Results 31 to 36 of 36
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2018-01-07, 03:52 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2006
- Location
Re: Unbelievable Lies and the Liars Who Tell Them
There are, too, real-world reports of people so good at fast-talking that they can get people to just hand them their wallets after a few minutes of conversation. Not because they've persuaded the person on a conscious level that giving them their wallet is a good idea, but because they're playing on distraction and social cues to get the reaction they want without the mark consciously thinking about it. I think you can find youtube video of it, though I'm too lazy to bother right now. And, of course, any video is arguably staged, so it's hard to use it as 100% proof.
Still, if it's even marginally believable that such things could happen in the real world, a sufficient bluff check could arguably believably achieve similarly outrageous results. Maybe you don't overtly convince the guard to let you past. Instead, you've got him so discombobulated or distracted looking for what you're "up to" that when you shake hands and part ways casually he doesn't even notice that he's let you by. Maybe you achieve this by inverting, at least momentarily, whether he's letting you in or out, so you "give up" and "go back in" as he takes a minute or so to realize, wait, you went the wrong way.
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2018-01-07, 05:18 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2016
Re: Unbelievable Lies and the Liars Who Tell Them
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2018-01-08, 01:16 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2012
- Location
- In the Playground, duh.
Re: Unbelievable Lies and the Liars Who Tell Them
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2018-01-08, 02:40 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2006
- Location
- Oregon
- Gender
Re: Unbelievable Lies and the Liars Who Tell Them
The irony is strong.
The false equivalence has already been shown, you're just ignoring it with your most recent "example" of climbing a completely flat wall. Which is not a single check, but a series of checks based on the distance required, with increasing penalties for failure that require an even higher skill and prepared equipment to avoid.
Oh, and it's also against the rules,
Originally Posted by Climb DCs
You're using the "a 9th level spell can do this so any spell can" argument, except replacing 9th level spells with ridiculously char-op'd skill results and/or actual spells. So both of those are wrong. Meanwhile hiding behind nothing requires supernatural effects except in the possible edge case of a particular version of Hide in Plain Sight is marked as both Ex and not requiring any particular terrain or lighting, so that one's wrong too.
*A specialized 10th level character with a +10 bluff item (assuming there's a printed one) can land the 20 vs 1 suggestion bluff, at around the same level domination magic appears, the point at which bluffing your way past something should no longer be viable anyway. Against someone with an actual Sense Motive rank they're still doomed, and as always an encounter bypassed without significant risk or resources spent no longer qualifies as an encounter. A creature with a climb speed still needs a total +52 (then +8 from climb speed and auto-take 10) in order to climb a perfectly smooth surface.
If a table actually has characters rolling skill checks high enough to hit epic DCs, then they're probably past the point where a 1 round bluff is going to invalidate anything, and sure the DM should probably have some results for them. That is literally the whole reason they wrote epic skill DCs into the ELH, for epic characters that make epic skill checks. These are not normal characters and have no bearing on the rest of the system. The vast majority of people getting the "lol sure you rolled a 20" result are not hitting these DCs, I'm pretty dang certain. That, or the other disconnect of only considering specialized characters of 10th+ level with highly statistically improbable rolls when they talk about "the game."Last edited by Fizban; 2018-01-08 at 02:43 AM.
Fizban's Tweaks and Brew: Google Drive (PDF), Thread
A collection of over 200 pages of individually small bans, tweaks, brews, and rule changes, usable piecemeal or nearly altogether, and even some convenient lists. Everything I've done that I'd call done enough to use in one place (plus a number of things I'm working on that aren't quite done, of course).
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2018-01-08, 03:14 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2012
- Location
- In the Playground, duh.
Re: Unbelievable Lies and the Liars Who Tell Them
I mean, sure, some bluffs have outrageously high DCs and rolling a 20 doesn't automatically pass. That doesn't magically mean that you need gather information to roll a bluff check or some crap.
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2018-01-08, 03:31 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2011
Re: Unbelievable Lies and the Liars Who Tell Them
{Scrubbed}
Last edited by Roland St. Jude; 2018-01-09 at 01:01 AM.
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