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  1. - Top - End - #241
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q134

    I am playing a Gestalt Warlock Build, I am using Abjurant Champion in the build (Using Duskblade/2 for my AbjC requirements, and I have Cleric/1 for travel devotion)
    That’s the background, now the question. Since I am using all five levels of AbjC I get Martial Champion. I have a BAB of 15 (Gestalt Build). I am applying Martial Champion to Warlock giving Caster Level of 15 instead of the 12 I would have without Martial Champion. Would that CL of 15 advance my Eldritch Blast?


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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciolfire View Post
    Q132:
    What are the rules concerning the different versions of a feat ? If a feat is in a setting book (for example one of the Eberron books) does it take precedence over the feat in the "general" book ?

    Example:
    - Improved Natural Attack (Eberron Campaign Setting page 55, Monster Manual I, III, IV, V)
    A132:
    In general, the source with the most recent printing date takes precedence, but there are some exceptions with certain campaign-specific books that have special rules that apply to those campaign worlds.

    The text of Improved Natural Attack is identical to the MM version. The only difference is there are two additional "Special" paragraphs. The first makes it clear that this feat can be taken multiple times. This was possible before, as several creatures in the MM have taken INA more than once, but this paragraph makes it clear that this is an option available to PCs with more than one type of natural weapon. The second paragraph adds a new feature, allowing Shifters to treat INA as a [Shifter] feat for the purposes of using their racial abilities. This paragraph is specific to the Eberron campaign. For games taking place in the Eberron Campaign Setting, the version with the two "Special" paragraphs takes precedence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciolfire View Post
    - Extend Rage (Complete Warrior (page 97 is the oldest one, but explicitly include Frenzy, Eberron Campaign setting is more recent but lack the precision for the frenzy, even though it's in the prerequisites)
    Huh. That's... puzzling. Well, "Frenzy" only exists as an ability in Complete Warrior. There is no class or PrC in ECS that includes an ability called "Frenzy", so... maybe the ECS designers left it out to avoid confusion? But if so, then why mention it in the prereqs? Well.. my ruling would be:

    In games that only contain ECS, the reference to "frenzy" doesn't matter, as this ability doesn't exist in that sourcebook. In such games, the ECS version of Extend Rage takes precedence. However, if a game contains Complete Warrior as an available sourcebook, then this is the source of both Frenzy and the Frenzied Berzerker. Since Complete Warrior is the primary source for Frenzied Berzerkers, then the Complete Warrior version of Extend Rage takes precedence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciolfire View Post
    And what about feats from 3.0 as prerequisite for 3.5 feats

    Exemple: 3.0 Corrupt Spell feat from Book of Vile Darkness which is a prerequisite for Favor of the zulkirs (Player's Guide to Faerun, page 176) (which makes no sense with 3.5 Corrupt Spell as prerequisite)
    There is no discrepancy or contradiction here. The 3.0 version of Corrupt Spell works with the 3.5 rules without any need of adjustment. The material in this appendix is provided to those players who want to include material from the Book of Exalted Deeds or Book of Vile Darkness. If the player doesn't have access to the Book of Vile Darkness, then they don't have the rules for handling corrupt spells or vile damage, and this extra material in the appendix may not be useful to them.

    The rules for corrupt spells and vile damage were updated to 3.5 in Champions of Ruin, so that's the latest version of the "Corrupt Spell" feat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciolfire View Post
    Q133:
    What about feats with the same name but different effects or type ?

    Example:
    - Discipline (Player's guide to Faerun page 38 and Age of Mortal page 50)
    A133:
    The two feats are very similar to each other, but the PGtF version is a regional feat and thus has additional rules about who is allowed to take it. The regional rules would be difficult to incorporate into a Dragonlance campaign world that does not have the same geographic regions as Faerun. I think it's safe to say:

    PGtF has precedence in Forgotten Realms campaigns. Age of Mortals has precedence in Dragonlance campaigns.

    Since the Age of Mortals version is a [General] feat, I could see that you could generalize it to be available in any non-FR game, assuming your group is comfortable with allowing non-WotC sources.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciolfire View Post
    - Corrupt Spell (Complete Divine page 80, Champions of Ruin page 17)
    Champions of Ruin updated Corrupt Spell to 3.5, although both versions appear to work the same way. In the 3.5 version it's a little clearer that the feat only works with a chosen spell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciolfire View Post
    - Axiomatic Strike ([General] in Complete Warrior page 96,[Epic] in Player's guide to Faerun page 135)
    It seems unlikely that the writers of PGtF would be unaware of the Complete Warrior version, so it appears that the intent here was Axiomatic Strike [General] and Axiomatic Strike [Epic] should be treated as two different feats. The two books were printed within a year of each other, so it's possible the design teams weren't aware of the overlap. If you want to get pedantic about it... I could see a ruling where the [Epic] version only takes precedence in games that are actually using the ELH rules. However, in such games I don't really see any harm in allowing both versions to exist.

    A better example might be Two-Weapon Rend, a [General] feat in PHBII but before that it was an [Epic] feat in the ELH. This looks more like the designers deliberately made it un-epic, either because it was horrendously underpowered for an [epic] feat or they felt it was more appropriate to non-epic TWFers. In this case, I'd have to conclude that the PHBII takes precedence over the ELH version.
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q135
    If a Sorcerer holds a spell charge, and releases it the next turn in a touch attack, does he provokes an Attack of Opportunity from the touch attack?
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yael View Post
    Q135
    If a Sorcerer holds a spell charge, and releases it the next turn in a touch attack, does he provokes an Attack of Opportunity from the touch attack?
    A135:

    No. As per PHB p. 139:

    "Sometimes a character’s or creature's unarmed attack counts as an armed attack. A monk, a character with the Improved Unarmed Strike feat (page 96), a spellcaster delivering a touch attack spell, and a creature with claws, fangs, and similar natural physical weapons all count as being armed." (emphasis added)

    A spellcaster delivering a touch attack spell counts as "armed" and thus does not provoke an AoO for making an unarmed touch attack.
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    Exclamation Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zephonim View Post
    Q 131:
    Can Planar Shepherds turn into Plants if their plane is Lamannia? I keep seeing in the planar shepherd handbooks that you can turn into battlebriars and other plants but does the shape have to be an outsider that lives on the plane or just any creature that lives on the plane once your level 9 do any creatures living there count as Outsiders?
    A 131

    My reading of the ability limits it to Magical Beasts, Elementals and Outsiders native to the chosen plane. There is no mention of Plants. The Wild Shape ability of the class specifically does not stack with Druid levels for forms that can be assumed (a Druid of 12th level or higher can assume plant forms).

    It is possible that the handbooks are referencing sources external to the PrC in order to be able to turn into a Plant.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciolfire View Post
    Q132:
    What are the rules concerning the different versions of a feat ? If a feat is in a setting book (for example one of the Eberron books) does it take precedence over the feat in the "general" book ?

    Example:
    - Improved Natural Attack (Eberron Campaign Setting page 55, Monster Manual I, III, IV, V)
    - Extend Rage (Complete Warrior (page 97 is the oldest one, but explicitly include Frenzy, Eberron Campaign setting is more recent but lack the precision for the frenzy, even though it's in the prerequisites)
    - Familiar spell (DMG page 209 is [Epic], Underdark page 25 is [General] and if the spirit is the same the way it works is a little different)

    And what about feats from 3.0 as prerequisite for 3.5 feats

    Exemple: 3.0 Corrupt Spell feat from Book of Vile Darkness which is a prerequisite for Favor of the zulkirs (Player's Guide to Faerun, page 176) (which makes no sense with 3.5 Corrupt Spell as prerequisite)
    A132: Later versions take precedent, always, except for specific books like Rules Compendium.


    Q133:
    What about feats with the same name but different effects or type ?

    Example:
    - Discipline (Player's guide to Faerun page 38 and Age of Mortal page 50)
    - Corrupt Spell (Complete Divine page 80, Champions of Ruin page 17)
    - Axiomatic Strike ([General] in Complete Warrior page 96,[Epic] in Player's guide to Faerun page 135)
    A133: Later version is, by RAW, treated as the only version that exists.
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q136

    If a Couatl takes Monk levels, can it perform an unarmed strike, hence a flurry of blows, with its constriction ability?

    In the description of a slam in MM pg.297 it includes constriction as one of the means by which a slam attack can be made. Making such an attack would preclude using both its improved grab ability and its constriction ability in the same round as making an unarmed attack of course.

    “A monk’s attacks can be made with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees and feet.”
    I would argue that “or even” makes that a non-exclusive list, and just describes other parts of the body which logically could be used in an attack. Which would include a slam attack.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    A 136: No.

    Quote Originally Posted by SRD
    When using flurry of blows, a monk may attack only with unarmed strikes or with special monk weapons (kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, and siangham).
    A slam attack is a natural weapon, not an unarmed strike, nor is it a special monk weapon, so you may not flurry with slam nor constrict. You may, however, use slam/constrict in addition to the flurry, albeit at an additional -5 penalty to hit (-2 with the multi attack feat).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    So now you're claiming that spellcasting "lacks a clear, supernatural element?" Being supernatural is literally the only point of magic.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by Frendle View Post
    Q136

    If a Couatl takes Monk levels, can it perform an unarmed strike, hence a flurry of blows, with its constriction ability?
    A136:
    No. The Coatl's Improved Grab ability triggers off it's bite attack. A bite attack is a different kind of natural weapon than an unarmed strike. They are not interchangeable. Monks cannot use natural weapons with their Flurry of Blows ability, as they are not identified as special monk weapons.

    The Constrict ability triggers whenever the Coatl makes a successful grapple check. This *can* be combined with a Flurry, because the monk can designate any of their unarmed strikes as initiating a grapple, but doing so generally ends the Flurry of Blows.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frendle View Post
    In the description of a slam in MM pg.297 it includes constriction as one of the means by which a slam attack can be made. Making such an attack would preclude using both its improved grab ability and its constriction ability in the same round as making an unarmed attack of course.
    The Coatl doesn't have a slam attack. Even if it did, slams are mechanically different from unarmed strikes. They aren't interchangeable.

    A Coatl monk could initiate a grapple with any melee attack, and if it wins the grapple check, then it could apply Constrict damage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frendle View Post
    “A monk’s attacks can be made with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees and feet.”
    I would argue that “or even” makes that a non-exclusive list, and just describes other parts of the body which logically could be used in an attack. Which would include a slam attack.
    No. Listing a series of body parts or appendages does not grant you a particular natural weapon attack. Even if it did, a slam attack is mechanically different from an unarmed strike. The exact "striking surface" that a monk uses to make an unarmed strike is deliberately abstract under the rules. Describing it as a kick, elbow strike, shoulder check, etc. is done purely for fluff reasons. From a mechanical standpoint, an unarmed strike is treated as a natural weapon for spells and certain feats, but it has an entirely different set of rules that describes how it can be used as an attack.
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q137

    My players are using the psionic power Object Reading, which will tell you the age of a previous owner of the targeted object (among other information). If one of the previous owners is an Outsider, say, from the Elemental Plane of Fire... how should a DM answer that? Infinite age? As old as the Great Wheel? Pick some randomly long age, like 2,000 years (assuming Outsiders can be newly made every so often, like the Abyss spawning new Demons)?

    I just don't know enough about all the different planes to figure every possibility out.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    A 137: Partial This is not really a RAW question, kinda outside of the scope of this thread. And the answer you're likely to receive here is "Ask the DM," which helps you not at all.

    You seem to have a good sense of how the power works, I'd encourage you to open a new thread to get some ideas if you are uncomfortable winging it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    So now you're claiming that spellcasting "lacks a clear, supernatural element?" Being supernatural is literally the only point of magic.

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    Question Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 138

    Are there any feats or PrCs that allow a monk to use or incorporate a natural attack (other than unarmed strike) in their Flurry of Blows?

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    Q 138

    Are there any feats or PrCs that allow a monk to use or incorporate a natural attack (other than unarmed strike) in their Flurry of Blows?
    A 138
    Unorthodox Flurry from Dragon Compendium allows you to turn a light weapon into a special monk weapon.
    Last edited by ZamielVanWeber; 2017-08-24 at 07:14 PM.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZamielVanWeber View Post
    A 138
    Unorthodox Flurry from Dragon Compendium allows you to turn a light weapon into a special monk weapon.
    Shou Disciple 3 (Unapproachable East) has Martial Flurry (Ex), which allows him to flurry with any light melee weapon. Natural weapons are considered light melee weapons, so they could be used in a Martial Flurry.
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 139

    My opponent is using a spiked chain and thus has reach (or any other reach weapon really) but I have spring attack but no reach weapon.

    I move in to attack him, but before I even reach him to attack I would proc that attack of opportunity. Does Spring attack protect me from the Attack of Opportunity before I'm even able to make the attack?

    (Primarily asking because it says 'when using the attack action with a melee weapon' which means that I haven't had the chance to actually start Spring Attack right? or does that matter?)

    Q 140

    My opponent is using a spiked chain and thus has reach (or any other reach weapon really) and I want to 'Fight Defensively' to get a bonus to my AC but also get in to attack the guy.

    Do I get the +2 AC when moving in on the guy (since I've decided that I'm 'fighting defensively?') or do I only get the bonus AFTER making the attack?

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeros View Post
    Q 139
    My opponent is using a spiked chain and thus has reach (or any other reach weapon really) but I have spring attack but no reach weapon.

    I move in to attack him, but before I even reach him to attack I would proc that attack of opportunity. Does Spring attack protect me from the Attack of Opportunity before I'm even able to make the attack?
    A139:

    Yes. PHB p. 100:

    "Moving in this way does not provoke an attack of opportunity from the defender you attack, though it might provoke attacks of opportunity from other creatures, if appropriate." [emphasis added]

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeros View Post
    (Primarily asking because it says 'when using the attack action with a melee weapon' which means that I haven't had the chance to actually start Spring Attack right? or does that matter?)
    You're using Spring Attack the moment you declare what your action is and start moving. In this case, it doesn't matter exactly when your attack happens, so long as you have a valid target to attack.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeros View Post
    Q 140

    My opponent is using a spiked chain and thus has reach (or any other reach weapon really) and I want to 'Fight Defensively' to get a bonus to my AC but also get in to attack the guy.

    Do I get the +2 AC when moving in on the guy (since I've decided that I'm 'fighting defensively?') or do I only get the bonus AFTER making the attack?
    A140:

    You get the +2 AC bonus as soon as you declare that you're fighting defensively, and it lasts for the rest of the round. It doesn't matter when your attack happens.
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 141

    The Spell Reflection alternate class feature (Complete Mage, p 35) mentions that "This effect applies only to spells and spell-like abilities that require an attack roll." The example and illustration make it very clear it work on rays. Other spells requiring an attack roll (like the "orbs" spells Tsukiko used on Haley) would certainly be affected too.

    What I'm wondering is whether it would work on "touch" spells too, considering those do also require an attack roll. Seizing a spellcaster's arm while he's trying to touch you and forcing him to touch himself wouldn't look too out-of-bound...

    The question can extend to the Spell Sense ACF (same page) too. It says you gain a "dodge bonus to your AC against spells and spell-like abilities." Does touch attacks carrying a touch spell count as those too?
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    A 141

    Neither ACF mentions any requirement that they only work against ranged spells and spell-like abilities, although it seems like that is the unwritten assumption. By RAW, they work just fine against touch attacks.
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 142a
    How exactly does Insidious Illusion, the gnome illusionist substitution level, work exactly? EX: Can someone without a caster level disbelieve the illusion at all?

    Q 142b
    If Insidious Illusion modifies will saves, how does it interact with Chains of Disbelief from Unearthed Arcana?

    Edit: Disregard. Turns out the version I was reading had some issues.
    Last edited by ZamielVanWeber; 2017-08-25 at 11:39 PM.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 143. Where in the rules does it state that natural weapons are considered light melee weapons?

    Rules I've examined are spoilered below:
    Spoiler: Rules that don't quite state it
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHB, Weapon Finesse Feat
    Natural weapons are always considered light weapons.
    States it is considered a light weapon, but it isn't an actual light weapon, nor does it call it a melee weapon.

    Quote Originally Posted by PHB p112, Weapon Categories
    Weapons are grouped into several interlocking sets of categories.

    These categories pertain to what training is needed to become proficient in a weapon’s use (simple, martial, or exotic), the weapon’s usefulness either in close combat (melee) or at a distance (ranged, which includes both thrown and projectile weapons), its relative encumbrance (light, one-handed, or two-handed), and its size (Small, Medium, or Large).

    ...Melee weapons are used for making melee attacks...
    Sure, most natural weapons are used for melee attacks...

    Quote Originally Posted by PHB p156, Grappling
    Attack your opponent: You can make an attack with an unarmed strike, natural weapon, or light weapon against another character you are grappling.
    ... if natural weapons are always considered light melee weapons why call it out here as somehow distinct?

    Quote Originally Posted by PHB p310, Glossary
    melee weapon: A handheld weapon designed for close combat.
    You can't hold your own natural weapon in your hands.

    Quote Originally Posted by MM p312, Glossary
    Natural Weapons: Natural weapons are weapons that are physically a part of a creature. A creature making a melee attack with a natural weapon is considered armed and does not provoke attacks of opportunity. Likewise, it threatens any space it can reach. Creatures do not receive additional attacks from a high base attack bonus when using natural weapons. The number of attacks a creature can make with its natural weapons depends on the type of the attack—generally, a creature can make one bite attack, one attack per claw or tentacle, one gore attack, one sting attack, or one slam attack (although Large creatures with arms or arm-like limbs can make a slam attack with each arm). Refer to the individual monster descriptions.
    Natural weapons are different from melee weapons in that you do not get iterative attacks for high BAB (barring feats and the like).

    Quote Originally Posted by Rules Compendium p16, Melee Attacks
    With a melee weapon, a natural weapon, or even a bare fist, you can strike any opponent within reach...
    Again, natural weapons and melee weapons are somehow distinct.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rules Compendium p100, Natural Attacks
    A creature making a melee attack with a natural weapon is considered armed and doesn't provoke attacks of opportunity. Likewise it threatens any space it can reach... Creatures don't receive additional attacks from a high base attack bonus when using natural weapons.
    Again, different from manufactured light melee weapons.

    Rules Compendium p150 "Weapons" doesn't really offer anything new, other than the whole page heading refers to manufactured weapons as if the entire page is rules for manufactured weapons but without explicitly calling it out.

    Quote Originally Posted by PHB 114 and Rules Compendium p152, Weapon Qualities - Type
    Type: Weapons are classified according to the type of damage they deal - bludgeoning, piercing,
    or slashing.
    There are apparently three types of weapons, and all weapons fall into one or more of those categories.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rules Compendium p100, Natural Attacks
    The number of attacks a creature can make depends on the type of the attack - a creature can make one bite attack, one attack per claw or tentacle, one gore attack, one sting attack, or one slam attack....

    ... Natural weapons have types just as other weapons do. The most common are summarized here.
    Bite...
    Claw or Talon...
    Gore...
    Slap or Slam...
    Sting...
    Tentacle...
    These are the most common types of natural weapons (same keyword used above). While they do one or more damage types, the types of natural weapons are different from the types of manufactured weapons.


    TLDR: While I consider it reasonable to consider natural weapons as light melee weapons in most circumstances, I'm seeking a RAW source that explicitly calls out that natural weapons are, or are considered, light melee weapons. Thanks
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    A 143 partial

    Quote Originally Posted by SRD, Power Attack
    You can’t add the bonus from Power Attack to the damage dealt with a light weapon (except with unarmed strikes or natural weapon attacks), even though the penalty on attack rolls still applies.
    The underlined sections certainly seem to infer that natural weapons are light weapons, calling them out as an exception to the usual rule for Power Attacking with a light weapon.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 143 continued My apologies if I was unclear, I'm looking more for clarification on the "melee" part. I'm comfortable with"light". Thanks
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    So now you're claiming that spellcasting "lacks a clear, supernatural element?" Being supernatural is literally the only point of magic.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q144
    If im wearing a towershield on my,back,do i get total,cover? If so would,itnfunction just,like if i planted a shield as a move action?
    Aka ranged units would,have to,move to my,sides or front to target me?
    If so can i wear a shield and plant a shield so i get total cover in 2 directions? What about with,multiple shields planted in all my spaces? And can i use a spear to attack around said shields?

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Quote Originally Posted by mattie_p View Post
    Q 143 continued My apologies if I was unclear, I'm looking more for clarification on the "melee" part. I'm comfortable with"light". Thanks
    Then the question is silly. Weapons are "ranged" or "melee" depending on the weapon. Most natural weapons are melee as an inherent property of the "weapon" - e.g. a bite. However, not all natural weapons are melee, for example a Manticore's Tail Spikes and a natural ranged weapon.
    What makes a manticore a useful example is that it shows how a ranged attack should be declared as such in the stat block (and so should melee attacks).

    This there is no rule that natural weaposn are always melee (because they are not), but all attacks should have what they are declared in the stat block.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    A144: No. Although there are no facing rules (aka no "sides" or "front" unless you use the variant rules found in UA) your character must actively use the tower shield to gain total cover.

    Quote Originally Posted by "Shield, Tower
    However, you can instead use it as total cover, though you must give up your attacks to do so. The shield does not, however, provide cover against targeted spells; a spellcaster can cast a spell on you by targeting the shield you are holding. You cannot bash with a tower shield, nor can you use your shield hand for anything else.
    The exact action to use a tower shield in this manner is not covered by the RAW, see spoiler.

    Spoiler: Opinion and (Shudder) the FAQ
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    It's reasonable to assume it's at least a move action to use it in this manner. However, the Sage in the FAQ calls it a standard action and additionally creates new rules for facing.

    Spoiler: I warned you about the FAQ
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    Question
    Total cover prevents any attack against you. You can
    use a tower shield to get total cover if you give up all your
    attacks. What does “give up all your attacks” mean? Can
    you move while getting total cover from the shield? Can
    you cast a spell? Also, do you get total cover from all
    directions or from just one side of your square? Will the
    total cover from a tower shield negate spell effects? Will it
    negate attacks of opportunity from movement or from
    other actions such as spellcasting? Will it prevent charge
    attacks against you? What about bull rush attacks? Can it
    prevent grapple attacks or snatch attacks? Will it stop fear
    effects, gaze attacks, or clouds of poison gas? Will it defeat
    traps?

    Answer
    To claim total cover from a tower shield, you must use a
    standard action. The tower shield rules don’t say that, but that’s
    what they mean. Since you can take only one standard action
    each round, you cannot also attack, cast a spell, activate a
    magic item (except for some use-activated items), use a special
    ability, use total defense, or start or complete a full-round
    action during the same round you claim total cover from the
    shield. You can, however, take a move action before or after
    you claim cover from the shield.
    Like other kinds of cover, the shield has to have a location
    relative to you on the battlefield. When you use the shield for
    cover, choose one edge of your space (not a corner). You have
    total cover against any attack’s line of effect that passes
    through that side of your space. If an attack’s line of effect goes
    through the corner of the side of your space that the shield
    blocks, you get cover from the shield (+4 AC, +2 on Reflex
    saves) instead of total cover. If an attack’s line of effect passes
    through a side of your space that the shield does not block, you
    get no cover from the shield at all. To determine where the line
    of effect enters your space, draw a line from the attacker’s
    center to your center. Or, in the case of a magical effect, from
    the effect’s point of origin and your center.
    Once you claim cover from the shield, the shield keeps
    blocking the side of your space that you chose until the
    beginning of your next turn, when you can again decide
    whether you’ll use the shield for cover. Once you choose the
    side of your space that the shield blocks, you cannot change it
    until your next turn.
    You continue to threaten the area around you while you use
    the shield for cover; however, it provides your opponents with
    the same benefits you get. You cannot make attacks through the
    side of your space that the shield blocks, and should you attack
    through the corners of that space, your foe gets cover against
    your attack. Since cover of any kind prevents attacks of
    opportunity (see page 151 in the PH), the shield keeps you
    from making attacks of opportunity in a pretty wide swath.
    Total cover or cover from a tower shield has the following
    effects in different situations:
    • Magical Attacks: A tower shield’s effects on
    magical attacks depend on the kind of magical attack.
    Any attack aimed at your equipment is aimed at you.
    If a magical attack has you as a specific target (that is
    it does not merely affect the area that contains you
    but is aimed right at you), the shield has no effect. All
    rays fall into this category, as does any spell that has
    a Target entry in its header and any spell that has an
    Effect entry and affects creatures (provided, of course, that the attacker can and does choose the
    shield user as a target). Magical attacks that fill areas
    (bursts, cones, cylinders, lines, emanations, and
    spreads) are subject to all the rules for cover on page
    151 of the PH. Such attacks are completely blocked
    if line of effect between you and the attack’s point of
    origin passes through the side of your space the
    shield blocks. You get cover (+4 AC, +2 on Reflex
    saves) if the magical attack’s line of effect passes
    through the corner of the blocked side. Spread effects
    reach around the shield if they normally would
    extend into your space, but you still get a Reflex save
    bonus for cover when they do. A gaze attack is
    blocked if the shield would give you total cover
    against attacks from the creature with the gaze attack.
    If the shield gives you cover only, you’re still subject
    to the gaze attack (although you could avert or close
    your eyes to avoid the attack).
    • Attacks of Opportunity: As noted earlier, cover or
    total cover prevents attacks of opportunity. So you
    could, for example, hunker down behind a tower
    shield and pick up a weapon or rummage around in a
    backpack and avoid attacks of opportunity against
    you. If you’re moving while using the shield for
    cover, things get a little more complicated. You must
    determine whether the shield gives you cover (or
    total cover) at the point during your movement when
    you’d normally provoke an attack of opportunity.
    Remember that attacks of opportunity are usually
    resolved before the actions that provoke them. In
    many cases, the shield won’t be positioned correctly
    to protect you during your whole move.
    • Charging and Bull Rushing: Opponents can charge
    you while you claim cover from the shield. An
    opponent moves as normal when charging you,
    moving to the closest square from which a melee
    attack normally would be possible. If the shield gives
    you total cover from the attack, the attack
    automatically fails. Foes can bull rush you normally,
    moving right into your space in spite of the shield.
    You normally get an attack of opportunity against
    someone entering your space, but not if the shield
    gives your foe cover or total cover.
    • Grapple and Snatch Attacks: Total cover from a
    tower shield blocks such attacks (the foe just can’t
    get hold of you). The foe could, however grab the
    shield. Conduct such attacks just like any other
    grapple or snatch attack. Your foe can’t damage you
    unless he pins you first. You can escape the foe’s
    hold simply by dropping the shield (a standard action
    since it’s strapped to your arm), so long as the foe has
    not pinned you.
    • Traps: Cover or total cover from a tower shield is
    just as effective against a trap as it is against any
    other attack.


    Multiple tower shields will offer no benefits, nor may you attack around it or them. Phalanx/hedgehog tactics are not well replicated in 3.5 RAW.

    143 cont. *Edit* Manticore tail spikes are Extraordinary, not natural. That said, the RAW is often silly, I'll open a new thread to discuss. Thanks.
    Last edited by mattie_p; 2017-08-27 at 06:28 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    So now you're claiming that spellcasting "lacks a clear, supernatural element?" Being supernatural is literally the only point of magic.

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q144con

    ....whats the point of,using a tower sheild for,total,cover then since sides dont,exist?
    And wouldn't it be better to just use a heavy steel shield then so the ac penalties are lessened?

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    144 cont. Without facing rules your character should gain cover in all directions, while allowing the character to do something useful like move to a different position or pull a potion or want. As far as better, that's outside of the scope of the thread.

    Spoiler: not in this thread
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    Most here would not recommend using a tower shield, but open a new thread to hear opinions on why not.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    So now you're claiming that spellcasting "lacks a clear, supernatural element?" Being supernatural is literally the only point of magic.

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    Question Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 145

    If I use Animate dead on the skeleton of a Lycanthrope (say, for instance, the sample Werebear in the SRD), does the resulting skeleton retain the HD from the Lycanthrope template? I'm assuming yes, unless there's anything I am missing?

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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q 146

    The rules for save DC of an effect produced by a magic item (save for a staff) is "the DC is 10 + the level of the spell or effect + the ability modifier of the minimum ability score needed to cast that level of spell."

    Is it a strict rule for all magic items, or just a creator's choice (like the caster level of the spell is usually the minimum, to make magic items cheaper)?

    What if the magic item creator had a much higher ability score than the minimum? And what if he had some feat increasing it, like Spell Focus? Is the save DC still the same?

    Q 147

    The rules for item creation imply that a metamagic feat can be included with a spell weaved in a item, modifying eventually the spell level.

    What happen when the spellcaster imbuing the spells in a magic item has another feat that alter specific spells without being specifically metamagic? (For example, Augment Summoning.) Does the spell inside the magic item is then still altered by the feat?
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    Default Re: Simple RAW Thread for 3.5 #33: Doesn't everything popular die when 33?

    Q148:

    Does my charisma have to be 19 to cast level 9 spells granted by a Death Rock?

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