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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

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    Dec 2017

    Default New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    OK, so i'm making a new campaign, and i have heard the following term uttered by my players to much: "Should we go kill it for the exp?" This bugs me. I've also had my players ask to fight the exact amount of kobolds or goblins to level up, and i hate this. But recently, i had an idea. What about getting experience for role-playing? I thought this through, and what i would do is take the personality traits, ideals, and the other things that make that character them, and make notes of them, and reward actions that play to these items. I would most likely make three different sections, a high, medium and low amounts of experience that are based on what level they role-played. For example; The dwarven barbarian drinking till the point that they pass out, even though there is a battle early in the morning, so that he is poisoned due to being hungover would cause them to get a large amount of experience. This is great cause its actually a bad thing and shows that the player is truly playing the role of the character no matter what, and makes sense because of the character.

    While the rest of the party is out, the half-elf bard spends his time in the tavern playing his lute for a crowd and arrive in when they others are done and is tired and happy, would earn them a medium amount due to the fact that they don't go to a large extreme level, but they are still playing their characters to the point where they are clearly characters.

    The mysterious ninja either talking in short sentences or not even talking would get you a small amount because you are still role-playing, but its not really establishing a character that much, but its still good because its easy to do repeatedly so you can earn a lot of exp over a longer time.

    Of course this will apply to combat, but relies on the character themselves and backstory much, much more.

    What do you think about this idea, and what would you do to make it better?

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Davrix's Avatar

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    Dec 2017
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    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    I would suggest you take a look at the 5th ed DMG and look for the section in where it describes alt ways of leveing up. One of them is basing it off the number of encounter and events in role-play and combat and not just getting xp from fights.

    In the game I am currently a part in the DM doesn't do XP or keep track. He simply takes note of how far we have progressed in the story, how many npcs we have interacted with and objectives we have accomplished and when eh feels that enough has been done we gain a level.

    This is something I suggest if your looking to spice things up. This way PC's are encouraged to explore the world, interact with things you have set up and not just to go kill stuff. i remember we leveled up after a month after doing nothing but playing political games with the neighboring city and a few border skirmishes. Mostly though we yelled at Npc's in council meetings and each other half the time for good old fun :)

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

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    Dec 2017

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    Thanks for helping man, means a lot. But yeah, i'v thought about doing milestone stuff like that, i could defiantly make it work, but the extra thing is that my table aren't really role-players. I have one guy who just doesn't role play, and that's fine to me. I have another who makes over elaborate characters then plays them the same and another guy who just plays it as him kinda playing a game. For example i made a solar grab him and place a blade at his throat, and he barely responded with any worry.
    So, ultimately, i kinda wanna work in an RP aspect to exp, and my players aren't very good without a form of prompting.
    I'm not trying to seem like i'm complaining, so seriously, thanks.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

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    May 2015
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    Mesquite, TX

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    What i've done is reward players with extra xp for bypassing encounters with stealth or diplomacy, versus the extra cash they would get for defeating and looting opponents via combat.

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    Jormengand's Avatar

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    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    Two main rules for XP: One, you get the XP even if you don't murder the enemies in question (such as stealth or diplomacy) or even if you murder them in a way that isn't combat (you remote-detonate all of the orcs' traps, killing them). Two, you don't get XP for going out of your way to murder random stuff - that is, if your only reason for murdering these guys is that you'll get XP for it, you don't get XP for it.

    (The other way of doing it is of course to do away with XP entirely and just level up after a climactic battle or story event. That may or may not work for you.)

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Composer99's Avatar

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    Sep 2013

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    I'm a player in a Pathfinder adventure path, and one thing I've noticed is that they hand out XP for accomplishing story goals/encounters whether they involve combat or not, along with XP for defeating enemies/monsters. (Our DM's handed out bonus XP for roleplaying from time to time.)

    If you want to get your players to stop treating monsters the way Belkar does, you could consider not awarding XP for killing them as such; instead they get XP for successfully ending an encounter. It could be fighting, it could be sneaking, it could be diplomacy.

    In addition, they could get XP from fighting monsters if the monsters surrender or run away. That way, when they are in combat, they don't have to feel like they have to kill absolutely everything.

    You may already be doing some of these things, of course.

    All that said, you could also be using milestone advancement as suggested by some of the other posters already.
    ~ Composer99

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BlueKnightGuy

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    Sep 2016

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    Like a lot of folks, I'm going to recommend the milestone system. It turns a game about killing (whether or not that solves problems) into a game about solving problems (whether or not that involves killing).

    You mentioned that you "made a solar grab him and place a blade at his throat, and he barely responded with any worry." Worry is a response to consequences. Show the player that there are consequences to these kinds of situations and the player will very quickly learn to worry about their situation. Examples:
    • Treat the player as Restrained (rendering them vulnerable to attacks and unable to attack effectively) until they escape the grapple or remove the blade.
    • Allow the solar to make an attack with the blade as a reaction after the player makes any sudden movements. End this if the player escapes the grapple or removes the blade.
    • Communicate to the player that there are mechanics behind the fluff. Describe how the PC can hardly breathe without bringing the blade to graze their, and how they're restrained by it and how easily the solar could drive it into them.


    This doesn't just go for worry. Create rewards for nonviolent solutions like conversation, investigation, stealth and craft. You might show an NPC succeeding in one of these ways or have an NPC suggest one of these paths to get the ball rolling, then offer mechanical advantages to the players as they try these kinds of solutions for themselves.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

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    Dec 2017

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    Cheers to everyone who has helped out, it really means a lot. Just to let you know, i'm gonna be using the milestone system.

    I feel like i ought to give some better context to something, mostly for what GalacticAxeick.
    The situation where the solar grabbed one of my players wasn't a combat situation. Basically, the guy was a paladin who was a kinda mean to a lot of people, and cause the player wanted a pet gold dragon and knew that he wouldn't get it if he was evil, he decided to have a change of heart and begin worshiping the god, Bahamut.
    After a bit, Bahamut sent a solar down to test this guys loyalties, you know, put him in a dangerous situation and ask him a bunch of questions and see how he responds.

    This wasn't men't to be insightful or useful at all, i'm just telling a small story. Again, thank you to everyone trying to help.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Oct 2011

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    If your story and enemies are pre planned then you xp is fixed and should be designed to make the adventure moderately challenging.

    But you really have to design it to entertain your PC's. If they want to level grind so that bosses are easier to beat then just throw easier bosses at them. If they just want to fight enemies without much story then let them do that too.

    You can award inspiration to players acting in character. You could award additional XP for overcoming a challenge in a creative manner i.e. instead of just disarming a trap they creatively coax an enemy into setting it off.

    Personally, I generally just grant a level up at the end of each session. I'll reward roleplaying with inspiration, or I'll fudge a treasure roll in their favour.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

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    Dec 2017

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    I dont know why, but i keep forgetting about inspiration, i really need to use it more, thanks for reminding me.

    The thing is that the characters they played at the time where quite powerful, and i used the CR system, so the encounters where never really that difficult, so im pretty sure that they just want that sweet, sweet experience, and to be honest, so does everyone, but they kept me around after online sessions just to grind, and it was just kinda frustrating, so i wanted to change the system. Also, all of our campaigns are so short, i want a longer campaign, so i dont want to have it be session based.
    Last edited by Jam_Slatewhich; 2017-12-31 at 03:41 PM.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

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    May 2015
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    Mesquite, TX

    Default Re: New, and possible more interesting Experience system.

    I personally find Inspiration to be an underutilized mechanic. Here's how I would change it to make it more attractive for players to try and use it.

    You begin each session with Inspiration.
    You either have Inspiration or you dont, it cannot be stacked.
    When you have Inspiration, you may expend it to re-roll any d20 roll after seeing the result. You must use the result of the new roll, but if you roll a 10 or less, add 10 to the result and treat it as if that was the original roll(giving a possible value of 11-20).
    Once each per session, you may invoke your character's Ideal, Bond or Flaw prior to making a decision or performing an action. The DM will evaluate the proposed decision or action and if it deemed to be sufficiently in-character with the chosen motivation, you gain Inspiration.
    In order to invoke a character motivation, the proposed decision or action must have a significant cost to the character and/or party.

    For example;

    Invoking the Coward flaw to flee a battle the party is losing, leaving your injured comrades to fend for themselves.

    Invoking the Mercy ideal to expend valuable potions and/or spell slots to save the life of a stranger or defeated opponent, while knowing you will have more dangerous fights in the near future before you can rest and restock.

    Invoking the Omuerta bond to resist interrogation about your criminal compatriots, even though it means you will be imprisoned and possibly tortured.

    If you wish to tie Inspiration to in-game time instead of being session based, the rules are the same but you can gain Inspiration no more than once per day.
    Last edited by SkipSandwich; 2017-12-31 at 04:15 PM.

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