bonobos and chimps?

[halfeye]

What happens when a bonobo crosses the Congo river? Or a chimpanzee in the other direction?

Do chimps have STDs? I'm told bonobos don't, presumably because the population's too small.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Do chimps have STDs?

SIV.

Grey Wolf

[halfeye]

SIV.

Grey Wolf

I thought there was something, I didn't remember what, look what humanity has though (not that it's big or clever to have STIs, just that it implies that humanity has been doing very well for a very long time).

[Leewei]

Here's an article that answers part of your question:

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal...tcallback=true

Apparently bonobos and chimps either do not or cannot interbreed.

[hamishspence]

I googled it and did get some references to bonobo/chimp hybrids in zoos. In the wild their territories don't overlap though. It's possible that it only ever happened in zoos - with the hybrids having reduced fertility.

[halfeye]

Here's an article that answers part of your question:

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal...tcallback=true

Apparently bonobos and chimps either do not or cannot interbreed.

Do they however have sexual relationships, and pass about diseases?

My initial hypothesis is that sexual expression is restricted by the presence of VD. Humans are currently in the process of eliminating VD, bonobos don't have it, chimps have it hard. Humans may be in the process of transitioning to a bonobo like lifestyle.

[Anymage]

In highly sex-positive communities, herpes is something that everybody just accepts is all over the place. I wouldn't have any way of knowing if bonobo-herpes is a thing that exists. Since the disease is an inconvenience more than something seriously damaging or fatal, it would pass around like wildfire in a bonobo-like environment. Because as mentioned above, it does.

AIDS in the gay community spread so quickly, largely in part because the community at the time was so small and so tight-knit. Assuming pre-smartphone dating, people usually slept with other people in a clearly defined clique with little cross-clique dating. So if a disease started spreading amongst a clique I wasn't part of, I'd be largely safe. (As an added feature, once the disease started spreading amongst one clique, members would have a harder time having outgroup dalliances.) If bonobo AIDS happened to become a thing, it would infect large communities in short order.

Which is why I think it's safe to say that there's no causative arrow that would cause us to be "more bonobo like". Bonobo AIDS doesn't exist because if it did, those apes would have been wiped out long ago and would be just another fossil curiosity. But historical luck as to whether or not a disease had evolved doesn't mean anything other than historical luck.

[halfeye]

In highly sex-positive communities, herpes is something that everybody just accepts is all over the place. I wouldn't have any way of knowing if bonobo-herpes is a thing that exists. Since the disease is an inconvenience more than something seriously damaging or fatal, it would pass around like wildfire in a bonobo-like environment. Because as mentioned above, it does.

AIDS in the gay community spread so quickly, largely in part because the community at the time was so small and so tight-knit. Assuming pre-smartphone dating, people usually slept with other people in a clearly defined clique with little cross-clique dating. So if a disease started spreading amongst a clique I wasn't part of, I'd be largely safe. (As an added feature, once the disease started spreading amongst one clique, members would have a harder time having outgroup dalliances.) If bonobo AIDS happened to become a thing, it would infect large communities in short order.

Which is why I think it's safe to say that there's no causative arrow that would cause us to be "more bonobo like". Bonobo AIDS doesn't exist because if it did, those apes would have been wiped out long ago and would be just another fossil curiosity. But historical luck as to whether or not a disease had evolved doesn't mean anything other than historical luck.

Luck is highly related to probability. The bonobo population is so small, that the probability of a species specific disease becoming established is almost nil. I think there is a chance humans will eradicate disease (not tomorrow), I think we probably need some bacteria, and there may even be some viruses that are useful, but there are some others that can go the way of smallpox as far as I'm concerned.

[snowblizz]

I think we probably need some bacteria,

Our bodies are filled with bacteria we need to be healthy (I'm not sure but I've heard they outnumber our own cells... or somethign like that). Maybe not going so far to actually functioning at all, but it might be clsoe. E.g. the appendix is thought to be safe haven for important gut bacteria and all those health drinks with bacteria (no where near as useful as their commercials want to make it) aren't totally quackery. IIRC also the broader fauna of bacteria you had in the gut the better, was mention in a documentary about food. Eating varied foods gives more bacterial variety.
There used to be pills of fecal matter you were given to restore gutflora in like WW1 and WW2, I think they were actually beneficial.
Similarly I broadly recall somekind of blanket "good" bacteria inhibits growth of the really bad ones, e.g. on the skin.
In the same way IIRC you are given a starter-kit of bacteria in the womb and on your way out (so yes, a cesarion means you miss some important stuff apparently).

So yes, as far as I can recall we definitely need some bacteria we are used to functioning with.

[Knaight]

Our bodies are filled with bacteria we need to be healthy (I'm not sure but I've heard they outnumber our own cells... or somethign like that).

They outnumber our cells, but it's worth noting that prokaryotic cells are vastly smaller than eukaryotic cells (roughly 0.1% the mass) and that human cells have several of what are effectively bacterial cells inside them.