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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    MonkGirl

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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by LeonBH View Post
    The funny thing is... the Shadow Sorcerer can hide exactly as well as any other Sorcerer, in shadows or bright light. I doubt casting a Darkness spell to be hidden from sight is going to be any more subtle.

    "Hey guys, do you see that dark sphere of shadow over there? Seems suspicious..."
    True, but I would guess many would have Stealth Proficiency and generally utilize stealth techniques compared to their peers

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    Dalebert's Avatar

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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by lunaticfringe View Post
    Dispel desummons summoned creatures...
    Yeah, if they were summoned with a spell. The hound is not a spell. It's a class feature. That's a nope to Dispel Magic and Counterspell and a yep to summoning it in silence or when you're tied up or when you don't have your focus and a yep to casting a full spell the same round you summon it because it's not a bonus action spell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Naanomi View Post
    True, but I would guess many would have Stealth Proficiency and generally utilize stealth techniques compared to their peers
    Maybe. Maybe not. I generally like stealth so yeah. I think it's a good fit. Then again, stealth isn't nearly as useful when you don't have cunning action. Your rogue will appreciate it being there so he can hide and then pop out and shoot.
    Last edited by Dalebert; 2017-12-04 at 11:49 PM.
    If you cast Dispel Magic on my Gust of Wind, does that mean you're disgusting?

    In real estate, they say it's all about location, location, location. In D&D I say it's about action economy, action economy, action economy.

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  3. - Top - End - #33
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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    On top of everything else, if it is a "Dire Wolf" for stats, it can knock things prone, right? If it hits it does basically a greatsword damage and if the target fails a str save (I think), prone it goes.

    This can be good or bad - bad if party has archer or caster getting ready to do scorching ray or chromatic orb - good if a meleer is on it.

    Or does a shadow hound (hound of ill omen) not knock things prone?

  4. - Top - End - #34
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dalebert View Post
    Yeah, if they were summoned with a spell. The hound is not a spell. It's a class feature. That's a nope to Dispel Magic and Counterspell and a yep to summoning it in silence or when you're tied up or when you don't have your focus and a yep to casting a full spell the same round you summon it because it's not a bonus action spell.



    Maybe. Maybe not. I generally like stealth so yeah. I think it's a good fit. Then again, stealth isn't nearly as useful when you don't have cunning action. Your rogue will appreciate it being there so he can hide and then pop out and shoot.
    eh, i'd say the hound is still magically summoned, and dispel magic can target magical effects.

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by SharkForce View Post
    eh, i'd say the hound is still magically summoned, and dispel magic can target magical effects.
    It can TARGET magical effects. Dispel Magic only affects spells in this edition, though. The magical effects bit is just there to let you target the spell itself, in case you have no line of sight on the object/creature it's on (e.g. so you can dispel Darkness).

  6. - Top - End - #36
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    Asmotherion's Avatar

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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Ever since I read about the Shadow Sorcerer, and especially Hound of Ill Omen, I knew what Character I'd be playing next :3




    The best thing is, I don't think there is a RAW limitation to how many hounds you can summon, as long as you have the Sorcery Points to afford them. And that's really great, as you can actually plan your strategy around this sometimes, coupled with putting them in darkness. You're less of a Glass Cannon, and more of a Saddistic Slow Pain Dealer/Debuffer that does his job right and with good synergy.
    Last edited by Asmotherion; 2017-12-05 at 07:12 AM.

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  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chugger View Post
    On top of everything else, if it is a "Dire Wolf" for stats, it can knock things prone, right?
    It uses the stats of a dire wolf with the only difference being it's medium-sized, so yes. You're summoning (creating?) an actual creature.

    Quote Originally Posted by Asmotherion View Post
    The best thing is, I don't think there is a RAW limitation to how many hounds you can summon, as long as you have the Sorcery Points to afford them.
    Yes. I would summon one next to them and then next round summon another on the opposite side. Now any direction means an AoO. Though hopefully you can do this on the first turn with the help of your allies depending on distance and terrain.

    Quote Originally Posted by SharkForce View Post
    eh, i'd say the hound is still magically summoned, and dispel magic can target magical effects.
    As was said, you can absolutely target a creature and the hound is a creature. If the hound is under the effect of any spells, you could end those spells, e.g. Haste. The hound is not a spell.

    Do you let people counterspell Bend Luck? Do you let people dispel Action Surge? These spells work on spells; not class features.
    Last edited by Dalebert; 2017-12-05 at 09:45 AM.
    If you cast Dispel Magic on my Gust of Wind, does that mean you're disgusting?

    In real estate, they say it's all about location, location, location. In D&D I say it's about action economy, action economy, action economy.

    Crystal Mage -- a homebrewed arcane tradition

  8. - Top - End - #38
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    Asmotherion's Avatar

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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dalebert View Post
    It uses the stats of a dire wolf with the only difference being it's medium-sized, so yes. You're summoning (creating?) an actual creature.



    Yes. I would summon one next to them and then next round summon another on the opposite side. Now any direction means an AoO. Though hopefully you can do this on the first turn with the help of your allies depending on distance and terrain.



    As was said, you can absolutely target a creature and the hound is a creature. If the hound is under the effect of any spells, you could end those spells, e.g. Haste. The hound is not a spell.

    Do you let people counterspell Bend Luck? Do you let people dispel Action Surge? These spells work on spells; not class features.
    Meh, even so you still win. It's a 3rd level spell slot against 3 Sorcery Points; The opponent will run out sooner than you, just convert more :P

    That said, it is specifically called a Magical Effect in it's description, thus it is Dispellable and Counterspellable unfortunatelly by RAW/RAI.

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  9. - Top - End - #39
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    MonkGirl

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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Asmotherion View Post
    That said, it is specifically called a Magical Effect in it's description, thus it is Dispellable and Counterspellable unfortunatelly by RAW/RAI.
    As something that is not a spell 3rd level or lower, or a spell 4th level or higher... it is targetable by Dispel Magic but the spell wouldn’t do anything to it without GM fiat

    Counterspell is explicitly only for spells being cast, not any magical effect, so wouldn’t interact at all (without GM fiat)

  10. - Top - End - #40
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    Default Re: When is Heightened better than Hound of Ill Omen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Asmotherion View Post
    That said, it is specifically called a Magical Effect in it's description, thus it is Dispellable and Counterspellable unfortunatelly by RAW/RAI.
    That doesn't make it subject to DM or CS. That's clear from the description in those spells and has been verified as both RAW and RAI by Crawford. Good grief. Go re-read those spell descriptions. They're very specific. It does make it subject to Antimagic Field which is much more broad but DM and CS only work against actual spells.
    Last edited by Dalebert; 2017-12-07 at 10:18 AM.
    If you cast Dispel Magic on my Gust of Wind, does that mean you're disgusting?

    In real estate, they say it's all about location, location, location. In D&D I say it's about action economy, action economy, action economy.

    Crystal Mage -- a homebrewed arcane tradition

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