El Goonish ShIVe: Damn It, Dan, Stop Teasing Us!

[Rater202]

I don't think it's that easy for a normal Wizard. I think normal Wizards probably have to study and practice, possibly even needing coaching or access to the spellbook containing the spell, to learn someone else's spell. The special thing about Wizards is that they can learn other people's spells at all, not that they can do it easily. Being able to just see a spell and immediately understand it is specifically noted as being part of a Seer's abilities.

In the card-game arc, Tedd gives "I'd be able to cast everyone's spells from the number ofd times I've just seen them" as why he's not a wizard.

Since Tedd's dad is a wizard, I'm going to assume that tedd knows at least the basics of how wizards work.

[Douglas]

True, but that statement also implies that a wizard learning a spell at least requires seeing it a large number of times, not just once. He also might be partly extrapolating from how much insight his special Seer ability had given him.

Edit: Found the reference. Tedd says wizards can learn spells just by seeing them, but they need to see them "enough times". I think Tedd can make a wand of a spell after seeing it just once, with a possible exception for particularly complicated spells.

[Geodude6]

So, new comic. It looks like Raven, Susan, and Diane might have their hands full pretty soon, judging from Sirleck's comment.

[eschmenk]

So, new comic. It looks like Raven, Susan, and Diane might have their hands full pretty soon, judging from Sirleck's comment.

Yes, and Sirleck wasn't completely honest with Magus. Surprise! Surprise! Surprise!

I will be disappointed if Magus isn't playing dumb in front of Sirleck.

[Douglas]

I'm guessing that Sirleck has underestimated Raven, and he certainly hasn't accounted for the presence of Susan - a fully Awakened person who not only has a talent for summoning magic weapons, but has a spell specifically to make her weapons even more dangerous to aberrations.

Even so, it will certainly be an unexpected, fierce, and very public battle.

[Calemyr]

I'm guessing that Sirleck has underestimated Raven, and he certainly hasn't accounted for the presence of Susan - a fully Awakened person who not only has a talent for summoning magic weapons, but has a spell specifically to make her weapons even more dangerous to aberrations.

Even so, it will certainly be an unexpected, fierce, and very public battle.

Susan nothing. Diane's there.

On his own, Adrian is in trouble. He's allowed some measure of self-defense, I'm sure, but he's got to watch it.
With Susan, he's got competent support, but he's still limited. Susan is not one of his students.
With Diane, a ward of his, in danger, he is no longer limited. Combined with Susan (and with some help from Diane), things are going to suck for the vampires. And not in a good way.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

With Diane, a ward of his, in danger, he is no longer limited.

Is that canon? Where from?

GW

[Forum Explorer]

Yes, and Sirleck wasn't completely honest with Magus. Surprise! Surprise! Surprise!

I will be disappointed if Magus isn't playing dumb in front of Sirleck.

I don't know, Magus is a AU of Elliot after all. Being an idiot might just be in his nature.

[Qwertystop]

Susan nothing. Diane's there.

On his own, Adrian is in trouble. He's allowed some measure of self-defense, I'm sure, but he's got to watch it.
With Susan, he's got competent support, but he's still limited. Susan is not one of his students.
With Diane, a ward of his, in danger, he is no longer limited. Combined with Susan (and with some help from Diane), things are going to suck for the vampires. And not in a good way.

Is that canon? Where from?

GW

Not quite. The fact that it's specifically one of his students in danger doesn't matter, but he's allowed to "act directly if the situation involves magic or is an immediate threat to myself or others."

So self-defense, defense-of-others, and magic-is-involved are (from what we know) the same degree of lifted limitations (apparently, entirely). Thus, he was unlimited as soon as he became aware that there were aberrations acting in an openly magical fashion. Possibly even before they were doing magic-y things, if he could sense them or if they started off with non-magical attacks.

[Calemyr]

Is that canon? Where from?

GW

Hmm... Fair point. I misremembered this. He does have an established limiter, but it's not limited to his students. He can act if he or anyone around him is directly threatened, so Adrian Raven can go full throttle the second the vampires shows up. He's not allowed to go looking for trouble, but he's allowed to defend when trouble starts near him.

[Rater202]

Is that canon? Where from?

GW

If you remember back in Sister II, when Abraham claimed that Raven couldn't stop him because Raven was an Elf, Raven responded by claiming that he was free to act in defense of himself or others or when Magic is involved.

"You are a homicidal wizard invading a public school. No one will care if I kill you."

We have six vampires, who are by definition homicidal magic users, invading a public location(the Mall) for the express purpose of killing Raven and who are more or less guarinteed to target two others, one who is defensless and another who has hangups that may preclude her from easily defending herself(In addition to it being the reason she's not happy and bubbly, per that part of Hammerclorians, she's apparently terrified of Abberations and I'm having trouble finding it but she blurted out "I killed a vampire" as one of the reasons why she was reluctant to get invovled in a relationship.)

Or, to put it simply, nobody will care if Raven kills the vampires.

[JeenLeen]

We have six vampires, who are by definition homicidal magic users...

Or, to put it simply, nobody will care if Raven kills the vampires.

While I agree completely that nobody will care if Raven kills the vampires, do we know that vampires are by definition magic users?

I know it's canon that at least some vampires can use magic, as noted by only those with magic can easily sense hunters, but do we know that all vamps have magic?
...though, with the EGS metaphysics, I suppose that all 'monstrous' powers are magic of one sort or another. From what Magus said recently, we have reason to believe that dragons and mermaids get their power somehow magically in his universe, so I reckon that even if a given aberration doesn't have magic in the sense of spells, they are magical and thus count.

As a side question: do we know if a spell is required to become an aberration, and/or has the process been described?
For some reason, I doubt that only awakened or wizards can become aberrations.

[Calemyr]

If you remember back in Sister II, when Abraham claimed that Raven couldn't stop him because Raven was an Elf, Raven responded by claiming that he was free to act in defense of himself or others or when Magic is involved.

"You are a homicidal wizard invading a public school. No one will care if I kill you."

We have six vampires, who are by definition homicidal magic users, invading a public location(the Mall) for the express purpose of killing Raven and who are more or less guarinteed to target two others, one who is defensless and another who has hangups that may preclude her from easily defending herself(In addition to it being the reason she's not happy and bubbly, per that part of Hammerclorians, she's apparently terrified of Abberations and I'm having trouble finding it but she blurted out "I killed a vampire" as one of the reasons why she was reluctant to get invovled in a relationship.)

Or, to put it simply, nobody will care if Raven kills the vampires.

In a... very well acted Live Action Role Playing Game?

[Rater202]

...Money on that Pandora actually being Voltaire?

[eschmenk]

...Money on that Pandora actually being Voltaire?

I wouldn't bet against it.

[John Cribati]

Does Voltaire k ow Pandora has a kid? And who exactly that kid is?

[Rater202]

Does Voltaire k ow Pandora has a kid? And who exactly that kid is?

1: He apparently sees "Choas" as his enemy, as he refers to Elliot as a pawn of Chaos and hijacked her attempts to make magic more wide spread to try and kill Elliot

2: He's the one that told Sirleck about Raven(though he lied and implied it was the French immortals) and it's implied that he's aware of the scheme to get Magus his body back and is co-opting it as his plan B.

[eschmenk]

So Voltaire probably also fooled Jerry/Zeus into thinking he was Pandora. I'm not sure how he would have made the aberrations make so much noise as the approached Dianne and Susan, though.

[tyckspoon]

As a side question: do we know if a spell is required to become an aberration, and/or has the process been described?
For some reason, I doubt that only awakened or wizards can become aberrations.

I don't believe so, but I doubt it can be done without some kind of magical intervention. I'd probably look toward Immortals running a scheme or just being eevvvilll; finding likely candidates and assisting in turning them into aberrations would easily fall within the dark side of 'empower and guide', similar to how Pandora used Dex as a means of attacking and provoking chaos. Probably also some magical artifacts around whose on-label use is 'extending life' with the practical means of doing so being turning the user into an aberration - the Dewitchery Diamond is a foundational plot point, after all. Other magical items with a buyer beware mode of operation are a possibility.

[Rater202]

One of the things we know about Aberrations is that they knowingly did it to themselves.

This is why Susan says they're not vampires at first since Vampires are usually defined as someone else turning them.

[Calemyr]

For my two pennies, I think Wednesday's strip only furthers the "Susan is Adrian's descendant" theory. The bomb dropped on April 14th. On April 24th, Zeus is captured in Susan's room by what is now suggested to be Pandora. Since that time, Zeus has gone from "I've gotta be a her ally" to "I gotta protect her from all the the things, up to and including spilled soda!", now actively admitting that he's terrified of what Pandora will do to him if Susan gets hurt, while Pandora is (almost in a panic) ordering Adrian to protect the girls.

It seems clear now (though I could of course be wrong), that Pandora has identified Susan as part of Adrian's supposedly impossible progeny. She's utterly terrified of telling Adrian the truth (as she believes he'll hate her for it, if he doesn't hate her already), but the idea of Susan being harmed (particularly before she can work up the nerve to tell Adrian) is more than she can bear.

How I rather suspect the Zeus/Pandora conversation to have finished:
Pandora (in Voice of the Legion mode): Why are you here?
Zeus: It's... uh... it's not by choice! My past self vowed to be her ally!
Pandora: You vowed to be her ally?!
Zeus: Not me me, but... yeah.
Pandora (in Chipper Child mode): That's alright, then.
Zeus: R-really?
Pandora: Yes, really. She needs someone looking out for her. But if you let her get hurt...
Zeus: Yes?
Pandora (in Voice of the Legion mode): We're going to test the limits of being an "Immortal", at length and in excruciating detail. Are we clear?
Zeus: *Gulp* A-as crystal.
Pandora (in Chipper Child mode): Good! Now I have to check on a friend of mine! Keep an eye on her for me while I'm gone!
Zeus: *Wipes brow as Pandora leaves* I hate you, Jerry. I really, really do.

[Rater202]

So... Susan is a Super Saiyan?

Greg's gonna be so jelly.

[Mith]

Also: Exploding faerie to the eye.

[John Cribati]

I just realized that Jerry was technically narrating this comic. As in this is one of the tidbits Jerry left for Zeus.

[Qwertystop]

... So her long hair is actually now really practical? That's two Susan-prompted lines about hair that are now actually a thing.

[Calemyr]

Oh... Oh, wow. That's... that's amazing. Tiffany Susan Pompoms has a super mode. She's a Super Susan!

[Vinyadan]

I'm Susan. I'm insane, from Earth!

[Douglas]

I'm Susan. I'm insane, from Earth!

For anyone who doesn't get that reference.

[Calemyr]

I'm Susan. I'm insane, from Earth!

For anyone who doesn't get that reference.

Gee, thanks, guys. Now my mind is trying to envision EGS Abridged... Though who would be the best person to have be voiced by Takahata101? That is the question we must ask ourselves...

Also, I'm kinda looking forward to this cooling down and Susan's reaction to the fact that turning blonde (something she's hated for years) is how she powers up. Not to mention Diane's take on it all - Susan is not only even more intense than Diane ever imagined, she's as much of a badass as Nanase!

[Mith]

I'm just wondering if Susan is just going to gain more magic power the longer her hair is, or if there is a limit. If there is no limit, and the longer her hair is means the more power she has, she could grow her hair out and be a Repunzelic badass.