Mind Over Matter: A Guide to the 5e Mystic

[carrdrivesyou]

Also cuts into the mechanical novelty of it. Though it's too soon to really say, I'm somewhat concerned that, say, the psionic warrior won't feel meaningfully distinct from the eldritch knight in play, etc. We already have seven full classes and additional subclasses of spell slot users. Would rather see a different mechanic myself, but so be it.

This is exactly what I feel. The appeal for me is the different mechanic. It's an entirely different approach than the rest of the classes. Honestly, I'm sick of seeing more subclasses being added in. The novelty of the idea has worn off. It's like adding more class archetypes in pathfinder. It isn't the same as a new class entirely. While we will be gaining the Psion, it will be the same as the others in mechanic. Which is not as appealing. In this case, why didn't the Artificer get it's own class? It had two subclasses that were both interesting, but lacked in core components. I worry that they are cutting too many options away from the Psion to really appeal to anyone.

I honestly like the life-fuelled giga-laser idea.

This made me chuckle. Definitely gonna use this next time I play a Mystic.

You have a limit on the number of psi points you can spend, not on the number of hit points you can spend. And Consumptive Power is very clear in that it is not converting Hit Points to Psi Points, but rather you are spending entirely and directly from your HP pool. The fact that you can't use Psi Points and must ONLY cast from HP, and the fact that you can only do this once per long rest strongly implies it's meant to be potentially powerful but risky given it lowers your hit point maximum along with the damage itself.

Your interpretation would make it completely and utterly pointless. As there would be almost no scenario in which you would WANT to use it.

As for Radiant beam, all other attack powers have a built in cap in the power, even ignoring the psi limit general rule. Radiant Beam does not, so once you find a way around the general rule.... like with Consumptive Power. You can push it as high as you deem safe.

RAW, you are correct. The specific verbiage does state Psi Points, not hit points. RAI however, I would say that the Psi Limit is supposed to remain a hard cap for Consumptive Power. Otherwise, as soon as you hit 10th level, you would unlock a life powered death beam that would outright destroy a Dracolich. That is a bit much methinks...

Overall, it really depends on the DM. Depending on their ruling, you could be a walking, talking, psychic doom laser. Special points for calling it the Special Beam Cannon. And charge it for five minutes. But considering how short battles take in DnD...well, you get the point...

[Alsc]

Is Immortal Durability +1 hp per mystic level calculated at each level up? Or is it +1 hp for each NEW mystic level?

Basically, as a lv 10 Order of the Immortal Mystic, should I have:

A.) 10 hp extra from Immortal Durability (10 mystic lvs = 10 hp)

OR

B.) 55 hp extra from Immortal Durability, from calculating bonus mystic level hp at each level up?
(1+2+3+4+5+etc etc etc)

I'd appreciate any response for this! I know there's some talk about mystics being overpowered so I'd hate to make a 45 hp mistake here.

[carrdrivesyou]

Is Immortal Durability +1 hp per mystic level calculated at each level up? Or is it +1 hp for each NEW mystic level?

Basically, as a lv 10 Order of the Immortal Mystic, should I have:

A.) 10 hp extra from Immortal Durability (10 mystic lvs = 10 hp)

OR

B.) 55 hp extra from Immortal Durability, from calculating bonus mystic level hp at each level up?
(1+2+3+4+5+etc etc etc)

I'd appreciate any response for this! I know there's some talk about mystics being overpowered so I'd hate to make a 45 hp mistake here.

I believe by the verbiage, ""Starting at 1st level, your hit point maximum increases by 1 per mystic level," they intend for it to be 1 per level, for a total of 20 over your career. That puts you well within the range of most fighters. Pretty good for a caster of any sort really. A bonus of 55 seems a bit much, especially for a class that is already a bit above the power scale at mid levels.

[Giatro]

Very impressed by your guide, and by your staying involved in the comments ... disappointed about the expected radical re-write of the class after three playtests.

I understand that multiclassing a UA class is discouraged ... but there's been a lot of discussion of it anyway. And I have tried to understand your opinion on taking a 1 level dip in Rogue ... can't figure out what it means ... Expertise, Sneak Attack, Thieves Cant ... don't see how these have any impact on bonus actions, or even how they help the Mystic much. I'm probably missing something obvious, but what?

[carrdrivesyou]

Very impressed by your guide, and by your staying involved in the comments ... disappointed about the expected radical re-write of the class after three playtests.

I understand that multiclassing a UA class is discouraged ... but there's been a lot of discussion of it anyway. And I have tried to understand your opinion on taking a 1 level dip in Rogue ... can't figure out what it means ... Expertise, Sneak Attack, Thieves Cant ... don't see how these have any impact on bonus actions, or even how they help the Mystic much. I'm probably missing something obvious, but what?

I'm glad you like the guide. Sad that the class got scrapped. I'm gonna remake it into the one for the Psion when it drops though. Hopefully it won't need too much revising.

As for the rogue dip, the reason I suggest it is that it synergizes well with most builds. The expertise goes a long way in skill builds, extra skills are nice, an extra d6 of damage is always useful, and Thieves Cant is just flavor. At a 2 level dip, you get Cunning Action, which is VERY useful, but the Mystic is chock full of bonus action abilities already. Overall, the dip here is mostly a small boost, but at a level or two, it will meaningfully add to your character while not taking away from your Mystic progression.

[mangosta71]

I have a DM that's letting me play the third-pass Mystic, and it's a lot of fun. Valenar High Elf, Order of the Immortal, it's a hell of a gish. Without armor I have the highest AC in the party (21) at level 4. And everyone at the table was shocked when I enhanced a swing with Lethal Strike and critted for a total of 52 damage.

But anyway, I've been making pretty heavy use of this guide. And I'm really sad that the Mystic class is getting disintegrated.

[RealBallOfFluff]

Exacting Query: You could just yell at them. Or I don’t know… TALK to them?

Isn't it Forceful Query and makes them have to tell the truth?

[carrdrivesyou]

Isn't it Forceful Query and makes them have to tell the truth?

There is Forceful Query via Psychic Inquisition, then there is Exacting Query by Telepathic contact. They do about the same thing, forcing a truthful answer out of the target on a failed save. The difference is that the latter is telepathic, while the former requires they be able to see and hear you.

The reason it is rated so poorly is because you could easily solve this with an intimidation or other social skill check. If you REALLY want to do the social intrigue thing and interrogate someone, a few points in CHA is a better investment.

[mangosta71]

The reason it is rated so poorly is because you could easily solve this with an intimidation or other social skill check. If you REALLY want to do the social intrigue thing and interrogate someone, a few points in CHA is a better investment.

Depends on the build. Some won't be able to afford stat points in CHA.

My Immortal mystic was unstoppable (the DM *tried*; I retired the character out of mercy), but I already needed high DEX, INT, and CON. I had to use both STR and CHA as dump stats. I was seriously considering Psychic Inquisition for several reasons; our highest CHA character had died (that player took over as DM when our current DM had a change in his availability) so we didn't have anyone who was good at that, and my character was also a secret Zhentarim agent so being able to interrogate people without being dependent on the rest of the party would have been incredibly useful from a RP perspective. I was never going to be able to intimidate, or persuade, etc., so "force truth out of this person with your brain" was an extremely appealing option.

[carrdrivesyou]

Depends on the build. Some won't be able to afford stat points in CHA.

My Immortal mystic was unstoppable (the DM *tried*; I retired the character out of mercy), but I already needed high DEX, INT, and CON. I had to use both STR and CHA as dump stats. I was seriously considering Psychic Inquisition for several reasons; our highest CHA character had died (that player took over as DM when our current DM had a change in his availability) so we didn't have anyone who was good at that, and my character was also a secret Zhentarim agent so being able to interrogate people without being dependent on the rest of the party would have been incredibly useful from a RP perspective. I was never going to be able to intimidate, or persuade, etc., so "force truth out of this person with your brain" was an extremely appealing option.

Well, YMMV. no character can really account for every situation, and especially not a party member dying. So, you situation sounds like it was more of a story development than anything else. It wasn't planned for. But I understand what you are saying. And you would be right in concluding either option to be a decent stand-in for a few good Intimidation rolls. Unfortunately, there is a save involved with both. All my guide and I are saying is that they are suboptimal options by comparison. If that's the way, you want to play it, go right ahead. It *IS* your character after all lol.

[mangosta71]

Of course, it's going to depend on your situation. But in general, a mystic isn't likely to be proficient in intimidate, and is fairly likely to not have a bonus to CHA either. Makes it hard to get a good roll.

Now, most players either won't be involved in campaigns in the city with a lot of intrigue (or won't have some other reason to hide their allegiances), so they won't need to be able to interrogate prisoners themselves. And sure, you can defeat the power with a save. But given that the DC is based on your highest stat and includes your proficiency bonus, not to mention that most of the things you'll need information from have low-average INT and won't be proficient in INT saves, you're more likely to have a target fail the save against the power than you are to succeed on an intimidate roll.

So, yeah. Not always applicable, but VERY useful when it is. And there's absolutely no reason to take both.

[carrdrivesyou]

You raise valid points. I will change their rating up a notch to Orange. It'd be rated black in any sort of social intrigue game.

I hope that the psion class and other psionic subclasses come out soon so I can revamp this guide. I'm eagerly waiting!

[flixcool]

I think it's a bug but i am unable to open any "spoilers"

[Didact]

Been coming back to this guide for reference a lot and I've noticed something that doesn't make sense; Why does Crown of Dispair's focus have a black rating, while Mantle of Fear's have a blue one? Aren't their effects exactly the same?

[Didact]

There is Forceful Query via Psychic Inquisition, then there is Exacting Query by Telepathic contact. They do about the same thing, forcing a truthful answer out of the target on a failed save. The difference is that the latter is telepathic, while the former requires they be able to see and hear you.

The reason it is rated so poorly is because you could easily solve this with an intimidation or other social skill check. If you REALLY want to do the social intrigue thing and interrogate someone, a few points in CHA is a better investment.

I think it's worth pointing out that Exacting Query is MUCH more powerful than Forceful Q. FQ must be phrased in a yes/no format; EQ allows you to frame the question any way you choose.

Quick edit: Although, since FQ calls for a wisdom save, it can be synergiezed with Hammer of the Inquisition.

[Didact]

I hope that the psion class and other psionic subclasses come out soon so I can revamp this guide. I'm eagerly waiting!

When you work on the new psionic subclasses, is there any way I can talk you into preserving (and possibly maintaining) this guide for the Mystic V.3? Just hit lvl.5 with my Awakened in a campaign I'm in with some guys at my shop and we're shooting for the long haul. As I've said before, this guide has been a handy resource, I'd hate to loose it

[carrdrivesyou]

When you work on the new psionic subclasses, is there any way I can talk you into preserving (and possibly maintaining) this guide for the Mystic V.3? Just hit lvl.5 with my Awakened in a campaign I'm in with some guys at my shop and we're shooting for the long haul. As I've said before, this guide has been a handy resource, I'd hate to loose it

My plan is to create a Psionics subclass Guide when they do release, and add all the Psionic material as it is released. I will leave this guide alone. :D

Been coming back to this guide for reference a lot and I've noticed something that doesn't make sense; Why does Crown of Dispair's focus have a black rating, while Mantle of Fear's have a blue one? Aren't their effects exactly the same?

I must have mislabeled that. Both should be blue rated.

[Goldlizard]

just a suggestion: bold everything in color so it's easier to see the colors. other than that, great job! this really helped me with making a build

[furby076]

After a quick rewatch of the Mike Mearls Happy Fun Hour series, the current idea seems to be:

Barbarian

• Path of the Immortal

Bard

• College of the Ardent

Fighter

• Psychic Warrior

Monk

• Way of the Soul Knife

Psion

• Order of the Awakened
• Order of the Metamorph
• Order of the Nomad
• Order of the Shaper

Wizard

• School of the Kineticist

which video?

[Millstone85]

which video?

Sorry, it has been almost a year and I can't remember.

If I didn't provide a link, it could be that no single video was enough. Maybe.

[LTSearchEngine]

Quick question about Animate Weapon - it seems really good, and is not rated very well. Maybe I am misunderstanding how it works overall, but it seems like one of the most efficient Psi-Point-to-Damage abilities available, especially at low level.

First, clarification, it refers to your "Discipline Attack Modifier." That is defined in the article as Proficiency bonus + Int mod. It says the weapon itself makes an attack, using your "Discipline Attack Modifier" and then damage is dealt, adding the same "Discipline Attack Modifier." It deals "normal weapon damage" plus 1d10 per Psi.

Reading all that verbatim, I think this is the resulting scenario:

The mystic, not proficient with martial weapons, holds a rapier in his off hand. He animates the rapier, and it flies off and attacks the bad guy. To attack, it rolls 1d20 + Discipline Attack Mod, which is 1d20 + Proficiency + Int mod. For damage, it rolls "Normal Damage" plus "Discipline Attack Mod" plus 1d10 PP, which is 1d8 + dex mod + int mod + proficiency bonus + 1d10PP. I am basing this on saying that "Normal Damage" for a finesse weapon is Die + Dex mod, 1d8 plus dex mod in this case.

So, for an average point-buy level 1 mystic (Int 16, Dex 14), for 1 Psi Point you get:

Attack: +5 (Int Mod + Proficiency Bonus)

Damage: 1d8 + 1d10 + 7 ( Weapon Damage Die, Discipline Damage Die, Int Mod, Proficiency Bonus, Dex Mod)

The attack mod is nothing special - it just lets you substitute your Int for a normal Str or Dex attack bonus. The damage seems very strong, and it seems like a pretty good option for mystics. It also scales okay, since as you find random magic weapons you can use them instead.

[Ventruenox]

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