Stellaris II: I, For One, Welcome Our New Robot Fungus Hivemind Overlords

[factotum]

I really dislike this change. Cold homeworlds are strictly better than the rest.

I disagree there. It does you no good to have worlds full of minerals if you don't have enough people to run the mines, and you won't get those people if you don't have food. The continental etc. worlds, which are supposed to have plenty of food and a decent mix of mineral and energy resources, sound like the best ones to me.

[tonberrian]

Gonna at least try out cold homeworld robots to see how they shake out.

I might have to set up another version of my "all planets and tiles have resources" mod...

[Silverraptor]

To me, desert worlds sound like a good start up pop into robotics. Get the energy to build the robots and then send the robots to the cold planets for the extra minerals. Also, it doesn't say that only those kind of resources will spawn on those planets, just that more of it will appear instead. It sounds like it'll be easier to specialize planets based on type. And if terraforming keeps the original value of resources that first appeared on the planet, you can hold over some of the other planets in your territory and get the terraforming ascension perk and transform all the planets into the planets that your species is the best at.

[tonberrian]

Aw, dang. 1.8 patches out certain event leaders from leading factions or becoming rulers. No more Preythorn fleet queens as democratically elected leaders...

[Olinser]

I disagree there. It does you no good to have worlds full of minerals if you don't have enough people to run the mines, and you won't get those people if you don't have food. The continental etc. worlds, which are supposed to have plenty of food and a decent mix of mineral and energy resources, sound like the best ones to me.

Food and energy are FAR less impactful on the early game than minerals, food especially having some surplus food production gives very little benefit early compared to having enough minerals to colonize another planet.

Now if you're robotic a case can be made for Desert because you actually need an energy stockpile to build your population, but for any biological empire cold will be strictly superior to the other options.

Are the other options playable? Of course. But the extra minerals means that Cold starters will have a much steeper power curve.

[GloatingSwine]

Now if you're robotic a case can be made for Desert because you actually need an energy stockpile to build your population, but for any biological empire cold will be strictly superior to the other options.

Not any more. Robots will cost 100 Minerals in 1.8.

And yeah, Space Penguin Master Race, cold planets forever because the early game of Stellaris is hunt the minerals.

[Olinser]

Not any more. Robots will cost 100 Minerals in 1.8.

And yeah, Space Penguin Master Race, cold planets forever because the early game of Stellaris is hunt the minerals.

Ah. I missed that in the patch notes.

Yeah. Cold is unambiguously the best choice for all then.

Balance - how does it work?

[GloatingSwine]

Science has no way of knowing how to balance videogames.


Anyway, I'm spending the time waiting for 1.8 with the New Horizons mod, which even if you're not a fan of Star Trek is a very interesting conversion of Stellaris mechanics. It has a number of things I think would improve the base game (smaller fleets, a few more interesting buildings and choices associated with them) and seems a little better balanced combat wise because the ship designer is much more restrictive so you can't just stack armour trivially.

That said though, I am playing as the Krenim in a Delta Quadrant game, and this is a problem because despite the game rating them as "easy" they are not because they are right next to the Borg and they are not nice neighbours.

Also the Devore have stolen some good planets because I was too busy cannoning up to survive living next to Very Rude Cyborgs. I may have to crush them, they are Inferior to me, but I may also wait for the Borg to try and eat them so I can raid Unicomplex 01 whilst their fleet is away.

[Kaptin Keen]

So here's a thing.

I've foolishly entered into a defensive pact with a friendly neighborhood empire that keeps getting attacked by another couple of empires. And since I'm the weakest of the three of us, I keep dodging fights: Whenever they cross my borders, I cross theirs somewhere else, making them retreat.

In this way, the war is only really between two of the parties, while and I and the last one do an endless dance of not-fighting.

However, I just noticed they have invested hugely in point defence. Literally every ship - from battleships to frigates - has point defence and/or flak. And I have neither missiles nor fighters.

Also, they have strong shields and weak armor. And I'm sporting nothing but plasma cannon.

On the other hand though, they're three times my fleet strength.

Anyone wanna take odds on the fight? It's Ironman, and Hard, so there's really no going back. If they decimate me, I'll be limping through the rest of the game.

[GloatingSwine]

If you have heavy armour, and their weapons are bad against armour, you'll probably win quite handily. Ideally add one kinetic battery per ship on your side to break their shields without disrupting your plasma's ability to hurt them too badly.

[Kaptin Keen]

If you have heavy armour, and their weapons are bad against armour, you'll probably win quite handily. Ideally add one kinetic battery per ship on your side to break their shields without disrupting your plasma's ability to hurt them too badly.

Yea - sadly, what happened was they warped in right on top of my fleet, and shredded me like uncomfortable financial reports. Chalk it up to poor luck, I believe I could have won, if only barely.

[boomwolf]

Well, 1.8 pathnotes.

Time for the great mod purge.

Then wait a bit and start stockpiling mods again :P

[Silverraptor]

Reading patch notes. One thing stuck out to me in particular.

Hard difficulty is now a bit easier

I don't know why, but this one made me laugh.

Edit:

Uhhh... What does this mean?

- Paradise Dome, Cultural Center and Xeno Zoos now give citizen happiness instead of happiness

[Narkis]

Uhhh... What does this mean?

I assume they now count only for species with full citizenship rights.

[Silverraptor]

I assume they now count only for species with full citizenship rights.

Ah. That makes sense. Also this is funny!

- Unbidden will no longer deploy every single fleet they have to defend the portal against wandering Tiyanki

I had no idea those space cows could send the entire Unbidden into their spawn system. That is incredibly funny!

Edit: Oh yes. We knew this was coming.

- Fixed an exploit where initializers not meant for player empires (such as Fallen Empire ringworlds) could be used as home systems through text file editing

In other words, "Fixed this exploit because of ASpec YET AGAIN!!!"

[Guancyto]

I assume they now count only for species with full citizenship rights.

In retrospect, it was super weird that they would give happiness to your slaves and to populations that you were neutering/displacing.

"On the one hand yes, I'm being driven from my race's home planet to an uncertain future (possibly involving starvation and death) among the stars... on the other hand they built one hell of a zoo."

[Kaptin Keen]

Ok - something that always gives me pause: I can invest two trait points in improving my race (who are currently intelligent, non-adaptive and thrifty.

Which traits do everyone consider impactful? I'm leaning towards the two that improve leader levels and experience gain.

Edit: Wait ... what?!

So I was just fiddling with the controls, looking at the options for upgrading my race - while waiting for anyone to hopefully post interesting info here - and I randomly noticed that the cost for swapping climate preference is zero. Nothing. That beats the hell out of terraforming. Time to complete, likewise zero.

Obviously, I can't be the first to have spotted that. But still. Wow!

[GloatingSwine]

Ok - something that always gives me pause: I can invest two trait points in improving my race (who are currently intelligent, non-adaptive and thrifty.

Which traits do everyone consider impactful? I'm leaning towards the two that improve leader levels and experience gain.

By the point in the game you're looking at genemodding, Conservationist is one of the best trait picks. I'd bolt on Conservationist/Communal.

Leader levels/XP gain is much more useful early game than late when there are a lot of other leader level boosts available. (1.8 might change that).

Conservationist is still great though, and gets better the bigger your empire.


And yeah, terraforming is the worst way of getting new planets. Has been since forever. The only downside to genemodding to a new planet type is that it makes the Xenophobe faction salty.

[Kaptin Keen]

By the point in the game you're looking at genemodding, Conservationist is one of the best trait picks. I'd bolt on Conservationist/Communal.

Leader levels/XP gain is much more useful early game than late when there are a lot of other leader level boosts available. (1.8 might change that).

Conservationist is still great though, and gets better the bigger your empire.

Those were the other two I was considering - for precisely the reason you mention.

And yeah, terraforming is the worst way of getting new planets. Has been since forever. The only downside to genemodding to a new planet type is that it makes the Xenophobe faction salty.

I'm not sure I have one. I'll check. Hmm, I'm actually not sure. Is the 'Whetstone Initiative' a militarist faction, or a xenophobe faction? No clue, I'd say militarist. I have only three: Whetstone, science and pacifist.

But I can totally see it - the xenophobes getting all up in it because 'you turned our holy race into dirty aliens!' =)

Edit: I do like terraforming though. 'We chose to alter these planets and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard!' Seems the least I can do for my hard working populace. But now that I know I can just magically alter them to suit the environment (free of charge) instead of the other way around, I'm not so sure.

[GloatingSwine]

Terraforming will be better in 1.8 when gaia planets give +5% happiness, it'll be a great use of all that late game energy to gradually remake the galaxy.

Still, I don't even tend to genemod for habitability because unless I'm Fanatic Purifiers I'll have conquered some aliens who can colonise for me.

[Kaptin Keen]

Terraforming will be better in 1.8 when gaia planets give +5% happiness, it'll be a great use of all that late game energy to gradually remake the galaxy.

Still, I don't even tend to genemod for habitability because unless I'm Fanatic Purifiers I'll have conquered some aliens who can colonise for me.

You feel no loyalty to your imaginary pixel people? I do.

Equal opportunities is all fine and good, and I never fail to set default rights to decent living standards, full citizenship and so on for all races. But I still tailor the galaxy to the benefit of my own race.

[Eldan]

I use habitats for my ruling population. Problem solved, the rest are mining slaves anyway.

[GloatingSwine]

You feel no loyalty to your imaginary pixel people? I do.

Equal opportunities is all fine and good, and I never fail to set default rights to decent living standards, full citizenship and so on for all races. But I still tailor the galaxy to the benefit of my own race.

Nope.

All species will be integrated into and given the full benefits of the Greater Freedom and Happiness Co-Prosperity Sphere. Whether they like it or not.

[Narkis]

The only right answer is to give your people brand-new shiny metallic bodies. Every piece of rock is the same when you don't need to breath.

[Silverraptor]

Wow. I didn't know about the genemodding. I've been terraforming every planet in my territory ever since. Even had a system in place for what planet to terraform into. 20 spaces of less world gets turned into the planet my species started on. 21-25 get turned into Gaia worlds. Of course I only terraformed when my energy credits were maxed so I'd spend them on a terraform and not waste the energy credit income.

[Kaptin Keen]

Wow. I didn't know about the genemodding. I've been terraforming every planet in my territory ever since. Even had a system in place for what planet to terraform into. 20 spaces of less world gets turned into the planet my species started on. 21-25 get turned into Gaia worlds. Of course I only terraformed when my energy credits were maxed so I'd spend them on a terraform and not waste the energy credit income.

Right? I mean, so I can either pay 5000 credits and wait for 6 years - or snap my fingers, transform one pop on my home planet into whatever I need, and go settle worlds with 100% climate match.

Honestly, that has to be an oversight =D

(Edit: I know it doesn't quite work like that - that you can't specifically transform one pop)
(Edit2: But I bet you could transform your entire population, send one off to colonize - then transform the rest back)

[tonberrian]

IIRC, it is, and it will be fixed in 1.8. Enjoy your easy genemodding for the time being.

[boomwolf]

Nope.

All species will be integrated into and given the full benefits of the Greater Freedom and Happiness Co-Prosperity Sphere. Whether they like it or not.

That's an odd way of saying they are going to become nutrient paste.

[Silverraptor]

Hey guys. Need clarification on robot pops. What stage can you send them to populate other planets? Can they be sent in colony ships as robots, or do they need to be atleast droids?

[tonberrian]

Hey guys. Need clarification on robot pops. What stage can you send them to populate other planets? Can they be sent in colony ships as robots, or do they need to be atleast droids?

Droids, I think. That's when it started working for me.