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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    So, a bit of thoughts welled up in me about what it'd be like to be a female...

    I thought they might have been tainted thoughts, and might really conflict with everybody I know, since for all they know, I am a male...

    How do I deal with such a thought? Is it normal, and what does this do to affect others?

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    What do you mean, "Welled up in you?" Is this something you think of often? Or is this the first time?

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    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    It's a first time, honestly...

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Unless your having these thoughts make you feel bad or wrong for being male, I would say its just a weird daydream.

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    I think one question to ask yourself is to what degree/strength did you have these thoughts and what was the emotion/events surrounding them?

    This forum is, what I can tell, very friendly to trans- folk, so I reckon you will get a lot of helpful and useful information from folk more experienced with that than I am. I'm not trying to answer from that perspective. (Also, none of the below is meant to be derogatory; I'm not used to writing about this stuff, so I might type something off by mistake.)

    What I can say is that, if your thoughts are just mental pondering or linked to certain negative emotions/events about being male, then it might be just thoughts and not actual really-a-woman. I'm a straight male and happy identifying as male, but I remember in grade school there was a time I was picked on a lot which included folk calling me a girl and gay. For a while, I pondered if I could pass as female (I had real long hair then, and it was before puberty) and if that would make me more accepted. But I believe those thoughts were just based on the insults I was exposed to, not any serious question about my gender identity.

    Also, I don't think it necessarily means one is trans if you ponder what it would be like to experience certain things as a woman or how folk would react to you if you were a woman.

    From what you wrote, I doubt the thoughts are minor ones like I'm talking about from my experience, but I still wanted to share my experience.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Ah, ok. They were pretty minor, but then again, I did ponder about being female and how this would be like for me...

    I mean, I do a few things that seem rather feminine, but I still do a few masculine things...

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    People think about things all the time, wonder. Just a general "What would it be like to be a woman? It might be cool." isn't really any different than thinking about what it might be like to be a bird, or a fish, or a tiger (and certainly even less troubling than idle thoughts like "What if I just stepped off this cliff?").

    Even approaching it just from a gender identity ad sexuality point of view, as I understand it these things are on a bit of a spectrum. If you randomly think "Wonder what it's like to be on the OTHER end of ********?" one day, you're not gay, you're just having a quick homoerotic thought that may or may not determine that you are a bit towards the homo/bi-sexual end of the spectrum (enough to entertain such thoughts if not act on them).

    Similarly if you have a fantasy about being a woman, it doesn't mean you need to crossdress or begin transitioning, it could mean it's either just a thought or daydream, or somewhere in the middle where you don't feel like you SHOULD be a woman but hey, maybe you wouldn't have minded if the dice had rolled the other way and are kinda curious how your life would be different (I think the same thing sometimes myself).

    Basically...don't worry about it, whatever way it goes.

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Well, I don't know what "normal" means in this context, but thoughts like this are common and certainly don't imply that there's anything at all wrong with you. Some people wonder about this sort of thing all the time. Some don't. Both are perfectly healthy.

    As for what you should do about it, it sounds like you don't feel any pressing need to explore it. Absent that, there's no real reason to do so; you can totally do nothing about it and that's fine. If you end up thinking more about it and decide to explore the possibility of expressing a more feminine identity, there are a wealth of resources you can look through for support; some threads on these boards are one such place.

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    I recently had thoughts of being a cat, then a bird and then a Tibetan monk. Most people have thoughts of being a millionaire or a celebrity, if that’s normal why woman would be anything but normal?
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-06-20 at 07:25 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
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  10. - Top - End - #10
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    I recently had thoughts of being a cat, then a bird and then a Tibetan monk. Most people have thoughts of being a millionaire or a celebrity, if that’s normal why woman would be anything but normal?
    I think it has to do with the degree to which gender plays into OP's identity. If they're very strongly identified with their gender as masculine, then it might be a very odd thing to think about. Like if you're very deeply focused on the idea that you're a good person and you briefly have thoughts about what it might be like to be a murderer (of course being a murderer in this example is negative so it's not a good analogy, let me reframe it). I'm a blue collar worker, this is a fundamental part of my identity, I would say it's one of the most important aspects of it to me. So for me to even imagine myself as being say an office worker, might be jarring to me in a way that me imagining myself as a Tibetan Monk or a cat or a bird might not be. Because those are so removed and so unusual that they don't feel like I'm separating myself from a fundamental part of my identity.

    It's often easier to imagine things that are further from our comfort zone rather than easier. Like it might be easy to think about what you might be like if you were a murderer (unpleasant certainly, but not difficult), whereas to think about if you were a deadbeat father (or mother) would be profoundly more uncomfortable, if only because it's closer and more real, and separating you more clearly from a fundamental part of your identity.
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSymphony View Post
    Ah, ok. They were pretty minor, but then again, I did ponder about being female and how this would be like for me...

    I mean, I do a few things that seem rather feminine, but I still do a few masculine things...
    This intrigues me... feminine things don't make you less of a man. You like flowers? You're the guy who owns a florist. You like the kitchen? You're a chef. You like kids? You work in pediatrics. Even if you want to have sex with men, you still a man...a gay man but a man nonetheless.
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Nothing wrong with thoughts. Usually just means you have an active imagination, but I would honestly look into it a bit deeper. CBT is an excellent technique to get to the root of what you really want or clear out mental clutter (incorrect thoughts caused by incorrect inputs).

    I would assess it physically too. Perhaps your testosterone is low. I would get all your hormones, thyroid, etc checked.

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    I recently had thoughts of being a cat, then a bird and then a Tibetan monk. Most people have thoughts of being a millionaire or a celebrity, if that’s normal why woman would be anything but normal?
    I just had a mental picture of a cat in a saffron robe miaowing the meaning of life at people.

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by The Succubus View Post
    I just had a mental picture of a cat in a saffron robe miaowing the meaning of life at people.

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSymphony View Post
    So, a bit of thoughts welled up in me about what it'd be like to be a female...

    I thought they might have been tainted thoughts, and might really conflict with everybody I know, since for all they know, I am a male...

    How do I deal with such a thought? Is it normal, and what does this do to affect others?
    If it seems like something you actually want to be, then think more on it. Don't make any rash decisions, but if you're experiencing gender dysphoria, it's worth some introspection.

    If it was just idle thoughts, then eh. Whatever.

    I'll say this-I'm a man, have always been male, and don't plan on changing. THAT BEING SAID! I'm not particularly attached to my gender. It's part of who I am, but not a major part. If that ends up being the case for you, that's fine. Enjoy idle thoughts of being a lady, and then go about being a man.

    I guess, overall, figure out how serious the thoughts were. If it's just "Huh. I wonder if..." then you don't need to do anything. If it's more "You know, I actually really would like to be a woman," then I'd say you should probably defer to some of the more experienced members on this forum when it comes to matters of gender. Regardless! Introspection.
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  16. - Top - End - #16
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarlet Knight View Post
    This intrigues me... feminine things don't make you less of a man. You like flowers? You're the guy who owns a florist. You like the kitchen? You're a chef. You like kids? You work in pediatrics. Even if you want to have sex with men, you still a man...a gay man but a man nonetheless.

    Well because being a man is deeply wrapped up in identity and that's deeply wrapped up in self-cognition, you're going to see that there's a lot of things that are not necessarily sensible about it, and things will vary drastically from person to person. I will say this, I suspect that there would be a difference between a man enjoying flowers (at least in most folks' perceptions) and a man enjoying flowers the same way that a woman does. It's not necessarily the act itself that makes something manly or manly but rather the set of drives, emotional component, and motivations behind them. That's the chief thing.
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by The Succubus View Post
    I just had a mental picture of a cat in a saffron robe miaowing the meaning of life at people.


    Embrace the truth and the catnip! Meow!
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

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    DwarfClericGuy

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Last week I was at the ortho and have been scheduled for a total knee replacement. That night I had a dream that I was on the operating table with the doctor saying "he has ran out of blood". I kept asking him "what are you going to do about that?". I believe the dream means I want to have sex with Kate Beckinsale...

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by FreddyNoNose View Post
    Last week I was at the ortho and have been scheduled for a total knee replacement. That night I had a dream that I was on the operating table with the doctor saying "he has ran out of blood". I kept asking him "what are you going to do about that?". I believe the dream means I want to have sex with Kate Beckinsale...
    Oooook, that's that escalated quickly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

  20. - Top - End - #20
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Hi, thanks for the thoughts. I thought I'd stay with being male. But thanks for the help!

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    We have a thread for this sort of thing here: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showt...-Thread/page40
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSymphony View Post
    Hi, thanks for the thoughts. I thought I'd stay with being male. But thanks for the help!
    Any changes in your social groups before these thoughts popped into your head?
    In an environment with many male figures, certain males sometime assume female social characteristica.
    It can lead to thoughts that are disturbing to those individuals, but it is actually perfectly normal, and once the social group changes, so do the thoughts.
    A fairly frequent occurrence in male dominant environments such as old-time navies and gangs, but it can happen in a modern workplace or groups of friends as well. Doesn't mean they can't like Kate Beckinsale.
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    It is perfectly normal.

    I think about what my life would be like if I were a man a great deal. You see, it is part of feminist analysis. If we never considered how our lives would be different if we were men, then we'd not know about male privilege.

    Thinking about what your life would be like if you were a woman is a great exercise in empathy. (That is, if you think about being a female version of yourself. If you think about being a female millionaire, then that'd be more in the daydreaming category.)

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Here are my two cents.

    Was it a one off daydream? We have all been there. It is a part of the human condition to imagine yourself in other circumstances. Do not spend too much time pondering it and move on.

    Has it been a recurring thought? Do you think of this situation often? That is also not outside the realm of human experience. If it is not impacting your life negatively, I would say keep it as a thought exercise. There is nothing wrong with such thinking. We human beings have the gift and the curse of imagining ourselves in different ways. Use these thoughts to boost your creativity. Not all of us can truly imagine ourselves in a different light.

    Is it an oppressive thought that is affecting your life in a negative way? See a psychologist. They can make recommendations on how best to deal with it. No one on this forum can give you professional advice. If they say otherwise, they are a charlatan. There is no shame in seeking professional help. Most 'Normal' people should probably be seeing a psychologist.

    I do not want this post in any way to be condescending or to sound overbearing. I am being sincere. I have had issues of my own and professional mental health counseling has helped tremendously.
    Last edited by Kromp; 2017-07-05 at 07:24 PM.

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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post
    It is perfectly normal.
    I'm not sure it's entirely normal. Since the person was pretty shocked and disconcerted by it. I've not heard many men talk about that sort of thing either, so I suspect that dismissing it as "perfectly normal" is probably not necessarily the right course here. Since again in his case he said that was unusual and it sounded like he was not comfortable with that sort of thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post
    I think about what my life would be like if I were a man a great deal. You see, it is part of feminist analysis. If we never considered how our lives would be different if we were men, then we'd not know about male privilege.
    You do realize that you picturing your life as a man, and an actual male's life are not the same, yes? And it's certainly not an indication of privilege. Generally people who talk about male privilege tend to be not all that interested in the discussions and opinions of actual men on the subject. Which is sad since you're missing out on first-hand accounts and in this case substituting fictional ones.

    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post
    Thinking about what your life would be like if you were a woman is a great exercise in empathy. (That is, if you think about being a female version of yourself. If you think about being a female millionaire, then that'd be more in the daydreaming category.)
    It's interesting that you would consider imagining oneself to be a woman (if one is not) an exercise in empathy), and imagining being a man not an exercise in empathy but rather of privilege. That's very troubling to me, personally at least.
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by AMFV View Post
    I'm not sure it's entirely normal. Since the person was pretty shocked and disconcerted by it. I've not heard many men talk about that sort of thing either, so I suspect that dismissing it as "perfectly normal" is probably not necessarily the right course here. Since again in his case he said that was unusual and it sounded like he was not comfortable with that sort of thing.
    I don't know; it sounded more like BlackSymphony was wondering if it was normal rather than assuming either way, since they mention only that those thoughts would conflict with other people who know him as male. (Feel free to jump in here if I'm wrong, BlackSymphony.)

    In which case, having thoughts of being generally other than you normally think of yourself as being is normal, at least in the sense that it's not maladaptive and somewhat common. It's also not common to mention it for any number of cultural reasons. It's also normal, in the same sense, not to have them.

    I absolutely agree that it would be a bad idea to dismiss as normal something that's distressing him, but I didn't read his posts that way and there's nothing wrong with thinking about it ipso facto, so if the only thing he's worried about is if he's "normal" I see no evidence to the contrary.

    Were he having thoughts of being violent or something, I'd be more worried. This is more probably benign, so I'm more inclined to suggest that he seek professional help if he thinks he needs it or could benefit from it, but he isn't reporting anything that would overly alarm me.
    Last edited by Trekkin; 2017-07-05 at 09:32 PM.

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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    Quote Originally Posted by Trekkin View Post
    I don't know; it sounded more like BlackSymphony was wondering if it was normal rather than assuming either way, since they mention only that those thoughts would conflict with other people who know him as male. (Feel free to jump in here if I'm wrong, BlackSymphony.)
    Fair enough. I think that his reference to "tainted thoughts", is what got me thinking he was deeply concerned about it. And it didn't seem normal for him, which is important. And I think not something we should brush aside. I would say that it doesn't seem normal to have thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Trekkin View Post
    In which case, having thoughts of being generally other than you normally think of yourself as being is normal, at least in the sense that it's not maladaptive and somewhat common. It's also not common to mention it for any number of cultural reasons. It's also normal, in the same sense, not to have them.
    True, but if you suddenly start having those types of thoughts and you have previously, then saying "Oh, that's normal", is not super-helpful, because it isn't normal for you. It's something happening outside of regular parameters in terms of cognition, and that should be investigated. Which is why I commented on it being slightly unusual in my original post. Because for somebody who has a strong identity as a male, and then suddenly they have an unusual daydream like that, it would be worth looking into at the very least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trekkin View Post
    I absolutely agree that it would be a bad idea to dismiss as normal something that's distressing him, but I didn't read his posts that way and there's nothing wrong with thinking about it ipso facto, so if the only thing he's worried about is if he's "normal" I see no evidence to the contrary.
    Well if somebody feels strongly enough to come and post something about that, particularly with verbiage like "tainted thoughts", we shouldn't just dismiss it as normal, out-of-hand. I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with imagining oneself as a gender one is not, in principle. I'm saying that if somebody suddenly starts to imagine themselves as a gender they are not, and are troubled by it, this is something that is NOT normal.

    We shouldn't dismiss what sounds very like an intrusive thought as normal, that sounds like something that should be at the very least explored with confidents and at the very worst explored with professionals. That sounds like an intrusive thought, like something that is coming from something else at the very least, unless it was something that he had experienced regularly before.

    It's also important to note there's no discussion of progression. It's not first he imagines himself doing things that are like female things or what he views as that, maybe imagines himself dressing that way. It goes right to a very drastic place, and that's not typical at least not from the people I've heard talk about these kind of things. And I could see why that would be very jarring.
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    Default Re: I er, recently had thoughts of being a woman...

    We're in total agreement that, if your thoughts disturb you, they should be explored and considered carefully rather than dismissed. Professional help is certainly an option. If BlackSymphony finds his thought of being a woman distasteful or unnerving in and of itself, absolutely take it seriously.

    I just read his discomfort as being worried about the possibility that these thoughts are evidence of a larger problem, and that need not be and is probably not the case. Minds do change, for all sorts of reasons, and while you're right in saying that it's worth examining new thoughts, there isn't enough evidence of either distress or maladaptivity here for me to advocate worrying about it. It's kind of like scratching an itch; if you constantly think about how you shouldn't scratch it, it itches more. Similarly, if he's constantly worried because he had these thoughts, he may get more distressed by seeing evidence of progression where there isn't any. When we look in our own heads, we generally find what we're looking for, and things can snowball very easily.

    He had a thought he finds unusual. While I agree that should not be dismissed, we should also not advocate concern to the point where he's jumping at shadows, so to speak. There are thoughts worth getting worried over; odds are that this isn't one of them, and proceeding with more trepidation than is warranted will probably lead to more stress than there needs to be. Sure, this thought may not have been normal for him, but it's also not inherently dangerous. Going through one's mind looking for reasons to be alarmed can be.

    So that's my point: the danger of too assiduous a search seems to me greater than anything this thought likely represents, and absent any inherent concern over it (which there may be, given the syntax you point out) I'd rather reassure him that it's not some universal telltale sign of a problem -- because it isn't -- and see if his discomfort persists than add worry onto what is probably a jarring moment already.
    Last edited by Trekkin; 2017-07-05 at 10:14 PM.

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