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  1. - Top - End - #91
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by ColorBlindNinja View Post
    All fear is mind-effecting, do you have Mind Blank?
    No, couldn't find a printed item with Mind Blank

  2. - Top - End - #92
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by flappeercraft View Post
    No, couldn't find a printed item with Mind Blank
    There's the Cowl of Warding, it provides Mind Blank, Freedom of Movement, and Spell Turning. It costs 200,800 and takes up the head slot.

    There's also the Third Eye Conceal, 120,000 and uses your face slot.

    You also might want to look at Lists-of-Necessary-Magic-Items.

  3. - Top - End - #93
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    Tainted_Scholar's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Venger View Post
    Dragon magazine is third party. It always has been third party. No, you didn't miss a response.
    No, Dragon Magazine is First Party.
    The False Balance Fallacy

    The tendency to interpret the rules, not based on any validity with RAW or logic, but that which makes the game (in their eyes) more balanced.
    This tendency is often fueled by the incorrect belief that the game is balanced or the desire for it to be.

  4. - Top - End - #94
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Are cost reducers allowed or disallowed?

  5. - Top - End - #95
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by flappeercraft View Post
    Are cost reducers allowed or disallowed?
    For clarification's sake, could you elaborate what you mean by that?

  6. - Top - End - #96
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    You can apply limitations to magic items to reduce their cost. For example only a specific class can use it and instead of the item costs 30% less

  7. - Top - End - #97
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    Tainted_Scholar's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by flappeercraft View Post
    You can apply limitations to magic items to reduce their cost. For example only a specific class can use it and instead of the item costs 30% less
    Interesting, where is this from?
    The False Balance Fallacy

    The tendency to interpret the rules, not based on any validity with RAW or logic, but that which makes the game (in their eyes) more balanced.
    This tendency is often fueled by the incorrect belief that the game is balanced or the desire for it to be.

  8. - Top - End - #98
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Tainted_Scholar View Post
    Interesting, where is this from?
    It sounds like it's from the custom magic item rules guidelines.

    If that's the case, no, it's not allowed.

  9. - Top - End - #99
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Some are custom items, some are from special materials like fey cherry wood. Most cost reducers are from custom item guidelines which are in DMG. The one I want to use is Fey Cherry Wood. I don't remember exactly where it's from but there is a description of it on Realmshelp Magic plants section IIRC

  10. - Top - End - #100
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by flappeercraft View Post
    Some are custom items, some are from special materials like fey cherry wood. Most cost reducers are from custom item guidelines which are in DMG. The one I want to use is Fey Cherry Wood. I don't remember exactly where it's from but there is a description of it on Realmshelp Magic plants section IIRC
    Making an item out of a (cheaper) special material would probably be OK, but we'll have to see what everyone else thinks.

    Edit: Fey Cherry Wood appears to be from Dragon Magazine #357; I'll do some more research and see what I can find.

    Edit 2: Yep, Dragon Magazine #357 Pg. 56.
    Link: Magical-Plants-and-Where-to-Find-them
    Last edited by ColorBlindNinja; 2017-07-20 at 07:46 PM.

  11. - Top - End - #101
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    tyckspoon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by flappeercraft View Post
    Then I'll see where else to get immunity to fear from. Any ideas? Basically on 12,000 GP budget

    Edit: Unless cost reducers are allowed. Are they?
    Banner of the Storm's Eye. 15k GP, suppresses fear in a 20' radius of the bearer. Held or can be mounted on a backpack, in which case it counts as a shoulder-slot item. Ironically, much more in character for a traditional Samurai appearance. Magic Item Compendium.
    Last edited by tyckspoon; 2017-07-20 at 07:59 PM.

  12. - Top - End - #102
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    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Magic reducers are custom items, you're using an item that isn't printed anywhere.
    Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
    Quote Originally Posted by willpell View Post
    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
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  13. - Top - End - #103
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by The Viscount View Post
    Magic reducers are custom items, you're using an item that isn't printed anywhere.
    It looks like flappeercraft is using a special material from Dragon Magazine.

  14. - Top - End - #104
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    GreenSorcererElf

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Dragon Mag is officially sanctioned third party. It was printed by Paizo, endorsed by WotC. It is sanctioned third party.

  15. - Top - End - #105
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    BlackDragon

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Calthropstu View Post
    Dragon Mag is officially sanctioned third party. It was printed by Paizo, endorsed by WotC. It is sanctioned third party.
    I thought I read somewhere that dragon mag is second party because its officially endorsed third party material. Not sure about the specifics.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    Therefore, you just need a taller statue -- or a sufficiently high pedestal for your statue, if you're a cheese-weasel -- to permanently kill any god in 2e.

  16. - Top - End - #106
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    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by ColorBlindNinja View Post
    It looks like flappeercraft is using a special material from Dragon Magazine.
    That says that items made from the wood cost 10% lest to enhance, so that doesn't sound like the effect that would apply for making the banner.

    Ok I've spent the last of my money and removed the chronocharm from my list, and I added 1 flaw for 1 feat. In the interests of transparency, flappeercraft, I know that we've been tweaking builds based on looking at each other's builds, but I'm ready to be mutually done after you buy your banner. Do we have a deal?
    Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
    Quote Originally Posted by willpell View Post
    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
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  17. - Top - End - #107
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Yeah I'm done on my part. Will not alter my build any further

  18. - Top - End - #108
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Unless anyone has any suggestions, I believe my build is final:

    Spoiler: Sammy the Samurai
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    Level 20 Samurai

    Dragonborn, Lesser Cansin

    Lawful Neutral

    HP: 225

    Movement: Land 30', Flight 30' (average maneuverability)

    STR: 27 (+8)
    DEX: 18 (+4)
    CON: 22 (+6)
    INT: 16 (+3)
    WIS: 14 (+2)
    CHA: 34 (+12)

    Initiative: +15

    BAB: 20/15/10/5

    Melee: 29/24/19/14

    DMG: 2D6+17

    AC: 20

    FORT: +23
    REF: +15
    WILL: +9 (+29 with Moment of the Perfect Mind)

    Skills:
    Intimidate: +38 (23 Ranks)
    Concentration: +29 (23 Ranks)

    Flaws:
    Fussy: -4 to poison on Fort Saves, can't drink potions or becomes naueseated
    Love of Nature: DC 12 Will save VS attacking Animals, Vermin, and Plants

    Racial Abilities:
    Flight

    Spoiler: Feats
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    Martial Stance: Moment of the Perfect Mind
    Power Attack
    Skill Focus: Intimidate
    Improved Bull Rush
    Imperious Command
    Improved Initative (Bonus Feat)
    Shock Trooper
    Shape Soulmeld (Crystal Helm) [+2 to WILL VS Charm/Complusion, when bound, all attack gain FORCE descriptor]
    Open Least Chakra (Crown, +1 to WILL)
    Split Chakra


    Spoiler: Class Features
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    Daisho Profciency
    Two Swords as One (Improved, Greater)
    Kiai Smite 4/day
    Iajjutsu Master
    Staredown (Improved)
    Bonus Feat: Improved Initiative
    Mass Staredown
    Frightful Presence


    Spoiler: Gear
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    Cloak of Resistance (25,000 GP)
    Manual of Gainful Exercise (137,500)
    Tome of Leadership and Influence (137,500)
    Cowl of Warding (200,800)
    Belt of Magnificence +6 (200,000)
    +2 Fearsome Death Ward Mithral Chainmail (7,250)
    +1 Warning Initiative Greatsword (38,350, +7 init)
    4,850 GP left



    Edit:

    My basic strategy is to use Intimidate to demoralize my foe and then wail on them.
    Last edited by ColorBlindNinja; 2017-07-20 at 09:32 PM.

  19. - Top - End - #109
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    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Perfect, now our agreement is tripartite and all builds are final. I'm so glad we could agree on this. Looking forward to the main event.
    Last edited by The Viscount; 2017-07-20 at 09:36 PM.
    Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
    Quote Originally Posted by willpell View Post
    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
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  20. - Top - End - #110
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    I've been reading up on Intimidate, and I was wondering, can I demoralize an opponent repeatedly? The skill description was a little vague.

  21. - Top - End - #111
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    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    You can't stack intimidate with itself, but you can demoralize the same opponent multiple times in combat.
    Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
    Quote Originally Posted by willpell View Post
    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
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  22. - Top - End - #112
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by The Viscount View Post
    You can't stack intimidate with itself, but you can demoralize the same opponent multiple times in combat.
    Thanks, that's all I wanted to know.

  23. - Top - End - #113
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    So to all who see this post, what class is your money on? Which do you think will prove superior in this competition?

    Also, tomorrow I am available and earlier than I thought sonif you guys are available maybe that could be when we do it since we are all done with the builds.

  24. - Top - End - #114
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    how are we handling stealth?

  25. - Top - End - #115
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Probably due to the nature of this it would be disallowed but you should ask Hackulator about that

  26. - Top - End - #116
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Just a quick note about ColorBlindNinja's Samurai: It looks like you're going all in on the Crystal Helm Soulmeld to gain its "All Melee attacks are Force attacks" chakra bind effect, which is cool. Just remember that you're not going to get the +2 to Will Saves; Crystal Helm gives a resistance bonus and you've got a Cloak of Resistance +5.

  27. - Top - End - #117
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    Jormengand's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Quote Originally Posted by flappeercraft View Post
    So to all who see this post, what class is your money on? Which do you think will prove superior in this competition?
    I predict that at this optimisation level it makes no functional difference whether you're using the samurai's weak features or the soulknife's non-features.

  28. - Top - End - #118
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    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Just the act of building has shown me how close they really are. So many of their features either don't matter or aren't worth using, it kind of comes down to samurai having full BAB but being more MAD, versus soulknife having average but having more money to work. Both classes need gear to be closer to competent, but I think in most normal games soulknife would have the edge in versatility.
    Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
    Quote Originally Posted by willpell View Post
    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
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  29. - Top - End - #119
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    Jormengand's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    In a real game a samurai would win easily - that is, in any game where their class features actually became relevant. I mean look: the soulknife is buying a very expensive anti-samurai peice of equipment; that isn't indicative of a normal game state. The samurai is simply better at fighting. A warrior is better at fighting than a soulknife at most levels.

  30. - Top - End - #120
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    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Samurai vs Soulknife: The Ultimate Showdown

    Oh I had meant if you're playing a regular game against monsters and encounters, that the soulknife's ability in scouting and maneuverability will lend it to be more useful to the party than the samurai, who can fight monsters and then maybe do a little social if they have the points.

    Soulknife can indeed neutralize the samurai's calling card, but the Samurai can do the same, and mind-affecting immunity is a fairly normal thing to acquire by level 20.
    Last edited by The Viscount; 2017-07-21 at 12:02 PM.
    Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
    Quote Originally Posted by willpell View Post
    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
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