OOTS 1085 - The Discussion Thread

[Jasdoif]

Like knag said, this strip suggests that a new day started. Note how the day is bright again, whereas last time they were on deck (some 5 strips before then) it was almost dark.

Another question would be, "what time is it now?" There's no frame of reference for how much time passed (if any) for the cutaway to Hel.

Unlike wizards, clerics need to prepare their spells at a certain time of day so leaving spell slots open isn't a viable option; if they've already prepared their spells for the day, and their spell selection didn't account for bypassing doors they didn't think would be a problem to enter, then the Order's going to arrive before they can prepare new spells for the problem at hand.

[Elkins]

I'm quite enjoying the steadily emerging background characterization of Gone-tor. Apparently, the poor old Exarch's dark mirror has some very strong (and very rigid!) feelings about hierarchies and utility and the "proper order" of things. Seems appropriate enough, for the vampire spirit of a dwarf who in life chose to worship elemental stone.

[ti'esar]

"Some kinda giant wallflower."

Hmm. Is this another example of Greg seeming to unconsciously drift into Durkon's accent?

[knag]

Well, yes, I'm aware its weak circumstantial evidence at best.

GW

It's actually much better than that. In panel 3 of #1050, Haley said she received the sending from Lien "last night", so the day of the Battle of Passage Pass is the day following Lien and O-Chul staking out Kraagor's Tomb.

We saw the sun set in #1036, and the sky lighten again in #1049. The current date is the day following Godsmoot.

[Goaty14]

"It's like fighting some kind of giant monstrous wallflower"

Do you mean THIS giant monstrous wallflower!?

[Matt620]

This is actually an interesting take on someone who has access to all of the information and choses not to use it. It's always fun to watch an arrogant SOB take one on the face when he had the chance to know better.

[Psyren]

(emphasis mine)
Actually, that might have been precisely what Durkon showed Greg: Durkon accessing that room with that stone, and not the bit about the stone's rules

GW

Indeed, but my larger point stands - GitP rules lawyers could find a loophole that Greg could not.

[georgie_leech]

Indeed, but my larger point stands - GitP rules lawyers could find a loophole that Greg could not.

That's mostly by virtue of having a whole lot of people with way too much time on their hands.

[Darkhands]

In the final panel: "Rot your face off". Would Durkon's accent allow him to enunciate "your"? Wouldn't "yer" be more Durkonish?

[Jay R]

That's the first positive thing I've ever heard any adventurer say about yellow mold.

[8BitNinja]

That's the first positive thing I've ever heard any adventurer say about yellow mold.

This is the first positive thing I've heard anyone say about mold in general.

[Psychronia]

Yeah Durkon! You tell that sentient bundle of negative energy molded into an unholy semblance of life!

I feel like there was potential for a tree joke at the end there, but Yellow Mold makes for a better quote.

[Jasdoif]

This is the first positive thing I've heard anyone say about mold in general.

Blue cheese is delicious, thanks to mold. Penicillin saves lives, and exists thanks to mold.

[2D8HP]

In the final panel: "Rot your face off". Would Durkon's accent allow him to enunciate "your"? Wouldn't "yer" be more Durkonish?

I believe that English common phrase "Rot your face off" fully translated into Scots Dwaven would be "Rot yer coupon aff"

[Gift Jeraff]

"Some kinda giant wallflower."

Hmm. Is this another example of Greg seeming to unconsciously drift into Durkon's accent?

Good catch. I hope it is, since the vampire still kind of feels like a non-character (hell, I felt like he was more distinguished as Malack's childlike thrall) and any kind of development would be welcome.

[Mandor]

Clearly(?) the vampire was hoping someone on the other side would open the door just to issue a correction.

But, the XKCD: Duty Calls guy, was not a Dwarf, and thus the world was saved.

[Dilvish]

I'm like yellow mold. Step on my and I'll rot your face off.

LOVE it. Glad to see Durkon's still finding ways to resist , even bound as he is.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Yes, that was a great line by Durkon. :)

[AutomatedTeller]

Go Durkon!!

[danielxcutter]

VampirExarch is comedy gold.

That last panel is hilarious too. Don't know what yellow mold is, but I get the idea.

[Goblin_Priest]

Good catch. I hope it is, since the vampire still kind of feels like a non-character (hell, I felt like he was more distinguished as Malack's childlike thrall) and any kind of development would be welcome.

Aren't OotSverse undead incapable of growth?

[danielxcutter]

Aren't OotSverse undead incapable of growth?

I think the Giant actually said something to the contrary... *casts Summon Banana*

[White Magic]

"Show me every way you know of to access that room, and nothing else" might have helped.

Cheers!

Durkon is not a file-server that responds as requested to even well-parsed commands. Undurkon* asked something just like that to discover the use of the key-stone. Is there another way he could have learned of it?

[danielxcutter]

Cheers!

Durkon is not a file-server that responds as requested to even well-parsed commands. Undurkon* asked something just like that to discover the use of the key-stone. Is there another way he could have learned of it?

Well, there is this...

[White Magic]

So... Durkon can omit details/memories that the vamp doesn't directly ask for? Are we going to get some odd variant of wish-lawyering where the vampire tries to get the necessary memories, with Durkon trying to hide vital details? Will Durkon drive the vamp mad from within?

Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Durkon is tops.

[White Magic]

memory priest says it unlocks any door to the temple.
yeah, but these are dwarves. Logical, they aint.

yeah, but good builders they are. Ask anyone.

[Epinephrine_Syn]

Funny enough, the thing I think about here is "All they need to do is find another priest, turn him into some kinda undead, then have him open the gate." To be fair, the gate may be smart enough to recognize an undead version as "not the same person", but it's entirely plausible that if they vamped that priest, that priest coulda just let them in 'freely'.

(They may not have that capacity anymore, admittedly, though maybe even a Wight would do.)

[Jasdoif]

I think the Giant actually said something to the contrary... *casts Summon Banana*

Time for me to work on that astral plane barrier again, I see....

One of the themes in the comic is "Only living things can learn and change". Is it a wink to the Discworld ?

No, not at all. I've never read the Discworld novels, so I don't even know how it would be. Further, that is not an intentional theme of OOTS; Malack certainly learned and changed over the course of his undeath, or else he would never have been able to manage the complex scheme that he started with Tarquin. Arguably, if Malack were incapable of learning, he would never have "learned" to underestimate Nale, thus negating the impact of his demise. Heck, Crystal just "learned" that Bozzok was bad for her and turned on him, something she never managed to do in her entire mortal life. Some of the characters may believe that only living things can learn, but it's not a thematic statement, or even especially accurate.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Playing devil's advocate for a moment, it's a key. Greg asked for the memory of "how to access Firmament" and Durkon showed him a key. It is too usual a method of access to immediately wonder if there is a second bit to the story involving getting the key freely. Yes, in hindsight Greg would've done better to inquire further, but there are infinite details which, if he was being careful, he'd need to inquire further on: what about the door? Maybe the floor in front of the door has an enchantment against undead? Maybe the passage beyond requires a prayer to Thor or alarms are raised? Maybe, maybe, maybe. Greg is on a tight schedule, and no matter how quickly time runs inside his head, he doesn't have an infinite amount of it.

But certainly his contempt and complacency aren't helping his cause.

GW

The vampire is an idiot, because you don't just ask for the key, you ask about the security as well. Being able to unlock the front door is no good if the burglar alarm goes of thirty seconds later.

Or to put it another way: "You should've taken the whole book.The warnings come after the spells."

[Grey_Wolf_c]

The vampire is an idiot, because you don't just ask for the key, you ask about the security as well. Being able to unlock the front door is no good if the burglar alarm goes of thirty seconds later.

Again, for all you know he did ask, and Durkon honestly showed that there was no further security beyond needing the rune to open the door (plus the air-tight seal & magic resistance). Unless he happened to ask about any magical effects on the key itself, he'd not have learnt of it. That doesn't make him an idiot. It is easy to second-guess the questions with the advantage of hindsight, and days to think of the questions, and plenty of other forumnites to bounce ideas off of, but Greg doesn't have any of that.

To be absolutely clear, my point here is that there is an infinite number of things a vampire'd need to ask to be sure that they have all the memories of the host. The process usually takes months. Greg has days at best. Therefore, yes, there is an angle that Durkon can exploit, helped by the fact that Greg doesn't think much of Durkon and believes himself superior to him. But there is a large gap between that and saying that Greg is stupid. He clearly is not, given how well he has been plotting and scheming so far.

Grey Wolf

[Chei]

"Ye dinnae ask fer it. Also, I hate ye an' I want ye ta fail."

This may be my favorite Durkon line ever, come to think of it. You always get those trickster characters smarming "You didn't ask," but Durkon ain't like that. He's got a real reason he did it, and he makes sure Greg knows, but Durkon's also going to rub in Greg's face that he's not infallible. It's a good time, that line.