General Anime/Manga Discussion 15: The Beach Episode

[gomipile]

Sorry, I should have made it clear I was just going for an easy joke.

[Aotrs Commander]

Sorry, I should have made it clear I was just going for an easy joke.

I know, I know.

It wasn't intended to be snippy, if it came across like that. I'm... having a Reality-is-making-Bleakbane-is-more-snippy-than-usual week, I'm afraid, shall we say.

[gomipile]

I know, I know.

It wasn't intended to be snippy, if it came across like that. I'm... having a Reality-is-making-Bleakbane-is-more-snippy-than-usual week, I'm afraid, shall we say.

Fair enough. I hope that clears up soon.

[Aotrs Commander]

So, I tried Violet Evergarden.

Ye gods, is it painfully ponderous.

Not sure, frankly, that I can stick out out after the first two episodes, but we'll see, because it's so... Stodgey. And nothing is happening.

What I can't understand is why that whathisname just doesn't tell the poor lass the Major's dead, since it was blindingly obvious from the get-go. I mean, the dude stopped just barely short of lying to her face when she directly asked in the first frickin' scene. That's... really kind of awful.

[Lord Raziere]

In related news, I tried watching Shin Sekai Yori up to the first two episodes. Very clear that it isn't my kind of anime by then. Whats shown is boring, creepy and implies bad stuff later on, so I'm not even bothering.

[Pendulous]

So, I tried Violet Evergarden.

Ye gods, is it painfully ponderous.

Not sure, frankly, that I can stick out out after the first two episodes, but we'll see, because it's so... Stodgey. And nothing is happening.

What I can't understand is why that whathisname just doesn't tell the poor lass the Major's dead, since it was blindingly obvious from the get-go. I mean, the dude stopped just barely short of lying to her face when she directly asked in the first frickin' scene. That's... really kind of awful.

I feel like this is the second time recently that I had just finished a show you also referenced. Violet Evergarden was...quite disappointing. Also, as you're watching the dub, I love Cherami Leigh, but she really doesn't have to be ten different minor characters on top of one of the main ones they never bother to delve into because that's what they went for. Pick literally anyone else to play those roles.

[DeadMech]

It wouldn't be me if I weren't late for a bandwagon so... Aggretsuko it gets a seal of approval from me. Not sure how I feel about the metal gimmick. It's a good fit for the internal screaming at people and is quirky enough to highlight that everyone has some interest that others don't understand and might be embarrassed about. On the other hand it also makes me feel like I need subtitles even watching the english dub. Think I'll be on the look out for the next season though. It's jsut so relatable and adorable. Reladorable. Even if I'm not a female or an office worker or in japan.

[Aotrs Commander]

Given Violoet evergarden was so... Yeah... I elected to try Lost Song.

First two episodes. Really not seein' why it's, like five stars. It's... Pretty every generic JRPG plot ever. Ye gods, so many clichés. And the bad guys are so very Generically Cartoonishly Evil, and not in an entertaining way, but a very, very boring one.

But... I guess... Things are happening...? Which put it marginally above the aforementioned, I think? Maybe?



Why is Glitterforce... FREAKING GLITTERFORCE seeming more appealing right now. I mean, it's so stupid (bad guys! You can generate negative energy from insects, you did it one episose, stop arsing around in Japan and go to a rainforest for a bit, you thickos!), but at least it's in "so bad it's funny" territory, the voice cast is good and every now and again it has some genuinely funny lines and delivery...

*sigh*

Getting the feeling I really did start out at the top, with 7DS...



(And I'm saving FMA/FMA Brotherhood deliberately until I've at least got to the end of the next couple of Naruto DVDs, as, from reputation, I migt like that, so it's nice to have something there that might not be disappointing. At this rate, I can honestly see me looking at Asterisk War again, since at least there was some minimal humour there.)



I noticed Wakfu is on Netflix, a show I've heard people mention, but know nothing else, but apparently it's not anime, which I had thought it was from the aforementioned mentions - googled it, and found that the third season has a different voice cast, so bollocks to that, then. Hate hate hate inconsistent voice acting. (Change of voice cast made me abandon Pokémon for years and miss entirely the best region arc. Why I would not be able to watch Saiki K season 2 until the dub Happens, because it wouldn't be the same voices, nevermind the language.)

[tyckspoon]

I noticed Wakfu is on Netflix, a show I've heard people mention, but know nothing else, but apparently it's not anime, which I had thought it was from the aforementioned mentions - googled it, and found that the third season has a different voice cast, so bollocks to that, then. Hate hate hate inconsistent voice acting. (Change of voice cast made me abandon Pokémon for years and miss entirely the best region arc. Why I would not be able to watch Saiki K season 2 until the dub Happens, because it wouldn't be the same voices, nevermind the language.)

It's a French show, IIRC, and anime in roughly the same way Avatar is - that is, it's another culture's take on the stylistic trappings and conventions of anime, just doesn't originate in Japan. It's supposed to be pretty good, haven't watched myself.

[Zalabim]

Given Violoet evergarden was so... Yeah... I elected to try Lost Song.

First two episodes. Really not seein' why it's, like five stars. It's... Pretty every generic JRPG plot ever. Ye gods, so many clichés. And the bad guys are so very Generically Cartoonishly Evil, and not in an entertaining way, but a very, very boring one.

But... I guess... Things are happening...? Which put it marginally above the aforementioned, I think? Maybe?

That's all pretty much true, but I did really enjoy the show's music and there really are some Fantastic scenes that go along with some of the other songs, so if each episode is entertaining enough as it goes by, it's worth finishing the series to complete all the songs. I wouldn't personally rate it five stars, but maybe 3.5 to 4. Anyway, things will happen. The show does not end on a cliffhanger or anything.

Wakfu, well, I had the show spoiled and so I kept watching it and it's really not as good as the spoilers make it sound. Probably not the best french Animated entertainment I've seen or anything special that way. Also, there's a miniseries style series between seasons 2 and 3 that is on Netflix but you have to switch over to manually or it will just run right into season 3 and a bunch of stuff will not make sense. It's good overall but a lot of episodes really feel made for a younger audience, especially early on. Good enough to kill time but you're not really missing out if you skip it.

[Kato]

Chainsawman is one of the extremely weird cases where I can not judge if the author is serious or way over the top satirical.. At least when it comes to main character motivation.

[LaZodiac]

Chainsawman is one of the extremely weird cases where I can not judge if the author is serious or way over the top satirical.. At least when it comes to main character motivation.

Chainsawman is hell.

On the one hand when the art does manage to be good it's honestly fantastic, and the actual design of things is really good. The art does...not manage to be good most of the time.

On the other hand it's written in a way that makes me hate myself.

[Kato]

Chainsawman is hell.

On the one hand when the art does manage to be good it's honestly fantastic, and the actual design of things is really good. The art does...not manage to be good most of the time.

On the other hand it's written in a way that makes me hate myself.

I feel the art has improved a lot since the first chapter. It's no very consistent but it's not... terrible. And it can be pretty good.

I... don't quite see what would make you hate yourself Some people might hate the author, though, in case he's serious..

[Braininthejar2]

I know some things just don't work that well in an anime as in the manga...

But Slime just skipped over an entire arc of international diplomacy.

I'm sad.

[LaZodiac]

I feel the art has improved a lot since the first chapter. It's no very consistent but it's not... terrible. And it can be pretty good.

I... don't quite see what would make you hate yourself Some people might hate the author, though, in case he's serious..

It's like on the one hand "oh wow this is a really cool in universe system. Demons are more powerful the more scared people are of a things, of COURSE a Chainsaw Demon would be horrifying chainsaws are HORRIFYING!" and it's like "oh man yeah this manga rules" and I told all my friends.

And literally the next page was our hero trying to buy the ability to grope someone and it's like...god. Why. Why do you do this to me manga.

[ajithajohn]

Can anyone say about what is this forum about?

[Kato]

It's like on the one hand "oh wow this is a really cool in universe system. Demons are more powerful the more scared people are of a things, of COURSE a Chainsaw Demon would be horrifying chainsaws are HORRIFYING!" and it's like "oh man yeah this manga rules" and I told all my friends.

And literally the next page was our hero trying to buy the ability to grope someone and it's like...god. Why. Why do you do this to me manga.

Tsk, horrifying is subjective. I think bats are adorable and I'm sure if it was not for a bunch of popular horror movies more people would think of chainsaws as useful tools instead of murder weapons. What will they use next? A cute little spider demon?
But no, it's a cool concept, I hope they do something with it.

And as for the other bit.. Until proven otherwise I assume we are meant to consider it stupid and not take it serious. It's weird for Mineta to be our protagonist but then again Seven Deadly Sins isn't much better.

[gomipile]

What will they use next? A cute little spider demon?

On a slightly related note, So I'm a Spider, So What? is getting an anime adaptation:

https://youtu.be/Nqu4D8P_oLQ

[Cozzer]

Well, the point of Chainsawman's main character is that he's horribly maladjusted and tends to fixate on whatever "normal" thing he considers his next goal. In the end, he's mostly a parody of the typical shonen protagonist (very notable in the latest chapter, with his "who cares if my dream is stupid, if I win the fight it means it was a better dream than yours" speech).

That said, they just animated the Separation Arc in the second season of Mob Psycho 100. I think everybody should know, because I'm totally in love with it.

[Aotrs Commander]

It's weird for Mineta to be our protagonist but then again Seven Deadly Sins isn't much better.

There is, of course, an interesting oddity about that in 7DS, which only came up in the third season (or second if you discount the four-episode season 2).

Spoiler

Show

I.e. the fact that Meliodas knows Elizibeth is the... re-incarnation? of Liz (who he was strongly implied to be living with - maybe even actually married (perhaps only in the common-law fashion), so he knew perfectly well who she was whe she first showed up, since he'd known he since she was a child (and even before that). And from his flat refusal to grope Diane when frankly offered, his focus seems to be on her alone.

Jury's out on whether that is less or more creepy, but...



Though there is some suggestion that, actually, she's kind of into it a little, actually, beneath the impropriety of him doing it so brazenly and in public.

Edit: Oh Lichemaster, the localisation on that last epsiode of Glitterforce hurt. The unusually locaious buffoon was asking questions of the hapless idiots, ncluding history questions on the former US presidents.

Glitterforce. Not three episodes ago, you were on a school culture trip to what is CLEARLY Tokoyo, complete with geisha girls, Japanese castles and the works, nevermind the fact the whole thing so heavily steeped in Japanese culture.

The crowning glory is when it asks GlitterSakura to read the kanji? (all the questions have been in English, because, y'know, USEFUL localisation) to which she answers and then, when they are surprised, says they weren't expecting her to read Japanese.

YOU'RE CLEARLY IN JAPAN!!!!

The real surprise, if we're actually going to call out that the prior text was localised to English, is that THE OTHER FOUR DUMBASSES CAN READ ENGLISH!

(Okay, fair point to GlitterIno, though, I did English at A level (literature, admittedly, not language - I'd have done the latter, but it didn't fit in with the other subjects I was doing) and I wouldn't have been able to pick out the preposition out of that sentence without looking up what a preopostitin actually is.)

Ye GODS, show, you expect us to believe that they are REALLY speaking English, and further they are in AMERICA?

I can only wonder how that panned out in Japanese - I am dimly aware that there is more than one form of written script, so the exchange may have been presupposed on the basis that the script was a nonstandard form. But there HAD to be a better way to localise that than just saying "Japanese," even if it might have been more difficult to work in that fact. The American presidents thing on it's own, though eyeglow rolling, would get a pass, since the point was to ask a question the girls couldn't answer (I mean, I freaking couldn't - as a British chap¹, why would they know that!) But



¹No, i couldn't name the umpteenth Prime Minster off the top of my head either, nor the umpteenth King, but of course, gratuituous jab at our friends on the other side of the pond, we have lots more history to learn so we're not reduced to learning lists of politicians..." (Zing!) I mean, even the industrial revolution and the THREE YEARS I spend at GCSE about the likes of Richard FRICKING Arkwright would be more interesting than that.

...

Maybe.

[LaZodiac]

Tsk, horrifying is subjective. I think bats are adorable and I'm sure if it was not for a bunch of popular horror movies more people would think of chainsaws as useful tools instead of murder weapons. What will they use next? A cute little spider demon?
But no, it's a cool concept, I hope they do something with it.

And as for the other bit.. Until proven otherwise I assume we are meant to consider it stupid and not take it serious. It's weird for Mineta to be our protagonist but then again Seven Deadly Sins isn't much better.

While I agree on bats, you have to understand that it does not matter how useful a tool a chainsaw is, it's a hand held and very heavy WHIRLING BLADE OF DEATH. Having a heavy respect and admiration for a chainsaw does not stop it from being genuinely a horrifying instrument. I would not even get within five feet of a turned off one. I don't even want to consider being in the room with one that's turned on.

That, I feel, is the power of chainsaw man. Maybe they are perfectly usable tooks...maybe so. But ultimately, it's a motorized belt of swords that could eviscerate you if it so much as touches you. There's a primal fear there, a fear we can't escape.

------

Regarding Glitterforce, as SOME small defense to it...some younger folk can't read kanji properly so it COULD be that she's saying "Ah I didn't expect them to expect us to read this level of character" and that's just...how they decided to localize it, which is mostly a mistake but does get across how difficult it would be at least. But yeah, man...shows do that so often even now and it kinda sucks.

[GloatingSwine]

That, I feel, is the power of chainsaw man. Maybe they are perfectly usable tooks...maybe so. But ultimately, it's a motorized belt of swords that could eviscerate you if it so much as touches you. There's a primal fear there, a fear we can't escape.

Not really moreso than other power tools. Chainsaws are actually pretty bad* at cutting flesh because they clog quite easily if they cut things that stick to them. (That's actually the basis of chainsaw proof clothing for people who work with them, they're packed in fibres that come loose and clog the chain and motor).

That said most modern chainsaws have enough built in safety features in the form of grip handles that make sure your hands are definitely both holding it that you're probably more likely to injure yourself with it by dropping a heavy thing on your foot than accidentally sawing bits off yourself.


* Not in the sense that they won't cause a serious injury or death, but in the sense that a mad chainsaw wielding psycho has about two murders in him before his chainsaw is hoplelessly clogged and useless.


(I gave up Chainsawman after half an issue, it wasn't interesting, I've read Devilman before).

[LaZodiac]

Not really moreso than other power tools. Chainsaws are actually pretty bad* at cutting flesh because they clog quite easily if they cut things that stick to them. (That's actually the basis of chainsaw proof clothing for people who work with them, they're packed in fibres that come loose and clog the chain and motor).

That said most modern chainsaws have enough built in safety features in the form of grip handles that make sure your hands are definitely both holding it that you're probably more likely to injure yourself with it by dropping a heavy thing on your foot than accidentally sawing bits off yourself.


* Not in the sense that they won't cause a serious injury or death, but in the sense that a mad chainsaw wielding psycho has about two murders in him before his chainsaw is hoplelessly clogged and useless.


(I gave up Chainsawman after half an issue, it wasn't interesting, I've read Devilman before).

Yeah but who actually knows all that stuff? And doesn't that really protect you from the creeping fear of whirling blades?

(that's valid, it is basically just a less interesting Devilman).

[Aotrs Commander]

Regarding Glitterforce, as SOME small defense to it...some younger folk can't read kanji properly so it COULD be that she's saying "Ah I didn't expect them to expect us to read this level of character" and that's just...how they decided to localize it, which is mostly a mistake but does get across how difficult it would be at least. But yeah, man...shows do that so often even now and it kinda sucks.

I assume, in original context, that would be what was supposed to be the case (we have GlitterSakura off-hand read a caligraphy thingy her grandfather was painting), but it was a poor localisation - and on top of the cringey very American history questions (they couldn't have seriously picked a more global history thing, like "what did year the first man go into space" or "who invented dot dot dot" or something, the narrative effect would be the same), it came off worse. (I mean, the addition of two words to "Japanese" like, Iunno, "kanji script" or something (just cut back to the bad guy's reaction faces is you coukld do the lip-flaps) and it would have been fine).

Hilariously, next episode had GlitterIno and GlitterNotFromNarutoProtagonist turn invisible and write their names down to show their friends... Vertically.



And hey, come episode 18, Plot Happens, even.



Glitterforce may stupid crap, but it's entertainingly, funny stupid crap (with a great fricking voice cast) and even the moments of sheer dumbness are not anger-inducing dumb. And it does have moments of being clever¹ and some of the lines (especially with the able delivery) and geninuely damn funny. I mean, I'm still watching, which is more than I can say for three out of the anime I've tried so far.



¹Said invisibility episode ended with a bral with an invisible buffoon, and the show neatly punctured the first couple of common ways of fighting invisible foes (sound and smell) by OldWitchKurenai actively fracking with them and in the end, required GlitterSakura to use snow instead o f the old "bags of flour" trick.

And while, on the one hand, I tip my helmet to them for the race episode whereby GlitterTenten - the best runner - tripped at the last moment and caused them to lose the race after the others had worked so hard and they had a bit of a moment (she was crying because she thought she let them down, they were crying because they never though they could do that well etc), it does still mean that FRAGDAMMIT TENTEN CAN'T EVEN WIN IN OTHER UNIVERSES, SERIOUSLY WHAT THE HELL.



Edit: Steins;Gate Elite came out today and it's £50 (£45 if you get it on launch sale!) Ouch! Okay, DEFINATELY not going to rush until the reviews come in (especially as it doesn't have English VO, which I'd sort of expect for that sort of price!)

[Prime32]

Edit: Oh Lichemaster, the localisation on that last epsiode of Glitterforce hurt. The unusually locaious buffoon was asking questions of the hapless idiots, ncluding history questions on the former US presidents.

Glitterforce. Not three episodes ago, you were on a school culture trip to what is CLEARLY Tokoyo, complete with geisha girls, Japanese castles and the works, nevermind the fact the whole thing so heavily steeped in Japanese culture.

The crowning glory is when it asks GlitterSakura to read the kanji? (all the questions have been in English, because, y'know, USEFUL localisation) to which she answers and then, when they are surprised, says they weren't expecting her to read Japanese.

YOU'RE CLEARLY IN JAPAN!!!!

Didn't Glitter Force leave out some of Smile Precure's episodes for being "too Japanese"? Makes me wonder what was in them.

Reminds me of that episode of Bobobo-bo Bo-bobo where the title character fails a test because he can't read kanji. In the dub (which actually has more signs of the story taking place in Japan than the original) he stares intently at the page for a few seconds then shouts "Wait, I can't read this, it's in Japanese!". But the series is a gag comedy, so it works.

Or the dub of Azumanga Daioh, which is still set in Japan but where "Your face sorta looks like... Mori, the last prime minister" became "You look like that American guy. You know... like Bill Clinton".

[Aotrs Commander]

Didn't Glitter Force leave out some of Smile Precure's episodes for being "too Japanese"? Makes me wonder what was in them.

Interesting... I did note it only took 18 episodes to fill out the 22-tick clock... That's kind of disturbing, if that's the case, since this is supposed to be a "Netflix original" label.



Nope, wiki says that's definitely the case, dropping eight episodes out of 48 (Saban is apparently responsible). OUCH. I mean I imagine it's just more of the same but, wow. That's a lot of episodes tro dump without bloody good reason.

(And cultural... What, supremacism? Is NOT a good reason.)

Skimming through the episode summaries of the Japanese-only episods, I can't really see anything that would give you a damn good reason to drop them (e.g. some of the Pokémon episodes that were banned/not translated) and damn it, some of those even sound like they would have been good.

That's kind of disgusting, really.

Welp, add that to the list of Things You Will No Longer Be Able To Do When Bleakbane Is In Charge On Pain Of A Rocket Launcher Being Violently Inserted Into Your Soul's Spleen.

(It is a VERY long and exhaustive list.)


Edit: Wow, apparently Glitterforce Doki Doki (also on Netflix UK) got it even worse, going from 49 to 30 episodes nearly HALF the damn series! Seriously, if you don't want to use the whole series, why would you want to bother at all?

[Prime32]

Nope, wiki says that's definitely the case, dropping eight episodes out of 48 (Saban is apparently responsible). OUCH. I mean I imagine it's just more of the same but, wow. That's a lot of episodes tro dump without bloody good reason.

[...]

Edit: Wow, apparently Glitterforce Doki Doki (also on Netflix UK) got it even worse, going from 49 to 30 episodes nearly HALF the damn series! Seriously, if you don't want to use the whole series, why would you want to bother at all?

Precure is the sister franchise to Kamen Rider and Super Sentai (they air back-to-back even), and Saban has the distribution rights to all three.

When Saban got their hands on a season of Super Sentai they took "Ancient warriors have awakened in the modern age at the call of their shattered god, the Great King of Beasts, who recover five of his seven fragments and help him pull himself together into something resembling his original form" and turned it into "Alpha, Rita has escaped! Assemble a team of teens with attitude!". And I think they turned Kamen Rider Black into a young alien learning about Earth from a smiling family?
EDIT: It was Kamen Rider Black RX, and oh god I forgot about Ferbus.

So historically, their approach to these kinds of stories has rarely been "Adapt a Japanese series into English" but "Create an original series using premade footage to reduce costs". But that's not exactly unique to them - in general, the younger the target audience of a franchise the more heavily it's localised. (while Smile Precure was notorious for its number of nods to the "big friends" watching, there's a few reasons why an adaptation would want to take those out)

EDIT2: Pretty sure it wasn't Saban, but Samurai Sentai Shinkenger had the protagonists write kanji to cast spells and even wear kanji on their helmets, so Power Rangers Samurai called them something like "secret samurai symbols of power". Which had the weird effect of Chinese and Japanese people in-series looking at common words from their own languages and saying "Ooh, how exotic and mysterious!".

[Aotrs Commander]

Well, to be fair to Glitterforce, that last couple of episodes of season one was pretty intense. (And worth the kinda stupid episodes that cropped up occasionally.) I mean, Princess Mode is kinda of utterly ludicrously silly (even above the likes of MLP's Rainbow Pwer mode), but at the same time, it takes itself just seriously enough that is also badass, despite being so utterly silly and very literally frilly.

(Again, the English VO cast must once again be praised for carrying it off.)

And it is the sort of silly where you find yourself laughing with it - I definitely see Zodi's "DragonBall for Girls" statement comes in. I might be silly as all get out, but it's also FUN with it.

...

Also have to say, I prefer the stupid combination friendship attacks to just the Protagonist-only attacks as the finishers. (Especially as let's be honest, Naruto goes on about friendship and such just as much as Glitterforce does and then proceeds to ignore it in favour Naruto-Is-Bestest.)

(Clearly, we need more Nanohas in our Narutos.)

[Rysto]

(Clearly, we need more Nanohas in our Narutos.)

Well obviously. Is there any anime that wouldn't be improved by putting Nanoha in it?

[Lord Raziere]

Well obviously. Is there any anime that wouldn't be improved by putting Nanoha in it?

talk to me when we get more spirit bomb attacks. that one isn't just the power of friendship, thats the power of civilization, of people combining all their energies into one to achieve a collective goal for the good of all. not just a few close friends.