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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Feb 2015
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    Default Working on a doctor feat, hoping for some help

    Title says most of it. The 1st and 4th bullets are something that my group is ok with. I could use some advice on how to clean up the second bullet to provide a reason to be able to remove the listed conditions regardless of their source (intentionally being designed to thwart both magical and mundane conditions). Perhaps following in the footsteps of the Healer feat and how the UA Artificers alchemist healing works would be a good start. (limiting to 1 application of these things per short/long rest). I fear that the ability to remove conditional ailments caused by magic may be the source of a de-sync between and other members of the group, but that is partly because of a locked mindset that magic just works and science can always be explained. Anyway, I figure I can just post my idea up here and see what the playground is willing to help with.

    DOCTOR
    Prerequisite: Alchemist Supplies or Herbalism Kit. Intelligence or Wisdom score of 13 or higher.
    • You may tend to up to 6 creatures over the course of a short rest that does not impede your own ability to rest. Creatures you tend to may use your proficiency bonus in place of their constitution modifier when they expend hit dice to regain hit points.
    • After you complete a short or long rest you can create poultices using either and herbalism kit or alchemist supplies. You can produce a number of poultices equal to your proficiency bonus. These poultices deteriorate 16 hours after being made. It takes an action to use a poultice. When applied, a poultice ends one disease or condition affecting that creature, or restore the creature's hit point maximum to its original value. The condition removed can be blinded, deafened, paralyzed, or poisoned. Conditions from permanent injuries cannot be removed until the injury is cured.
    • As an action, you can identify one poison or disease affecting that creature that you were previously unaware of. You must be within 5 feet of the creature and be able to clearly see the target and you must still possess knowledge of the poison or disease.
    • If you take an hour each day to tend to a creature while they are recovering, that creatures recovery time is reduced by half.


    Things that might help: Require an Arcana Check to "workaround" magical ailments instead of providing a flat "it works", or maybe a medicine check vs the spell save DC. 3rd bullet, require more time with the patient (like the Battlemaster and Mastermind features) and require a check to ID the disease.

    Anyway, please let me know if I'm barking up the wrong tree on this one.
    Last edited by Gr7mm Bobb; 2018-01-01 at 10:23 AM.
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    When questioning matters of whether something in a game is "Broken", one should always consider if it is being implimented beyond its designed intent. This is in addition to looking at how mechanically healthy the questioned material is.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

    Join Date
    Jul 2015
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    The Netherlands
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    Default Re: Working on a doctor feat, hoping for some help

    Quote Originally Posted by Gr7mm Bobb View Post
    You may tend to up to 6 creatures over the course of a short rest that does not impede your own ability to rest. Creatures you tend to may use your proficiency bonus in place of their constitution modifier when they expend hit dice to regain hit points.
    This is pretty interesting, it's an alteration of the Song of Rest concept that I haven't seen before. I like the 'extra HP per hit die' approach, but I don't know if using your Prof in place of their Con works properly in practice. For one, it's unlikely to do anything before level 5, since every competent player is likely to have at least a 14 in Con. Secondly, it helps low-Con characters more than high-Con ones, thus indirectly buffing backliners. Third, it carries the weird implication that if you're a naturally robust person, medical treatment of wounds does NOTHING for you.

    Granting extra HP per hit die equal to half your Prof, or something like that, might be a more reliable alternative.

    After you complete a short or long rest you can create poultices using either and herbalism kit or alchemist supplies. You can produce a number of poultices equal to your proficiency bonus. These poultices deteriorate 16 hours after being made. It takes an action to use a poultice. When applied, a poultice ends one disease or condition affecting that creature, or restore the creature's hit point maximum to its original value. The condition removed can be blinded, deafened, paralyzed, or poisoned. Conditions from permanent injuries cannot be removed until the injury is cured.
    Yeah, I don't think you're going to find a rational explanation for how this works. It's a pretty bizarre concept no matter how you put it. I mean, if someone has been deafened by a loud noise or by the Blindness/Deafness spell, what does curing them with a poultice look like? Do you put it in their ear?

    Jokes aside, a way to make this easier to swallow might be to say that poultices must be specifically made for the condition they cure, but that they can be made during the day, taking maybe a minute. (With the justification being that you have all the ingredients prepared and pre-treated, and merely have to mix the right ones.) There would still be a limit on how many you can make before you need to prepare new ingredients (i.e. rest). This is obviously a nerf compared to the way it works currently, but it still functions fine against lasting conditions (diseases, lowered max HP), and you can prepare them in advance if you know what you're about to face.

    Regarding magical ailments, you could perhaps use the Counterspell method: Conditions from low-level spells are removed automatically, ones from high-level spells require a roll. Maybe the highest level you can automatically remove is equal to your Prof. Of course, that leaves the awkward question of what to do with monster abilities. Don't know about that one.

    As an action, you can identify one poison or disease affecting that creature that you were previously unaware of. You must be within 5 feet of the creature and be able to clearly see the target and you must still possess knowledge of the poison or disease.
    You suggested adding a roll to this, but making a check to diagnose an illness is already what the Medicine skill is for. Like, that is its one listed purpose besides stabilising a dying person. I don't think there are any rules on how long it takes to diagnose someone and what the difficulty is, so this bullet is of dubious purpose at best.

    If you take an hour each day to tend to a creature while they are recovering, that creatures recovery time is reduced by half.
    I can't wrap my head around what this means. As far as I know, 'recovery time' is not an established concept in 5e.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Orc in the Playground
     
    BlueKnightGuy

    Join Date
    Sep 2016

    Default Re: Working on a doctor feat, hoping for some help

    I wrote some rules for this, including changes for Wisdom (Medicine) and a few feats, to accomplish some of this. Might inspire changes or additions to this feat!

    http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/Bk_qMLV3e
    Last edited by GalacticAxekick; 2018-01-01 at 03:11 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Feb 2015
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    Male

    Default Re: Working on a doctor feat, hoping for some help

    Quote Originally Posted by Lalliman View Post
    This is pretty interesting, it's an alteration of the Song of Rest concept that I haven't seen before. I like the 'extra HP per hit die' approach, but I don't know if using your Prof in place of their Con works properly in practice. For one, it's unlikely to do anything before level 5, since every competent player is likely to have at least a 14 in Con. Secondly, it helps low-Con characters more than high-Con ones, thus indirectly buffing backliners. Third, it carries the weird implication that if you're a naturally robust person, medical treatment of wounds does NOTHING for you.

    Granting extra HP per hit die equal to half your Prof, or something like that, might be a more reliable alternative.
    Point, that is something that could be argued. I can see where you're coming from. A mid ground perspective is to allow them to sub out there Con for your Prof as is, but if they have a Con that is equal to or higher than your Prof they can gain an additional # of HP equal to the HD + Con + 1/2 your proficiency. This way it can cater to both the frail characters and the hardy in a way that is impactful to both without handing out too much HP.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lalliman View Post
    Yeah, I don't think you're going to find a rational explanation for how this works. It's a pretty bizarre concept no matter how you put it. I mean, if someone has been deafened by a loud noise or by the Blindness/Deafness spell, what does curing them with a poultice look like? Do you put it in their ear?

    Jokes aside, a way to make this easier to swallow might be to say that poultices must be specifically made for the condition they cure, but that they can be made during the day, taking maybe a minute. (With the justification being that you have all the ingredients prepared and pre-treated, and merely have to mix the right ones.) There would still be a limit on how many you can make before you need to prepare new ingredients (i.e. rest). This is obviously a nerf compared to the way it works currently, but it still functions fine against lasting conditions (diseases, lowered max HP), and you can prepare them in advance if you know what you're about to face.

    Regarding magical ailments, you could perhaps use the Counterspell method: Conditions from low-level spells are removed automatically, ones from high-level spells require a roll. Maybe the highest level you can automatically remove is equal to your Prof. Of course, that leaves the awkward question of what to do with monster abilities. Don't know about that one.
    One of the concepts I am bouncing around my head atm is the ability to create "refresh" potions using supplies from your herbalism kit or alchemist supplies. When applied to a creature they can expend a HD to attempt to shake a condition affecting their body, thus providing a reroll for them that uses your Intelligence or Wisdom (Medicine) skill bonus instead of their own. I can also just limit it so that a creature can only benefit from this feature once (or both HD cost + 1/short rest). I do have a lot of variables to consider: how are conditions without saves handled, what conditions can be removed, what kind of knowledge and preporation is required to create one of these potions (stim packs, detox shot?). Also like the 3rd bullet from GalacticAxekick's Mental Healer Feat in terms of expending HD for THP and feel like it could have something I can use.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lalliman View Post
    You suggested adding a roll to this, but making a check to diagnose an illness is already what the Medicine skill is for. Like, that is its one listed purpose besides stabilising a dying person. I don't think there are any rules on how long it takes to diagnose someone and what the difficulty is, so this bullet is of dubious purpose at best.
    Point, perhaps given adv on the roll and the ability to speed up the recovery from a disease or poison? The intent behind it was to provide a way for the Doctor to more reliably indentify and treat the ailments of their patients.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lalliman View Post
    I can't wrap my head around what this means. As far as I know, 'recovery time' is not an established concept in 5e.
    I think I finally figured out where my head was with this one. This was a blanket concept on "recovery time" on the whole. But also directly inspired by the Recupurrating section in the PHB on page 187 under Downtime Activities. Looking at it a bit closer, I has potential, but is completely outshown by the 2 bullets above it.
    Spoiler
    Show
    When questioning matters of whether something in a game is "Broken", one should always consider if it is being implimented beyond its designed intent. This is in addition to looking at how mechanically healthy the questioned material is.

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