XCOM 2 is on sale 60% off...

[Aotrs Commander]

A lot of the major mods are getting updated pretty quickly (like EU Aim Rolls) and a lot of the cosmetic mods are just fine, though some need to be updated.

I played a good chunk last night and I'm having a good time, but then, I play on easy sooooo...

Hey, no judgement from on that dude/dudette/small-furry-from-Alpha-Centauri-de; I barely touch any game above normal at the best of times!

[Avilan the Grey]

Gah! I spend WAY too much time in the armory trying to customize my squad.
A problem is that except for Torso 0 / Pants 0 nothing really matches. Which is very common in games and I always find weird (worst example is in Sims 2 and 3, where for example a bedroom set does not have a single matching bed, or everything in the kitchen matches except one thing that is made to match but doesn't).

[Aotrs Commander]

Well, given that generally the reviews have been pretty glowing overall (and we are not in a Beyond Earth-sort of scenario), I went ahead and bought the base game, DLC and expansion.

Ponythread can thus no doubt dread another Aotrs-Com play-blither at some point in the future (after I've finished blithering about EUIV...)

[boomwolf]

Yea, losing the mods was painful.

Can someone explain how ALL the mods got broken?
Even something as simple as added soldier voices breaks everything for some reason.



Some mods I feel are really essential after a few games (like the ones that streamline animations and take away odd delays between the shot animation and the damage trigger, the fast evacs, etc.)

Losing the actual gameplay modifiers was expected, losing on all the quality-of-life and simple graphic/audio spices is odd.

[Aotrs Commander]

Losing the actual gameplay modifiers was expected, losing on all the quality-of-life and simple graphic/audio spices is odd.

Possibly not, since a lot of the Steam reviews are talking about performance enhancement. If they've changed how the game accesses those things or something (to improve the speed of access), it could break stuff.

[Avilan the Grey]

So for those that has installed the expansion:

Is the loading times better? I head mutterings online that they fixed the loading with this.
I don't have it yet and I have to sit through 2-3 minutes for just returning to base. It still beats those who at game launch had to wait 15 minutes for the game to load anything, of course...

[Vitruviansquid]

My loading times to get into and out of missions are like 5 seconds.

[Rodin]

I've got similar load times. Way, way faster. Previously, Bradford would outline the mission objectives and then I'd sit there for a minute or so waiting for it to load. Now, I've accidentally cut him off a few times by clicking early.

[Theodoric]

So for those that has installed the expansion:

Is the loading times better? I head mutterings online that they fixed the loading with this.
I don't have it yet and I have to sit through 2-3 minutes for just returning to base. It still beats those who at game launch had to wait 15 minutes for the game to load anything, of course...

It runs a lot better, definitely. Like Enemy Within, War of the Chosen is basically a 2.0 version of the game with many old issues being fixed.

They've also incorporated a lot of mods, too, as game options. Having a bit more breathing room with the Avatar project is now a simple, well-integrated toggle.

[Avilan the Grey]

It runs a lot better, definitely. Like Enemy Within, War of the Chosen is basically a 2.0 version of the game with many old issues being fixed.

They've also incorporated a lot of mods, too, as game options. Having a bit more breathing room with the Avatar project is now a simple, well-integrated toggle.

Good to hear! Unfortunately they've put a patch behind a paywall, but if the code is integral to the expansion they might not have had any other way to do it...? I hope? I am extremely tempted to get it just for that.

Edit: So, I got it. I found it on Gamebillet for 28% off. SO I paid €28,60 instead of €39,90. Suck it, Valve!

[boomwolf]

Oh, so the loading time upgrade is part of the expansion?

I recently modified my rig a bit, and assumed that what led to it.

Its really short loading time now.



Still miss some quality of life mods though...hopefully we'll get a new version for them soon.

[Rodin]

Just ran into a hilarious bug I've never seen before. Reinforcements transport dropped a MEC. Instead of doing its "enemy sighted" animation, it jumped 10 feet into the air, went ragdoll, then flew backwards 20 feet. When it landed on its side, it started running like a dog running in its sleep.

What apparently happened is my Overwatching guys nailed it, and then the animations played out of order. So it died, flew through the air while ragdolling as the game moved it to the tile it was supposed to end on, and then once it was dead the running animation played.

[Sian]

started playing it again (never really got that far the first time around, so for the time being I'm not playing with Expansion), and I have to say, the funniest thing to do is to Haywire a MEC, run it into the middle of the opponent position and get it to fire its micro missiles on itself, hitting as many others as well (and/or their cover), an then see the AI thinking it's a hostile that they should shoot at, leaving my team unharmed

[Avilan the Grey]

Just ran into a hilarious bug I've never seen before. Reinforcements transport dropped a MEC. Instead of doing its "enemy sighted" animation, it jumped 10 feet into the air, went ragdoll, then flew backwards 20 feet. When it landed on its side, it started running like a dog running in its sleep.

What apparently happened is my Overwatching guys nailed it, and then the animations played out of order. So it died, flew through the air while ragdolling as the game moved it to the tile it was supposed to end on, and then once it was dead the running animation played.

Okay, that's hilarious

I realized that you can't transfer characters, so I remade the ones I had saved in my Character pool from my two started plays.
I also realized that there's a Developer.bin file. I think I will import it and only have them marked for VIP:s, just for fun.

[Avilan the Grey]

First impressions about Wizard Of The Coast (WotC):
(Seriously, youngsters using WotC as the abbreviation of War Of The Fallen always translates to Wizard Of The Coast for an oldtimer like me)

The Good: Well more XCOM.
The also Good: Claudia Black is Claudia-Blacking it up.
The Bad: Run of The Mill zombies. Seriously, the Lost is about as boring and completely utterly uninspired as you can get.
The Also Bad: The "special agents" you meet are
1. More interesting than your own soldiers
2. FAR FAR more powerful than your own soldiers
3. Has a far better leveling up system (playtesting for XCOM 3?).

In short, why should I give a frakk about my own soldiers?

[Vitruviansquid]

I found the Lost pretty interesting for how they make you have to stop and think about the order in which you take actions. They also make you think about whether you actually want to shoot them or not sometimes. I do wish they came in more varieties, though. Maybe a ranged zombie or one that explodes upon death. I dunno. Something.

You can get your own soldiers on the same level up system that the heroes get if you get a training center.

While I think the heroes are new and fun, as someone who's sunk a lot of hours into Xcom 2 already, I don't know that they particularly replace the basic soldiers. Like if you take a Reaper, sure it's really good at scouting, but once you've used up your claymore, your Vektor Rifle is going to hit lighter than a basic assault rifle.

Besides, the heroes are limited in supply, so you can't help but use normal units.

[Hunter Noventa]

I found the Lost pretty interesting for how they make you have to stop and think about the order in which you take actions. They also make you think about whether you actually want to shoot them or not sometimes. I do wish they came in more varieties, though. Maybe a ranged zombie or one that explodes upon death. I dunno. Something.

You can get your own soldiers on the same level up system that the heroes get if you get a training center.

While I think the heroes are new and fun, as someone who's sunk a lot of hours into Xcom 2 already, I don't know that they particularly replace the basic soldiers. Like if you take a Reaper, sure it's really good at scouting, but once you've used up your claymore, your Vektor Rifle is going to hit lighter than a basic assault rifle.

Besides, the heroes are limited in supply, so you can't help but use normal units.

The Lost are kind of amusing to cheese sometimes. If you're lucky enough to get high ground with only one or two ways up, you can just climb up and stand there, blocking the ladders, and they can't get to you.

I used this to great effect during the Lost and Abandoned story mission where it's just your two soldiers and a skirmisher waiting for Fireband to come in for evac.

[boomwolf]

I just throw pistols and shotguns on the problem. They clear whole hordes in a turn.

And I'd admit the heros are far more interesting than the regular troopers, but you only have a few and once fatigue kicks in, you really can't deploy them as much as you'd wish.
And losing one is hard to replace, borderline impossible if you lucked out on good xcom abilities for them (bladestorm Templar is awesome)
The training center is a must build though, makes your troopers Almost like heroes in thier skillset building.

I wonder if sparks got that too? Gotta build one and check.

Also long waaar please update...

[Hunter Noventa]

I just throw pistols and shotguns on the problem. They clear whole hordes in a turn.

And I'd admit the heros are far more interesting than the regular troopers, but you only have a few and once fatigue kicks in, you really can't deploy them as much as you'd wish.
And losing one is hard to replace, borderline impossible if you lucked out on good xcom abilities for them (bladestorm Templar is awesome)
The training center is a must build though, makes your troopers Almost like heroes in thier skillset building.

I wonder if sparks got that too? Gotta build one and check.

Also long waaar please update...

I have a SPARK under construction in my current run, I have no idea if they're any good now or if they need a mod to be useful like before.

And I need to figure out how to unlock the training center. And build an infirmary. And a defense matrix once I blow a turret.

[Rodin]

I just throw pistols and shotguns on the problem. They clear whole hordes in a turn.

And I'd admit the heros are far more interesting than the regular troopers, but you only have a few and once fatigue kicks in, you really can't deploy them as much as you'd wish.
And losing one is hard to replace, borderline impossible if you lucked out on good xcom abilities for them (bladestorm Templar is awesome)
The training center is a must build though, makes your troopers Almost like heroes in thier skillset building.

I wonder if sparks got that too? Gotta build one and check.

Also long waaar please update...

They don't have that system, but there's already a mod out for it. Haven't tried it yet though.

So far I've found the faction heroes don't scale that well. Your regular X-COM soldiers are effectively getting free abilities every level up over the heroes since they can access the same skill tree in addition to their usual one. This means that at higher ranks they quickly outpace the faction heroes with how much they stack abilities.

They are pretty easy to replace - just use the Resistance Ring and go on a Covert Op to find another.

Specific stuff:

Templars - Feel like a cross between Ranger and Psi Operative. Except, they don't as much damage as a Ranger and don't have either the raw power or utility of a Psi Op. The lack of a ranged weapon can be really crippling.

Reapers - The damage on their rifle is really lacking, and not having Squadsight is really noticeable. They also don't seem to bring the same suite of "kill an entire pod by yourself" that an end-game Sharpshooter has. Best ability by far is Remote Start, but you're still pretty dependent on the location of said objects. I have the least experience with this class thus far, since mine keep on getting themselves discovered and wounded or killed. Seriously guys, you CAN open a door without there being a pod of ADVENT leaning up against it.

Skirmishers - One of their signature abilities is the Grapple, which you can build yourself fairly quickly with the Spider Suit. Other than that, their abilities thus far haven't really impressed me. The only really good one is the ability to yank an enemy into your squad. Shame it only works on ADVENT and doesn't work on even something as humanoid as a Sectoid.

-----

I got a really good chuckle out of one of the Chosen. The Sniper dude was on a billboard that was right up against a drainage channel, so he was effectively 3 stories up. I tossed a grenade at the billboard and he fell all the way down. As he picked himself up, he snarked "You're not very subtle, are you??"

[Avilan the Grey]

Well I haven't played yet. Been busy reconstructing my favorite soldiers from vanilla xcom 2 and xcom 1.

So, looking at it... Looks like there is even more to stress out about. Now you have to stop the chosen as well as the avatar project.
I already felt completely overwhelmed.
How should I prioritize things?

[Rodin]

Well I haven't played yet. Been busy reconstructing my favorite soldiers from vanilla xcom 2 and xcom 1.

So, looking at it... Looks like there is even more to stress out about. Now you have to stop the chosen as well as the avatar project.
I already felt completely overwhelmed.
How should I prioritize things?

If you still haven't started yet, I actually recommend the modification that doubles the time of the Avatar project. I got utterly slammed in my last game because there's so many events to chase after that the Avatar project got away from me very quickly. Doubling the time actually gives you a chance to deal with all the early Chosen and Faction stuff and get to the Avatar project in a reasonable amount of time.

Beyond that, I've found that my standard research focus is still pretty important - get Resistance Comms ASAP to let you expand out into other regions, then push for tier 2 weapons and armor. Building wise, the two most important early buildings seem to be Guerilla Warfare Center and Infiltration Ring. The former for the Squad Size upgrade, the latter because Covert Ops are really, really powerful. Training Center is also pretty high priority for all the extra abilties you get as well as upgrading Bonds, but it's a tough call between that and the Proving Grounds.

[Avilan the Grey]

Okay, thanks. Is the doubling of the Avatar project official or a mod?

[Hunter Noventa]

Templars - Feel like a cross between Ranger and Psi Operative. Except, they don't as much damage as a Ranger and don't have either the raw power or utility of a Psi Op. The lack of a ranged weapon can be really crippling.

Reapers - The damage on their rifle is really lacking, and not having Squadsight is really noticeable. They also don't seem to bring the same suite of "kill an entire pod by yourself" that an end-game Sharpshooter has. Best ability by far is Remote Start, but you're still pretty dependent on the location of said objects. I have the least experience with this class thus far, since mine keep on getting themselves discovered and wounded or killed. Seriously guys, you CAN open a door without there being a pod of ADVENT leaning up against it.

Skirmishers - One of their signature abilities is the Grapple, which you can build yourself fairly quickly with the Spider Suit. Other than that, their abilities thus far haven't really impressed me. The only really good one is the ability to yank an enemy into your squad. Shame it only works on ADVENT and doesn't work on even something as humanoid as a Sectoid.

-----

I got a really good chuckle out of one of the Chosen. The Sniper dude was on a billboard that was right up against a drainage channel, so he was effectively 3 stories up. I tossed a grenade at the billboard and he fell all the way down. As he picked himself up, he snarked "You're not very subtle, are you??"

The Assassin said something similar when I first encountered her and just threw all my grenades at her to make her go away. I really wish Hunker Down could do something to reduce damage/daze chance because when she's running around invisible there's nothing you can do at all.

I've been getting decent use out of my Reaper, and you're right that their rifle is a bit lacking. What I DID just get though is the ability where every enemy they see remains visible forever, which is pretty incredible if you ask me.

Okay, thanks. Is the doubling of the Avatar project official or a mod?

It's under the 'Additional Options' when you start the game, there's also one for doubling mission timers.

I personally used a mod to eliminate the Avatar Project entirely, since you've got the new, more pressing lose condition of the Chosen taking you down, I didn't want to deal with juggling everything.

[Rodin]

The Assassin said something similar when I first encountered her and just threw all my grenades at her to make her go away. I really wish Hunker Down could do something to reduce damage/daze chance because when she's running around invisible there's nothing you can do at all.

I've been getting decent use out of my Reaper, and you're right that their rifle is a bit lacking. What I DID just get though is the ability where every enemy they see remains visible forever, which is pretty incredible if you ask me.

While I haven't really dealt with the Psionic dude yet, I hate the Assassin with a passion. She guarantees wounding at least one and probably two soldiers on every mission she's in, because the only way to stop her from shanking you is to get lucky and flank her while she's on her way in the first time. Even if you manage that, chances are you aren't going to be able to one-round her so she'll get the shank in anyway.

Her often arriving with Rapid Reflexes or that ability that gives her HP if you miss only makes her more infuriating.

[boomwolf]

Ok, got mods, started a new run.

Oh god, the hunter that starts out with grenade immunity and soulstealer is outright brutal. having him as my first chosen, if I couldn't get the drop on him, I never stood a chance.
And I rarely did get a drop of him. so many bull**** team-wipes this run its not even funny. non of the heroes, they managed to either escape or were lucky enough to be wounded at the time.
(by bull**** team wipes I mean things like an enemy trooper somehow dropping my full-cover high-ground sharpshooter from across a river, followed by a lancer taking down someone else at the same time, or moving around a pod, just to be revealed by a second pod that was JUST out of sight for my scouting reaper due to some boxes and getting sandwiched)
Losing so many missions already, let alone having practically no rookies, and added fact I fail again to find any engineers (just one two months in, i can hardly even excavate!), its time to try again.
Maybe lower the difficulty a bit.

As for the hero classes not scaling-they just enough ability points each time they level to get one of their "normal" skills, or a cheap xcom skill (so far saw only 10 point skills and 25 point skills-the 25 point usually something utterly bonkers for the class)
And they can get brutal.
Reapers are practically invisible, except when cheaty AI decided to "randomly" patrol directly into his position, multiple times. the ability to strike and remain concealed (via explosives) is very powerful, and the pure vision they give is such a tactical advantage I feel blind every time I go to a mission without one.
Skrimishers, from what I saw so far, are powerful damage sources and they just tell the action economy to screw itself with how many actions they can pull at one turn if you really want to. not to mention becoming a practical "alien ruler" on top level, is just awesome. enemy move? I shoot. enemy shoot? I shoot. give him some good ammo and go to town.
Templars are...intresting. Parry makes them gods at handling single strong enemies. if you luck out bladestrom on one, they become pure terrors once they rake up focus. stack deflect and reflect, and you got a fast-moving hard-hitting though nut to crack. you just gotta stack some focus first.

[Hunter Noventa]

Ok, got mods, started a new run.

Oh god, the hunter that starts out with grenade immunity and soulstealer is outright brutal. having him as my first chosen, if I couldn't get the drop on him, I never stood a chance.

Oh damn, Grenade Immunity is rough. My Assassin ignores Overwatch which is annoying enough, but immune to grenades? That's just cruel.

[Vitruviansquid]

So far I've come up with two strategies for fighting Chosen.

1. Take double grenadiers and just throw grenades at it until it's dead.

2. Take double rangers and just chop it to ribbons until it's dead.

If I ever meet a chosen that has both blast immunity and melee immunity, I'm pretty much screwed.

The more I fight these guys, the more I think the problem isn't hitting them hard, it's mobility.

[Rodin]

Huh, I don't really grenade the Chosen all that much. If I do, it's just to remove cover like I would any other unit. Shooting them in the face a few times works quite well, and flanking them with a Ranger is pretty effect for the damage burst you need.

I've hit my first campaign-ending bug - a Retaliation mission that crashes no matter what I do. I went back and re-finished the previous mission, I chose not to make the same upgrades I did before starting, I even re-verified my game files through Steam. It just crashes. I'm suspicious of the "steal an enemy unit" faction bonus I got - it's only the second mission since I got it and the only thing I haven't had yet while doing a Retaliation mission. Maybe it's trying to steal an invalid unit or something.

My options now are to try doing the Black Site to try and break the chain of events, but I don't think it'll work. I'll probably just start a new campaign and hope that this is an isolated bug.

[boomwolf]

Yes, mobility is king.

And dear god the hunter just zips around like crazy. if you are fighting on anyhting that ins't a flatland, he'll be flanking you practically non-stop with his grapple moves. the AI really knows how to make sue of them to continuously rotate good cover and good shooting lines in a way most your troops will simply never manage to keep up.




Honestly, I think the best advantage of the "lost and abandoned" mission is not only you get two factions without much hassle (mox is really easy to grab), but the fact you get the assassin as your assured first chosen.
Sure, she hurts. but going invis is the only real trick up her sleeve, and that is easy to counter with good positioning.
But the hunter? he's so godamn mobile. he is so good at shooting he gets a lot of hits even against full cover from large distances. he's a sharpshooter and a skrimisher fused.
And the warlock-easy mind control, and the possilibity to throw multiples?! you know how crazy it is to try to kill him with a four-man squad, when two of them are mind controlled?!