The Order of the Stick: Utterly Dwarfed
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  1. - Top - End - #91
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Allow me to disagree. She's a support. Her damage output is dismally low, with little range. The range on her dash is pitifully short, and her more reliable reach out and touch you ability is her whip shot, which is basically a faster anti-hook, pushing enemies away and doing a touch of burst damage. Between a whipshot/charge/melee cancel, she might be able to string together 165 damage, but her low mobility and reach will make that a 'if you get close, I might punish you' kind of affair. Her most impactful ability is her repair pack, a massive 150 health heal on a 6 second cooldown. Bad for sustain, but great to save a teammate who's being focused down by dive. In fact, between her dash, whip shot, and repair pack, she's basically entirely built around peeling.
    IMO, her strength as a defensive brawler isn't her damage, but the AoE healing she puts out when she smacks people with her mace.

    That's why it's significant that she's a good defensive brawler. She wouldn't be especially good at actually killing her opponent, but she'd keep herself and her team up through the brawl.
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  2. - Top - End - #92
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by BRC View Post
    IMO, her strength as a defensive brawler isn't her damage, but the AoE healing she puts out when she smacks people with her mace.

    That's why it's significant that she's a good defensive brawler. She wouldn't be especially good at actually killing her opponent, but she'd keep herself and her team up through the brawl.
    Reliable CC is good too, or so I'm told.

  3. - Top - End - #93
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by BRC View Post
    IMO, her strength as a defensive brawler isn't her damage, but the AoE healing she puts out when she smacks people with her mace.

    That's why it's significant that she's a good defensive brawler. She wouldn't be especially good at actually killing her opponent, but she'd keep herself and her team up through the brawl.
    She's got a bigger radius than Lucio, I'll give her that. I'm just skeptical she's going to find people willing to come into arm's reach to trigger it. Now if she's able to trigger Inspire just by landing whip shots, then maybe you'll see 50% uptime. Look, I could be totally wrong, in fact, I'd kind of like to be wrong. I'm more than happy to see more heroes with something to do other than play health-bar whack-a-mole in the game.

    I see her being very much a deathball healer, useful on payload and king of the hill. I'm just not sure if she's going to see more use than Lucio in that role, who has the means to provide his team with mobility, bring reliable healing, peel, and all while retaining reach to spam enemies with his Sonic Amplifier.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kitten Champion View Post
    Reliable CC is good too, or so I'm told.
    I'm not sure I've seen much in the way of reliable CC in her kit. She's basically got Genji Dash but instead of her moving, it's her flail.

  4. - Top - End - #94
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Hey guys, I could use a little help.
    Im having a really hard time climbing out of silver/now high bronze. I played OW on xbox for about a year and had no problem reaching gold. And even when i switched to pc in season 6 or 7 i believe, i was placed in the low 2k. But there are so many throwers and trolls and leavers in this low SR i feel like i will never reach gold again. I guess my question to those that have climed out is first How? And second how do you handle the quad dps instalock? Iv read forums watched the videos and just about all say pick a carry dps, well if we already have 4 dps who refuse to switch or change it up we need a tank and healer so its usally some horrible form of 4-1-1. Sorry to rant its just so irratating and seems endless...in the words of Kevin Heart "Help me...help me"

    Also anyone in the 1.5k SR rang who wants to add me and climb together please do, i have a mic and i use it.
    Name: xdacy666

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Xdacy56 View Post
    Hey guys, I could use a little help.
    Im having a really hard time climbing out of silver/now high bronze. I played OW on xbox for about a year and had no problem reaching gold. And even when i switched to pc in season 6 or 7 i believe, i was placed in the low 2k. But there are so many throwers and trolls and leavers in this low SR i feel like i will never reach gold again. I guess my question to those that have climed out is first How? And second how do you handle the quad dps instalock? Iv read forums watched the videos and just about all say pick a carry dps, well if we already have 4 dps who refuse to switch or change it up we need a tank and healer so its usally some horrible form of 4-1-1. Sorry to rant its just so irratating and seems endless...in the words of Kevin Heart "Help me...help me"

    Also anyone in the 1.5k SR rang who wants to add me and climb together please do, i have a mic and i use it.
    Name: xdacy666
    Classic example of why the SR system doesn't work. I very little advice for you, except to do your best, have a healer, a tank, and a dps in your stable of Heroes you can play well, and wait for the 'lose in spawn room' plague to afflict the other team instead of yours. In the end, all you can do is push hard to post good stats until you get to Diamond, where winning and losing actually matters.

    I would argue that climbing shouldn't be your goal. Getting better at the game should be your goal, and climbing will be a side effect of doing that successfully.

  6. - Top - End - #96
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Classic example of why the SR system doesn't work. I very little advice for you, except to do your best, have a healer, a tank, and a dps in your stable of Heroes you can play well, and wait for the 'lose in spawn room' plague to afflict the other team instead of yours. In the end, all you can do is push hard to post good stats until you get to Diamond, where winning and losing actually matters.

    I would argue that climbing shouldn't be your goal. Getting better at the game should be your goal, and climbing will be a side effect of doing that successfully.
    Thank you, i do agree with what you said about trying to get better and not try to climb. Its just such a mess down here lol

  7. - Top - End - #97
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Xdacy56 View Post
    Thank you, i do agree with what you said about trying to get better and not try to climb. Its just such a mess down here lol
    Yeah, and the 'pad your stats' incentives are inconsistent with playing in a manner which will actually help your team win. For example: Let's say you're in a match on King's Row, and your team has just failed a push. You're outnumbered 3 to 1, and any professional team trying not to feed the enemy team ultimate charge would simply fall back to their spawn, and wait for the team to re-group. But by doing that, you're actually hurting your stats. Of course, if you die, you'll be worse off, and make it more likely your team will lose, but doing the responsible thing when the rest of your team is dashing off in four directions to die alone punishes the folks trying to not feed.

    That's why I advise people to just find someone else to follow, and focus fire what they're shooting, in the event you've got the clownfiesta draw in the spawn room.

  8. - Top - End - #98
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    I decided to come back to Overwatch and start by trying out deathmatch. As it was introduced after I'd left. Running around like an idiot and dying is a lot less stressful if I'm not pulling my party down by doing it. And then I managed to be the first to score 20 kills as Sombra. Whom I'd hardly played before quitting. Go figure. Her ability to hack medkits and know exactly where the best targets are helps a lot.
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  9. - Top - End - #99
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    The Deathmatch modes are really fun. I like 4 v 4 team and 3 v 3 Lockout Elimination more than Free For All (with randos anyway, I play FFA with friends all the time) but I'm glad they were all added.

    What I DO hate is that the game modes in Arcade rotate instead of all of them being available all the time.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    What I DO hate is that the game modes in Arcade rotate instead of all of them being available all the time.
    I agree with that. I understand that they don't want to fragment the player base too much, but I used to get really mad when the game modes that I enjoyed would disappear, only to be replaced with their terrible Capture the Flag mode that ended in a draw like 90% of the times I've tried it.

    And no, the fact that you can make whatever mode you are missing in the custom match creator does not make up for it. Those are always filled with stupid stuff and have people just screwing around goofing off.
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  11. - Top - End - #101
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Well, I have to say, the new Sombra changes suit me very much. Her spread feels a lot more manageable, there's less of a sense that you're just blindly spraying in the direction of your enemies, and I LOVE the new hack speed. And, of course, the nerf cries are immediate and profound. I only have so much sympathy. Yes, she can now get off a hack without a chance of interrupting, in the event she catches you while you're facing the other direction. To which my response is, so what? She still has to actually beat you in a duel, and she's just blown any advantage in the fire-fight she might have because she leads off with hacking you in lieu of shooting.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Well, playing in Deathmatch was fun enough, but when I actually tried quick play I quickly remembered why I'd stopped playing OW to begin with. Maybe I shouldn't have opened with trying out Moira.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Morty View Post
    Well, playing in Deathmatch was fun enough, but when I actually tried quick play I quickly remembered why I'd stopped playing OW to begin with. Maybe I shouldn't have opened with trying out Moira.
    Moira is super-strong, but yeah, quick play is definitely a clownfiesta. I love Overwatch for what it could be, but kind of loathe it for what it actually is. The game has a demographic problem, one that could be circumvented by design changes, but likely won't, because when you're a full time employee of a game company, you don't lack for people to team up with. There are simply too few players who want to play tanks and healers. You would think that after running WoW for, like 12 years, they would have gotten that problem drilled into their heads, but apparently not. So, instead of adjusting the design of the game and making all the heroes more self-reliant, they're just doubling down on making healers unkillable, which is how you get Moira.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    I'd rather not pin it on other players here. This is an issue of being bad at the game and its being too frustrating to actually get better.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Morty View Post
    I'd rather not pin it on other players here. This is an issue of being bad at the game and its being too frustrating to actually get better.
    Well, if your core FPS skills are poor, I'd agree, playing a competitive online FPS is probably not the best setting to bone up on your mouse control. I really wish they'd get the lead out and publish some persistent cooperative content, because I'm finding the same old PVP dumpster fire to be kind of dreary.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Moira is super-strong, but yeah, quick play is definitely a clownfiesta. I love Overwatch for what it could be, but kind of loathe it for what it actually is. The game has a demographic problem, one that could be circumvented by design changes, but likely won't, because when you're a full time employee of a game company, you don't lack for people to team up with. There are simply too few players who want to play tanks and healers. You would think that after running WoW for, like 12 years, they would have gotten that problem drilled into their heads, but apparently not. So, instead of adjusting the design of the game and making all the heroes more self-reliant, they're just doubling down on making healers unkillable, which is how you get Moira.
    I'm not sure what the current logic is with Blizz, but they need to make their tanks "tanky" and stop trying to make them slow moving DPS. Give them huge health bars and armor, so they won't go down to a lone Tracer at the drop of a hat, and give them bottom of the barrel DPS so twinks won't try to flank with them. You should HAVE to focus a tank to drop one, not just run around them with a Tracer or Genji for a second or two. In exchange, the Tank should do shyte for damage (unless you are in Melee range like Rein). But with the high population of twinks playing the game, nobody wants to be the slow moving shield...every little kid playing, want's to be the glory hound flanking DPS, no matter what character they choose....
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutazoia View Post
    I'm not sure what the current logic is with Blizz, but they need to make their tanks "tanky" and stop trying to make them slow moving DPS. Give them huge health bars and armor, so they won't go down to a lone Tracer at the drop of a hat, and give them bottom of the barrel DPS so twinks won't try to flank with them. You should HAVE to focus a tank to drop one, not just run around them with a Tracer or Genji for a second or two. In exchange, the Tank should do shyte for damage (unless you are in Melee range like Rein). But with the high population of twinks playing the game, nobody wants to be the slow moving shield...every little kid playing, want's to be the glory hound flanking DPS, no matter what character they choose....
    Again, the game is designed around these team synergies. The tanks have the big hitboxes and tools to peel for the healers, and the healers can keep the tanks alive through enormous punishment, and the DPS use the space created by the tanks to do work. Honestly, the game as its designed has nothing or less to do with how it's played at every rank of play up until you're in the top 10th percentile. Tracer and Genji might dance around a tank and pick them apart alone, but try do to that through a healer, and you're spitting into the wind.

    Believe me, tanks are plenty tanky, but they NEED healers to give them sustain, and healers need tanks and DPS to protect and peel for them. But you're really on point when you make this remark:

    nobody wants to be the slow moving shield
    This is the real issue: Overwatch is a game that 95% of the player base doesn't want to play. They want to play their pet DPS hero, and they want someone else to take the chore role of barrier spam or health bar filling.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    I am the best Junkrat in the world: O
    I think it's the best OFFENSIVE hero, if you can play it.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutazoia View Post
    I'm not sure what the current logic is with Blizz, but they need to make their tanks "tanky" and stop trying to make them slow moving DPS. Give them huge health bars and armor, so they won't go down to a lone Tracer at the drop of a hat, and give them bottom of the barrel DPS so twinks won't try to flank with them. You should HAVE to focus a tank to drop one, not just run around them with a Tracer or Genji for a second or two. In exchange, the Tank should do shyte for damage (unless you are in Melee range like Rein). But with the high population of twinks playing the game, nobody wants to be the slow moving shield...every little kid playing, want's to be the glory hound flanking DPS, no matter what character they choose....
    Low mobility low damage tanks are a very, very good way to take those tanks completely out of the meta. There is no agro meter in an FPS, so the tanks need to provide a compelling reason for people to attack them instead of the actually dangerous characters. Orisa and Reinhardt present their shields as the only viable targets by being just that large, Zarya becomes more dangerous the more you attack people she is protecting, and D.va and Winston are mobile and aggressive enough that ignoring them results in important people dying. Roadhog works by disrupting enemy formations and positions, and has a good peel if youre good with him. None of the tanks work by being slow and ignorable.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Low mobility low damage tanks are a very, very good way to take those tanks completely out of the meta. There is no agro meter in an FPS, so the tanks need to provide a compelling reason for people to attack them instead of the actually dangerous characters. Orisa and Reinhardt present their shields as the only viable targets by being just that large, Zarya becomes more dangerous the more you attack people she is protecting, and D.va and Winston are mobile and aggressive enough that ignoring them results in important people dying. Roadhog works by disrupting enemy formations and positions, and has a good peel if youre good with him. None of the tanks work by being slow and ignorable.
    But imagine if Rein or Orisa wouldn't drop dead the moment Tracer ran up behind them. You could just up their health/armor, and leave their current damage kit alone, but that would make them OP very quickly.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Thats how you get the quad tank meta.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutazoia View Post
    But imagine if Rein or Orisa wouldn't drop dead the moment Tracer ran up behind them. You could just up their health/armor, and leave their current damage kit alone, but that would make them OP very quickly.
    Do they really, though? Sure, if permitted to approach and mag-dump a tank, Tracer can do a lot of damage to a tank, but she's fairly flimsy herself, and tanks aren't supposed to be alone. Like I said before, Overwatch is designed to be a team game, but the ranking and queue systems discourage actually making a team.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Do they really, though? Sure, if permitted to approach and mag-dump a tank, Tracer can do a lot of damage to a tank, but she's fairly flimsy herself, and tanks aren't supposed to be alone. Like I said before, Overwatch is designed to be a team game, but the ranking and queue systems discourage actually making a team.
    I rarely see a tracer outright burn down a Reinhardt or Orisa. The worst thing that usually happens is the tank in question stops paying attention to tanking to try and swat the tracer, which is often just as good a result, but is a function of bad decision making on the part of the player, not an inherent property of tanks.

    Yes, a solo Reinhardt might struggle against a Tracer, but a solo Reinhardt is a bad Reinhardt anyway.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    I rarely see a tracer outright burn down a Reinhardt or Orisa. The worst thing that usually happens is the tank in question stops paying attention to tanking to try and swat the tracer, which is often just as good a result, but is a function of bad decision making on the part of the player, not an inherent property of tanks.

    Yes, a solo Reinhardt might struggle against a Tracer, but a solo Reinhardt is a bad Reinhardt anyway.
    Pretty much my experience as well. So I've been adding a bunch of Sombra time to my Overwatch CV, and she obviously is very effective against tanks, if permitted to work her mischief unhindered. But the thing is, if the tank has some marginally effective DPS nearby, she's really limited in what she can accomplish, thanks to a mere 160 DPS, wide spread and quick damage fall-off. The trick with Sombra, and with Tracer, isn't so much doing straight up damage, but rather splitting the other team's focus. Flanking is amazingly effective in FPS games, if the rest of your team is actually in position to take advantage of it. The problem, of course, is that at low SR, players just feed, constantly. It's why in Bronze, Sombra goes from being among the lowest win rate heroes, to one of the highest in Grandmaster. Yes, some of that is the impact of the player actually playing Sombra, but most of it is because she's an enabler Hero. If all you're enabling is derpiness, then you don't actually get to win. And it's exactly the same for Tracer. Bronze, Tracer is bottom tier, low pick rate, and low win rate. At GM, she's a beast, top pick rate and top win rate among offense heroes.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Sombra nerfs incoming

    TL;DR

    Taking damage while hacking puts hack on a 2s CD

    .1s grace period that lets you hack behind walls/through recall etc. going away, but in exchange improving detection so things like lamp posts won't block hack

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    So that pretty much nixes ever using hack under fire. I'm basically okay with it, but I'd like to see some improvements to Sombra's attenuation, so she can reach out a bit further than currently.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    So, I've been wondering something.

    Is backfill as emotionally rewarding for the backfill players as regular play is? If it is less rewarding, could it be made to feel enough better to achieve parity?
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    I must admit I have quite a bit of a crush on Brigitte.

    Also, I find it interesting that they managed to pick a Danish name for her, yet actually have an actual Swedish voice actor (unlike her father, for some reason).
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    I must admit I have quite a bit of a crush on Brigitte.

    Also, I find it interesting that they managed to pick a Danish name for her, yet actually have an actual Swedish voice actor (unlike her father, for some reason).
    In the Lore, Reinhardt named her.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by BRC View Post
    In the Lore, Reinhardt named her.
    ah.
    That explains it! How did I miss that?? *Weirdly ashamed now*

    Also, the name exists in Swedish but either as Birgitta or Birgit.
    Just FYI
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