Dragon Ball FighterZ - Destroying the planet with every match!

[Zevox]

So, this game has finally come out, and it is awesome! If you're a Dragon Ball fan, you should buy it. If you're a fighting game fan, you should buy it. If you're a fan of both, I can't imagine you haven't already bought it.

Spent most of today running through the challenge mode (which was actually kind of disappointingly easy - I've never 100%ed any fighting game's challenge mode before, but this one was a piece of cake to do day 1) and playing the story mode, which is pretty different from past ArcSys story modes. Way more fights, less story - but well, it is Dragon Ball, so I suppose that fits. The whole setup with you being a spirit that's bonded to Goku is weird, but after a little ways into the story I can see why it's there - I don't think it needed to be anyway, but at least it makes a kind of sense. Haven't finished it yet though, which is expected, given the length of ArcSys' typical story modes. It's good though, plenty of fun scenes of the characters interacting depending on who you have on your team before different fights. It's quite funny too - there are so many jokes at Yamcha's expense even from his friends, and Cell especially seems to have exactly two settings: "recently beaten up" or "snarky."

In the beta I was playing Android 18/Vegeta/Freeza, and I expect that'll be my main team initially when I go into online play later, but trying everybody out in challenge mode and story mode has made me want to find other teams to play too. Some characters I expected to want to try or knew I kinda liked from playing them a little in the beta, like SSB Vegeta, Trunks, Gotenks, Beerus, or Kid Buu, but others surprised me, like Yamcha (who I've been playing a lot in story mode and actually enjoying way more than I expected) and Goku Black. I'm also expecting I may like Android 21 once I unlock her, but I've yet to do that.

Anybody else playing this?

[Lord Raziere]

I am! its not my first dragon ball game, but it is my first um Arcsys/"Real" fighting game? The fact that I have to do it all on my keyboard is probably making it worse, and I can't seem to activate any specials aside from the ones that just automatically happen at the end of combos, nor have I figured out how to do the health recovery thing. I pretty much do rushdown combo stuff aka "lots of button mashing" and switching characters out for extra attacks. My team right now is Freeza/Goku Black/Hit.

as for Android 21, I already have her before finishing the storyline somehow, guess thats a perk for pre-ordering the ultimate edition, since I wanted the 8 DLC characters.

regardless its really fun! when things work it just feels sooooo good and I didn't lose all the matches I went into, I did win some, so I count that as "not hopeless" I think my favorite to play is Hit despite me being a newbie. I know I'm supposed to start with some newbie character like Goku or Vegeta, but I don't care I want to fight with the characters I like.

[Zevox]

I am! its not my first dragon ball game, but it is my first um Arcsys/"Real" fighting game? The fact that I have to do it all on my keyboard is probably making it worse, and I can't seem to activate any specials aside from the ones that just automatically happen at the end of combos, nor have I figured out how to do the health recovery thing. I pretty much do rushdown combo stuff aka "lots of button mashing" and switching characters out for extra attacks. My team right now is Freeza/Goku Black/Hit.

Well, this is an anime fighter, so rushdown is generally pretty effective. Fast-paced fighting games like this encourage aggressive play and setting up your opponent in situations where it will be hard for them to block you. That's basically ArcSys' (which is short for Arc System Works, the developers of the game, in case you didn't know) MO with all of their series. I mean, heck, they even made moving forward build super meter in this game - doesn't get much more obvious what they're encouraging than that.

Wish I could help you with the keyboard thing, but I can't imagine using one of those for a game like this myself. I'd suggest a controller, but I'm guessing you don't have one, else you'd be using it. Oh well, for someone new to the game, auto-combos will work okay. Learning to do real combos and make good use of all your moves is better, but auto-combos are better than nothing, which is where you'd be with most fighting games in that situation.

as for Android 21, I already have her before finishing the storyline somehow, guess thats a perk for pre-ordering the ultimate edition, since I wanted the 8 DLC characters.

Hm, yeah, I know any pre-orders got an auto-unlock of SSB Goku and Vegeta, so it wouldn't surprise me if Ultimate Edition also gave an auto-unlock for 21. I just got the standard edition myself, I doubt I'll be getting any DLC characters. Pretty much everyone I could want and then some are already in the base roster. But then, I'm someone who hasn't been a Dragon Ball fan for over a decade, never saw the movies, and hasn't watched Super. So, to me, all that's left to add are minor characters, more versions of characters we already have, or characters from parts of the series I've never seen.

regardless its really fun! when things work it just feels sooooo good and I didn't lose all the matches I went into, I did win some, so I count that as "not hopeless" I think my favorite to play is Hit despite me being a newbie. I know I'm supposed to start with some newbie character like Goku or Vegeta, but I don't care I want to fight with the characters I like.

Definitely fair. I'm a little surprised Hit's actually working for you, since at a glance he seems like one of the harder characters in the game to use to me, but if he is, great.

Played a lot more story mode today, and I used a lot of Gotenks after he joined up... but honestly, I can't seem to figure out how to make him work well. His normals are all pretty standard-seeming, and his specials all feel like combo filler, but leave a lot to be desired even as combo filler, since none seems to be able to extend a combo. On top of that, his level 1 is ground-only, and the only way to combo into it is to do a 2H launcher into j.H knockdown combo, which is as basic as combos get. On an aesthetic level too, it's kind of disappointing that neither of his supers can score a Destructive Finish. He's like the opposite of Yamcha: a character I expected to like, but who doesn't seem to work for me in practice.

Also got into the villains' side of story mode and played around with Ginyu some. I'm pretty convinced he's just a troll character, built entirely around Body Swap. Even with his Ginyu Force moves, he feels totally basic and unimpressive, so it seems like the best thing he can do is Body Swap and stick the opponent with a weak character (since after the swap his Ginyu Force moves are disabled, so he's even weaker then). Which is neat, but then requires you to be able to play anyone in the roster, since you have limited at best control over who you steal. (Also, they've disabled Body Swap in story mode, so yeah, he does not feel good there.)

On the plus side, there was a good bit in story mode of him deciding against trying to steal Cell's body because his green skin and spots gave him frog flashbacks, so that was fun.

[Lord Raziere]

I dunno, one match had a guy repeatedly use Gotenks as support with galactic donuts to lock me down while his Fat Buu or Teen Gohan beat me up. I guess he is primarily meant for that purpose.

The reason I like Hit is because he closes in so fast and can deliver so many blows up close. I don't know how to do the special ki blasts anyways, so I might as well play him because he has no ranged specials that I can't even do, and he is good at what I CAN do, which is getting up close and beating them up until they die. I THINK Goku Black and Freeza also fulfill that up-close rush style, but I need to keep testing to figure out what characters are best for me.

like for example, some guy just spammed kamehameha with Goku at me and the tutorial I tried, I couldn't even get off ONE. whether its because I don't get the exact combination yet or if its because of the keyboard, I don't know.

as for controllers.....yep I still have xbox 360 controllers, but no way to connect them to my computer and I don't know if 360 controllers will even work with this stuff anymore? if they work at all?

me I'm a big DB fan and watch Super and Abridged. I honestly got into the game because TFS was playing it and it looked awesome.

as for Yamcha, try getting victories with him, one of his win quotes is supposed to be him breaking the fourth wall and thanking you for making him awesome again.

[Anteros]

Xbox controllers will work fine as long as they are wired. Just go buy a 10 dollar wired controller from Walmart. You've already invested like 70 dollars for the game, so at this point you may as well invest another 10 so you can actually play it.

I like Dragonball, but I think I'll pass on this game. I'm not huge into fighting games, and I can't justify the price point when they're locking additional characters behind a 35 dollar DLC. I don't like to support companies who do things like this.

[Binks]

I'm playing as well. Similar boat as Raziere, this is my first real fighting game. I've played a few DBZ games in the past, but nothing more complex than Xenoverse, so this is an interesting change of pace. I do like how the game kind of eases you into combos with the easy autos, but am not a big fan (yet) of how supers are executed (at least on the Xbox 1 controller I have connected to my PC, rotating the thumbstick and then pressing a button is a lot harder for me than just pressing a series of buttons in a row).

I'm mostly playing story and only occasionally popping into the online area, got demolished ever time I tried to play multiplayer, so holding off on that until I understand how to break out of enemy combos. Having a lot of fun though, I really like this story mode, though the start of the last arc is pretty annoying with a very limited character roster.

Right now, in story/arcade at least, I'm sort of main-ing Yamcha for his quick basic attacks, lets me react far quicker to what the computer is doing than other characters I've tried. I've tried Vegeta and SSGSS Vegeta and found I like both because of their simple but powerful supers (SSB Vegeta's 5 bar super is really cool, if inefficient :P) and good range but I haven't really found a good character I'd want to put in my third slot yet. Still have a long way to go to learn good combo-ing though (I have yet to complete any character's combo challenge, but I've gotten several to the last 1 or 2), so I'm not overly worried about picking out characters yet :).

All in all, a game I'm glad I picked up, even if I don't expect I'll ever be good enough to compete online. Seems to be a great introductory fighting game and, from what I'm hearing, a pretty high skill cap one.

EDIT: Oh, for reference, anyone who orders the Season Pass DLC (Ultimate Edition or just buying base+that) gets Android 21 from the start, that's the immediate bonus for buying it now. Since I saw it was being discussed. I don't have it myself but I did lookup what all the bundles come with so I remember that :).

[Lord Raziere]

the more I play, the more I feel as if Teen Gohan is OP or ridiculous for some reason. like every time I face him it feels as if he is somehow harder to beat than other foes. while playing as him feels real easy for some reason.

also list of characters that I feel I can do good with and like:
-Cell
-Tien Shinhan
-Hit
-Freeza
-Goku Black
-Beerus

characters I don't care for but can play good:
-Gokus
-both Gohans

characters I want to be good with but aren't:
Android 21?
Android 18?
Vegetas?
Future Trunks?

the rest I either don't care about or think are bad for one reason or another, or I'm bad at them. I think the Gohans and Gokus are the easiest of the lot, while Vegetas are supposed to be easy, but I think I've had bad luck with him? I'll have to fight with him more.

[Zevox]

I dunno, one match had a guy repeatedly use Gotenks as support with galactic donuts to lock me down while his Fat Buu or Teen Gohan beat me up. I guess he is primarily meant for that purpose.

His assist does seem good, that's true, though I would peg it more as a combo extender than a lockdown assist. The best lockdown assists I'd say would be Vegeta or Kid Buu. I guess I'm just skeptical whether a character who is only good as an assist but not on point can be good in this game. But then, it has happened in Marvel vs Capcom, which is what much of this game's team system is modeled after, so maybe.

The reason I like Hit is because he closes in so fast and can deliver so many blows up close. I don't know how to do the special ki blasts anyways, so I might as well play him because he has no ranged specials that I can't even do, and he is good at what I CAN do, which is getting up close and beating them up until they die. I THINK Goku Black and Freeza also fulfill that up-close rush style, but I need to keep testing to figure out what characters are best for me.

True, Hit's normals shooting him forward could be helpful to newer players. Mobility is often a bit of an obstacle at first, and those sort of bypass that.

I'd say you've got Freeza backwards though. He's possibly the most long-range oriented character in the game, with all of his specials being ranged attacks, unique anti-air eye-beams on 2S (down + ki button), and even his 5H (standing heavy attack) being essentially a projectile. He's not awful up close the way many ranged characters are in other fighting games, but for this game, he's probably the furthest character from being a pure rush-down type.

as for controllers.....yep I still have xbox 360 controllers, but no way to connect them to my computer and I don't know if 360 controllers will even work with this stuff anymore? if they work at all?

I'd think they should, and a simple USB cable should be all it takes to connect them. Can't verify it since I have the PS4 version of the game myself, though.

as for Yamcha, try getting victories with him, one of his win quotes is supposed to be him breaking the fourth wall and thanking you for making him awesome again.

Yup, saw screenshots of that even before the release. Good stuff.

I like Dragonball, but I think I'll pass on this game. I'm not huge into fighting games, and I can't justify the price point when they're locking additional characters behind a 35 dollar DLC. I don't like to support companies who do things like this.

I don't see any issues with the DLC here. The core roster has every major character from DBZ and then some, it's not lacking at all (and is actually significantly larger than the base roster of the first entries in other fighting game series this developer has made), so anything further likely is genuinely extras they're making after completing the base game. There have been fighting games with actual problems there - Street Fighter x Tekken's DLC being all on the disk, MvC:I making one of its main antagonists a DLC character, or the recent reveal of the travesty that is BlazBlue Cross Tag's DLC plan (half the roster on a game that is mostly re-used assets will be DLC) - but this isn't one of them.

I'm playing as well. Similar boat as Raziere, this is my first real fighting game. I've played a few DBZ games in the past, but nothing more complex than Xenoverse, so this is an interesting change of pace. I do like how the game kind of eases you into combos with the easy autos, but am not a big fan (yet) of how supers are executed (at least on the Xbox 1 controller I have connected to my PC, rotating the thumbstick and then pressing a button is a lot harder for me than just pressing a series of buttons in a row).

Really? Odd. That's how everything except normal moves has worked in fighting games for as long as the genre has existed. This game even makes a point of using only the simplest motions in the genre (quarter-circles and one or two down-down moves). Personally, I've even favored using the analog stick on my controllers over using the d-pad, which a lot of older fighting game players prefer, specifically because I find it a lot easier to perform special and super move motions with the stick.

I'm mostly playing story and only occasionally popping into the online area, got demolished ever time I tried to play multiplayer, so holding off on that until I understand how to break out of enemy combos. Having a lot of fun though, I really like this story mode, though the start of the last arc is pretty annoying with a very limited character roster.

I'm actually pretty happy to have hit the last arc, since it finally let me use Android 18, who is one of my favorites. Yamcha wasn't a bad substitute, but still. I'm also curious what's up with the two character slots in the previous arcs that didn't get unlocked through playing them through the first time. I'm guessing it's either SSB Goku and Vegeta, or Teen Gohan and Trunks, and you only get them after beating the entire story mode since they don't fit naturally into the story, but they threw them in so they could have some pre-battle cutscenes.

I should mention, depending on what you meant, the "break out of enemy combos" thing may not be possible. "Combos" in fighting games refer to a sequence of hits that is guaranteed to connect as long as you do it right once you've landed the first hit. Some few games provide a mechanic for breaking them, including actually most of this developer's other games, but this one actually doesn't have one. That said, if you're not aware of that, I can't be sure you're not talking about opponents pressuring you after the actual combo has completed and getting another one, in which case the answers are, well, situational, but the simplest is to block until they do something that's slow to recover. An important thing when first learning a fighting game is getting a sense for when it's safe to press buttons and when it isn't, essentially, and a lot of it has to do with how long the enemy is stuck waiting for their last attack to finish its animation.

I've tried Vegeta and SSGSS Vegeta and found I like both because of their simple but powerful supers (SSB Vegeta's 5 bar super is really cool, if inefficient :P)

Yeah, I like that too. Back when I watched the show Vegeta was my favorite character, and that makes playing him and landing Final Flash in this game so satisfying - especially when you get a Destructive Finish with it.

All in all, a game I'm glad I picked up, even if I don't expect I'll ever be good enough to compete online. Seems to be a great introductory fighting game and, from what I'm hearing, a pretty high skill cap one.

Yeah, they've done a good job making it accessible to newcomers while not hurting for competitive depth, I think. Much as I've seen some people whine about the auto-combos, I think they're pretty much in that perfect sweet spot of easy to use and far better than just button mashing normally is, but nowhere near effective enough that experienced players would consider using them.

It's kind of surprisingly nice how the Dragon Ball/Shenron mechanic works out with them too. I was worried when it turned out it couldn't be turned off, but since it only activates off auto-combos and requires you to have a full 7 bars of super to actually summon Shenron even once all seven balls are acquired, it's pretty much guaranteed to only show up when two more casual players fight each other, since competitive players won't auto-combo and will spend meter a lot. Competitive players needn't worry about it, and casual ones can have fun with it, which is a good place for it to be.

the more I play, the more I feel as if Teen Gohan is OP or ridiculous for some reason. like every time I face him it feels as if he is somehow harder to beat than other foes. while playing as him feels real easy for some reason.

Huh, interesting. I don't think I've played against him yet, and he felt a bit awkward to me when I was using him in challenge mode, personally, so I don't know that I can say anything about him there.

characters I want to be good with but aren't:
Android 21?
Android 18?
Vegetas?
Future Trunks?

Can't speak to 21 since I haven't unlocked her yet, but 18 is one of my favorites, and I also play Vegeta.

18 is a pure rush-down character. Her strength is in making the opponent stay on the defensive for a long time - her specials that call in 17 are good for keeping them blocking, especially the aerial medium one and the ground ki blast version. Combined with a good lockdown assist like Vegeta's she can keep up pressure quite well. And, while it doesn't happen in low-level play, once you've conditioned the opponent to block, she can start mixing in her command grabs to help open them up. If I were to guess though, what might make her harder for you to use is the short reach on many of her normals, particularly her light attacks. She needs to be closer to hit people than many other characters, which will make her harder to use at a beginner level than others, especially if you can't do her specials yet.

Vegeta is a pretty basic character on point, sort of the Ryu of the game (to use a Street Fighter comparison) alongside regular Goku. He just tries to exploit whatever weakness the enemy has - firing ranged attacks if they're best up close, rushing in if they're best from a distance - and gets big damage if you can do his combos into Final Flash. What's best about the regular version is probably his assist though - that projectile barrage is great for locking down a blocking opponent or for extending combos, since it lasts so long. Can't speak too much to the SSB version, but I know one of his specials is a command grab, which should give him more varied options for getting past an opponent's defenses than the regular version. His assist is worse though, being a single big, slow projectile, I'm not sure what use it really has.

Can't speak much to Trunks, since I've only tried him in challenge mode, but I know he's supposed to be a more aggressive, rush-down oriented character, based on breakdowns I saw pre-release.

[Binks]

Really? Odd. That's how everything except normal moves has worked in fighting games for as long as the genre has existed.

I'm starting to get the hang of it, but it's quite difficult coming from a background of almost 0 fighting game experience. I played Budokai on the Wii, but that had a...unique...method of inputting supers, and I played Xenoverse with its mapped 'entering a super' button. Never played a game with actual series of commands for supers before, so just have to learn it. I've been trying to finish some of the harder combo challenges to learn proper inputting and am getting a little better at it, but I still mess up around 50% of the time when trying to launch a super.

I'm also curious what's up with the two character slots in the previous arcs that didn't get unlocked through playing them through the first time.

Spoiler: Who the last two characters are

Show

I unlocked one and looked the other up while working towards 100%, it's the SSB Goku and Vegeta. They're unlocked by getting Goku/Vegeta to link lvl 40 each, kind of a 'now you've unlocked their true power' thing. And you would be correct that they don't perfectly fit in the story but do get the unique intro events for certain situations.

I can't be sure you're not talking about opponents pressuring you after the actual combo has completed and getting another one, in which case the answers are, well, situational, but the simplest is to block until they do something that's slow to recover. An important thing when first learning a fighting game is getting a sense for when it's safe to press buttons and when it isn't, essentially, and a lot of it has to do with how long the enemy is stuck waiting for their last attack to finish its animation.

Yeah, that's what I was trying to say. I'm trying to learn blocking (ie remembering to block when I'm thinking/recovering/not in the middle of a combo), but it's not coming naturally to me. That and actual combos are my top 2 'to-do' list items right now as I progress.

Yeah, they've done a good job making it accessible to newcomers while not hurting for competitive depth, I think. Much as I've seen some people whine about the auto-combos, I think they're pretty much in that perfect sweet spot of easy to use and far better than just button mashing normally is, but nowhere near effective enough that experienced players would consider using them.

People are whining about auto combos? Why? Even with my limited experience I can tell they're not great. I use them a lot because I'm still learning, but they do way less damage than even the basic 0 bar combos I've seen people teaching on videos and such. Heck, they do less damage than the combo challenge 0-1 bar combos I've been learning, and those are displayed in game. Seems like a weird thing to complain about...



Finished the main story and started into hard mode. Then stopped and went into training :P. The hard mode AI is a league above even the last arc's final boss AI, and I'm having to learn proper combos and such to stand a chance against it. I quite like that actually, as I'm enjoying the single player stuff a lot and the fact that it forces me to actually get mediocre at the game (:P) to play it is nice. I was worried with how exploitable the normal difficulty AI was that it wouldn't get hard at any point, and that fear is proving quite unfounded.

[Rodin]

I am! its not my first dragon ball game, but it is my first um Arcsys/"Real" fighting game? The fact that I have to do it all on my keyboard is probably making it worse, and I can't seem to activate any specials aside from the ones that just automatically happen at the end of combos, nor have I figured out how to do the health recovery thing. I pretty much do rushdown combo stuff aka "lots of button mashing" and switching characters out for extra attacks. My team right now is Freeza/Goku Black/Hit.

While the technology may have changed since the last time I tried to do Arcade/controller inputs on a keyboard, in the past at least keyboards didn't like multiple key presses together at high speed like are required for most fighting games.

In other words, it may be impossible to perform some of the moves on keyboard. My experience was around 15-20 years ago though, so take it with a grain of salt.

[Anteros]

I'd think they should, and a simple USB cable should be all it takes to connect them. Can't verify it since I have the PS4 version of the game myself, though.

Wireless 360 controllers will not work. The USB port on them does not transmit data, and is only used to charge. You can plug it into a computer, and the computer will recognize them, but you won't be able to do anything. Wired 360 controllers work just fine though and are fairly cheap and easy to find. PS3 or PS4 controllers will also work if you have the cable for them. Obviously computer specific controllers will work as well.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

While the technology may have changed since the last time I tried to do Arcade/controller inputs on a keyboard, in the past at least keyboards didn't like multiple key presses together at high speed like are required for most fighting games.

In other words, it may be impossible to perform some of the moves on keyboard. My experience was around 15-20 years ago though, so take it with a grain of salt.

Yeah, ghosting is a thing. For me, playing Guilty Gear on a keyboard (until I found a decent controller), it was not being able to perform Instant Kills, which require four attack buttons to begin activation. Since my attacks were mapped to J/U/I/O like an arcade stick, there was some sort of problem there. If certain buttons are pressed at the same time, they won't both register. (This is because, to make the keyboard design simpler, the manufacturer actually puts those keys on the same circuit.)

If using WASD for movement, that shouldn't impact quarter circle movements, but the bits where you have to press two attack buttons at once to activate different things, that would be an issue.

[Lord Raziere]

True, Hit's normals shooting him forward could be helpful to newer players. Mobility is often a bit of an obstacle at first, and those sort of bypass that.

I'd say you've got Freeza backwards though. He's possibly the most long-range oriented character in the game, with all of his specials being ranged attacks,

Can't speak to 21 since I haven't unlocked her yet, but 18 is one of my favorites, and I also play Vegeta.

18 is a pure rush-down character. Her strength is in making the opponent stay on the defensive for a long time

Vegeta is a pretty basic character on point, sort of the Ryu of the game (to use a Street Fighter comparison) alongside regular Goku.

Can't speak much to Trunks, since I've only tried him in challenge mode, but I know he's supposed to be a more aggressive, rush-down oriented character, based on breakdowns I saw pre-release.

Huh, interesting. guess I can try replacing freeza with Trunks? Guess I didn't know how Freeza works given my keyboard set up, I just tried to be as aggressive with freeza as I could, and found him fun? hm. Guess I'll have to play more to get these characters down....

[Zevox]

I'm starting to get the hang of it, but it's quite difficult coming from a background of almost 0 fighting game experience. I played Budokai on the Wii, but that had a...unique...method of inputting supers, and I played Xenoverse with its mapped 'entering a super' button. Never played a game with actual series of commands for supers before, so just have to learn it. I've been trying to finish some of the harder combo challenges to learn proper inputting and am getting a little better at it, but I still mess up around 50% of the time when trying to launch a super.

Huh. Okay, fair I suppose. Guess it just strikes me as surprising since I recall learning to do the most basic fighting game specials way back when I was little kid. Quarter-circles feel so simple it's a strange thought to me that they'd be a problem for someone. (I get it with Raziere playing on a keyboard, but a controller is a different thing.)

Spoiler: Who the last two characters are

Show

I unlocked one and looked the other up while working towards 100%, it's the SSB Goku and Vegeta. They're unlocked by getting Goku/Vegeta to link lvl 40 each, kind of a 'now you've unlocked their true power' thing. And you would be correct that they don't perfectly fit in the story but do get the unique intro events for certain situations.

Spoiler: Is this really a spoiler?

Show

Okay, cool. I had Vegeta at level 39 by the end of the story mode, so I got him unlocked easy. Hadn't been sure whether I'd go for Goku, who was still 24, until the servers went down for maintenance today. Went ahead and ground him up while they were down, and now I've finished all of the bonus cutscenes. Well, aside from the link ones that unlock as you level, those I'm not bothering trying to collect.

Yeah, that's what I was trying to say. I'm trying to learn blocking (ie remembering to block when I'm thinking/recovering/not in the middle of a combo), but it's not coming naturally to me. That and actual combos are my top 2 'to-do' list items right now as I progress.

Cool, good places to start. Blocking in particular will help a lot - players who don't defend at the right times are easy prey for players who know how to set themselves up to hit you again after a combo finishes. At least at first, it's always a good idea to block when you get up after a knockdown - unless the opponent is nowhere near you or something, I suppose.

People are whining about auto combos? Why?

Because some segments of the FGC see anything that makes the genre friendlier to newbies as "dumbing down" the game, even if it's not impacting where the actual depth of the genre lies. There were complaints when people realized that every special move in the game used quarter-circle motions rather than anything more complicated, too.

To be fair, some small part of me does understand the auto-combo frustration, in that it feels like it rewards button-mashing, which isn't generally something you'd want to do. But of course it's actually fine for all the reasons we've mentioned.

Wireless 360 controllers will not work. The USB port on them does not transmit data, and is only used to charge. You can plug it into a computer, and the computer will recognize them, but you won't be able to do anything. Wired 360 controllers work just fine though and are fairly cheap and easy to find. PS3 or PS4 controllers will also work if you have the cable for them. Obviously computer specific controllers will work as well.

Huh, odd... I thought the 360 controller I used with my PC to play Mega Man x Street Fighter was a wireless one I'd just plugged a USB cable into. Maybe I'm wrong and I had my wired one by then though.

Huh, interesting. guess I can try replacing freeza with Trunks? Guess I didn't know how Freeza works given my keyboard set up, I just tried to be as aggressive with freeza as I could, and found him fun? hm. Guess I'll have to play more to get these characters down....

Hey, no need to replace him if you're enjoying him and he's working for you. Honestly, a lot of my analysis of characters won't necessarily apply to you, since you can't use their full set of moves. If you're not using Freeza's specials, he doesn't look nearly as long-ranged focused.

Anyway, beat story mode, tried out Android 21! She's a bit complicated, but I am enjoying her. I'm a bit surprised to find that she feels like a more all-around character in terms of gameplan, kind of like regular Goku and Vegeta - and she particularly wants you to adapt not just to your opponent, but to the moves she can steal from them. Some lend themselves to a ranged, zoning gameplan (Kamehameha, the scattershot energy balls she gets from the Androids), while others are better suited to a more aggressive, mixup-oriented one (the homing shot and teleport from the alien characters, the command grab from Vegeta's family). Really not sure what to do with Solar Flare, though, it's an oddball one.

I did a few casual matches today, trying a team of Yamcha, 21, and Goku Black. Felt pretty awkward at times, and I screwed up a lot, but I do want to try and make those characters work, and I do think they seem to suit each other as a team mechanically. Might switch 21 to the front though, which feels odd since Yamcha seems like someone you want to lead off with due to his aggressive nature, but his assist is actually really good for 21, so putting her out front might make more sense. Not likely to overtake 18/Vegeta/Freeza as my preferred team though.

[Lord Raziere]

Yeah, I've tried to make a kamehameha in a story tutorial, and I only got it off once, so on keyboard I'm pretty certain you cannot do any special reliably. I will have to order a a plug-in controller, thankfully I got the money judging from what I've seen of the prices on amazon and it will help with various other games as well.

[deuterio12]

Because some segments of the FGC see anything that makes the genre friendlier to newbies as "dumbing down" the game, even if it's not impacting where the actual depth of the genre lies. There were complaints when people realized that every special move in the game used quarter-circle motions rather than anything more complicated, too.

Could you imagine how other genres, say first person shooters, would be if you had to press a different six button combination to use each special attack but the basic attacks?

Thanks Vecna for super smash brothers.

[Calemyr]

Could you imagine how other genres, say first person shooters, would be if you had to press a different six button combination to use each special attack but the basic attacks?

Thanks Vecna for super smash brothers.

... ... ... If I ever run another D&D campaign, it's going to be set in a world where Vecna runs Nintendo. (It'sa me! Mario! ... Run!)

Edit: Oh, yeah. I'm also playing the game on the PS4. Great game. The combat is fluid and has enough easy mode to let newbies feel like they're doing something while making easy mode easily punished by advanced players. The characters function similarly enough that mastering one lets you learn others pretty easily, too. I've been mostly playing the campaign mode and enjoying the hell out of it. The writing is a perfect blend of genuine to the characters as well as blithely self deprecating.

[Murmaider]

Yeah, I've tried to make a kamehameha in a story tutorial, and I only got it off once, so on keyboard I'm pretty certain you cannot do any special reliably. I will have to order a a plug-in controller, thankfully I got the money judging from what I've seen of the prices on amazon and it will help with various other games as well.

QCF(quarter-circle-forward) is as easy to do on a keyboard as it is on any controller. I just tried it out on an old hp-keyboard. Pressing multiple buttons is no problem. No idea where people got the idea that it wouldn't work.

If you have trouble doing it on your keyboard, you'll probably have trouble doing it on any other device anyway. Maybe you'll have more motivation to practice because you'll have spent money on a controller already, but it won't be easier.

Just head into practice mode for a bit, select 'display command history'(or something like that) and try to do the down, down-forward, forward motion. If the command history shows something else, then you'll know what to adjust.

[Binks]

QCF(quarter-circle-forward) is as easy to do on a keyboard as it is on any controller. I just tried it out on an old hp-keyboard. Pressing multiple buttons is no problem. No idea where people got the idea that it wouldn't work.

Depends on the keyboard. Some support multi-key rollover, some don't. Generally speaking, the cheaper the keyboard (at time of creation, this has been a known issue in PC gaming for decades), the less likely 3 button combinations will work on it. My dirt cheap microsoft keyboard, for instance, wouldn't be able to do combos because it can't register that many key presses that quickly (I occassionally get key jamming issues playing HotS with this thing :P).

There are software setting that can help (keyboards can be configured using different protocols, and sometimes changing the protocol used will allow more simultaneous/closely-spaced key presses) but generally speaking if you want to do complex combos on a PC it's get a controller or a higher-end gaming keyboard with n-key rollover (not necessarily the most expensive keyboard, but at least midrange and specifically looking at its rollover support).

EDIT: That said, it is not bad advice at all to head into training and turn on key presses to see what's happening. Could be an issue with how you're inputting or a hardware issue, and that should tell you pretty well what's going on. Best of luck.

[Lord Raziere]

EDIT: That said, it is not bad advice at all to head into training and turn on key presses to see what's happening. Could be an issue with how you're inputting or a hardware issue, and that should tell you pretty well what's going on. Best of luck.

Did retry that, doing nothing but entering specials and I'm doing it much more consistently now. It was just a matter of practice and not rapidly tapping the keyboard. you have to do this weird motion with the keys to get quarter-circle as if your rolling your fingers over them so that they register as diagonal for a second where previously I was pressing the keys at the same time.

now I can do the specials at least in practice mode, haven't actually done so in actual fights yet.

[Murmaider]

Depends on the keyboard. Some support multi-key rollover, some don't. Generally speaking, the cheaper the keyboard (at time of creation, this has been a known issue in PC gaming for decades), the less likely 3 button combinations will work on it. My dirt cheap microsoft keyboard, for instance, wouldn't be able to do combos because it can't register that many key presses that quickly (I occassionally get key jamming issues playing HotS with this thing :P).

Daaang, that's really a thing. I tried some Tekken, which actually has 4-key moves. I can't Ki-Charge(4 buttons) or taunt(3 buttons) but I can use throws that have diagonal directions(2 buttons) + 2 other buttons. So, I was definitly wrong with my assumption. Sorry, Pals.

Still, a keyboard is perfectly servicable to do a Hadoken(QCF) or even a Raging Storm(Pretzel) on.

I wonder how many keys I can press on my gaming-mouse at once? It has 8 Buttons, which is actually enough to play Tekken with

[Drasius]

After seeing a clip of this and recently finding DB:A and reliving a guilty pleasure, my interest was piqued and a quick read of the various reviews suggests that story mode is enough to keep me entertained so I've picked this up, though I'm not really a fighting game guy. My only prior experience with fighting games (discounting button mashing against some friends a million years ago when Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter were still on their first iterations) is Dissidia 012 (which I loved and sunk many, many hours into). I have no intention of every going online however, but I would like to not be absoutely terrible at the game.

Any tips for going through the story (or just in general) without spoiling anything?

[Binks]

Any tips for going through the story (or just in general) without spoiling anything?

As someone who walked into the game in the same boat as you, my recommendation would be to just start playing. I went through the tutorials first, but the story mode repeats them all at the start so kind of a waste of time :P. Early story mode is so easy you can practically breeze through it even if you're not experienced at all, and by the time you get to the later parts you should have a decent grasp on the mechanics.

Couple of other small tips for story mode:
The save button is located in the middle of the long list of options when you hit start, not near the top or bottom, so it can be easy to miss (I didn't even know it existed until my second run through). It also really should be labeled "save and quit" since it boots you out on completion.

Fight more than the minimum # of battles per stage, if you just rush through story you'll finish it quickly, but if you grind levels you'll have a better time (properly leveled for the last fights) and it'll last longer.

If you want all the dramatic scenes, the "Arc Gallery" button on the story intro page shows silhouettes of what team combination / enemy you need to trigger the specific event.

And most of all, have fun. Normal mode story is not that hard so you don't need to 'get gud' to beat it, I got through it before even getting a full grasp of combos (and most of my learning was playing it). Hard mode is a lot more skill intensive (though still below online play), but Normal mode is a lot of fun if you're a newbie to the fighting games genre. Change up your teams, try new characters, experiment with supers, and have fun :).

[Aotrs Commander]

Well. Fighting games are very much not cup of tea at all, but having cross across the cutscenes on youtube... I have to hand it to them, the story mode appears to be abolsutely brilliant and hilarious (and, from what I can gather from random scenes out of sequence, cleverly woven around the game mechanics to boot).

Whatever else one might say about this game, the script writers (and the VO) were clearly having an absolute blast.



(Krillen - who is, to be fair, my favourite - is amazing in his scenes!)

[Drasius]

As someone who walked into the game in the same boat as you, my recommendation would be to just start playing. I went through the tutorials first, but the story mode repeats them all at the start so kind of a waste of time :P. Early story mode is so easy you can practically breeze through it even if you're not experienced at all, and by the time you get to the later parts you should have a decent grasp on the mechanics.

Couple of other small tips for story mode:
The save button is located in the middle of the long list of options when you hit start, not near the top or bottom, so it can be easy to miss (I didn't even know it existed until my second run through). It also really should be labeled "save and quit" since it boots you out on completion.

Fight more than the minimum # of battles per stage, if you just rush through story you'll finish it quickly, but if you grind levels you'll have a better time (properly leveled for the last fights) and it'll last longer.

If you want all the dramatic scenes, the "Arc Gallery" button on the story intro page shows silhouettes of what team combination / enemy you need to trigger the specific event.

And most of all, have fun. Normal mode story is not that hard so you don't need to 'get gud' to beat it, I got through it before even getting a full grasp of combos (and most of my learning was playing it). Hard mode is a lot more skill intensive (though still below online play), but Normal mode is a lot of fun if you're a newbie to the fighting games genre. Change up your teams, try new characters, experiment with supers, and have fun :).

Having just run my controller out of batteries and realised it's past 2am, I can say that it's quite good fun, if absurdly easy (so far) and that the story is much better than I expected it to be. Quality of animation is outstanding, though the load times (on XBone) are nothing short of painful.

I did most of the tutorials, got my arse handed to me on the final arcade fight, went and played training mode for a bit to try everyone out and have been steamrolling the story so far. The story mode mechanics are basically exactly the same as Dissidia, which is fine 'cause I quite liked it there. Wish I had known about the arc gallery button beforehand, but oh well, I can definatly see myself making multiple trips through the story, so it's ok.

The one thing that has helped me more than anything else is going into training mode and turning on command history to see where I was screwing up inputs. D-pad entry was fine >95% of the time, but I was hitting the face buttons a touch too early ~80% of the time. Slowed that down a touch and now I can reliably get most of the quarter circle stuff off with maybe 80-90% succes rate now. Still getting used to block being a d-pad thing rather than a button and I'm nowhere near getting any real combos going, but I'm pleased enough with progress for now.

For as much as each character has a bunch of the same or similar movesets, there's still a fair bit of personality in each of them. Pretty disappointed with Nappa though I quite like Vegeta, even if he is just a slightly faster but weaker Goku, which is nice since the personification of short man syndrome is my favourite character. I have no idea how the hell anyone plays Hit effectively however.

[Rater202]

Been watching people play on Youtube and looking up stuff.

Not much one for fighting games, but I am absolutely in love with everything about Android 21 and I am really hoping that Toriyama makes her canon, as he said he might if she's popular enough... mostly becuase while the game itself doesn't really fit into the timeline, her backstory does almost perfectly.

Spoiler: Storymode Speculation

Show

...So, Evil 21 gained a new form after absorbing Cell...

...Cell has no inherent drive to kill Goku and doesn't know what his purpose is other than becoming perfect.

21 is heavily implied to be Gero's wife who he made into an android, using the same technology he'd use to make Cell, to keep from losing her like tey lost their son, who per WoG Android 16 was modeled on.

Was Cell meant to be fed to 21 the same way that 17 and 18 were meant to be absorbed by Cell?

Or, with the revelation that Gero invented technology that lets him create souls, rip souls out, and bind souls to other people's bodies... Was the plan for Gero to rip out Cell's soul and transplant his own into Cell's perfect body with his brain in a jar in a robot body a temporary means of extending his life?

Also, people seem to be pretty split on whether 21's tail comes from Frieza's cells or from Beerus,
but I'm honestly more concerned about whether her ears come from Piccolo, Supreme Kai, or Dabura.

[Lord Raziere]

Aaaaaagh, I tried to apply the supers to actual fighting and it didn't turn out very well. I barely got any supers in so I have to resort to using my rushdown tactics anyways, and even then I keep getting defeated by people who seem to combo me so fast I can barely get a hit in half the time. I keep expecting for all these much better players to eventually get out of being saibamen so they can go bother other people more their skill level, but even the supposed "equal strength" people the system matches me up with are better than me.

[Zevox]

So, couple of things I want to put in here before replies. First, here's a video on team building in this game that explains it very well for newcomers, for anyone looking to decide how to structure their teams.

Second, for anyone who's interested in the DLC characters that will be coming, there's a decent chance that people have figured out who they are. Datamining of the game has found a few things that make three of them pretty certain and might also have figured out the other five. The three that are nearly certain are Cooler and base (Saiyan Saga-era) forms of Goku and Vegeta. For Cooler there's actually a voice clip of the announcer calling out his name the way he does when you select someone on the character select screen, and for Goku and Vegeta there's actually incomplete character models buried in there - different from the ones in story mode where they're not in SS form, especially since Vegeta has his Saiyan Saga armor. So, those three are basically a given. For the others the information is shakier, but supposedly there's lobby avatars in there that aren't currently available for use, including the above three, plus Broly, Bardock, Vegito (in SSB form), Merged Zamasu, regular Zamasu, and "Ranger 17" (apparently Android 17 as he appears in Dragon Ball Super?). Speculation is that the regular Zamasu avatar is just a bonus lobby avatar you'll get when you pick up Merged Zamasu, and the other eight are the DLC.

Personally, not for me, since I don't know anything about most of those and I'm already happy with the existing Goku, Vegeta, and 17's role in 18's moveset, so the only way they're getting me to consider buying those is if their gameplay just looks amazingly fun - and I've got enough characters to play as-is, I feel, so that's unlikely. But for anyone who's interested, that's likely who you're getting.

Did retry that, doing nothing but entering specials and I'm doing it much more consistently now. It was just a matter of practice and not rapidly tapping the keyboard. you have to do this weird motion with the keys to get quarter-circle as if your rolling your fingers over them so that they register as diagonal for a second where previously I was pressing the keys at the same time.

now I can do the specials at least in practice mode, haven't actually done so in actual fights yet.

Nice! That'll be helpful for sure - getting to use a character's full toolset is bound to be better than not.

Well. Fighting games are very much not cup of tea at all, but having cross across the cutscenes on youtube... I have to hand it to them, the story mode appears to be abolsutely brilliant and hilarious (and, from what I can gather from random scenes out of sequence, cleverly woven around the game mechanics to boot).

Whatever else one might say about this game, the script writers (and the VO) were clearly having an absolute blast.


(Krillen - who is, to be fair, my favourite - is amazing in his scenes!)

Yeah, they did quite well with it. I kind of wonder what amount of it was done by the Dragon Ball writers versus ArcSys' teams - ArcSys' other fighting games always have expansive story modes, and in BlazBlue in particular they've always had comedic side-paths. But I know that writing on the other licensed series they've handled, Persona 4 Arena, was handled by the Persona writers, so perhaps it was the Dragon Ball team's doing.

The one thing that has helped me more than anything else is going into training mode and turning on command history to see where I was screwing up inputs. D-pad entry was fine >95% of the time, but I was hitting the face buttons a touch too early ~80% of the time. Slowed that down a touch and now I can reliably get most of the quarter circle stuff off with maybe 80-90% succes rate now. Still getting used to block being a d-pad thing rather than a button and I'm nowhere near getting any real combos going, but I'm pleased enough with progress for now.

Huh, interesting. I'm glad some folks are finding that feature useful - I've always just found it distracting and so I leave it turned off, personally. But I don't think it got added to fighting games until just after I got into the genre and got all the basic inputs down playing BlazBlue: Calamity Trigger, so maybe it would've been helpful back then.

Been watching people play on Youtube and looking up stuff.

Not much one for fighting games, but I am absolutely in love with everything about Android 21 and I am really hoping that Toriyama makes her canon, as he said he might if she's popular enough... mostly becuase while the game itself doesn't really fit into the timeline, her backstory does almost perfectly.

Spoiler: Storymode Speculation

Show

...So, Evil 21 gained a new form after absorbing Cell...

...Cell has no inherent drive to kill Goku and doesn't know what his purpose is other than becoming perfect.

21 is heavily implied to be Gero's wife who he made into an android, using the same technology he'd use to make Cell, to keep from losing her like tey lost their son, who per WoG Android 16 was modeled on.

Was Cell meant to be fed to 21 the same way that 17 and 18 were meant to be absorbed by Cell?

Or, with the revelation that Gero invented technology that lets him create souls, rip souls out, and bind souls to other people's bodies... Was the plan for Gero to rip out Cell's soul and transplant his own into Cell's perfect body with his brain in a jar in a robot body a temporary means of extending his life?

Also, people seem to be pretty split on whether 21's tail comes from Frieza's cells or from Beerus,
but I'm honestly more concerned about whether her ears come from Piccolo, Supreme Kai, or Dabura.

Spoiler

Show

The weird thing about 21 vs the show's canon, though, is that there doesn't seem to be a way for her to exist in it. She's obviously an amalgam of various villains of the series, probably the most important being Buu - but Gero was dead before Buu was revived. Plus, as Gohan pointed out in one of the story's pre-battle cutscenes, if you had a sample off Buu's body, it would just let him regenerate himself. So, kind of some logic problems she has to ignore in order to exist.

Aso for what comes from where, I've been assuming the tail was from Freeza, so that she could have elements from all of the major villains of the series (Freeza's tail, being created the same way Cell was and having the same drive to absorb people to become stronger, and of course a lot of Buu). By that same logic I'd probably favor Piccolo as the source of the ears, since he was originally a major villain too, albeit back in the original show.

Aaaaaagh, I tried to apply the supers to actual fighting and it didn't turn out very well. I barely got any supers in so I have to resort to using my rushdown tactics anyways, and even then I keep getting defeated by people who seem to combo me so fast I can barely get a hit in half the time. I keep expecting for all these much better players to eventually get out of being saibamen so they can go bother other people more their skill level, but even the supposed "equal strength" people the system matches me up with are better than me.

Hm, well, the "equal strength" thing just means it tries to match you up based on your ranked points - the game can't actually tell anything about your skill, it can just check your point value. So the matchmaking will never be perfect for that.

That said, I can probably give a few tips. For instance, on supers, while there's times when throwing them out raw can be good, they're usually best comboed into - which is generally pretty easy in this game. Almost all moves can be canceled into supers, meaning that if you do the input for the super while a move is hitting the opponent, it will skip the rest of that move's animation and the super will come out immediately, which is one of the main ways most characters combo into supers. Also, if you've going to throw one out raw, it should usually be the ones that cost 3 bars (which is quarter-circle back + 2 buttons on most characters) - those ones have a lot of invincibility on startup, which means your opponent won't be able to hit you out of them. They can still block or punish in other ways if they're smart, but raw level 3s can be good to get a lot of damage on aggressive opponents who just won't stop hitting buttons. (Also, from experience, it feels really bad to get hit by them...)

Beyond that, on defense. A basic tip: if your opponent finishes a combo and is anywhere near you, unless you're going to throw out a level 3, block! They are probably in an advantageous position and pushing a button might well get you hit. Also, when blocking, generally favor holding down-back, not just back. It's a lot easier for opponents to slip a crouching light or medium in and hit you past a standing block that to hit an overhead and start a combo past a crouching block.

In addition, when you're getting hit, hold one of the attack buttons. You see, in this company's fighting games, you need to manually decide when to "tech" out of a combo - recover from the stun state that getting hit puts you in, basically. This is because at high levels of play there's reasons why you might not want to do so as soon as possible, but for new players, it's generally best just to hold a button so you recover immediately if the opponent doesn't do the combo perfectly. If you've ever seen a combo counter turn from red to blue, that's a sign that the combo wasn't a true, guaranteed combo - there was a moment where you (or the opponent, if it was your combo) could have teched out, but didn't. This isn't likely to happen with people doing auto-combos or only very simple combos, but it could if anyone tries anything beyond the bare basics. Often if the opponent does mess up and you get out of a combo early, you might find yourself in a position that makes it easy to get a hit in on them, too.

[Drasius]

Huh, interesting. I'm glad some folks are finding that feature useful - I've always just found it distracting and so I leave it turned off, personally. But I don't think it got added to fighting games until just after I got into the genre and got all the basic inputs down playing BlazBlue: Calamity Trigger, so maybe it would've been helpful back then.

Oh, I don't pay any attention to it while doing the move, just use it for analysis when what I try to do doesn't work so I can see that I get too keen and hit a face button before I've finished the quarter cirlce. Interestingly I've noticed that you can get moves to activate even if you do (for example) 23a6 or even 2367a instead of 236a, so there's a little bit of leeway.

One thing that I've had a fair bit of trouble with is getting consecutive opposite quarter circle inputs down (in this case going from 236d into 214cd while Airborne with Vegeta to end a long combo). Even with this example where there's a fair bit of time (due to the long animation on Vegetas ki-spam) I'm struggling. Needless to say that anything with strict timing is right out. Tips other than not being an uncoordinated dingus?

I've also noticed that after facerolling the story for a while, once I had practiced some combos and went back to do them in an actual match I started to actually take damage. Was pretty demoralising that as soon as I went back to mashing I went back to face rolling. Just means that I need more practice I assume?

[Murmaider]

Oh, I don't pay any attention to it while doing the move, just use it for analysis when what I try to do doesn't work so I can see that I get too keen and hit a face button before I've finished the quarter cirlce. Interestingly I've noticed that you can get moves to activate even if you do (for example) 23a6 or even 2367a instead of 236a, so there's a little bit of leeway.

One thing that I've had a fair bit of trouble with is getting consecutive opposite quarter circle inputs down (in this case going from 236d into 214cd while Airborne with Vegeta to end a long combo). Even with this example where there's a fair bit of time (due to the long animation on Vegetas ki-spam) I'm struggling. Needless to say that anything with strict timing is right out. Tips other than not being an uncoordinated dingus?

I don't think the key layout you're using is any good.

1. You do your movement with the right hand and press buttons with the left? It doesn't really matter at all, it's just weird to me

2. Why do you need the diagonal directions on a button? That's just one more button you need to worry about. Pressing down + forward should do the job well enough.

3. Using the Numpad for directions, as you have it set up right now, is not a good idea. You'll be doing a lot of QCF(down, down+forward, forward) and QCB(down, down+back, back) in this game. Going from 2 to 6, or from 2 to 4 is just impractical. You'll also need to be able to go from blocking low on one side, to blocking low from the other side, in case you get crossed up. Doing that quickly, when your down is set to 2, requires either too much movement of your fingers, or practice in playing a string instrument.
Ideally you set your four movement keys in a row, so that each finger covers one direction. I know using your pinky like this is not easy for everyone, so instead, you can just use wasd or the arrow keys with three fingers if you prefer.