Is Rick Sanchez CE according to 5e standards? Sure he is.

[No brains]

And Legend of Zelda's Link goes into dungeons, make things explode just to check if he can, manipulate people, the environment and time itself to make his far-fetched ideas possible, kills monsters when he needs pocket changes and spend a lot of time on random sidequests.

There might be similarities, but it doesn't make Link a D&D character.

But Link and Rick could be D&D characters. All it takes is someone leaping for a springboard of inspiration. It might be seen as gauche to make an expy, but if the character grows beyond their inspiration, they can become a good character in their own right. Rick himself started as a terrible parody of Doc Brown.

So it may still be useful to ask what D&D parameters a fictional character aligns with. Maybe somebody wants to know if their Rick Expy would be able to shank a Rakshasha to death, since that's the only way alignment really matters anymore. If someone wants to know if this pattern of behavior would result in the fruitful stabbing of a causality-violating tiger, that's relevant to both roleplay and optimization in D&D.

[Malifice]

I'm with Mal here, Rick barely ever acts out of anything but his own self interest. He's a protagonist, but he ain't Good with a capital G.

That said, status as a protagonist or antagonist has nothing to do with alignment.

Tony Soprano is the protagonist of the Sopranos, and he is very (very) much Evil. Same with Dexter, Walter White (after starting as Good in early seasons), the Punisher, Titus Pullo etc.

All protagonists, and all evil.

One of the antagonists in Breaking Bad is Walts brother Hank who is clearly LG. Walt (the protagonist) winds up very much NE.

[Malifice]

I could possibly buy CN.

Which is truly unusual for a genocidal monster.

[Talamare]

Insignificant? They're a galaxy containing at least one entire species (sentient, sapient, technologically advanced people). Rick first creates them, then enslaves them, and rules them through fear and deception... and then when they learn the truth and ask to be set free, he wipes the entire species out in a moment of genocidal stubbornness.

To kill one man who discovered his secret and against whom he had a grudge.



A PC who created a demi-plane (effectively what Rick did) in which an entire species of sentient people evolves, then proceeds to enslave those people, and rule them through fear, before wiping them out in a genocidal rage over a car battery is ****ing EVIL.

That I even have to explain this to you is deeply deeply worrying.



What? Dont be revisionist. He brough down the Citadel of Ricks and the Galactic government, committing hundreds of murders (personally) in the process, and resulting in the deaths of millions if not billions of people.

For the sole reason of breaking up his Daughter and her husband. He then trolls his grandson about what he did and why (while saying he also wants some Sechuan sauce).



No. Just no.

Youre conflating the fact that (from our perspective as viewers of the show) Rick Sanchez is the protagonist.

To everyone else in the universe (barring his grandson and daughter) he is the principal villian and protagonist who can (and often does) kill people, whole planets, and from time to time entire universes, often on nothing more than an existentialist whim.

For the love of God man, he rigs a neutrino bomb (in a labrynth of death traps he also made) and puts his son and current adventuring companions (the Vindicators) inside this death trap (killing several of them, and very nearly the entire planet the bomb is on) simply to prove a point.

Morty says this isnt the first time he's done it.

Jesus dude. I mean come on.

I don't know why I have to repeat myself.
Killing insignificant lifeforms does not make you Evil.

There is no revisionism, they spend an entire episode when they conquered Earth to prove that the Galactic Government was Orwellian. I'm not sure how you missed that.

I think you took the Szechuan sauce throw away joke too seriously

Stop trying to dismiss the things I'm saying by including lines such as
"That I even have to explain this to you is deeply deeply worrying."
"Jesus dude. I mean come on."
"Youre conflating the fact that (from our perspective as viewers of the show) Rick Sanchez is the protagonist."
If you disagree with me, that's fine. There is no compulsion to respond to everything.

Rick is by definition Chaotic Good
"He acts as his conscience directs, with little regard for what others expect."

[Kane0]

"Act with arbitrary violence, spurred by their greed, hatred, or bloodlust"
"Do whatever they can get away with, without compassion or qualms"
"Follow their whims, holding their personal freedom above all else"

These also describe Rick.

[Talamare]

"Act with arbitrary violence, spurred by their greed, hatred, or bloodlust"
"Do whatever they can get away with, without compassion or qualms"
"Follow their whims, holding their personal freedom above all else"

These also describe Rick.

He has shown to have occasional qualms

Example where he is shown to be centrally motivated by Greed, Hatred, and/or Bloodlust?
- He didn't destroy the Council of Ricks or Galactic Government out of Hatred, since he would have done it sooner.
- He did it solely to protect his family.
- I shouldn't even need to mention Greed.

He has shown to hold his family above his personal freedom.

[Malifice]

I don't know why I have to repeat myself.
Killing insignificant lifeforms does not make you Evil.

They were not insignificant life forms!

They were the (sentient, sapient, technologically advanced) population of an entire planet!

If they're insignificant, arent also homo-sapiens?

Aside from size, whats the difference?

Rick is by definition Chaotic Good

No he is not. He is a murderous, genocidal monster.

If you think otherwise, you're wrong.

"He acts as his conscience directs, with little regard for what others expect."

So... you're saying if my PCs conscience directed him to murder, rape and enslave people (without regard for what others expect) you would call me 'Chaotic Good'.

Cool story bro. Youre wrong.

**** me mate. How are you even arguing this with a straight face?

[Dyndrilliac]

Rick is a nihilist, which makes him Chaotic Neutral. The only thing he's dedicated to destroying are McNuggets dipped in Szechuan sauce, via his mouth. The only thing he hates is the stupidity of others. The only thing he truly cherishes is his own personal freedom. Everything else is merely the collateral damage of his shenanigans, which on the cosmic scale are utterly unimportant and meaningless. His actions lead to an entire species being eradicated? Who cares, the multiverse continues on as if nothing happened. There are an infinite number of universes where that same species is alive and kicking, no harm, no foul. It's indifference, not malice. He doesn't care if one universe is irreparably damaged because there are infinitely more waiting in the wings.

[Knaight]

Rick is a nihilist, which makes him Chaotic Neutral. The only thing he's dedicated to destroying are McNuggets dipped in Szechuan sauce, via his mouth. The only thing he hates is the stupidity of others. The only thing he truly cherishes is his own personal freedom. Everything else is merely the collateral damage of his shenanigans, which on the cosmic scale are utterly unimportant and meaningless. His actions lead to an entire species being eradicated? Who cares, the multiverse continues on as if nothing happened. There are an infinite number of universes where that same species is alive and kicking, no harm, no foul. It's indifference, not malice. He doesn't care if one universe is irreparably damaged because there are infinitely more waiting in the wings.

"The universe doesn't care" can be used to justify basically anything. Murder a dozen people? Whatever, that's a dozen out of billions, of one species on one planet. No biggie. The universe doesn't care. It's a thoroughly unimpressive argument.

As for indifference and malice, indifference is a better position. That doesn't mean it's not still terrible, and when the sort of collateral damage being talked about here is being caused by indifference it's still an indication that the person doing is is a terrible person.

It's also not even accurate. Rick is all about petty, stupid enmity. The scientist in the miniverse he made is probably the single most blatant example.

[Malifice]

Rick is a nihilist, which makes him Chaotic Neutral.

Nihlist? Like Tharizdun and Shar?

They aint 'neutral'. Not morally. They're NE.

The only thing he's dedicated to destroying are McNuggets dipped in Szechuan sauce, via his mouth. The only thing he hates is the stupidity of others. The only thing he truly cherishes is his own personal freedom.

Upon which reasoning.... he engages in murder, slavery and genocide.

He is totally happy enslaving an entire species of people to walk on treadmills for eternity to power his car battery.

A car that he's equipped with muderous AI.

After genociding 2 seperate universes, and extinguishing all life therein (presumably to kill a single man, his microverse rival), he then forces the miniverse people to walk on treadmills as slaves forever on pain of gencocide.

He imprisons associates in deathraps wired with neutrino bombs just to teach them a lesson. On more than one occasion.

He is depicted pushing his grandson down stairs just to get a laugh.

During his (many) criminal enterprises, he's shown hinself to be perfectly prepared to murder people to get away with it.

His girlfriend assimilated an entire planets worth of people, enslaving them. Rick then proceeded to have sex with the enslaved people.

I could go on and on and on. The man is CE.

He literally has one redeeming feature and its his love for his daughter. Who he abandoned in his home dimension full of Cronenbergs. And then abandoned her in a second universe when he pissed off the squirells. And the third one he has now possibly cloned. And stared a galactic civil war, killing millions of people (personally murdering dozens himself) simply to wreck her marriage.

It's indifference, not malice.

If I repeatedly rape people out of indifference to their suffering, instead of raping them out of malice, am I 'morally neutral'?

If I repeatedly murder people out of indifference to their suffering, instead of murdering them out of malice, am I 'morally neutral'?

If I repeatedly torture people... you get the idea.

[Dyndrilliac]

I'm not saying he isn't bad or immoral. He is both of those things and worse. But evil, in the D&D sense, requires malevolence. Rick has none. Therefore your argument is invalid.

[Malifice]

I'm not saying he isn't bad or immoral. He is. But evil, in the D&D sense, requires malevolence.

No, it doesnt

For ****s sake.

Are you saying I can act immoraly (rape, murder, torture, genocide, slavery), but as long as I lack malevolence (genuinely think Im a good person, and doing those things for good reasons or for reasons other than malevolence)... I am not evil?

[RedMage125]

What I find amusing about Rick -and I love this thread, I've mused on this in my own time before this- is what happens when you look at Toxic Rick.

Let me preface this by stating that Rick does, indeed, evince all the outward characteristics of a sociopath. A Neutral Evil or Chaotic Evil one at that.

But Toxic Rick LOVES Morty, and Cleansed Rick actually-despite seeming more gentle and humane-does not. Cleansed Rick is actually the sociopath, with no empathy, love, or emotion. He's just not a d*ck, so it's hard to tell.

Cleansed Rick and Morty were purged of what THEY considered "toxic". Morty, obviously, considered his conscience as something that was keeping him from being "healthy", right up there with his insecurity. But Rick...Rick thought that his love for his family was a "toxin" in his system. His emotional attachment to his biological kin was something he viewed as a pathogen to be purged.

Rick isn't a sociopath...but he wishes he was. He tries with all his might to kill callously, emotionally scar everyone around him, and espouse a stance that rejects "giving a f***". He does this in the hopes that he will become a true sociopath. We've also seen in other episodes that he's actually HEAVILY weighed down with the weight of not only what he's done, but what he's lost. He has been occasionally suicidal (the end of the episode where he passes out drunk while trying to kill himself). He's also constantly engaging in self-destructive acts (not the least of which is his drinking, which is leading to psoriasis of his liver-just compare the color of his skin to that of Cleansed Rick), hoping to eventually find a challenge that he can't overcome that will end him.

As per the OP's original question, Rick Sanchez would, indeed be Chaotic Evil by a D&D metric. Because alignment in D&D stems from actions and outlook, not the other way around. For my personal summary of him, I'd say he's Chaotic Evil with Chaotic Neutral tendencies, because deep-down, he's not a callous murder-hobo. But he hates that about himself, and has been trying to make himself into one.

[RedMage125]

I'm not saying he isn't bad or immoral. He is both of those things and worse. But evil, in the D&D sense, requires malevolence. Rick has none. Therefore your argument is invalid.

Malifice and I disagree a lot about alignment issues, but I need to stand with him on this one. You, sir, are 100% factually incorrect.

Don't take offense, I'm not insulting you, but your facts are in error.

One of the most classic definitions of evil is "selfish, without regard for others." Neutral Evil is often this. There has never been a requirement for "malevolence". No book says that. If you think it does, I challenge you to provide a page number as proof. Until then:

3.5e PHB: "'Evil' implies hurting, oppressing, and killing others. Some evil creatures simply have no compassion for others and kill without qualms if doing so is convenient." Rick does all of these things.

4e PHB: "Evil characters don't necessarily go out of their way to hurt people, but they're perfectly willing to take advantage of the weakness of others to acquire what they want." Oh, looky, the rules even seem to say malevolence is not a prerequisite to Evil.

5e PHB: "Neutral Evil is the alignment of those who do whatever they can get away with, without compassion or qualms." Rick to a T, and nothing about malevolence.

The last 3 editions of D&D say you are wrong, sir. Your move.

[DeadMech]

To be fair, you need an INT score of 22+ to appreciate Rick & Morty.

*Sigh* ... I was gonna make that joke.

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand D&D 5e alignment threads. The humour is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of theoretical philosophy most of the jokes will go over a typical readers head. There's also Xanathar's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into his characterisation- his personal philosophy draws heavily from Narodnaya Volya literature, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of these jokes, to realise that they're not just funny- they say something deep about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike D&D 5e Alignment truly ARE idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in Xanathars's existential catchphrase "So why can't people who use magic do it all the time? I can disintegrate things whenever I want. Like now. And now. and now. And now... here where'd everyone go?" which itself is a cryptic reference to Turgenevs Russian epic Fathers and Sons. I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as Mike Mearls' genius wit unfolds itself on their tabletops. What fools.. how I pity them. 😂

And yes, by the way, i DO have a D&D 5e alignment tattoo. And no, you cannot see it. It's for the ladies' eyes only- and even then they have to demonstrate that they're within 5 IQ points of my own (preferably lower) beforehand. Nothin personnel kid 😎

[Unoriginal]

Rick is by definition Chaotic Good
"He acts as his conscience directs, with little regard for what others expect."

You can't commit torture, genocide and other atrocities and be acting "as your conscience directs".

Conscience would prevent you from doing those things if you listened to it, by the very definition of the concept.

Also, just to say, but in D&D it's totally possible to kill evil people and do evil in the process.

[Blas_de_Lezo]

*Sigh* ... I was gonna make that joke.

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand D&D 5e alignment threads. The humour is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of theoretical philosophy most of the jokes will go over a typical readers head. There's also Xanathar's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into his characterisation- his personal philosophy draws heavily from Narodnaya Volya literature, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of these jokes, to realise that they're not just funny- they say something deep about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike D&D 5e Alignment truly ARE idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in Xanathars's existential catchphrase "So why can't people who use magic do it all the time? I can disintegrate things whenever I want. Like now. And now. and now. And now... here where'd everyone go?" which itself is a cryptic reference to Turgenevs Russian epic Fathers and Sons. I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as Mike Mearls' genius wit unfolds itself on their tabletops. What fools.. how I pity them. 😂

And yes, by the way, i DO have a D&D 5e alignment tattoo. And no, you cannot see it. It's for the ladies' eyes only- and even then they have to demonstrate that they're within 5 IQ points of my own (preferably lower) beforehand. Nothin personnel kid 😎

That was a nice joke when it first appeared, but now it has quickly become the new "I watch R&M so I'm smart"...

Back to line, I find the analysis of Toxic Rick as very appealing. Toxic Rick is the epitome of evil, and he kinda "loves" Morty... That bring us back to the fact that evil characters (remember, using a D&D metric) are indeed capable of loving. Many atrocities have been comitted in the name of love, and that doesn't make characters less evil!

[S_A_M I AM]

I don't know why I have to repeat myself.
Killing insignificant lifeforms does not make you Evil.

"...And that's what your holy men discuss, is it?" [asked Granny Weatherwax.]
"Not usually. There is a very interesting debate raging at the moment on the nature of sin. for example." [answered Mightily Oats.]
"And what do they think? Against it, are they?"
"It's not as simple as that. It's not a black and white issue. There are so many shades of gray."
"Nope."
"Pardon?"
"There's no grays, only white that's got grubby. I'm surprised you don't know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
"It's a lot more complicated than that--"
"No. It ain't. When people say things are a lot more complicated than that, they means they're getting worried that they won't like the truth. People as things, that's where it starts."
"Oh, I'm sure there are worse crimes--"
"But they starts with thinking about people as things..."

Source.

People are not insignificant.

I get that you may be trying to talk within the ethical boundaries that are established within the context of the show, frankly, you're not being very coherent without that assumption and you deserve the benefit of the doubt.

And to be fair, Rick does find that kind of sentiment aspirational, even if that's not what the show communicates it's various morals. It is explicit within the text of the show: Rick is a ****ing broken person, because, amongst other things, he's capital-E Evil.

I am genuinely shocked and appalled at the **** you're saying, Mate.
Is there some context we're missing?

[S_A_M I AM]

Those political alignments are the worst thing. America NE, the USSR LN? Liberalism is CN, but actual anarchy is CG? ****ing retarded.

Rick is CN trending CE. But the alignment system is terrible, as your sig demonstrates.

To elaborate on this point without having to actually get into a political argument? I'd put anarchism (or at least social and socialist anarchism) somewhere in the neutral spectrum thanks to how it's underlying expectations of behaviour remove hierarchical structures and then emphasises the social contract and then, what is definitionally vigilantism as a way to reinforce non-hierarchical order.



I hope that comes of as being a statement without moral judgement.

[Naanomi]

Which afterlife would he fit best in... I’d say the howling selfish madness of Pandemonium or the tortured self-loathing of Carceri... putting him at CE (though not Abyss-archetypical CE) with tinges/possibility of CN and NE

[Sigreid]

IMO he would be CE. His driving character trait is that he believes the universe is so vast that nothing in it matters. Because of this he is miserable, hating nearly everything almost as much as he hates himself. Birdman even pointed out that it's because he doesn't care that he has great power to save or destroy. Birdperson also let Morty know that Rick's catchphrase means "I am in great pain".

Rick is at his core a vicious wounded animal with a godlike intellect.

[Rhedyn]

I would say CN.

For example, the death game with the vindicators. That group also destroyed world's. They were just as bad as Rick in the grandscale. Yet before destroying them, Rick killed their galactic threat enemy. He destroys both sides on a drunken whim.

Another example, he destroys the galactic government and the council of Ricks. Both entities are neither good or evil completely, but both threatened his freedom. The government improved quality of life but was also pretty dystopian in their control of people to the point a human resistance existed. The Ricks are pretty evil on the whole but kept all the Ricks within certain rules and contained the damage they could be doing.

Rick's actions veer the universe towards chaos, but in terms of good and evil his overall impact can be argued as neutral. By no means is Rick a good man. His cause is not just. He saves and destroys worlds on a whim and he disregards all authority.

Basically a murderhobo by DnD standards and they always claim to be CN.

[Dankus Memakus]

What I find amusing about Rick -and I love this thread, I've mused on this in my own time before this- is what happens when you look at Toxic Rick.

Let me preface this by stating that Rick does, indeed, evince all the outward characteristics of a sociopath. A Neutral Evil or Chaotic Evil one at that.

But Toxic Rick LOVES Morty, and Cleansed Rick actually-despite seeming more gentle and humane-does not. Cleansed Rick is actually the sociopath, with no empathy, love, or emotion. He's just not a d*ck, so it's hard to tell.

Cleansed Rick and Morty were purged of what THEY considered "toxic". Morty, obviously, considered his conscience as something that was keeping him from being "healthy", right up there with his insecurity. But Rick...Rick thought that his love for his family was a "toxin" in his system. His emotional attachment to his biological kin was something he viewed as a pathogen to be purged.

Rick isn't a sociopath...but he wishes he was. He tries with all his might to kill callously, emotionally scar everyone around him, and espouse a stance that rejects "giving a f***". He does this in the hopes that he will become a true sociopath. We've also seen in other episodes that he's actually HEAVILY weighed down with the weight of not only what he's done, but what he's lost. He has been occasionally suicidal (the end of the episode where he passes out drunk while trying to kill himself). He's also constantly engaging in self-destructive acts (not the least of which is his drinking, which is leading to psoriasis of his liver-just compare the color of his skin to that of Cleansed Rick), hoping to eventually find a challenge that he can't overcome that will end him.

As per the OP's original question, Rick Sanchez would, indeed be Chaotic Evil by a D&D metric. Because alignment in D&D stems from actions and outlook, not the other way around. For my personal summary of him, I'd say he's Chaotic Evil with Chaotic Neutral tendencies, because deep-down, he's not a callous murder-hobo. But he hates that about himself, and has been trying to make himself into one.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. For those who keep referencing Ricks past and how he was a revolutionary, he may have been good once but now he isn't. Alignment is subject to change so don't get so upset when others say he's evil which he is. He may one day not be so evil. We know there's a glimmer of hope somewhere down in Ricks soul to do the right thing, it's just suppressed by his self hatred and uncaring attitude. For now though I agree with the fact he's CE with a CN bent

[Sigreid]

I agree with this wholeheartedly. For those who keep referencing Ricks past and how he was a revolutionary, he may have been good once but now he isn't. Alignment is subject to change so don't get so upset when others say he's evil which he is. He may one day not be so evil. We know there's a glimmer of hope somewhere down in Ricks soul to do the right thing, it's just suppressed by his self hatred and uncaring attitude. For now though I agree with the fact he's CE with a CN bent

Personal theory is that Morty is not a moron and Rick recognizes that Morty could be just like him, something he's determined to stop. He puts Morty down in the hopes that he does not realize his full potential, which Rick sees as a path to loneliness and misery.

[Submortimer]

Just so this is here to see...

Spoiler: Alignment

Show

Lawful good (LG) creatures can be counted on to do the right thing as expected by society. Gold dragons, paladins, and most dwarves are lawful good.


Neutral good (NG) folk do the best they can to help others according to their needs. Many celestials, some cloud giants, and most gnomes are neutral good.


Chaotic good (CG) creatures act as their conscience directs, with little regard for what others expect. Copper dragons, many elves, and unicorns are chaotic good.


Lawful neutral (LN) individuals act in accordance with law, tradition, or personal codes. Many monks and some wizards are lawful neutral.


Neutral (N) is the alignment of those who prefer to steer clear of moral questions and don't take sides, doing what seems best at the time. Lizardfolk, most druids, and many humans are neutral.


Chaotic neutral (CN) creatures follow their whims, holding their personal freedom above all else. Many barbarians and rogues, and some bards, are chaotic neutral.


Lawful evil (LE) creatures methodically take what they want, within the limits of a code of tradition, loyalty, or order. Devils, blue dragons, and hobgoblins are Lawful evil.


Neutral evil (NE) is the alignment of those who do whatever they can get away with, without compassion or qualms. Many drow, some cloud giants, and yugoloths are neutraI evil.


Chaotic evil (CE) creatures act with arbitrary violence, spurred by their greed, hatred, or bloodlust. Demons, red dragons, and orcs are chaotic evil.

Now, by that, I'd say Rick C-137 fits mostly into Neutral Evil instead of Chaotic Evil: Yes, he does do terrible things and kill people indiscriminately, but he's never violent for the sole purpose of being violent.

Krombopulus Michael? Sure. He just loves killing, and does so for money. But not Rick.

It's somewhere in the nebulous region between Chaotic Neutral and Neutral Evil. Most episodes, I'd probably classify him as the former, but otherwise he's certainly the latter.

[willdaBEAST]

I haven't been on these forums long enough to see how cyclical these arguments are, but this thread reminds me of all the people justifying Walter White's behavior throughout Breaking Bad. As illustrated by this thread, people have an extremely hard time recognizing an evil protagonist. When we see almost everything through a main character's perspective, we tend to sympathize with their plight and are trained by most media to see them as a hero. Any well written fictional character will have moments where they deviate from whatever alignment you wish to categorize them as (if you choose to undergo that labeling), but I think that when you take all their actions into account, both Walter White and Rick Sanchez would be defined as evil by DnD standards. Rick may have a redemption arc in future seasons, but currently I think there's no doubt that the show's writers/creators fully intend for him to be perceived as evil and season three seemed to be focused on reinforcing how toxic he can be.

[Rhedyn]

I haven't been on these forums long enough to see how cyclical these arguments are, but this thread reminds me of all the people justifying Walter White's behavior throughout Breaking Bad. As illustrated by this thread, people have an extremely hard time recognizing an evil protagonist. When we see almost everything through a main character's perspective, we tend to sympathize with their plight and are trained by most media to see them as a hero. Any well written fictional character will have moments where they deviate from whatever alignment you wish to categorize them as (if you choose to undergo that labeling), but I think that when you take all their actions into account, both Walter White and Rick Sanchez would be defined as evil by DnD standards. Rick may have a redemption arc in future seasons, but currently I think there's no doubt that the show's writers/creators fully intend for him to be perceived as evil and season three seemed to be focused on reinforcing how toxic he can be.

Walter White is evil. He even admits he did it all because he liked it. CE/NE at it's finest.

Rick is not a psychopath, but he is so chaotic that it seems evil to us law abiding citizens. He doesn't believe in socal order or the social contact. Through that lens, his actions are less malicious. He's more random than anything, just powerful enough that such things can save or end worlds. CN

[willdaBEAST]

Walter White is evil. He even admits he did it all because he liked it. CE/NE at it's finest.

Rick is not a psychopath, but he is so chaotic that it seems evil to us law abiding citizens. He doesn't believe in socal order or the social contact. Through that lens, his actions are less malicious. He's more random than anything, just powerful enough that such things can save or end worlds. CN

I don't have a problem with Rick being CN or somewhere between CN, NE and CE, but I think he's done a lot more intentionally malicious acts than you're crediting him. He's willing to do anything, at any cost, to prove that he's right. I also think that ultimately he does believe in a form of social order, but social order in the sense that he's at the apex and should be able to do whatever he wants with no oversight from anyone else. Ultimately I think he needs a rigid sense of social order to rebel against and feel superior to, which approaches the theme popularized by the Dark Knight: "some men just want to watch the world burn". I agree that Rick isn't a psychopath, but he intentionally behaves like one and uses that as a mask to cover up how sensitive he is. I guess that would boil down to a more personal question, how much action vs intent matters to each of us.

[Zene]

Neutral (leaning toward chaotic) Evil (leaning toward neutral).

[Blas_de_Lezo]

Now, by that, I'd say Rick C-137 fits mostly into Neutral Evil instead of Chaotic Evil: Yes, he does do terrible things and kill people indiscriminately, but he's never violent for the sole purpose of being violent.

what about THIS https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4j9x_vPefn8