connery, James Earl Jomes, Patrick Stewart, and at the extreme Barry White.

    Most of these will get you more respect from men as well...

  2. - Top - End - #92
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by georgie_leech View Post
    So between the people I've met online going for one date and then vanishing, and actually asking the friends I've asked out who declined, I've come to the conclusion that while I'm not a major creep or otherwise turning people away, but... Well, I apparently give off no sense of chemistry. Like, if I were a character in a dating sim, I'd be a background supporting cast with no stat screen; you wouldn't even think about if I would be fun to date.

    So... how do I go about changing that? Vague, broad advice would be helpful, as I have no idea where to start.
    Well generally from my experience and talking to folks that have had similar experiences either you are getting way too invested too fast, or the opposite. It sounds from what your friends are saying that you're a little on the cold fish side. Which is usually going to be kind of a turn off for some ladies. Some of my advice is probably going to sound like it might almost be creepy it isn't, or hasn't been if you're not a creep about it.

    A.) Physical contact, make sure that you are actually having some physical contact. I'm talking like holding hands, kind of brushing up against her, if she doesn't think you are into her physically, and that's what's she's looking for, she's not going to be into you. Now it's very easy to overdo this and come off as really creepy, but it's equally to underdo it and come off like you have zero interest in any kind of actual romantic relationship or Tangoing in either position.

    B.) Try for dates that give you something to talk about during the date. Hiking can be good in that regard, but you need to make sure she's really into it, and make sure that you pick a well-populated trail, both for your safety and so that she knows that you aren't just trying to take advantage of her. Dinner and a movie is good too. A lot of people say that it's boring or cliche. But it's really an ideal date. Dinner gives you time to talk and kind of get to know each other, the movie, being at a specific time cuts down on the necessity to fill every moment with conversation. Also a movie is a good place to get that initial physical contact, you can put your arm around her, or get rejected and figure out that she isn't that interested in you, in either case, that way you'll have some idea about how things are going.

    C.) Make sure that you're talking about both of your interests some. Most online dating things have "Profiles" use that to have at least 30-40 minutes worth of good conversation topics about her interests and then plan for about 1/3rd of that around your interests. So that way you aren't being boring. Most people seem far more boring than they really are when they're put on the spot.

    Edit: D.) If you're really feeling stiff, maybe sneak a beer in the bar of whatever restaurant you're meeting at beforehand or two, that'll loosen you up, don't have more than that, and don't have enough that she can tell you've been drinking, but it definitely helps at least to get you past that awkward stage.

    Edit:

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    If you want women's attention that's good news!

    Most American men think that women are looking for guys that look more like Arnold Schwarzenegger.
    Some women are, it really depends on your woman. My experience has been that there are plenty of women out there who like muscular guys. I think it's about split down the middle.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Women typically want guys who look more like David Bowie than a body-builder.
    Again, it really depends on your lady. Plenty of ladies would find David Bowie "too skinny", I've talked to women who have made that observation about guys with that sort of build, in fact I've heard women make that observation about guys with more muscular builds than Bowie by a considerable amount.

    Generally women's objections to bodybuilders have to do with the perception that they're vain, which is probably often the case. But once you're in person, if it's clear that you aren't completely full of yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Men seeking men usual do like more musculature though.
    Were this the case, twinks and (homosexual male) crossdressers would not be a thing. Again it varies a lot depending on who you are talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post

    Both prefer some facial hair, women usually like short to long stubble, guys full beards.

    It's no accident that so many young guys seem to be trying to look like Paul Bunyan ("lumbersexuals").
    Depends entirely on who you're talking to, AGAIN. I've had several of my significant others who liked that I had facial hair, and my current fiancee and my ex both insisted that I shave.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Unfortunately the main way to look attractive to most women is to be tall, and while a few sartorial tricks can help a little bit, there's not much you can do.
    My experience as somebody who is 5'6", has been that being tall is not critical in attracting women. At all. Like I've had dates with hot women, with women who were taller on me on at least one occasion and it never mattered. Where I've seen height mostly brought up is in the Redpill sections of Reddit, and the Misc. and those are people who are looking for excuses about why they suck: "I'm so short so I'll never get laid even though my personality absolutely sucks." That sort of thing.

    There are women who value taller men, but I think it is a lot less prevalent, again in my experience than those cesspools on the internet would suggest.
    Last edited by AMFV; 2017-07-22 at 05:20 PM.
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  3. - Top - End - #93
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    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by AMFV View Post
    ....Some women are, it really depends on your woman....

    AMFV is right, I was lazy in just quoting myself with incomplete information.

    Anecdotedly teen girls and very young women have a preference for somewhat "girly" pop stars ("Bobbysoxers" for the thin young Sinatra of the 1940's, the "long" haired Elvis of the 1950"s, Bowie of the '70's, etc.), and anecdotally they outgrow that preference, but the reality is different, in that unlike men who seem more likely to share a "type", women just tend to have a greater diversity of "types" overall.

    Quote Originally Posted by goto124 View Post
    I've been asking similar questions about men's tastes in women. It may be the media goes for a well-known standard that is most marketable and appeals to most people (men?). There may even be a self-reinforcing cycle....
    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    IIRC what I've read, most on-line dating messages are sent by men to the same minority of women, but women have a wider variety of "types".

    Yes men have different "types", and yes women do share "types", but two random American men are more likely to share what they regard as an attractive women, than two random American women are to regard who is an attractive man. Women are more likely to have different tastes in men, but men are more likely to have the same taste in women (image wise).

    How much media images are influencing tastes vs. how much tastes cause media images, I have no idea.

    I haven't given any links because I'm just not in the mood to read on the subject again (maybe someone else can verify or disprove).

    Well I thought that I'd try to find links to whatever it was that I read (or imagined!) but there's just way to much to wade through (especially since I'm not "looking for love"), so here's just one somewhat relevant

    link

    While in idle moments "how to get romantic" articles are amusing to read in small bites, I've found that wading through lots of them headache inducing.

    I won't link to them (because I really don't want to re-read any of it), but there's lots of stuff about men into their 50's sill seeking girls in their early 20's, while women generally seek men slightly older until they reach their 40's, when they want a man who's slightly younger (but older women point to images of guys around 40 years old, so if you really want romance than either be a women in her early 20's, or a man in his late 30's to early 40's who has grey hair and studies up on pop culture of previous generations, lies about his age, and goes for women 60 and up. This allegedly worked for a co-worker of mine who went grey in his late 20"s and told me, "I can have any old lady I want", somewhat true he got an older women in the Fire department who has a much bigger income than his to date him, but she "won't put a ring on it").

    Anyway, I'm just going to drop the romantic advice and go for life advice instead:

    Don't look for romance, just keep a look out for it.

    IIRC you'll find a lot more people with the time and inclination to share social activities at your age than when you're older (until retirement),


    If people are the same as when I was your age (just writing that really makes me feel old and clinched!), most women/girls near your age are way too busy discovering art and finding out who they are themselves to want to be "exclusive". You'll likely have to seek someone who is at least 27.(the age my wife was when I met her when I was 23).

    Yes my grandmother was 16 when she married my grandfather and they live into their 90's together, but that generation had the shared memory of the Great Depression and a World War to bind them.

    My mother was 20 when she married my father, but that marriage like most of the early marriages of that generation didn't even last ten years.

    Lasting love (in my experience) is built on shared memories and struggles, and the chances of finding someone who will want to stay at your age is remote.

    If you're just looking for someone to spend a few evenings with?

    Then be cute and bartend at art gallery show openings, that worked for me when I was in my 20's (and would definitely not work for me now as I now have the face of goblin with a personality to match)..

    When I was in my 20's I had friends who definitely gained friends (and romances) while doing community theater.

    Be open to romance when it happens, but it's a waste of time to obsess about seeking it.

    Make art!

    Build community!

    Tell jokes!

    Volunteer for good causes!

    Be passionate about what you love, not just finding who you want to love.

    Good luck.

  4. - Top - End - #94
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by georgie_leech View Post
    So between the people I've met online going for one date and then vanishing, and actually asking the friends I've asked out who declined, I've come to the conclusion that while I'm not a major creep or otherwise turning people away, but... Well, I apparently give off no sense of chemistry. Like, if I were a character in a dating sim, I'd be a background supporting cast with no stat screen; you wouldn't even think about if I would be fun to date.

    So... how do I go about changing that? Vague, broad advice would be helpful, as I have no idea where to start.
    It would help to know more about you and about what you think you're doing wrong our how you've been going about it so far.
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  5. - Top - End - #95
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by georgie_leech View Post
    So between the people I've met online going for one date and then vanishing, and actually asking the friends I've asked out who declined, I've come to the conclusion that while I'm not a major creep or otherwise turning people away, but... Well, I apparently give off no sense of chemistry. Like, if I were a character in a dating sim, I'd be a background supporting cast with no stat screen; you wouldn't even think about if I would be fun to date.

    So... how do I go about changing that? Vague, broad advice would be helpful, as I have no idea where to start.
    I agree with dehro, that's not much info to work with.

    At least, you seem to be able to turn online contacts on dating sites into actual dates with a decent success rate? That's good news. How big is your sample, though? There's nothing wrong with a first date not automatically leading to more. In fact, that's kind of the exact point. As far as the "vanishing", it seems the most convenient, most effortless way to pull the plug on a dating partner for some people.

    So, the dates that led to "vanishing", do you estimate that they went well? Did the other person seem bored? Or did they seem to like their evening (lots of smiles, no gaps in conversation, new subjects always flowing)? I suppose you're in a position to judge that. It would be a start.
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  6. - Top - End - #96
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Thanks for the advice everyone. Yeah, the scenario is pretty broad and vague, and that's by design. I'm looking for general principles over specifics, as I didn't know enough of what I was doing that was important. You know, that level of experience where you don't know what you don't know.

    What I'm taking away from this is that it could be helpfull to make my attraction more obvious before I ask someone out. Not to full on creep status, but apparently I've gone too far in tbe other direction. So actually flirting and occasional contact could be helpful, and in general acting like relafionships are a possibility. As oppose to, you know, trying to avoid being a creep so hard that some people have actually thought I was aesexual.

    And yes, I'm not pursuing romance to the exclusion of other aspects of my life, nor am I jumping to super serious and/or life partner status right off the bat. I don't think that a relationship is necessary nor sufficient for happy life. That said, I like them, and going on 5 years since I broke up without so much as a second date with anyone is a bit much for my tastes.

    Oh, and re: online messaging leading to dates, I'm not actually particularly successful with that, which is why I'm hoping to make the most of the few that do pan out
    Last edited by georgie_leech; 2017-07-23 at 02:56 PM.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Afternoon folks: I must once again enlist your advice in the ongoing chronicles of my own cluelessness. So I've been thinking of asking a classmate of mine on a date-- in fact, I was tempted to do it earlier today, but seeing as I have pretty much no experience asking out somebody I'm not already friends with, I thought I'd better get a little perspective from others. As I said, I don't know her very well, only enough to be interested in getting to know her better, and though our interactions thus far have been pretty amiable, they've also been limited to the context of a college classroom. So I'm kind of torn between three notions here-- should I just be straightforward and ask her after class if she'd like to get coffee or something? Should I wait and see if I can strike up a friendship first? Is it a terrible idea to try and ask out a classmate in the first place?
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  8. - Top - End - #98
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Comrade View Post
    Afternoon folks: I must once again enlist your advice in the ongoing chronicles of my own cluelessness. So I've been thinking of asking a classmate of mine on a date-- in fact, I was tempted to do it earlier today, but seeing as I have pretty much no experience asking out somebody I'm not already friends with, I thought I'd better get a little perspective from others. As I said, I don't know her very well, only enough to be interested in getting to know her better, and though our interactions thus far have been pretty amiable, they've also been limited to the context of a college classroom. So I'm kind of torn between three notions here-- should I just be straightforward and ask her after class if she'd like to get coffee or something? Should I wait and see if I can strike up a friendship first? Is it a terrible idea to try and ask out a classmate in the first place?
    Do you know for sure that she's not straight? There's a lot hinging on that. For all we know, from your description, she likes you as a female college acquaintance... and might very well agree to spend time with you in an outside-of-school context, but then in her head it would be as friends.

    I have to admit though that all my own experience has been from the other side of the fence - the thought "maybe she's not into guys" has never entered my mind before I'd start courting a girl. Through dumb luck, statistics were strongly in my favor so it was never a factor. I'm pretty sure however that most homosexuals have to use their "gaydars" subtly in those very early stages in any context that aren't meant to focus on meeting other people for relationships/romance/sex, such as, obviously, the workplace and school, to only name a couple.

    So, for that part, I couldn't tell you how to proceed, I'm sure you're more experienced than me.

    Putting that aside, the way you should ask her out depends on your tolerance to risk vs reward. If you don't think you can handle it becoming awkward in the worst case scenarios, then you should probably continue cultivating the friendship for now. There's also the time factor to consider - I suppose you're doing a summer semester at the moment? If you know that you two will be together for a good while beyond the summer, then you can be patient, but if you're going to part ways then, you will probably have nothing to lose making a move at the end of the semester.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
    Do you know for sure that she's not straight? There's a lot hinging on that. For all we know, from your description, she likes you as a female college acquaintance... and might very well agree to spend time with you in an outside-of-school context, but then in her head it would be as friends.
    I definitely don't know for sure-- she's mentioned attending a local LGBT Pride parade, which implies she's not straight, but I can't say for sure.

    Putting that aside, the way you should ask her out depends on your tolerance to risk vs reward. If you don't think you can handle it becoming awkward in the worst case scenarios, then you should probably continue cultivating the friendship for now. There's also the time factor to consider - I suppose you're doing a summer semester at the moment? If you know that you two will be together for a good while beyond the summer, then you can be patient, but if you're going to part ways then, you will probably have nothing to lose making a move at the end of the semester.
    I think I can handle getting shot down. It's never happened to me (not that I'm bragging, my sample size is one), so maybe I'll realise on the cusp of asking that I'm too intimidated, but I don't think I will be. And aye, it's a summer quarter, of which there are about two weeks left, and it should be my last at this school, so I pretty much have that two-week interval to see about making a move. Should I belay that plan if, by the conclusion of the quarter, we haven't spoken much more/I haven't picked up on any sign of interest from her?
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by skim172 View Post
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  10. - Top - End - #100
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Comrade View Post
    I think I can handle getting shot down. It's never happened to me (not that I'm bragging, my sample size is one), so maybe I'll realise on the cusp of asking that I'm too intimidated, but I don't think I will be.
    Good!


    And aye, it's a summer quarter, of which there are about two weeks left, and it should be my last at this school, so I pretty much have that two-week interval to see about making a move.
    Well, these are good circumstances for what you're planning to do. You guys both know you're never going to see each other unless you act about it, so it's somewhat natural that at the end of the semester you'd ask her for a way to continue to keep in touch. If you were already friends (which you're not yet, from what I've seen) it would be all but guaranteed that you could obtain at least one "date" this way (it wouldn't be a date in her head, but still, that would be a step forward).

    If I were you, I'd try to become closer to her, but not overdoing it. Better safe than sorry.

    Also, something that would probably work really well for you - isn't there some kind of party or going out to a given place to celebrate the end of the semester? If so, see if she's going, if not, invite her. Even if there isn't, you could easily ask her, towards the end, if she's doing anything to celebrate semester's end.




    Should I belay that plan if, by the conclusion of the quarter, we haven't spoken much more/I haven't picked up on any sign of interest from her?
    I wouldn't. You haven't got anything to lose in any case. Try to get closer, if you can, but not in an unnatural way. (I'm just saying this as I'm not sure when giving advice here how skilled people are socially, but I think you'll be okay :) )
    Last edited by lio45; 2017-07-26 at 10:37 PM.
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  11. - Top - End - #101
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
    If I were you, I'd try to become closer to her, but not overdoing it. Better safe than sorry.
    That I can do. The class we share entails a good few group activities, so there are a number of opportunities for that, if nothing else. I mean, as long as I avoid giving the impression of 'why does this girl keep ending up in my group?'

    Also, something that would probably work really well for you - isn't there some kind of party or going out to a given place to celebrate the end of the semester? If so, see if she's going, if not, invite her. Even if there isn't, you could easily ask her, towards the end, if she's doing anything to celebrate semester's end.
    Not as far as I'm aware, but I'm really not the party kind of person, so I wouldn't be savvy to that. I figured 'hey, do you want to get coffee or tea after this?' was probably the most natural way to do it.

    I wouldn't. You haven't got anything to lose in any case. Try to get closer, if you can, but not in an unnatural way. (I'm just saying this as I'm not sure when giving advice here how skilled people are socially, but I think you'll be okay :) )
    I'd like to think I can avoid coming on too strong in cases like this. If anything, maybe I'm inclined to be too cautious. That might mean, of course, that I need to mind that I don't inadvertently jump the gun or something, but I also don't want to keep thinking 'right, not now, the opportunity isn't there... not yet, I should wait and see if we get any closer... maybe I should-- oh, it's the last day of class and she's just left, so much for that idea'.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
    : THOG NOW SCHRÖDINGER's ORC!
    Quote Originally Posted by skim172 View Post
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by georgie_leech View Post
    Oh, and re: online messaging leading to dates, I'm not actually particularly successful with that, which is why I'm hoping to make the most of the few that do pan out
    That's pretty much the experience for most men when it comes to online dating, so I wouldn't be particularly worried about that. As a guy you generally end up wasting a lot of time and effort reading profiles and setting a lot of messages with little return on that investment.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by georgie_leech View Post
    Oh, and re: online messaging leading to dates, I'm not actually particularly successful with that, which is why I'm hoping to make the most of the few that do pan out
    It's a numbers game. Keep it casual, talk to lots of people, and suggest meeting up for something fairly innocuous (coffee) rather than a heavy date-like situation. You're more likely to get a response to a 15-minute coffee get-together than a whole evening plan.

    And expect that most of those 15-minute-coffee deals won't really work out, either.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Form View Post
    That's pretty much the experience for most men when it comes to online dating, so I wouldn't be particularly worried about that. As a guy you generally end up wasting a lot of time and effort reading profiles and setting a lot of messages with little return on that investment.
    Quote Originally Posted by kyoryu View Post
    It's a numbers game. Keep it casual, talk to lots of people, and suggest meeting up for something fairly innocuous (coffee) rather than a heavy date-like situation. You're more likely to get a response to a 15-minute coffee get-together than a whole evening plan.

    And expect that most of those 15-minute-coffee deals won't really work out, either.
    That's the expectation, yup. I'm not worried about that one, just discouraged by how rarely (so far: never) a first date has led to a second when arranged online.
    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?

    I have a great girlfriend. I'm very lucky to have her, really. My girlfriend has a steady job and she works for the government, she earns well, she an MA degree, I like her family and friends a lot, she has a great personality and she loves me. I love her too. She's absolutely an A class woman in every way.

    It's just that I don't have almost any "dirty" thoughts about her. I think about us "like that" (I'm keeping the text indirect since it's a family-friendly forum) maybe less than once a month. My girlfriend sometimes seems frustrated with my passiveness and she has told me that dating with me seems like "dating a Catholic priest". She has told me that our relationship could become like a friendship if I don't start showing some interest towards her.

    I must say that I'm happy with the situation. I love talking with her and sharing my life with her.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?

    I have a great girlfriend. I'm very lucky to have her, really. My girlfriend has a steady job and she works for the government, she earns well, she an MA degree, I like her family and friends a lot, she has a great personality and she loves me. I love her too. She's absolutely an A class woman in every way.

    It's just that I don't have almost any "dirty" thoughts about her. I think about us "like that" (I'm keeping the text indirect since it's a family-friendly forum) maybe less than once a month. My girlfriend sometimes seems frustrated with my passiveness and she has told me that dating with me seems like "dating a Catholic priest". She has told me that our relationship could become like a friendship if I don't start showing some interest towards her.

    I must say that I'm happy with the situation. I love talking with her and sharing my life with her.
    It's as important as you want it to be, it varies from person to person. While you seem satisfied with the state of affairs, she clearly isn't, so you might want to talk with her about that. You don't need to have 'dirty thoughts', but for a lot of people sex is a fairly major component of a functioning relationship.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by georgie_leech View Post
    That's the expectation, yup. I'm not worried about that one, just discouraged by how rarely (so far: never) a first date has led to a second when arranged online.
    After how many of those first dates have you wanted a second?
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)? ...
    Well, I believe the important thing is that it has to have more or less the same importance for both parties, which doesn't seem to be the case here. I admit that "talking" and "sharing my life" are activities that sound more like friendship than romantic/sexual relationship to me too.

    I don't know, are you generically a low-libido person or are you specifically not very attracted to her? In the first case, you might want to discover (together with her, if it's possible) what are the things/topics/activities that turn you on.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?...

    How long have you been together? (It makesa ddifference)

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Comrade View Post
    Not really a woe or a question of advice, just curious as to the thoughts of some of the folks who frequent this thread: at what point, in your estimation, does a series of dates become a relationship?
    When the people involved have a conversation and decide they want to be in a relationship with each other.

    My Big Ex, getting into a relationship went like this:
    >no dates
    > spontaneous make-out sesh
    Me: "So does this mean you're mine, now?"
    Him: "Of course! What sort of person do you think I am?"

    Boom, relationship.

    And on the other side, recently I had to break up with a guy I was never going out with. We went on one date. I told him I enjoyed the date a lot, but I didn't see it going anywhere romantic. Fast forward a year, with periodic hang-outs, and one night he observes "Oh hey, we've been dating for a year!" At which point I had to clarify, we went on a date a year ago.
    That sucked.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Glass Mouse View Post
    After how many of those first dates have you wanted a second?
    Most, partly because I didn't want to let first date jitters wreck a potential relationship. That is, I wanted to give people a chance to see if the things that were a turn off for me were just a temporary thing and not who they were, so to speak.

    Yes, I do generally have a problem with giving people the benefit of the doubt despite evidence to the contrary, why do you ask?
    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    We should try to make that a thing; I think it might help civility. Hey, GitP, let's try to make this a thing: when you're arguing optimization strategies, RAW-logic, and similar such things that you'd never actually use in a game, tag your post [THEORETICAL] and/or use green text
    Quote Originally Posted by Lvl 2 Expert View Post
    So a ranger is like a Bachelor of Applied Druidology.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Jake View Post
    What's the word for 'fear of being eaten by a mounted bear in half-plate' again? Because that's the one I have.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    How long have you been together? (It makes a difference)
    7 months. (10 characters)
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cozzer View Post
    Well, I believe the important thing is that it has to have more or less the same importance for both parties, which doesn't seem to be the case here. I admit that "talking" and "sharing my life" are activities that sound more like friendship than romantic/sexual relationship to me too.

    I don't know, are you generically a low-libido person or are you specifically not very attracted to her? In the first case, you might want to discover (together with her, if it's possible) what are the things/topics/activities that turn you on.
    I would definitely say that I have a low libido.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Serpentine View Post
    And on the other side, recently I had to break up with a guy I was never going out with. We went on one date. I told him I enjoyed the date a lot, but I didn't see it going anywhere romantic. Fast forward a year, with periodic hang-outs, and one night he observes "Oh hey, we've been dating for a year!" At which point I had to clarify, we went on a date a year ago.
    That sucked.
    Oh wow, that must have sucked indeed. I'm a bit confused why he thought you had been dating this whole time though. Sorry you had to live through this awkwardness!
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?

    ...snip...
    What's important is that both of you are getting your needs met - that you're getting out of a relationship what you want out of a relationship.

    She's telling you - pretty clearly - that she needs more physical intimacy. You don't.

    If you can't give her what she desires, then it's best to tell her that. If you *can* then you should consider it, even if it's not the first thing on your mind.

    There's this huge belief that you should only ever do exactly what you want to do. In my experience, relationships work best when you are considerate of the needs of the other person, even when you don't share them. That goes for everything from watching movies that wouldn't be your first choice, to going to eat places that wouldn't be your first choice to, yes, your patterns of physical intimacy.

    Of course, at the same time, she should be considerate of *your* needs and desires (or, well, lack thereof) as well. There needs to be some kind of meeting in the middle, and right now, based on your description, it sounds like things are going at *your* preferred pace.

    So, of course you're fine. But she's not. And if you love her as much as you say you do, *this should concern you*.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?
    It's a requirement for allosexuals to have a legitimate relationship, rather than a farce that ends badly and hurts people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    It's just that I don't have almost any "dirty" thoughts about her.
    Do you have sexual thoughts about anyone? Did you at some point in the recent or not-so-recent past and now you do not?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    (I'm keeping the text indirect since it's a family-friendly forum)
    You can use the word sexually, mate. You're not supposed to be explicit, but we're not prudes, either. Pussyfooting around it just makes you look immature and muddies up just what you're trying to communicate, because then we have to make assumptions about what you actually mean.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    My girlfriend sometimes seems frustrated with my passiveness and she has told me that dating with me seems like "dating a Catholic priest". She has told me that our relationship could become like a friendship if I don't start showing some interest towards her.
    That's a wake up call to take her seriously. And have some serious conversations. Which it doesn't sound like you've had. So have them. Chop chop.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    I must say that I'm happy with the situation. I love talking with her and sharing my life with her.
    You bloody well shouldn't be happy with the situation. Your partner is actively expressing dissatisfaction to you and you're happy about it? That's not good. That's not respectful.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Comrade View Post
    Afternoon folks: I must once again enlist your advice in the ongoing chronicles of my own cluelessness. So I've been thinking of asking a classmate of mine on a date-- in fact, I was tempted to do it earlier today, but seeing as I have pretty much no experience asking out somebody I'm not already friends with, I thought I'd better get a little perspective from others. As I said, I don't know her very well, only enough to be interested in getting to know her better, and though our interactions thus far have been pretty amiable, they've also been limited to the context of a college classroom. So I'm kind of torn between three notions here-- should I just be straightforward and ask her after class if she'd like to get coffee or something? Should I wait and see if I can strike up a friendship first? Is it a terrible idea to try and ask out a classmate in the first place?
    Definitely the first of of your three notions.

    If you waited to be friends with everyone know first, you dating scene would work painfully slowly, and there's nothing at all wrong with asking out a classmate.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?

    I have a great girlfriend. I'm very lucky to have her, really. My girlfriend has a steady job and she works for the government, she earns well, she an MA degree, I like her family and friends a lot, she has a great personality and she loves me. I love her too. She's absolutely an A class woman in every way.

    It's just that I don't have almost any "dirty" thoughts about her. I think about us "like that" (I'm keeping the text indirect since it's a family-friendly forum) maybe less than once a month. My girlfriend sometimes seems frustrated with my passiveness and she has told me that dating with me seems like "dating a Catholic priest". She has told me that our relationship could become like a friendship if I don't start showing some interest towards her.

    I must say that I'm happy with the situation. I love talking with her and sharing my life with her.
    I think it is very important to most people. You gf has already said it is important to her.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?

    I have a great girlfriend. I'm very lucky to have her, really. My girlfriend has a steady job and she works for the government, she earns well, she an MA degree, I like her family and friends a lot, she has a great personality and she loves me. I love her too. She's absolutely an A class woman in every way.

    It's just that I don't have almost any "dirty" thoughts about her. I think about us "like that" (I'm keeping the text indirect since it's a family-friendly forum) maybe less than once a month. My girlfriend sometimes seems frustrated with my passiveness and she has told me that dating with me seems like "dating a Catholic priest". She has told me that our relationship could become like a friendship if I don't start showing some interest towards her.

    I must say that I'm happy with the situation. I love talking with her and sharing my life with her.
    I suppose you're not sexually attracted to anyone, then? Otherwise, you'd obviously be clearly unhappy that you're stuck with someone you're not attracted to, while there are others out there that you'd want to bang.

    So, that's good news -- it augurs better for your relationship than the other way around (i.e. you having high libido but not being attracted to her).

    Wait a minute though, is she in Brazil or in Finland...? That's a pretty important factor.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice XXVIII: Happy and Perfect!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl View Post
    How important it is to be sexually attracted to your girlfriend (or boyfriend)?

    I have a great girlfriend. I'm very lucky to have her, really. My girlfriend has a steady job and she works for the government, she earns well, she an MA degree, I like her family and friends a lot, she has a great personality and she loves me. I love her too. She's absolutely an A class woman in every way.

    It's just that I don't have almost any "dirty" thoughts about her. I think about us "like that" (I'm keeping the text indirect since it's a family-friendly forum) maybe less than once a month. My girlfriend sometimes seems frustrated with my passiveness and she has told me that dating with me seems like "dating a Catholic priest". She has told me that our relationship could become like a friendship if I don't start showing some interest towards her.

    I must say that I'm happy with the situation. I love talking with her and sharing my life with her.
    Well, personally, I find it much more important to be able to say "I love you" and really mean it. That was an area in which my ex-boyfriend and I disagreed somewhat - then again, we had different views on what speed our relationship should progress at. The physical intimacy that we did have was quite chaste (hugs, and he kissed my hand once). I did think about other stuff, and I know he did, but there were two things we were both pretty sure of.
    1) I wasn't comfortable with much of anything.
    2) I eventually would be.

    My favourite thing about dating was that we actually talked . . . yeah, it could be disguised as an oddly close friendship, but that wasn't how my feelings ran (or his either, I'm fairly sure).

    I suppose the point I'm trying to make is that there's nothing wrong with loving each other and saving most things for later. The question is whether "later" will in fact show up. Also (as has been pointed out) you should talk to her about what she expects from the relationship, what you expect, and how you can both be happy.


    Edit
    Oh look, now I need some advice. My ex just broke up with his new girlfriend (and made a point of specifically telling me about it). I don't know what to do or even what I want. On the one hand, I think we can be wonderful for each other if we put in a little work. I was so happy when we were together. I miss talking (and just spending time together) the way we used to. On the other hand, I'm terribly confused and quite tired of being twisted around like this. I cringe every time he talks about my religion, my church, or God (his views on all three are quite harsh). And I'd have such a hard time trusting him again, besides which I'm not sure I even want to try.
    Last edited by AuthorGirl; 2017-07-30 at 10:06 AM.

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