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  1. - Top - End - #151
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Knaight View Post
    Yes, because everyone has so much experience dealing with death all the time and knows this about themselves
    We don't and that's my point, I'm planning on holding a seminar on death and how to deal with it in medicine campus of the university I attend to try to do something about it, it's an absurd that we are sending those young lads and girls to face the mortality of our species without any preparation on how to deal with it, the med schools are really unprepared to deal with the topic.

    I think I will start with the Twilight Zone episode "Nothing in the Dark", what do you guys think? To be honest the best work of art to represent how normal death is to our lives is sandman but my university is too conservative for me to use comics as a visual aid.

    Who knows maybe this will even become a paper I will write about

    Thanks for the inspiration guys.
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-09-01 at 03:16 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

  2. - Top - End - #152
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    The most implausible thing about that whole post is the idea that you go to a university. Most people grow out of the edgy pseudo-nihilist phase around 16.
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  3. - Top - End - #153
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    The most implausible thing about that whole post is the idea that you go to a university. Most people grow out of the edgy pseudo-nihilist phase around 16.
    And most people grow out of calling people names to make them feel bad about themselves around 9 and yet here you are.

    We can clearly see by the OP and many others (including me) had bad experiences with doctors, they need to improve their ethics code and just being the pharmaceutics industry mistress is not enough.
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-09-01 at 03:50 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

  4. - Top - End - #154
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    We don't and that's my point, I'm planning on holding a seminar on death and how to deal with it in medicine campus of the university I attend to try to do something about it, it's an absurd that we are sending those young lads and girls to face the mortality of our species without any preparation on how to deal with it, the med schools are really unprepared to deal with the topic.
    Just in veterinary medicine, but my school had a whole class on dealing with grief, death, and burnout.

    The fact you are not aware of a discussion within a community does not mean the community is ignoring the topic.
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  5. - Top - End - #155
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    Just in veterinary medicine, but my school had a whole class on dealing with grief, death, and burnout.

    The fact you are not aware of a discussion within a community does not mean the community is ignoring the topic.
    I aware of that, but ti1's clearly not enough giving the suicide rates.

    And correct if I'm wrong but those classes deal with it more in a "This is a thing that happens to the patients" rather than "This is a thing you will have to deal with in regular basis try not to let it consume you". Don’t they?
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-09-01 at 04:01 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

  6. - Top - End - #156
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    And most people grow out of calling people names to make them feel bad about themselves around 9 and yet here you are.

    We can clearly see by the OP and many others (including me) had bad experiences with doctors, they need to improve their ethics code and just being the pharmaceutics industry mistress is not enough.
    Things you don't understand, as demonstrated in this thread:

    1.) Physicians

    2.) Psychology
    -2a.) Depression and suicide in particular

    3.) Empathy

    4.) Anecdotal evidence

    5.) The concept of outliers

    6.) Pharmaceuticals (here's a hint, nothing in this thread has anything to do with pharmaceutical companies)

    7.) How to keep your mouth shut on any of these subjects you have zero clue about.

    That's a pretty impressive list in only three posts, let's see you add to it. I believe in you, given your track record in other threads.
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    I aware of that, but ti1's clearly not enough giving the suicide rates.

    And correct if I'm wrong but those classes deal with it more in a "This is a thing that happens to the patients" rather than "This is a thing you will have to deal with in regular basis try not to let it consume you". Don’t they?
    Pretty sure they're directed to the doctor on how to break the news to their relatives as well as how to deal with that the person you were entrusted to keep alive died. A doctor shouldn't get used to it so that they become numb, but they also can't let losing one patient turn into their career-ruining injury.

    I mean, sometimes no matter how hard you try, some people just don't make it. A surgeon must abide to their hippocratic oath, but they should be prepared to deal with the fact that they're not a miracle worker and sometimes they'll be the unlucky one to lose a patient.
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  8. - Top - End - #158
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikemical View Post
    I mean, sometimes no matter how hard you try, some people just don't make it. A surgeon must abide to their hippocratic oath, but they should be prepared to deal with the fact that they're not a miracle worker and sometimes they'll be the unlucky one to lose a patient.
    Indeed and by the looks of it they are not.


    EDIT: Just found this I think it's relevant.
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-09-01 at 04:17 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

  9. - Top - End - #159
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    I aware of that, but ti1's clearly not enough giving the suicide rates.

    And correct if I'm wrong but those classes deal with it more in a "This is a thing that happens to the patients" rather than "This is a thing you will have to deal with in regular basis try not to let it consume you". Don’t they?
    I correct you. You are wrong.
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  10. - Top - End - #160
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Things [The Eye] do[es]n't understand, as demonstrated in this thread:

    3.) Empathy
    This, I think, is the biggest underlying factor. "If people in a given job have a high suicide rate, then those people are weak and should not be in that job" is a horrible argument, in every sense of the word "horrible."
    Last edited by Peelee; 2017-09-01 at 05:03 PM.
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Knaight View Post
    The reason suicide rates are so high among doctors is the same as the reason suicide rates are so high among soldiers - high PTSD rates caused by dealing with severe trauma all the time. Dealing with severely wounded patients is traumatic. Dealing with patients dying is traumatic. Even a cursory look at which doctors kill themselves a lot will reveal a way higher rate among emergency room physicians, surgeons who deal with life threatening injuries, and generally any particular career that is likely to involve people dying messily in front of you.
    The suicide rate in doctors isn't evenall that high. It's 12th, 12th, among professions according to the CDC. That doesn't mean it's low but the national suicide rate is 13 per 100,000 people. Doctors (and Lawyers) are 19 out of every 100,000. That's nowhere near the suicide rate of Farmers. Which is 85 out of every 100,000. Or Factory Workers, which is 35 out of every 100,000.

    Still, those numbers are sad and it's regrettable that people take that option...but it happens and that's just how it is.


    The Eye, on the other hand, continues to demonstrate just what sort of person he really is.

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    I still believe that physicians have issues, the fact that they don't respect psychology as a real form of treatment just makes matters worst.

    But calling suicidal people “weak” or “pathetic” is just horrible, these people are going thought sates of extreme sadness and suffering, having empathy and kindness is a must.

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luz View Post
    I still believe that physicians have issues, the fact that they don't respect psychology as a real form of treatment just makes matters worst.

    But calling suicidal people “weak” or “pathetic” is just horrible, these people are going thought sates of extreme sadness and suffering, having empathy and kindness is a must.
    I think that's fair. It just does grate on me when people armchair general this sort of stuff, especially with arguments which boil down to "Why don't they do X" when I know from personal experience that "X" is basic training and the current debate among experts has moved past "Y" and "Z" and is around "Chi."
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    FWIW, I clearly remember that after a job-site injury my employer sent me to a cheap-o quack clinic, where the "Physician" said, "You're a plumber? I should have been a plumber! Do you know how many Doctors commit suicide?"!

    I later sussed out that the way to get better odds of somewhat competent treatment is, if still mobile enough, to keep my mouth shut about being injured at work, stay away from the "occupational clinics", and hope for the best with general care.

    I'm firmly of the opinion that medical workers are like most people (including plumbers), they're nowhere near as competent as we hope, or they themselves would like to be, they're just trying to do what they can, and pay the rent.

    There just not enough competent people for how much need there is.

    If we wanted more competence we shouldn't have eliminated the Guilds (but then we'd have less people allowed to do the jobs).


    Also, lay off The Eye, he just posted that he's in College, so while probably from a priveledged background, he's likely still just a kid. Unless he's the son of an ultra-wealthy real-estate developer (which I doubt since he spends his time posting to this Forum), he'll get wiser and more empathetic in time.
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luz View Post
    I still believe that physicians have issues, the fact that they don't respect psychology as a real form of treatment just makes matters worst.
    I jokingly rag on psychology a lot because I like the hard sciences, but I fully agree.
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    Quote Originally Posted by littlebum2002 View Post
    It would be nice to just change the title of this thread to be "stuff about Jedi"

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Come on, everyone know many physicians have God complexes, they are hardly angels.

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    I'm firmly of the opinion that medical workers are like most people (including plumbers), they're nowhere near as competent as we hope, or they themselves would like to be, they're just trying to do what they can, and pay the rent.

    There just not enough competent people for how much need there is.
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Also, lay off The Eye, he just posted that he's in College, so while probably from a priveledged background, he's likely still just a kid. Unless he's the son of an ultra-wealthy real-estate developer (which I doubt since he spends his time posting to this Forum), he'll get wiser and more empathetic in time.
    I fail to see how the fact that I have a college degree and work in the academic field makes me automatically "from a privileged background” (Oh and I think you spelled privileged wrong BtW), do you use stereotypes this often?

    I also don't see why being the son of a rich guy would make me post less (I don't even post that much) if anything I would have tons of free time not having to work to pay the rent and the bills.

    Besides aren't we all getting wiser with time? The person who claims to be wise is really the biggest fool.
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-09-01 at 06:38 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    I aware of that, but ti1's clearly not enough giving the suicide rates.
    Some of that rate is an intrinsic occupational hazard. I'm not saying that medical schools (and lets be clear here: society in general) couldn't do a better job dealing with suicide, but that doesn't make using high suicide rates as a stick to beat the profession with in any way okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Razade View Post
    The suicide rate in doctors isn't evenall that high. It's 12th, 12th, among professions according to the CDC. That doesn't mean it's low but the national suicide rate is 13 per 100,000 people. Doctors (and Lawyers) are 19 out of every 100,000. That's nowhere near the suicide rate of Farmers. Which is 85 out of every 100,000. Or Factory Workers, which is 35 out of every 100,000.
    If you break it down by specifics those numbers start looking a bit worse - particularly for people who work in the ER.

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    I agree.



    I fail to see how the fact that I have a college degree and work in the academic field makes me automatically "from a privileged background” (Oh and I think you spelled privileged wrong BtW), do you use stereotypes this often?

    I also don't see why being the son of a rich guy would make me post less (I don't even post that much) if anything I would have tons of free time not having to work to pay the rent and the bills.

    Besides aren't we all getting wiser with time? The person who claims to be wise is really the biggest fool.
    I think the main point was that as a young academic, you've no real experience dealing with death and are in that way privileged. That would make you not the right person to hold any kind of seminar on that.
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    ...I fail to see how the fact that I have a college degree and work in the academic field makes me automatically "from a privileged background”



    Oh, you graduated and have a white collar job?

    Okay, I now classify your status as "privileged", i.e. someone who's job doesn't cause death or cripling injuries.

    I may be wrong, perhaps you've served in thr military overseas?

    (Oh and I think you spelled privileged wrong BtW),
    Thanks for the tip!



    do you use stereotypes this often?

    Yes. Yes I do.

    I also don't see why being the son of a rich guy would make me post less (I don't even post that much) if anything I would have tons of free time not having to work to pay the rent and the bills.

    Because I imagine that you would be spending your time and money on debauchery if that was the case (I also had a very specific person in mind).

    Besides aren't we all getting wiser with time?

    All? No. Just many.

    The person who claims to be wise is really the biggest fool.

    There's a difference between "wise" (I don't know anyone who makes that claim), and "wiser than once they were" (many have said they were).

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    I'm just gonna grab some popcorn and watch you two tear each other's throats out now.

    God, I love the Friendly Banter sub-forum.
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post


    Oh, you graduated and have a white collar job?

    Okay, I now classify your status as "privileged", i.e. someone who's job doesn't cause death or cripling injuries.

    I may be wrong, perhaps you've served in thr military overseas?
    You're almost as judgmental and bigoted as The Eye. Got a non-blue collar job? Privileged.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Because I imagine that you would be spending your time and money on debauchery if that was the case (I also had a very specific person in mind).
    You should probably not judge people on a very specific person.

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Razade View Post
    You're almost as judgmental and bigoted as The Eye. Got a non-blue collar job? Privileged.

    You should probably not judge people on a very specific person.

    Yes Razade, what a fool I am, you are so very correct (and also good looking)., I must agree with you, as you're wisdom is an inspiration for the ages! The demise of my statements are at hand, for you wield debate power beyond my feeble reasoning!

    The forces of the very cosmos are yours to command, and yet still I cannot comprehend the dark dismal end in store for me and my wickedness. Nay! My little brain can only leave me gasping in horror as you tear my arguments asunder! .

    Woe is the day I ever dared dispute you, as the intelligence you bring to this thread dwarfs mine and in fact is wasted on such a pitiful creature as myself. And lo, in days and years to come, when future playgrounders come to use the search function, they shall find the smoking crater that once held my posts, but all shall feel the echoes of the power wielded by the might of your wisdom today, and they shall ponder: whence did your mighty intellect come to shine it's brilliance!

    You leave me in awe, as my tears flow in the realisation of how wrong I was!

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Eh, 4/10, way too forced. If you're going to drop a response like that it needs to be referring to a way more pretentious or lengthy post.

    Have to measure your response to the context or it just isn't funny.
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Eh, 4/10, way too forced. If you're going to drop a response like that it needs to be referring to a way more pretentious or lengthy post.

    Have to measure your response to the context or it just isn't funny.



    True that.

    I was just going to go with the first couple of lines, but it was so fun to write that I got carried away.

    I feel shame.

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post


    Oh, you graduated and have a white collar job?

    Okay, I now classify your status as "privileged", i.e. someone who's job doesn't cause death or cripling injuries.

    I may be wrong, perhaps you've served in thr military overseas?

    Thanks for the tip!



    Yes. Yes I do.

    Because I imagine that you would be spending your time and money on debauchery if that was the case (I also had a very specific person in mind).

    All? No. Just many.

    There's a difference between "wise" (I don't know anyone who makes that claim), and "wiser than once they were" (many have said they were).
    Are you aware that we don't live in the feudal system, where a person born peasant will die peasant, anymore? And people can strive to improve their social position despite their social background?

    I don't need to serve in the military nor does the fact that I work in a so called "white collar job" makes me "privileged". I don't need to tell you my life story since that's pointless in the internet anyway I could be a dog brain in a jar for all you know but the fact that you see yourself as a underprivileged doesn't give you the right to call others privileged.

    Your welcome, I want to make it clear that it wasn't used to diminish in any way I commit typos all the time.

    Not all rich people are the same just as not all poor people are the same, how would you feel if I said that blue collar workers can't appreciate the sword and sorcery subgenre? That’s just as dumb as saying all rich people engage in copious acts of debauchery, I know quite a few rich teens who spend their days reading and posting at reddit.

    Oh? You had a very specific person in mind? Well too bad I’m not that person and I would appreciate if you didn't compare me to him/her. I'm my own person thank you very much.

    They all do, it's just that some choose to ignore their wisdom.
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-09-02 at 12:08 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    Are you aware that we don't live in the feudal system, where a person born peasant will die peasant, anymore? And people can strive to improve their social position despite their social background?.

    It's cute that you think that.

    You keep doing you.


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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    It's cute that you think that.

    You keep doing you.

    1- Less likely.

    2- That study is only about US, despite what you guys seem to believe the world doesn't revolves around you.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Yes Razade, what a fool I am, you are so very correct (and also good looking)., I must agree with you, as you're wisdom is an inspiration for the ages! The demise of my statements are at hand, for you wield debate power beyond my feeble reasoning!

    The forces of the very cosmos are yours to command, and yet still I cannot comprehend the dark dismal end in store for me and my wickedness. Nay! My little brain can only leave me gasping in horror as you tear my arguments asunder! .

    Woe is the day I ever dared dispute you, as the intelligence you bring to this thread dwarfs mine and in fact is wasted on such a pitiful creature as myself. And lo, in days and years to come, when future playgrounders come to use the search function, they shall find the smoking crater that once held my posts, but all shall feel the echoes of the power wielded by the might of your wisdom today, and they shall ponder: whence did your mighty intellect come to shine it's brilliance!

    You leave me in awe, as my tears flow in the realisation of how wrong I was!
    For someone who allegedly comes from a very humble background and social position you are not a very humble person.
    Last edited by The Eye; 2017-09-02 at 12:28 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Excellent Chaotic Evil "roleplaying" The Eye. "The only people responsible for the welfare of or harm dealt to others are people who aren't me."
    "A clear horizon — nothing to worry about on your plate, only things that are creative and not destructive… I can’t bear quarreling, I can’t bear feelings between people — I think hatred is wasted energy, and it’s all non-productive." - Alfred Hitchcock

  29. - Top - End - #179
    Troll in the Playground
     
    RangerGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015
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    San Francisco Bay area
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    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Eye View Post
    ...you are not a very humble person.

    True.

    Despite my lack of education and feeble-mindedness I'm far from humble (except in the face of Razade's superior wit. He was right. I was wrong).

    I'd say I'm mostly bitter and morose.

    Is that important?


    Anyway, I was wrong to post something I posted about you.

    I now don't think, that in time, you're going to change much anymore.

    Be well, and best wishes.

  30. - Top - End - #180
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
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    Male

    Default Re: Why are physicians generally huge jerks?

    Great Modthulhu: This thread is going nowhere, and I'm locking it before it gets any worse. Please remember to play nice with other people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Fel, on quest rewards
    "Is a stack of ten pancakes too many pancakes to give to the party, even if most of them fell on the floor and one or two were stepped on? I wanted to give my party pancakes as a reward but I'm unsure if it's too much. The pancakes are also laced with blowfish poison so the party would have to get an antitoxin before they could eat the ones which weren't pulverized by shoes."

    I don't think anyone would want those pancakes even if you paid them to eat them.

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