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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Wasn't that sort of the point? Theyre emulating an ineffectual government that was so corrupt and ineffective that corporations had more power than entire planets.
    Point taken. Though I think they're actively, if not knowingly, trying to be even more ineffectual by shying away from anything that could resemble the Empire, even if it may be a good idea.
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    It would be nice to just change the title of this thread to be "stuff about Jedi"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Point taken. Though I think they're actively, if not knowingly, trying to be even more ineffectual by shying away from anything that could resemble the Empire, even if it may be a good idea.
    Basically:

    "better inefficiency and money wastage, than let Coruscant's domination, that began with the Republic and peaked with the Empire, continue."
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    The problem is, while that may have been the plan, they just look so frelling stupid. Seriously. Your government was so incompetent that a glorified terrorist organization built a weapon that snaps the established tech level over it's knee. I don't feel sorry for you. And the books make me feel you had it coming
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackhawk748 View Post
    The problem is, while that may have been the plan, they just look so frelling stupid. Seriously. Your government was so incompetent that a glorified terrorist organization built a weapon that snaps the established tech level over it's knee. I don't feel sorry for you. And the books make me feel you had it coming
    The founders of the First Order snuck into the Unknown Regions to rebuild, and managed to remain secret for the next 20+ years.

    They then had their agents convince a few Republic worlds secede, forming a tiny Separatist state calling itself the First Order (the only thing the Republic knows about - they have no reason to believe there's a huge Unknown Regions state).

    So the Republic mistakes regarding the First Order in the time period between Bloodline and TFA, don't bother me so much. Thrawn's state, the Empire of the Hand, managed to remain secret from the Rebellion/New Republic for nearly 20 years in Legends, too, before Luke and Mara discovered it.

    Complete Locations (newcanon version) makes it clear that the initial stages of Starkiller Base (its discovery, and the first experimentation with its kyber crystals) took place under the aegis of the Empire - the First Order just inherited the Empire's work and built on it.
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    From someone who began reading the EU in the 90s, it wasn't surprising to me at least, that Thrawn would bring a Star Destroyer to the capture Luke op. Zahn's first book came out in 1991 and was essentially the beginning of the EU. At that point in time, Star Destroyers were the iconic imperial ship and were the main vessels used by the empire....for everything. The Battle of Endor for instance, featured only Star Destroyers and the SSD (with a couple of other ships being added by later novels). I actually don't remember seeing an Imperial Capital Ship other than Star Destroyers (and the SSD) in movies IV-VI. They used that **** for everything. As the Empire was always presented as a monolithic evil, their reliance on a singular threatening ship made sense storywise, whereas the Alliance's reliance on their hodgepodge of Corvettes, Frigates, and Cruisers likewise made sense storywise.
    I'd also accept commandeering another SD, or at the very least not giving Luke its real name. Even if he's confident the Rebels won't recognise the name, Luke is on his way to Jomark, and C'Baoth definately will if it ever comes up.

    The capital ships were used in the movies were mostly doing things you'd expect capital ships to do, heavy combat, blockades, or chasing that one critically important ship. But the whole point of this ambush is to play it off as coincidence, which means Luke either blew up a really important freighter, or there's more to the story, and either way staging it as a coincidence doesn't really work for me.

    Ideally, we'd have Thrawn coming to the ambush with three or four smaller ships that nonetheless are more than sufficient for an ordinary fighter/freighter. This would also make it more plausible that he can't waste the time to hunt Luke down, because he wouldn't have already wasted the time of his flagship during a war where everyone keeps stressing that the Empire is critically shorthanded.

    It's a great scene and everything, but as far as staging it as a coincidence goes it doesn't really make sense.

    Can't imagine the type of person who would willingly subject themselves to the Aftermath novels. Comparing them to food: The Aftermath Novels are dog pissed on brownies made half of dirt, while the Zahn novels are made of a fine quality chocolate cake, that is worth every bite. The books have low ratings on Amazon.
    I've only read Life Debt. They're not as bad as they're reputed to be, but not fantastic reads either.

    Moving the capital didn't bother me. Governments do move, although usually when they're pushed out due to war or some other disaster.

    Not noticing Starkiller base was a problem, though. Although if the capital was a space station, that would make the First Order's trump card completely redundant.

    Anyway, CH21:

    Mara is summoned to Karrde, as Han and Lando are on route. Holding Luke captive is likely to be a bit awkward on this account, so he's being moved cell to somewhere more discreet. Mara sensibly wants them planetside as little as possible, but Karrde takes his obligations seriously, including those of his underlings. Or else he's just messing with Mara for fun. Either way, they have to move Luke so he doesn't make things awkward, while Karrde is figuring out why Thrawn wants him so badly. Everyone on site that knows about him is being moved to other duties, and Mara has to move his cell.

    So she goes to visit. He's dressed the same as he had been 'that day in Jabba's palace.' Interesting. I'd assumed Mara was an Imperial, but she was on Jabba's barge? So... someone belonging to her was killed when the gang sank it? Bounty hunter? Or maybe she's a Rancor enthusiast?

    Luke is fairly compliant when being moved. Mara searches the storeroom briefly and then disables the inside lock before leaving.

    Alone, Luke decides that since this cell was improvised, it's a better bet that he can escape somehow. Lockpicking requires a power source, so he goes looking for one along the walls. He eventually finds a power socket, and improvises a screwdriver to take off the cover, Discovering R2 next door, but restrained so he can't help. He pulls wire from the socket trying to reach the door, but in the process accidentally touches one and discovers that the socket is dead. Which means no lockpicking.

    Unless, of course, you have a robotic hand with its own power. He's not sure how to mess with it, but R2 is there for a quick tutorial.

    We learn a bit more about Mara, and Luke makes a fair attempt at an improvised escape. Karrde is forced to improvise, since it would be kind of awkward to negotiate with Han with Luke locked in the other room. Unfortunate. We'll see how this plays out.

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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Mara wasnt on Jabba's Barge; but Jabba's Palace.

    Everyone who was on the Barge xploded good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cikomyr View Post
    Mara wasnt on Jabba's Barge; but Jabba's Palace.

    Everyone who was on the Barge xploded good.

    Not everybody (according to Tales from Jabba's Palace, a few people, including the Max Rebo Band, managed to get off the barge before it blew)- but yes, Mara was not on the Barge during Jabba's attempt at feeding our heroes to the Sarlacc.
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    Not everybody (according to Tales from Jabba's Palace, a few people, including the Max Rebo Band, managed to get off the barge before it blew)- but yes, Mara was not on the Barge during Jabba's attempt at feeding our heroes to the Sarlacc.
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    I know. I was just trying to set the record straight regarding Mara's absence on the Barge without hinting that its an important backstory point

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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Fair enough.
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapphire Guard View Post
    Either way, they have to move Luke so he doesn't make things awkward, while Karrde is figuring out why Thrawn wants him so badly.
    Wait, it's a mystery why a major figure in the Imperial Remnant would want to capture a major figure in the New Republic? Just how little does Karrde know?

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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Lethologica View Post
    Wait, it's a mystery why a major figure in the Imperial Remnant would want to capture a major figure in the New Republic? Just how little does Karrde know?
    But why NOW?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cikomyr View Post
    But why NOW?
    Why NOT now? And how would Karrde know that it has only come up now?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lethologica View Post
    Wait, it's a mystery why a major figure in the Imperial Remnant would want to capture a major figure in the New Republic? Just how little does Karrde know?
    Mostly cuz Luke isnt actually super important beyond being a symbol, kinda like Han. Capturing Lea would make way more sense. A Jedi....less so.
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Lethologica View Post
    Wait, it's a mystery why a major figure in the Imperial Remnant would want to capture a major figure in the New Republic? Just how little does Karrde know?
    I think it's a valid question, because there could be any number of reasons WHY, and the specific reason could be valuable currency if Karde can learn it. If Thrawn wants Luke to drain his blood and use it to power up an ancient Murder Dodecahedron superweapon, that's different than if he wants Luke as the living key to unlock a vault full of Jedi artifacts, or if he wants to interrogate him for secrets about New Republic leadership, or if he just wants the best possible opponent for a really resounding game of space chess.
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    I think it's a valid question, because there could be any number of reasons WHY, and the specific reason could be valuable currency if Karde can learn it. If Thrawn wants Luke to drain his blood and use it to power up an ancient Murder Dodecahedron superweapon, that's different than if he wants Luke as the living key to unlock a vault full of Jedi artifacts, or if he wants to interrogate him for secrets about New Republic leadership, or if he just wants the best possible opponent for a really resounding game of space chess.
    Space chess? Really? This isn't Star Trek.

    It's laser chess.
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    It would be nice to just change the title of this thread to be "stuff about Jedi"

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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    It's laser chess.
    Excuse me, this is Star Wars. It's Holo chess.

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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Lethologica View Post
    Why NOT now? And how would Karrde know that it has only come up now?
    Because the Empire only recently sent out a bounty on Skywalker's head?

    Thats the entire point pf this plot point. The bounty is recent, and Karrde knows the Empire dont just suddenly wake up and put a 500,000 credit bounty on someone just because.

    There has to be a rationale.

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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    I think it's a valid question, because there could be any number of reasons WHY, and the specific reason could be valuable currency if Karde can learn it. If Thrawn wants Luke to drain his blood and use it to power up an ancient Murder Dodecahedron superweapon, that's different than if he wants Luke as the living key to unlock a vault full of Jedi artifacts, or if he wants to interrogate him for secrets about New Republic leadership, or if he just wants the best possible opponent for a really resounding game of space chess.
    This isn't fully right. Karrde wants to know because Karrde has an obsession with information and having secrets, especially secrets that can worth a considerable amount of money. First and foremost, Karrde is an information broker while being a smuggler second. Reread the sections with Karrde up to this point, take note of how many times Karrde does something that will get him information but not money. Money is certainly valuable to him, but Information is more.

    Regarding Capitals, Having Coruscant or Imperial City makes the New Republic the legitimate government. They were able to take the Empire's capital away after all, and when there is only one government on the scene, then this counts big time. None of the warlords, moffs, or anybody else who broke from the Empire can claim Authority over what is Imperial space without owning Imperial City.

    I think there is a story in the "Tales from Jabba's Palace" that features a persona that is supposed to be Mara Jade during her time there. I can't recall the name of it though. She later shows up in one of the Karrde stories from the Tales from the Empire/Tales from the New Republic. She meets and gets hired up by Karrde at the end of it.

    One thing I don't recall being covered; does Luke know the language of droids that R2 uses? I know the character in both Knights of the Old Republic understands the language. Was it ever stated before this point? Or did Luke just pick it up in some fashion?

    I have an image of Luke trying to figure out words from R2, while R2 applies some kind of shock tool when Luke gets it wrong. It would make you learn a language faster if pain were applied.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cikomyr View Post
    Because the Empire only recently sent out a bounty on Skywalker's head?

    Thats the entire point pf this plot point. The bounty is recent, and Karrde knows the Empire dont just suddenly wake up and put a 500,000 credit bounty on someone just because.

    There has to be a rationale.
    That just means that the Empire only recently cared to let bounty hunters in on the fun. Really, having a bounty out for Luke seems quite natural for the Imperial Remnant given their position, and the stranger state of affairs was the one before a bounty was put out. Either way, though, the idea that bringing bounty hunters into things indicates anything significant about the Imperial Remnant seems to be overstating the relevance of bounty hunters, even before we recall that the actual reason (as presented) for bringing in bounty hunters is merely not wanting to waste a few weeks hunting down Luke's ship.

    By the way, this only highlights the strangeness Sapphire Guard previously pointed out--sure, putting out the call to bounty hunters might save Thrawn's organization some valuable resources, but having Luke in the hands of a bounty hunter is no substitute for having him in your own hands. The whole operation is a waste if the first guy who happens on Luke has second thoughts about delivering him to the Imperial Remnant, or if he fumbles the ball and Luke gets away. Worse than a waste, considering intelligence revealed. And far be it from me to speculate about how events will turn out in a thread where most people already know the answer, but it certainly seems like Luke's opportunity for counterplay only exists because of the decision to get bounty hunters involved.

    If Karrde just wants information for information's sake, fine. I just don't buy the idea that there's anything obviously weird about the Imperial Remnant putting a bounty on Luke at any time.
    Last edited by Lethologica; 2017-10-22 at 01:52 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by russdm View Post
    I think there is a story in the "Tales from Jabba's Palace" that features a persona that is supposed to be Mara Jade during her time there. I can't recall the name of it though. She later shows up in one of the Karrde stories from the Tales from the Empire/Tales from the New Republic. She meets and gets hired up by Karrde at the end of it.
    Yup - those are
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    "Sleight of Hand" (her alias in that is Arica) and"First Contact" in Tales from the Empire (her alias in that is Celina Marniss).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lethologica View Post
    If Karrde just wants information for information's sake, fine. I just don't buy the idea that there's anything obviously weird about the Imperial Remnant putting a bounty on Luke at any time.
    The Empire doesn't actually care for bounty hunters, as seen in ESB, and only uses bounties when they need to capture someone in a hurry and don't have a lead on them, like in ESB. So the Empire suddenly putting out a bounty on Luke suggests that the Empire needs him for some reason and can't get at him themselves. Add in that the bounty is on Luke and not, as far as I can recall, on Han or Leia or Wedge or other prominent Republic figures suggests that there's something special about Luke. This is what triggers Karde's curiosity.

    As for Thrawn allowing it and all of the oddities around his going out to capture Luke and then not even detailing any Imperial resources to hunt him down, it seems to me that Thrawn is aiming for efficiency here and not caring that much about the minor curiosities that the moves make. As already stated, having an ISD escort an Interdictor on its runs isn't much of a surprise. Even if they figure out that it was Thrawn's flagship, that's a minor curiosity that might trigger some pondering, but only after it's too late. Thrawn obviously expected the capture to work, and thus would either have prevented Luke from reaching Jomark or given him sufficient reasons to explain the oddity, and so Luke's telling C'boath wouldn't be an issue. After it fails, Thrawn has to get back to his more important plans that he needs his resources for, and most bounty hunters won't think like Karrde and wonder why the bounty is getting placed now. In fact, they'll likely take the reasoning presented in the thread and think "Of COURSE they want Luke!". But seeing the weirdness requires understanding Imperial psychology and looking up all of the other bounties, too, which many won't do. So it would be another curiosity that most people will ignore.

    One of Thrawn's weaknesses seems to be that he doesn't expect others to be able to put together the threads he leaves behind to oppose him, but Karrde, as seen here, is one of the few who can at least follow enough of them to be an issue.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russdm View Post
    One thing I don't recall being covered; does Luke know the language of droids that R2 uses? I know the character in both Knights of the Old Republic understands the language. Was it ever stated before this point? Or did Luke just pick it up in some fashion?
    C3PO had to translate R2's speech for Luke in ANH. Him and R2 conversed more directly in ESB and RotJ, but while Luke was in his X-Wing I always got the impression that he was reading a translation of R2's speech on the ship's display screen. They conversed a bit on Dagobah without an obvious aid, although it's hard to say whether Luke was actively understanding R2's speech there or just reacting to R2's general tone to get a rough gist of what he was saying - and whether he was meant to be doing the latter, but the writing/direction/acting made it seem more like the former. I don't recall the EU stating that he'd learned the droid language (although it's a long time since I read any of it) but I feel like from that point it was then just treated like he can directly understand it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russdm View Post
    One thing I don't recall being covered; does Luke know the language of droids that R2 uses? I know the character in both Knights of the Old Republic understands the language. Was it ever stated before this point? Or did Luke just pick it up in some fashion?

    I have an image of Luke trying to figure out words from R2, while R2 applies some kind of shock tool when Luke gets it wrong. It would make you learn a language faster if pain were applied.
    Well, he converses quite a bit with R2 in Empire Strikes Back, so I think it's implied that he learned at least the gist of what R2 was saying somewhere in the years after A New Hope.


    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
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    Yup - those are "Sleight of Hand" (her alias in that is Arica) and"First Contact" in Tales from the Empire (her alias in that is Celina Marniss).
    It may not directly be a spoiler, but
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    the fact that Mara Jade is the kind of person who operates under numerous aliases
    could be construed as spoiling the nature of what she does.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Velaryon View Post
    It may not directly be a spoiler, but
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    the fact that Mara Jade is the kind of person who operates under numerous aliases
    could be construed as spoiling the nature of what she does.

    Amended then.
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    The founders of the First Order snuck into the Unknown Regions to rebuild, and managed to remain secret for the next 20+ years.

    They then had their agents convince a few Republic worlds secede, forming a tiny Separatist state calling itself the First Order (the only thing the Republic knows about - they have no reason to believe there's a huge Unknown Regions state).
    Huh... this finally makes some sense. Thanks, now I can look forward to Ep 8 a bit more.

    Because the Empire only recently sent out a bounty on Skywalker's head?

    Thats the entire point pf this plot point. The bounty is recent, and Karrde knows the Empire dont just suddenly wake up and put a 500,000 credit bounty on someone just because.
    I don't think it's the bounty timing that's so important, that could easily just be 'we happen to know he's vulnerable right now', I think it's Thrawn doing things like harvesting hundreds of Ysalamiri that is making Karrde interested, because that's a lot more than you need for one Jedi.

    As for Thrawn allowing it and all of the oddities around his going out to capture Luke and then not even detailing any Imperial resources to hunt him down, it seems to me that Thrawn is aiming for efficiency here and not caring that much about the minor curiosities that the moves make. As already stated, having an ISD escort an Interdictor on its runs isn't much of a surprise. Even if they figure out that it was Thrawn's flagship, that's a minor curiosity that might trigger some pondering, but only after it's too late. Thrawn obviously expected the capture to work, and thus would either have prevented Luke from reaching Jomark or given him sufficient reasons to explain the oddity, and so Luke's telling C'boath wouldn't be an issue. After it fails, Thrawn has to get back to his more important plans that he needs his resources for, and most bounty hunters won't think like Karrde and wonder why the bounty is getting placed now. In fact, they'll likely take the reasoning presented in the thread and think "Of COURSE they want Luke!". But seeing the weirdness requires understanding Imperial psychology and looking up all of the other bounties, too, which many won't do. So it would be another curiosity that most people will ignore.
    The whole point of the expendable freighter was that this could be staged to look like an accident. Having an ISD and an Interdictor there undermines that, because it's unlikely that much firepower is necessary for just any old cargo freighter. Either way, it's likely to result in an investigation, either 'how did they know I was coming?' or 'what the hell was so important about that freighter'?

    C'Baoth knows the Chimaera is Thrawn's personal ship, so there's no way he'll buy that it was some kind of happy accident if he hears the name from either an escaped or captured Luke.

    The thing about the bounty hunters is that it seems pretty strange that Thrawn could spare his own flagship for this hunt, but not any lesser ships to continue the hunt especially as any bounty hunter without Ysalamiri is likely to have a lot of trouble containing Luke if they do find him. If he's so stretched for resources, why bring the flagship, especially as it makes his ruse much less convincing? If he's not, why not send some of his own ships to continue the hunt? Any bounty hunter without ysalamiri (ie. all of them other than Karrde) is going to have trouble keeping Luke captured if they did find him. It's hard to reconcile this into something that makes much sense.

    CH22:

    Han finishes his presentation on the merits of running cargo for the republic. Karrde listens politely, then informs Han that his business interests in both Empire and Republic space mean that he's not in a position to take sides. This makes sense. Han then asks about the slicer he doesn't need any more, and Karrde asks him to stay for dinner to meet his.

    They head in , meet some of his associates including Mara and the slicer, who regales them with an old story of Han taking over a slave ship and freeing everyone-Chewbacca isn't a fan of slavery. Karrde is interrupted to take a call, and Lando feels he recognises Mara. They wonder what to do, and keep eating while they figure it out.

    Just to make things more awkward, Admiral Thrawn has chosen this moment to show up for more Ysalamiri, so he says at least. Karrde takes this with truly impressive calm under the circumstances . Thrawn is coming to visit directly, as soon as possible. He wonders if Mara called them and she says she hasn't. Thrawn also says he's looking for warships, which Karrde doesn't react to with an effort, which means he has some or knows where to get them.

    Thrawn tries to catch him in a contradiction re the search for Luke, but he seems to be able to cover himself. Thrawn is visiting in person, and Karrde excuses himself to prepare.

    The news is stressful, as you might imagine. Mara asks whether he could turn over Han and Lando, Karrde correctly calls that a bad idea with a Star Destroyer directly overhead.

    'I doubt Thrawn would be coming down himself if he thought there was the possibility of a firefight.' Hrm, he didn't take that viewpoint on Wayland, so I'm not so sure.

    According to this book, Luke doesn't fully understand R2 outside the X Wing, but he can get the gist. He gets the door open and sneaks into the woods. He narrowly avoids being seen by Mara and three men with guns. He tries for his X Wing but finds it has been moved, so has no choice but to take one of Karrde's other fighters.

    Mara is done with organising and decides to check on Luke, a bit upset that she hasn't killed him already. She hears the fighter lift off and doublechecks Luke's cell to find him gone. She can't call for help in case the Imperials hear, so she has no choice but to go after him herself in the other fighter.

    Well, that was tense. Took some willpower not to keep reading. Karrde is brilliantly composed under extreme pressure, Luke takes his chance and goes, although escaping an ISD will be tricky. The burning question now: How much does Thrawn know?

  26. - Top - End - #296
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapphire Guard View Post
    The whole point of the expendable freighter was that this could be staged to look like an accident. Having an ISD and an Interdictor there undermines that, because it's unlikely that much firepower is necessary for just any old cargo freighter. Either way, it's likely to result in an investigation, either 'how did they know I was coming?' or 'what the hell was so important about that freighter'?
    Having the Interdictor there was strictly necessary, because otherwise Luke would have just flown right through in hyperspace and never noticed. Or possibly arrived and immediately hyper-jumped out again if this was actually a planned stop on his route, I don't quite recall. An Interdictor's primary ability is to pull ships out of hyper and prevent them from re-entering, making an area where hyperspace functionally doesn't exist, and Thrawn had to have that ability present for the ambush to have any hope of working.

    Interdictors don't have much in the way of combat ability because of how much power their hyperspace denial costs, so they need an escort to protect them. Thus, a standard Interdictor deployment includes a powerful escort, such as a Star Destroyer.

    So, for plausibility concerns, the presence of the Interdictor automatically explains the presence of the ISD. What needs explaining is why the Interdictor was there, and there are only two options for that: they're trying to catch a specific important ship, or they're trying to blockade something. I don't think the location and situation lent itself to the blockade explanation, at least not to the degree of obviousness that could possibly outweigh the immediate "they're here for me, duh" reaction, so presenting some kind of other ship as their target was pretty much their only option.

    In sum, plausibility might be stretched a bit, but Thrawn didn't have any better options that fit the absolute requirements of the mission.
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  27. - Top - End - #297
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Douglas View Post
    Interdictors don't have much in the way of combat ability because of how much power their hyperspace denial costs, so they need an escort to protect them. Thus, a standard Interdictor deployment includes a powerful escort, such as a Star Destroyer.
    Yup - this is normally the case in the newcanon too. In Heir to the Jedi, Luke gets ambushed in the armed yacht he's flying, by an Interdictor that doesn't have escorts - just 24 TIE fighters. He notes the unusualness of this, and concludes that the Empire must be frantic to find the Rebels if it sent the ship (a production-discontinued model, but still useful) out without anything heavier backing it up.
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  28. - Top - End - #298
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    I think the Freighter and interdictor with look bit is intended mainly as a double-blind against C'Baoth, since it presents the deception that Luke wasn't the target. That way, Thrawn wouldn't be revealed as having acted against CB.

    Wish that Lando was utilized more than he is. Like seeing Lando playing more Sabac or engaging in more of what he is pretty famous for. I feel that Lando could have contributed more to the plot rather than just tag along with Han more as a driver than anything. It feels like that Lando has more important matters with Han taking a more pro-active role.

    I liked Heir to the Jedi, since it featured Luke and was one of the good books of the NewCanon, of which I have read quite a bit with a few bombs. That they are copying in the best material from the Legends in some form is nice. Simply wish they did more.

    Karrde is basing his view of Thrawn's reasoning probably on what Karrde knows, which seems to be way more than the New Republic. He seems to misjudge Thrawn some.

    As a character, I happen to like Karrde a lot. It was nice seeing him appear in the other stories that he does. Especially the one with the selling paint bit.
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  29. - Top - End - #299
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Douglas View Post
    Having the Interdictor there was strictly necessary, because otherwise Luke would have just flown right through in hyperspace and never noticed. Or possibly arrived and immediately hyper-jumped out again if this was actually a planned stop on his route, I don't quite recall.
    He was yanked out early (20 light years).



    Quote Originally Posted by Douglas View Post
    So, for plausibility concerns, the presence of the Interdictor automatically explains the presence of the ISD. What needs explaining is why the Interdictor was there, and there are only two options for that: they're trying to catch a specific important ship, or they're trying to blockade something. I don't think the location and situation lent itself to the blockade explanation, at least not to the degree of obviousness that could possibly outweigh the immediate "they're here for me, duh" reaction, so presenting some kind of other ship as their target was pretty much their only option.

    In sum, plausibility might be stretched a bit, but Thrawn didn't have any better options that fit the absolute requirements of the mission.
    Luke himself think's it is a coincidence. It's important to note that at this time, the Republic doesn't know about Thrawn yet, much less how effective he actually is.
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  30. - Top - End - #300
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    Default Re: Reading Heir to the Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapphire Guard View Post
    The whole point of the expendable freighter was that this could be staged to look like an accident. Having an ISD and an Interdictor there undermines that, because it's unlikely that much firepower is necessary for just any old cargo freighter. Either way, it's likely to result in an investigation, either 'how did they know I was coming?' or 'what the hell was so important about that freighter'?
    As others have pointed out, an unescorted Interdictor would raise more questions. And we know that with the Empire's resources dwindling a bit that an ISD might be what they can spare, and also that Interdictors are now so valuable that losing one would be devastating. So it being escorted by an ISD isn't all that puzzling.

    C'Baoth knows the Chimaera is Thrawn's personal ship, so there's no way he'll buy that it was some kind of happy accident if he hears the name from either an escaped or captured Luke.
    Thrawn expected to be successful, and certainly had a plan in mind for how he was going to deal with that if he succeeded. If he failed, then yes C'Baoth might have made the connection, but it would only raise suspicions and not be a sign of complete disloyalty.

    The thing about the bounty hunters is that it seems pretty strange that Thrawn could spare his own flagship for this hunt, but not any lesser ships to continue the hunt especially as any bounty hunter without Ysalamiri is likely to have a lot of trouble containing Luke if they do find him. If he's so stretched for resources, why bring the flagship, especially as it makes his ruse much less convincing? If he's not, why not send some of his own ships to continue the hunt? Any bounty hunter without ysalamiri (ie. all of them other than Karrde) is going to have trouble keeping Luke captured if they did find him. It's hard to reconcile this into something that makes much sense.
    Luke is an important enough prisoner that Thrawn wanted to be there personally, but he does have other plans in motion and can't spare any resources for the longer search for Luke. Yes, what he's doing risks dropping some red flags and maybe failing, but the other parts of his plan are now more crucial than capturing Luke.
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