How can i be more ruthless while blacksmithing?

[Draconi Redfir]

all i know is had i rolled high enough, the armor probably would have been blessed by asmodeus and magical or something idk. that's the main thing i'm sad about :P

[GungHo]

Don't forget to quench the swords in angel tears and to do "proofing strokes" on stacks of ducklings.

[Lord Torath]

Maybe punch an bunny or two, as well.

Or realize that the gruesomeness wasn't actually helping. Try refinement instead.

Because whipping the slaves doesn't really make the food taste better. Maybe make some offerings to the Smithing god? That might get some extra bonuses from the DM to your next check, even if it's a dwarven or human god. Maybe include the argument that the God of Smithing is probably more concerned about the smithing itself, rather than the race or species doing the smithing.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Have you tried using any part of a unicorn yet? An anvil of its bones maybe?

[Deliverance]

Sounds like the real problem is that the hobgoblins suffer from a lack of knowledge of metallurgy and a severe case of missing common sense. (Not that such are typically well represented in RPGs.)

Have you considered confounding your DM by addressing your real problem "we don't know how to make steel, we need the knowledge and the experience, how about we do some adventures that leads to us learning these skills from somebody who knows how", or perhaps, "since we do have some knowledge, if we spend all our time trying to create small steel ingots based on the knowledge we do have, varying the experiment slightly with each experiment and taking careful notes of the result, can we roll for how long time it will take to succeed?" rather than "how well do I need to roll dice to craft a full set of steel plate armour, when we don't know how to make steel yet"?

Anyhow, for a more ruthless approach, punish your own hobgoblin. Anybody can be ruthless to others - being it to oneself shows true determination.

So whenever an attempt fails, it is time for a bit of self-mutilation. In order of failed attempts, chop off: foot, hand, head. Three strikes and you are out - your hobgoblin's problem will be solved one way or the other.

[Lord Torath]

...perhaps, "since we do have [I]some[I] knowledge, if we spend all our time trying to create small steel ingots based on the knowledge we do have, varying the experiment slightly with each experiment and taking careful notes of the result, can we roll for how long time it will take to succeed?" rather than "how well do I need to roll dice to craft a full set of steel plate armour, when we don't know how to make steel yet"?

Considering your recent rolls, this might be the best bet.

[Draconi Redfir]

Have you tried using any part of a unicorn yet? An anvil of its bones maybe?

not sure we have any unicorns unfortionately. There is a silver dragon somewhere though...

Sounds like the real problem is that the hobgoblins suffer from a lack of knowledge of metallurgy and a severe case of missing common sense. (Not that such are typically well represented in RPGs.)

Have you considered confounding your DM by addressing your real problem "we don't know how to make steel, we need the knowledge and the experience, how about we do some adventures that leads to us learning these skills from somebody who knows how", or perhaps, "since we do have some knowledge, if we spend all our time trying to create small steel ingots based on the knowledge we do have, varying the experiment slightly with each experiment and taking careful notes of the result, can we roll for how long time it will take to succeed?" rather than "how well do I need to roll dice to craft a full set of steel plate armour, when we don't know how to make steel yet"?

Anyhow, for a more ruthless approach, punish your own hobgoblin. Anybody can be ruthless to others - being it to oneself shows true determination.

So whenever an attempt fails, it is time for a bit of self-mutilation. In order of failed attempts, chop off: foot, hand, head. Three strikes and you are out - your hobgoblin's problem will be solved one way or the other.

offically the hobgoblins already know how to make steel. making something out of steel is something completely different.

plus, rolling less then a five isn't helping.

[Corsair14]

What part of the armor were you building out of curiosity? Hobgoblins in the fluff are quite good at smithing being on par with humans being as militaristic and disciplined as they are. Building a suit of plate over a few months would certainly be within their ability. With shamans around to assist in the various rites as they come along and a high level shaman to do the final "blessing" a magical suit shouldn't be that hard. Its more of a time and materials thing.

[Kane0]

Alternatively, come up with some way to roll more often (by splitting up the work for example) so you're more likely to roll something well, then progress from there.

[Draconi Redfir]

Alternatively, come up with some way to roll more often (by splitting up the work for example) so you're more likely to roll something well, then progress from there.

wouldn't work. we only get one roll per action per week. and i only have the one action.

[CharonsHelper]

Don't forget to quench the swords in angel tears and to do "proofing strokes" on stacks of ducklings.

More bonuses for using puppies which are especially happy and rambunctious.

[Xuc Xac]

Adding a lot of extra detail is nice, but it doesn't help when the detail is wrong. All of the "ruthlessness" is counterproductive because it's just bad smithing technique. Blood is a horrible thing to quench steel in but that's probably the least worst of your attempted "bonuses". If I were GM, all of these ruthless things would give you large modifiers to your roll but they would be negative modifiers.

If you want special magic armor, first make good armor then enchant it. Use good metalworking techniques to make the armor, then do all your "ruthless" stuff for the enchantment.

[Draconi Redfir]

Adding a lot of extra detail is nice, but it doesn't help when the detail is wrong. All of the "ruthlessness" is counterproductive because it's just bad smithing technique. Blood is a horrible thing to quench steel in but that's probably the least worst of your attempted "bonuses". If I were GM, all of these ruthless things would give you large modifiers to your roll but they would be negative modifiers.

If you want special magic armor, first make good armor then enchant it. Use good metalworking techniques to make the armor, then do all your "ruthless" stuff for the enchantment.

again, i tried making steel the normal way. never rolled higher then a five. DM said i could try using my ruthless stat instead of my connections one, and i have more points in ruthless, so i gave that a shot instead.

[Hypersmith]

take it as a sign you're only partway to true ruthelessness.

The hammer has to be made from the skull of a troll (or something)
The anvil has to be made of some big beasts shoulder blades. Maybe a troll.
Take normal metal and add dried and crumbled bone marrow from something powerful. Like a troll.
In the core of the blade, work in a long bone or a a sliver of tooth or whatever to create a "powerful base".

Tie a human by the arms and legs, stab them with a tube so you that you can see clear through them, use a funnel to pour the molten mixture literally through their bodies, into a mold. Take it over to the bone forge and with the bone hammer, make the edges, put it under the human again, then rip out the tube so that the blood cools the blade. Done!

might want to try a ritual sacrifice irl to get rid of the luck problems.

[Hypersmith]

Adding a lot of extra detail is nice, but it doesn't help when the detail is wrong. All of the "ruthlessness" is counterproductive because it's just bad smithing technique. Blood is a horrible thing to quench steel in but that's probably the least worst of your attempted "bonuses". If I were GM, all of these ruthless things would give you large modifiers to your roll but they would be negative modifiers.

If you want special magic armor, first make good armor then enchant it. Use good metalworking techniques to make the armor, then do all your "ruthless" stuff for the enchantment.

I mean come on, it's game with giant spiders that should suffocate, not to say a thing about undead and like 90% of everything. I'm pretty sure reality is meant to be thrown out the window.

[goto124]

DM said i could try using my ruthless stat instead of my connections one, and i have more points in ruthless, so i gave that a shot instead.

Wait, what? What game is this?

[Draconi Redfir]

Wait, what? What game is this?

Way of the Wicked. it's a leadership feat thing. we get

ruthless, secrecy, survivability, connections, espionage, and loyalty.

my stats are 4, 1, 2, 2, 0, and 6 respectively. Making steel the normal way is a connections roll, so i get more of a bonus by being ruthless.

[cullynthedwarf]

Love the opening description, but your trying to make a jump from stone to steel with out hitting some of the steps along the way.

Copper, yes its a soft metal but you NPC smiths should batter this up to get some kind of expierence

Bronze/brass, alloys at its finest. Still not as good as steel but on the cusp.

And iron. Straight pig iron would be good for first attempts for your suit before you do it for real.

As for ruthless.
Track a dryad down. Look in the area for her animal protector and capture it. Threaten to cut her tree down and eat her sacred beast if she does not show her self. Clap her in cold iron manacles when she does. Then cut the tree down any way. Take your animal prize, the dryad, and as much of the tree as you can pack back to the goblin warren. Build you fire with her tree. Slaughter the beast in front of her to drive her to dispair. Use its bones to give coal/carbon to you metal. Call upon the smith god to bless you forge and anvil. Call upon the greatest devil to bless the work. Cast your sheets of steel and hammer them in to shape. When the last of the wood is gone, push the dryad into the heart of the fire to built up heat for the final quench. Her dispair well make the armour extra potent. A warning though, the dryad must remain pure of body so that her pure spirit can be fully corrupted by Asmodean. He does not want your soiled seconds.

At least that is what I would suggest

[Draconi Redfir]

As for ruthless.
Track a dryad down. Look in the area for her animal protector and capture it. Threaten to cut her tree down and eat her sacred beast if she does not show her self. Clap her in cold iron manacles when she does. Then cut the tree down any way. Take your animal prize, the dryad, and as much of the tree as you can pack back to the goblin warren. Build you fire with her tree. Slaughter the beast in front of her to drive her to dispair. Use its bones to give coal/carbon to you metal. Call upon the smith god to bless you forge and anvil. Call upon the greatest devil to bless the work. Cast your sheets of steel and hammer them in to shape. When the last of the wood is gone, push the dryad into the heart of the fire to built up heat for the final quench. Her dispair well make the armour extra potent. A warning though, the dryad must remain pure of body so that her pure spirit can be fully corrupted by Asmodean. He does not want your soiled seconds.

At least that is what I would suggest

don't think we have acess to dryads anywhere nearby, but i am DEFFINATELY showing this to my DM and partymembers. they'd get a kick out of this

[cullynthedwarf]

Well I'm glad I could bring a smile to your dark heart ;)

[Xuc Xac]

again, i tried making steel the normal way. never rolled higher then a five. DM said i could try using my ruthless stat instead of my connections one, and i have more points in ruthless, so i gave that a shot instead.

Is this really how you should be trying to do things with ruthlessness?

"I pound on the hot metal really hard."
"Make a Strength roll."
"Only 5. Darn."
"You can try again with Charisma."
"I pound on the hot metal really hard while yelling at it."
"That's still Strength..."

Maybe you should treat it as an HR problem instead of an engineering problem. Vader didn't get the Death Star construction back on schedule by counterproductively smashing the equipment. He did it by threatening the foremen with a telekinetic tracheotomy.

[cullynthedwarf]

"I pound on the hot metal really hard."
"Make a Strength roll."
"Only 5. Darn."
"You can try again with Charisma."
"I pound on the hot metal really hard while yelling at it."
"That's still Strength..."

If I'm understanding this, ruthlessness is the STR equivalent for this system. And connection is a INT equivalent. So instead of using his INT a 2 he is getting to use his STR instead.

But I haven't played this system and I'm just guessing.

[cullynthedwarf]

I am curious to the conclusion of your story, how have you managed to up the grisly factor?

[Deliverance]

Way of the Wicked. it's a leadership feat thing. we get

ruthless, secrecy, survivability, connections, espionage, and loyalty.

my stats are 4, 1, 2, 2, 0, and 6 respectively. Making steel the normal way is a connections roll, so i get more of a bonus by being ruthless.

Err, I don't know the game in question any further than that it is about evil organizations, so this infusion of common sense may be completely missing the point, but...

If those are leadership feat thingies for your organization, if making steel the normal way together with your assistants is a connections roll and represents one area of leadership, and if the GM suggests you use your ruthless stat instead, which is also about leadership, why on earth are you use bizarre materials and being comically evil towards others that you want to use as materials in an attempt to get a bonus, something that on the face of it has little to do with leadership, rather than being ruthless towards your assistants, who are the ones you are exerting leadership over? Or being ruthless towards others who have the information you need, as your means of acquiring it?

I mean, "work harder or I'll punish you severely" is one expression of ruthless leadership as is "send my goons to forcibly abduct a smith who knows how, and force him to teach us" and both of them might achieve the goal, whereas "drown a puppy in molten steel and sacrifice a dryad on the anvil" most definitely is not and will not*: It is just stupid.

If you were told you could use your espionage skill instead, you wouldn't try to gain a bonus to succeed by playing a game of cluedo on the anvil or sacrificing a statue of a maltese falcon, would you? No, you'd send out spies to obtain information by covert means and write up some awesome story to get your GM's approval.

* Unless, of course, the rules of the game says so. But it does sound really weird, if so.

---

Don't take me wrong, but re-reading the OP again I can't help recall the joke about the boss who is told that the company has a real security problem with hackers penetrating security and the company's servers crashing on a weekly basis - and decides to remedy the situation by ordering security personnel to wear condoms and helmets while working, on the grounds that it is more secure so it just might work.

[Lord Torath]

Heck, you've got a 6 in loyalty. Can you inspire greater loyalty in your followers, and use that skill in your forging attempts?

[Herobizkit]

Forget the surface dwarves.

Y'all need Droskar.

[Angelmaker]

Break down the project into different workgroups. One experimenting with bones as a source for carbon, another experimenting wit prayers to the dark gods, another one doing whatever,

This way you cana rgue that you ar allowed to roll severall roles of dices, and then promoting the project wit the best outcome thus never rolling dice anymore.

Honestly, a SINGLE dice roll for a week long project? Pssst, yeah. 5% chance of blowing up yer base.