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  1. - Top - End - #31
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Olinser's Avatar

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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Nadevoc View Post
    I've heard good things about the series for a few years now; this seems like a good time to try it out.

    I'd be interested in an MP game. Since it's a 4x, is multiplayer done in a 'play by email' style? What's the time commitment?
    I haven't done it myself but I understand its basically the same as Dominions 4 - as in, IN CLIENT you can only play direct connect, which is extremely difficult to coordinate more than a couple people, or you can go outside the client and use llamaserver and email your turn actions and receive the updates just like Dominions 4.

    ALL HAIL THE GREAT RAK!!

    I use the same name in every game I ever play or forum I join (except the pretender on PSN that forced me to be RealOlinser). If you see an Olinser in a game or on a website, there's a high chance it's me, feel free to shoot me a message.

  2. - Top - End - #32
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Nadevoc View Post
    I've heard good things about the series for a few years now; this seems like a good time to try it out.

    I'd be interested in an MP game. Since it's a 4x, is multiplayer done in a 'play by email' style? What's the time commitment?
    As already pointed out, the game itself allows you to do direct connect but it's kinda clunky. The most popular option is llamaserver to which you send and receive your turn files, with the added benefit it sends warnings when there's only X hours left to update, you get to keep old saves and even restore a previous turn in case something goes wrong.

    Usually time commitment is 24h for early game where you only need to do some orders per turn (or 25 h to avoid the deadline slowly creeping back in your schedule), normally increasing to 48-72h after the first 12 turns (1 year in-game) as micro increases. It's also ok for players to request deadline extensions in case real life stuff happens.

  3. - Top - End - #33
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    I'm willing to run a dedicated server if people want that. I've run a dom3 server for a group of old highschool friends for the last year or two, so I know how to get them running.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3SecondCultist View Post
    Yeah, DreamingMage honestly thinks he is a god. Over the years, I've found it best just to go with it.
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  4. - Top - End - #34
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Otomodachi View Post
    I am recently and explicitly volunteering. :P

    Here's the thing though... I've been playing since Dom3, I've probably got a total hours logged in the vicinity of Manticoran.... but I've literally never played an MP game. So I don't know how useful I'd be as a mentor, but I don't think I need a mentor as much as more raw players, like, I'm sure there's stuff I could learn but it'd be a lot more incremental than it'd be for a newer player.

    But yeah, I'm in, I wanna dive into the world of MP.

    EDIT: On second thought, I guess I do have SOME things to offer as a mentor. I really DO know how the game works, so I guess there's WORSE people you could pair with a really new person. I just have no idea how MP really works out in practice.
    I'm in a similar boat. Been playing a lot of single player because I like the background of the game and its ideas, but haven't ever jumped into multiplayer. Since I put myself down as Mentee, I guess I should also put you down as Mentee. I figure people who want to be mentORs should know how the game works and understand how the game's mechanics play out in actual multiplayer.

    If I put anyone in the wrong category, neglected to put anyone down at all, or such, please PM me with instructions for how you wanted to be included in the list, that way I can't forget you or read past your post.

    edit: It looks like we're getting a healthy enough base of committed players, though I realize some said they would be able to play in a few weeks.

    Is it good with everyone if we start a game on Jan 2? I expect some people may be occupied in the time between the winter holidays, and I don't want to put the game on hiatus during that time, only for some to drop out as people tend to do during hiatuses. This also gives other players time to see this thread and participate.

    Until then, maybe we should sort out the terms of the game. How are multiplayer games generally played? For newbies, what is the ettiquette, what is the format, etc?
    Last edited by Vitruviansquid; 2017-12-17 at 12:29 AM.
    It always amazes me how often people on forums would rather accuse you of misreading their posts with malice than re-explain their ideas with clarity.

  5. - Top - End - #35
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Alright, this sounds good - officially interested in joining a MP game!

    I've messed around for like 15 minutes, but the UI makes it difficult to learn. I think I'll have to hunt down some Let's Plays or something to cover the basics - anyone have any suggested resources/streamers/etc?

    I agree that starting post-holidays is probably wise, and 24 hours a turn seems reasonable.

  6. - Top - End - #36
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Nadevoc View Post
    Alright, this sounds good - officially interested in joining a MP game!

    I've messed around for like 15 minutes, but the UI makes it difficult to learn. I think I'll have to hunt down some Let's Plays or something to cover the basics - anyone have any suggested resources/streamers/etc?

    I agree that starting post-holidays is probably wise, and 24 hours a turn seems reasonable.
    The game's starting menu has a selection for, I believe "Tools and Manuals" that should take you a series of informative youtube videos. You can also get to an interesting, informative, and gigantic manual as a PDF somehow, but I can't remember how to right now
    It always amazes me how often people on forums would rather accuse you of misreading their posts with malice than re-explain their ideas with clarity.

  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Nadevoc View Post
    Alright, this sounds good - officially interested in joining a MP game!

    I've messed around for like 15 minutes, but the UI makes it difficult to learn. I think I'll have to hunt down some Let's Plays or something to cover the basics - anyone have any suggested resources/streamers/etc?

    I agree that starting post-holidays is probably wise, and 24 hours a turn seems reasonable.
    24h should be to start but it should increase after about 15 turns when the amount of stuff per turn starts to skyrocket.

    Though it can be shorter, typically its set so that as soon as everybody has submitted their turn the game creator/mod can waive the timer and immediately issue the next turn - so if everybody can arrange to be around for at least a couple hours for a game start time we could probably do 5+ turns real quickly to get the game underway.

    ALL HAIL THE GREAT RAK!!

    I use the same name in every game I ever play or forum I join (except the pretender on PSN that forced me to be RealOlinser). If you see an Olinser in a game or on a website, there's a high chance it's me, feel free to shoot me a message.

  8. - Top - End - #38
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    I'm personally a fan of setting it to auto-host, so it hosts a new turn as soon as everyone's turns are in. If someone goes more than 24 hours, then we just get on their case on the forums, and if that doesn't get them in you set them to AI.

    That way we can make as much progress as possible, while still being pretty flexible. And I always found that when someone misses a turn, they get out of the loop pretty fast and find it hard to get back in the game, thus AI.


    Also: I'm down to act as a mentor as well as hosting. I think I posted that earlier, but I don't see it in the OP.
    Last edited by Sen isSaqqara; 2017-12-17 at 10:35 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3SecondCultist View Post
    Yeah, DreamingMage honestly thinks he is a god. Over the years, I've found it best just to go with it.
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  9. - Top - End - #39
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Sen isSaqqara View Post
    I'm willing to run a dedicated server if people want that. I've run a dom3 server for a group of old highschool friends for the last year or two, so I know how to get them running.
    How do you get them running in dom3? I've tried, and it's not been going well - I can get a server going and another copy on my computer hooked in, but not beyond that.

  10. - Top - End - #40
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    If this ends up being personal hosting, I'll be bowing out. It's simply more unstable and limited, no reminder e-mails nor able to review previous turns, which would be particularly important for newbies. Plus the ever present chance it crashes midway with no chance of recovery and impossible to change administrator should the need arise.
    Last edited by deuterio12; 2017-12-18 at 07:53 PM.

  11. - Top - End - #41
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Knaight View Post
    How do you get them running in dom3? I've tried, and it's not been going well - I can get a server going and another copy on my computer hooked in, but not beyond that.
    Quote Originally Posted by deuterio12 View Post
    If this ends up being personal hosting, I'll be bowing out. It's simply more unstable and limited, no reminder e-mails nor able to review previous turns, which would be particularly important for newbies. Plus the ever present chance it crashes midway with no chance of recovery and impossible to change administrator should the need arise.
    It's actually quite stable! You just have to get intimately familiar with the console arguments for the executable. I assure you, I keep meticulous backups of my server computer. And I'm sure I could rig up some quick code to send out reminder emails (though with a 24-hour schedule I'm not sure why we'd need them). Keeping copies of old turns for review is not something I've done before, but if it's something people want I'm sure I could take a look at implementing it.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3SecondCultist View Post
    Yeah, DreamingMage honestly thinks he is a god. Over the years, I've found it best just to go with it.
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  12. - Top - End - #42
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Sen isSaqqara View Post
    It's actually quite stable! You just have to get intimately familiar with the console arguments for the executable. I assure you, I keep meticulous backups of my server computer. And I'm sure I could rig up some quick code to send out reminder emails (though with a 24-hour schedule I'm not sure why we'd need them). Keeping copies of old turns for review is not something I've done before, but if it's something people want I'm sure I could take a look at implementing it.
    Why not simply use llamaserver then? It's the most common method of setting up big mp dominions games. If nothing else newbies would benefit from getting used to it since chance are that their future games will be through such method.

    And again, you can't be sure of how things are going to go with you in 1-2 months (average game time assuming everything goes smoothly). Llammaserver allows the admin to share the master password with somebody else if they need to bow out, whereas if something happens that prevents you from taking care of the server (I sincerly hope not but you never know what may happen), the game would go down too.

    EDIT: Another nice thing about llammaserver is that besides reminder e-mails, it also warns you when a new turn arrives, while with private server you need to check in-game.
    Last edited by deuterio12; 2017-12-19 at 06:42 AM.

  13. - Top - End - #43
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Sen isSaqqara View Post
    It's actually quite stable! You just have to get intimately familiar with the console arguments for the executable. I assure you, I keep meticulous backups of my server computer. And I'm sure I could rig up some quick code to send out reminder emails (though with a 24-hour schedule I'm not sure why we'd need them). Keeping copies of old turns for review is not something I've done before, but if it's something people want I'm sure I could take a look at implementing it.
    I was thinking of the direct connection game, not PBEM. PBEM I can get working.

  14. - Top - End - #44
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Sen isSaqqara View Post
    I'm personally a fan of setting it to auto-host, so it hosts a new turn as soon as everyone's turns are in. If someone goes more than 24 hours, then we just get on their case on the forums, and if that doesn't get them in you set them to AI.

    That way we can make as much progress as possible, while still being pretty flexible. And I always found that when someone misses a turn, they get out of the loop pretty fast and find it hard to get back in the game, thus AI.


    Also: I'm down to act as a mentor as well as hosting. I think I posted that earlier, but I don't see it in the OP.

    Yes but the problem is that the AI is so stupid that auto-AIing somebody out massively skews the power balance of the area they were in because its so easy to manipulate the AI and it turns into a feeding frenzy of grabbing up the now AI territory.

    ALL HAIL THE GREAT RAK!!

    I use the same name in every game I ever play or forum I join (except the pretender on PSN that forced me to be RealOlinser). If you see an Olinser in a game or on a website, there's a high chance it's me, feel free to shoot me a message.

  15. - Top - End - #45
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by deuterio12 View Post
    Why not simply use llamaserver then? It's the most common method of setting up big mp dominions games. If nothing else newbies would benefit from getting used to it since chance are that their future games will be through such method.

    And again, you can't be sure of how things are going to go with you in 1-2 months (average game time assuming everything goes smoothly). Llammaserver allows the admin to share the master password with somebody else if they need to bow out, whereas if something happens that prevents you from taking care of the server (I sincerly hope not but you never know what may happen), the game would go down too.

    EDIT: Another nice thing about llammaserver is that besides reminder e-mails, it also warns you when a new turn arrives, while with private server you need to check in-game.
    Fair enough! I've never actually played over llanaserver before, nor any kind of pbe. If you think that would be a better option, I have no objection.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3SecondCultist View Post
    Yeah, DreamingMage honestly thinks he is a god. Over the years, I've found it best just to go with it.
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  16. - Top - End - #46
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Thank you for your understanding. Llammaserver indeed offers a lot of conveniences and it's pretty easy to set up too. I can be the admin for that if nobody else wants, got some experience.

    Quote Originally Posted by Olinser View Post
    Yes but the problem is that the AI is so stupid that auto-AIing somebody out massively skews the power balance of the area they were in because its so easy to manipulate the AI and it turns into a feeding frenzy of grabbing up the now AI territory.
    Actually, one of the nice things about Dominions 5 is that the AI has been significantly improved (even indies can no longer just be curbstomped with meathshield bait+bows) and you can default the difficulty level of players that leave. Not saying it's as good as a human player, but should no longer be the virtual free lunch it used to be.

  17. - Top - End - #47
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    I'm assuming the middle age is the 'default' choice, and so that's what I did during my learning game. Do any of the veterans have any strong opinions on the age?

  18. - Top - End - #48
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    I wouldn't say any age is default, but MA is probably best for newbies because things are overall more simple there. EA relies more on capital uber mages, and LA has higher magic variety with most nations able to use blood spells which complicates things significantly.

    And if we're going MA I would also suggest banning Ermor since it's the mother of death nations and definitely not suitable for a first mp game.

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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Ah, makes sense. I vote MA, then, because I could probably use all the help I can get.

    Are duplicates allowed, or is there some form of draft? Trying to decide if it would be advantageous to stick to one nation or switch it up while messing around with AI.

  20. - Top - End - #50
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    You would need some kind of mod to have duplicate nations.

    Usually it's first come first served, but for a team game a snake draft is best, in particular because it's important to have some synergy between allied nations.

  21. - Top - End - #51
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    I'm in, relatively experienced player from the same mumble server as Manticoran.

  22. - Top - End - #52
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Middle Age sounds good to me!

  23. - Top - End - #53
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    I'm normally an Early Age fan, personally, but I can always do MA or LA too.

    Edit: Just realized I initially typed "I'm normally an EA fan," and shuddered involuntarily.
    Last edited by Sen isSaqqara; 2017-12-21 at 01:12 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3SecondCultist View Post
    Yeah, DreamingMage honestly thinks he is a god. Over the years, I've found it best just to go with it.
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  24. - Top - End - #54
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    And if we're going MA I would also suggest banning Ermor since it's the mother of death nations and definitely not suitable for a first mp game.
    Yeah do think this could really screw people up, who are not used to handling a wasteland full of the angry dead. Took me a bit of trial and error to figure out myself.
    thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar

  25. - Top - End - #55
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    Yeah do think this could really screw people up, who are not used to handling a wasteland full of the angry dead. Took me a bit of trial and error to figure out myself.
    MA Ermor isn't too bad - it's LA Ermor that warrants hard banning.

  26. - Top - End - #56
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    Thumbs down Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    My impression of EA is that everything in it is massively and grotesquely OP compared to what you find later. My impression of LA is that it ends up basically like MA in every way.

    I'm personally down for a MA game or LA.

    @Hicks I will add you as soon as I am on my computer, as opposed to my phone which I am currently using.
    It always amazes me how often people on forums would rather accuse you of misreading their posts with malice than re-explain their ideas with clarity.

  27. - Top - End - #57
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Vitruviansquid View Post
    My impression of EA is that everything in it is massively and grotesquely OP compared to what you find later. My impression of LA is that it ends up basically like MA in every way.
    Most of the troops are garbage by MA standards (which really shines through when you get MA or LA mercenaries in EA; 40 Hysapsists can do a number on any EA army without mage support), and other than the one capital only mage the mages are generally no better.

  28. - Top - End - #58
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by deuterio12 View Post
    You would need some kind of mod to have duplicate nations.

    Usually it's first come first served, but for a team game a snake draft is best, in particular because it's important to have some synergy between allied nations.
    Should we perhaps do a nation draft here in the forums in the next couple days before everybody disperses for the holidays? That way everybody can look into how they'd like to build their Pretender and we'd be ready to start right away on the 2nd.

    ALL HAIL THE GREAT RAK!!

    I use the same name in every game I ever play or forum I join (except the pretender on PSN that forced me to be RealOlinser). If you see an Olinser in a game or on a website, there's a high chance it's me, feel free to shoot me a message.

  29. - Top - End - #59
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Olinser View Post
    Should we perhaps do a nation draft here in the forums in the next couple days before everybody disperses for the holidays? That way everybody can look into how they'd like to build their Pretender and we'd be ready to start right away on the 2nd.
    That sounds like a good idea. Additionally, I'm not sure the 2nd would work for me as I'll be in transit for the better part of the day. Would it be possible to do the 3rd instead? If not, I can probably make the 2nd work, it's just more uncertain.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3SecondCultist View Post
    Yeah, DreamingMage honestly thinks he is a god. Over the years, I've found it best just to go with it.
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  30. - Top - End - #60
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    Default Re: Okay, let me pitch Dominions 5 to you

    Quote Originally Posted by Sen isSaqqara View Post
    That sounds like a good idea. Additionally, I'm not sure the 2nd would work for me as I'll be in transit for the better part of the day. Would it be possible to do the 3rd instead? If not, I can probably make the 2nd work, it's just more uncertain.
    I personally am totally flexible on the actual start date.

    I'd definitely like to get the draft going if possible though, it will also let newer players have a decent time period to consult with the more experienced players to get advice on their initial Pretender build before they're committed.

    ALL HAIL THE GREAT RAK!!

    I use the same name in every game I ever play or forum I join (except the pretender on PSN that forced me to be RealOlinser). If you see an Olinser in a game or on a website, there's a high chance it's me, feel free to shoot me a message.

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