How will info gathering skills help in a campaign?

[Longman]

I'm wondering how other players discuss with their GM what a new campaign will actually be like, and how particular skills wil be useful.

My main concern is having a character that is expert in gathering information of various kinds (Cha-based rogue, Diviner, a character who is very good at research, etc).

In some games, such skills are vital because the GM isn't going to give that information away, and your party can do much better if someone has those kind of abilities. In such games, you can actually get stuck becuase you don't know what is going on. Information is truly hidden.

In other games, it often seems that important information needs to be revealed at some point, otherwise the session will stall. That means, the info that leads you to a particlar adventure location or a course of action will have to emerge in a game session. Your info-gathering skills are a bit redundant because the information wil always come out anyway...

Some players may take pleasure in having it be their characer who found out the answer to something. I'm not like that. If I do something in play, I like the idea that it's something that wouldn't have happened anyway, half an hour later.

I know this leads into age old discussions about railroading, etc. I'm mostly curious to know if people actually sit down and say:

"Hey Dave...I'm thinking of making a smooth-talking rogue who can find out what's going on in town. But is that actually going to make the game take a new turn, or are you going to tell us all that sort of information anyway after an hour or so? If you are, I'll make more of a stealth type."

Most games work best if you talk that stuff through, right? Curious to know how people do that.

[Knaight]

Usually people get a feel for the GM over time, and more veteran players will inform new players of the GM's quirks. In my case, that involves information gathering being really useful, to the tune of "it's likely that if you don't investigate a problem it will eventually come to you, much bigger and meaner after having wrought a great deal of carnage".

[Nifft]

I sometimes roll Gather Info into other skills, like Diplomacy & Knowledge: Local, or in a more noir game also into Intimidate & Investigate.

[Longman]

Usually people get a feel for the GM over time, and more veteran players will inform new players of the GM's quirks. In my case, that involves information gathering being really useful, to the tune of "it's likely that if you don't investigate a problem it will eventually come to you, much bigger and meaner after having wrought a great deal of carnage".

Ideally, investigate skills should be useful - especally if the game is inherently an investigation style game!

I think what's happening is that people (a few GMs I know) are writing 'plots' based on TV show episode format. In that situation, the good guys can't figure out the mystery in 10 minutes because it would wreck the pacing of the show. They figure it out close to the end. Sometimes you can set your clock by it.

The problem is you you transfer that idea over into a game environment you end up with investigation skills being useless at the start of the "episode" because the GM just isn't ready to give it away yet.

Your "investigate or the problem will come to you" sounds a good solution but not all GMs will write that way.

[Nifft]

The game Gumshoe did some cool stuff with investigation.

Basically, if you had the appropriate skill, and you asked a question in the right place, you didn't even roll -- you just get the info you wanted.

That's a nice thing because it removes the boring potential to fail -- there's no such thing as "roll above 15 to continue with plot", you have to figure out what to ask (i.e. player skill) and you get to advance the plot.

[Slipperychicken]

I try to focus on asking for information which will help the characters' struggles, rather than simply advancing the plot.


Instead of just asking "who is the bad guy and where is he?", I try to look for what his defenses are, what his MO is, and in which ways and times he is most vulnerable.

[Jay R]

Usually people get a feel for the GM over time, and more veteran players will inform new players of the GM's quirks.

Yup. This is a crucial aspect of superior play. There's an old legal maxim. "Any lawyer knows the law. A good lawyer knows the exceptions. A great lawyer knows the judge."

Similarly, any player knows the basic rules. A good player knows the splatbooks and magazine articles. A great player knows the GM.

[Aotrs Commander]

I think it will depend a lot of the sort of campaign being run.

Certainly, for example, a campaign (in Rolemaster) wherein a large portion of the thrust is exploration (significantly well above combat) information gathering (in a literal sense of "analytical skills") is critical to the point, so everyone has them. Less so in a typical D&D adventure path.

Consulting the DM is usually the best option as always.

[Darth Ultron]

Not something that I really talk about with players.

I really hate lazy roll playing...and the *Roll* ''ok, DM tell me stuff'', worst of all.

I only give the most basic...and really obvious..information for most roll playing. But this make most players happy.

I make it very clear any ''roll to know'' information will be vague, and not always 100% accurate and true. Really like all other information in the game.

Generally I prefer information to be found by role playing, and encourage players to do that.

[Anonymouswizard]

In theory characters should always have enough information to act. Investigation skills are when you want to know more so you have more options or be more effective. Divination spells are for when you want a GM to tear their hair out.