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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Why do I feel this way?

    (Just to warn you, wall of text ahead) Hey all, just to warn you, this is a post more to help me, not feel so "angry", or sad with the events, that have recently transpired in a 5e campaign, that I'm a player in. My former character, eleftherosi, was a tielfing paladin, who in his past, had done some terrible things in his earlier years (he was ordered by his superior officer, in the army to murder his family, because they were suspected heretics, supposedly working with the enemy of the crown, elef with a very heavy heart, carried out this task.) After these events, elef began suffering from PTSD (the DM of the world and I, had come up with the idea that whenever elef would sleep, he would roll a D6, and if he rolled a 6, he would be plagued with nightmares, and wouldn't be able to sleep, thus gaining a level of fatigue, and not healing or gaining back his paladin spells.) After the supposed "enemies" of the crown were taken out, it was revealed that the king, had only been killing his political opponents, and those who supported him, and took full control of the country, as a dictator. Elef learning this, abandoned the army, and became a paladin of redemption, wanting to free the country he unknowingly helped enslave, and try his best, to repent for what he did. Well, eventually elef joined a small group of others, an aasimar rogue, who had been a soldier, under the command of one of the kings rivals, a human wizard (an NPC the DM was controlling for the time being), who was an "advisor" from the resistance, who had serious anger issues, and a human cleric, who has been a healer during the large conflict. After only 3 sessions elef had become good friends with his fellow "rebels", and they had begun taking assignments, from the underground revolution. After a "less than successful" first assignment, where the party failed to save a group of prisoners, of extreme importance to the revolutionary group, they decided to send us, on a less important mission, to spy on the enemies local grain silos, and if possible burn down the silos.

    After a heated confrontation with some rather well armed scouts (our party just barely had leveled to 5), we managed to capture two out of the nine scouts, and planned to interrogate them. Sadly, the dice were not on my side, and during the night, I rolled a 6, and elef was unable to sleep, and thus couldn't heal from his rather severe injuries, leaving him in low double digits, and leaving him unable, to regain his paladin spells for the next day. When the next day arrived, interrogations began, and elef being a paladin of redemption, wanted to try and "play the nice guy" card against this scout, and convince him to give up important info through kindness. Well, after almost 30 minutes of intense role play, elef was tired and discouraged, and decided to call it quits, at least for the time being, that's where things went horribly wrong.

    As soon as elef had left the prisoner alone, he was able to slip his binds, and quickly proceeded, to stab elef in the back, reducing him to 4 HP, (which I was surprised that he hadn't killed elef outright, since he had landed a sneak attack, with a hidden dagger.) Elef, realizing, that he party needed to keep at least one of these prisoners alive, decided to try and subdue him, and knock him out. Elef managed to grapple the scout, and put him on the ground, sadly at that exact same time, the other prisoner had began to slip his binds, while our rogue had his back turned, and tried to run as well. Elef tired to call for help from his party, but sadly for him, the parties wizard, decided to launch a chromatic orb at the grapple, and rolled an epic fail, causing elef to be nailed by a chromatic orb, knocking him out cold.

    As the chaos of this event happened, I'll admit I was really hopeful that my party would rush to my aid, and stabilize elef, since on his first death save, he had rolled an epic fail, thus failing two death saves instead of the usual one. Our cleric, being the only one who was the only hope of making sure elef didn't die, after thinking heavily on what her character would do in this situation, decided to pursue the escaping scouts, so they didn't compromise the mission, alongside the rogue and the wizard, who having seen she had hit elef, went ballistic, and chased after the scouts. As they ran past poor elef, luck would have it, that i rolled an 8, on his final death save, and elef died, feeling almost betrayed, since he didn't know that our wizard, had hit him on accident, since she had violently lashed out before. After the action came to a close, resulting in one of the scouts escaping, and the other, being violently burned to death, by our wizard, the party promised to bring elef back sometime in the future, when they could find the resources, or could convince the resistance to pay for his resurrection.

    After the session closed, the DM personally apologized for what had happened, and I'll will totally admit I don't blame him, if anything the dice and the party screws poor elef. So in the end, I just felt sad, and annoyed I had spent easily 3 or so hours if not more, creating elef, and creating his backstory, setting him up to be a paladin, who wanted to repent for his past crimes, and maybe one day redeem himself. I'll admit, that I drew the inspiration for elef, a lot from my personal life, I suffer from depression, off and on, and elef was kind of like the "better" version of me in D&D. So, to maybe help lessen the pain a bit, of losing such a cool character, I wanted to ask you all, about characters you've lost that you were truly attached to, and maybe how you replaced such a cool character? Thanks in advance, after all, I'm really thankful to anyone who takes some time, to write about a really awesome character they ever played.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

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    Feb 2017

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by jangartharn1 View Post
    the parties wizard, decided to launch a chromatic orb at the grapple, and rolled an epic fail, causing elef to be nailed by a chromatic orb, knocking him out cold.
    This is not how Chromatic Orb works. A nat 1 should not have hit you unless the DM deliberately houseruled it that way.

    As to answer your inquiry, well, I haven't had any character I actually cared about die, or at least not without them getting resurrected so soon after it barely count.

    But if you want, I could tell you about how one of my character cheated death when he sacrificed himself.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unoriginal View Post
    This is not how Chromatic Orb works. A nat 1 should not have hit you unless the DM deliberately houseruled it that way.

    As to answer your inquiry, well, I haven't had any character I actually cared about die, or at least not without them getting resurrected so soon after it barely count.

    But if you want, I could tell you about how one of my character cheated death when he sacrificed himself.
    Yeah, to answer your question, the group voted, that if someone rolled an epic fail, and they were firing into a grapple, they would hit an ally. As for a character that cheated death, that sounds pretty cool. 😀

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ShikomeKidoMi's Avatar

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    Mar 2010

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    It's natural to feel bad when a character you're invested in dies.

    Mind you, at level 5, if the whole party pooled their money and they found a friendly cleric* of appropriate level in the next 10 days they might be able to buy a Raise Dead spell.

    *maybe a higher up in the same church as your cleric.
    Last edited by ShikomeKidoMi; 2017-12-07 at 03:58 PM.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    DwarfFighterGuy

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    Feb 2017

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Why didn't your party healer use healing word? It's cast as a bonus action, so s/he could have still managed to pursue the enemy. And, even though it only heals a small amount, it would have stabilized you. AND, it can be cast at a distance.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    Why didn't your party healer use healing word? It's cast as a bonus action, so s/he could have still managed to pursue the enemy. And, even though it only heals a small amount, it would have stabilized you. AND, it can be cast at a distance.
    I'll admit, I have no idea why. I'm not sure if she just forgot, or if she just so invested in the moment, that it slipped her mind.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Orc in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    No one in your party had Inspiration? Cleric doesn't have Revivify? When you fail to long rest, and you really need one, keep trying (take another long rest)!

    As far as losing a character, it happens. Don't get too hung up on it, and try to come up with a couple new concepts for your next characters even while playing your current one. There are easy ways to bring back a hero, but I usually won't bring them back even if it is possible when my character dies. I prefer to make a new one.

    Hang in there!
    Last edited by Demonslayer666; 2017-12-07 at 04:33 PM.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    PirateCaptain

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    Aug 2016

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by jangartharn1 View Post
    ...the DM of the world and I, had come up with the idea that whenever elef would sleep, he would roll a D6, and if he rolled a 6, he would be plagued with nightmares, and wouldn't be able to sleep, thus gaining a level of fatigue, and not healing or gaining back his paladin spells.
    As you discovered, this is quite a stiff penalty you set yourself up for (with, I presume, no corresponding upside?). May I suggest in future you roleplay nightmares and being haunted/tired rather than mechanically punishing yourself for it?

    Also, as has been pointed out already, Healing Word is a really good spell for exactly this reason. If it isn't on your clerics go to list I would definitely point it out to them.

    To be honest this is part of the reason why I tend to start off with a general idea of who a character is and then fill in with detail more as I go. Low level characters die. It's unavoidable, you're only ever a couple of bad rolls away from biting it.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Devil

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    Nov 2012

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    As a heads up, the better your characters get the more chance they have of rolling 1's. Epic fail rules are precisely that, fails. If you fail, failure is failure enough. Having that humiliation compounded further isn't how I want to spend my Evenings.

    If you are playing in games where a playstyle or your actions trying to do something out of the norm are punished, then you can ou have to get to grips with the concept that your characters are going to die. Either don't get invested in them, or remove the ****ty rules. There is enough punishment in level appropriate challenges without getting bent over by crappy 'verisimilitude' nonsense.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by Demonslayer666 View Post
    No one in your party had Inspiration? Cleric doesn't have Revivify? When you fail to long rest, and you really need one, keep trying (take another long rest)!

    As far as losing a character, it happens. Don't get too hung up on it, and try to come up with a couple new concepts for your next characters even while playing your current one. There are easy ways to bring back a hero, but I usually won't bring them back even if it is possible when my character dies. I prefer to make a new one.

    Hang in there!
    Yeah, nobody in our party had inspiration, and our cleric didn't have the necessary components, to cast revivify. I'll admit, I got killed, in a spot that can only be described as "unlucky." 😢

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    SolithKnightGuy

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    Nov 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Hey, ya know, it might feel bad but you should be happy that D&D caused you to feel such strong emotions. Imagine if you had just been stonefaced the whole time.
    I'm working for the Empire. But don't worry… I'm not going to garrote you!

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by Douche View Post
    Hey, ya know, it might feel bad but you should be happy that D&D caused you to feel such strong emotions. Imagine if you had just been stonefaced the whole time.
    That's true, I am glad, that this group, had made me want to role play that much. The group I was primarily with, before this one death, was a common thing. I mean amongst a group of almost all power gamers, when a character died, they quickly rushed to come up with a new, even better build (this group focused heavily on playing 3.5)

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Feb 2016

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Congratulations!

    Seriously. While losing a character is sad, it also means that you have a DM that is willing to let things end “badly”, if the dice are against you and players choose poorly.

    So next time you have a close call but pull through, you’ll know it means you actually succeeded, instead of wondering if the DM fudged things in your favor.

    This is a matter of personal preference, but I am MORE invested in a game after I’ve seen the DM let a character die, if that is how the dice landed. (As opposed to having a DM decide “I’m gonna kill Bob’s character next game). I am just not interested in spending my time in a game where - no matter what happens - the party will always get saved by Dues Ex Machina. My philosophy in this regard is that no real chance of failure means no meaningful victory.

    I am aware that other DMs and players have different philosophies in this regard, and I have nothing against other groups playing as they find enjoyable. But if you want help to not be sad over a PC death, I find this outlook helps. Don’t know if it will help you.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by BoringInfoGuy View Post
    Congratulations!

    Seriously. While losing a character is sad, it also means that you have a DM that is willing to let things end “badly”, if the dice are against you and players choose poorly.

    So next time you have a close call but pull through, you’ll know it means you actually succeeded, instead of wondering if the DM fudged things in your favor.

    This is a matter of personal preference, but I am MORE invested in a game after I’ve seen the DM let a character die, if that is how the dice landed. (As opposed to having a DM decide “I’m gonna kill Bob’s character next game). I am just not interested in spending my time in a game where - no matter what happens - the party will always get saved by Dues Ex Machina. My philosophy in this regard is that no real chance of failure means no meaningful victory.

    I am aware that other DMs and players have different philosophies in this regard, and I have nothing against other groups playing as they find enjoyable. But if you want help to not be sad over a PC death, I find this outlook helps. Don’t know if it will help you.
    That's a very positive view, to a sad situation. I appreciate you sharing such a good way, to look at a thing like this. 😀

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    SamuraiGuy

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    Oct 2006
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    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    it sounds like Elef died to a combination of bad luck and "fog of war" lapse in judgement....probably a more realistic death than most experienced in D&D.

    There is a delicate balance to D&D. You don't want people to get TOO upset when they lose a character, but it is also difficult to tell a compelling story when the players don't care about or aren't invested in their own characters. The healthy middle-ground can be difficult to find or create.

    So condolences and congratulations are in order. SO I'm sorry to hear you lost your character. But kudos on being involved and invested enough (and presumably part of a group that is as well) that losing your character made you FEEL anything.
    Rule 0: What the DM says goes.
    Rule 0.5: What the DM says goes. And if the DM says enough dumb **** the players go too.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gryndle View Post
    it sounds like Elef died to a combination of bad luck and "fog of war" lapse in judgement....probably a more realistic death than most experienced in D&D.

    There is a delicate balance to D&D. You don't want people to get TOO upset when they lose a character, but it is also difficult to tell a compelling story when the players don't care about or aren't invested in their own characters. The healthy middle-ground can be difficult to find or create.

    So condolences and congratulations are in order. SO I'm sorry to hear you lost your character. But kudos on being involved and invested enough (and presumably part of a group that is as well) that losing your character made you FEEL anything.
    Thanks, I'm glad in the end, that elef ended up being a character I truly enjoyed playing. :)

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingPirate

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    Dec 2016
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    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Yeah, I have to say, the fact that you felt a loss meant that you had something good, and, assuming you don't leave the group, you can have something equally good (but different) again.

    The only time that I cared when a character died, the campaign thereafter turned into the most fun one I ever played, with a different new character. I'm not saying that the same thing is guaranteed to happen to you, but hey-it could.

    I wish you good luck with your future characters.
    Spoiler: To My Fellow Empire Players and GM
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    I may tend to come across as negative, as I usually post when something is wrong or to winge, but I really like this game so far and I'm having loads of fun. Thank you everyone for making it such a great experience!


    Quote Originally Posted by DM
    You are walking down the hallways following the map. You make a left turn, two right turns, step over a tripwire, and turn into a secret door.
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    I turn into a secret door? Dang the traps in this place are OP!

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Aug 2015

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Quote Originally Posted by Potato_Priest View Post
    Yeah, I have to say, the fact that you felt a loss meant that you had something good, and, assuming you don't leave the group, you can have something equally good (but different) again.

    The only time that I cared when a character died, the campaign thereafter turned into the most fun one I ever played, with a different new character. I'm not saying that the same thing is guaranteed to happen to you, but hey-it could.

    I wish you good luck with your future characters.
    Yeah, I plan to stay with this group, till the very end. This group highly favors RP, and to me personally, role play is the best part of D&D.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Aug 2016

    Default Re: Why do I feel this way?

    Elef sounds like an engaging character that was both well made and well played.

    Your table and group also sound quite outstanding.

    It sucks that he died, but at least he died committed to doing the right thing. Perhaps if/when he's resurrected Elef the experience can contribute positively to the character's healing process, maybe through a newfound sense of confidence in his ability to do the right thing no matter how painful it might be.

    At least, having read his story, that would be my hope. Good luck with the campaign though however it progresses.
    Coffee_Dragon: "Since the effect clearly allows mundane healing over time, no sane DM would rule that the narrative is constrained by an edge case catch-22 in the abstract rest model."

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