General Anime/Manga Discussion 15: The Beach Episode

[Doorhandle]

The big problem with the label 'deconstruction', when talking about works of fiction, is that it's always been kind of vague and ill-defined. Even Derrida, who coined the term, never gave a terribly clear definition of what he actually meant by it and didn't really ever use it to describe works of fiction themselves. Of the various literary theorists who've put forward their own definitions of it since then, most of them have used it to describe ways of reading and thinking about a text, not so much an inherent property of the text.

So when you get into using it as that, you're effectively trying to navigate a river with a collection of abstract boat blueprints. Which is why most general definitions of it as a label for works of fiction are kind of a mess (GloatingSwine's own example, for instance, isn't entirely consistent with the definition he gives at the start of it), assuming anyone's even giving definitions to begin with - which they often don't.

Trying to get prescriptivist about the term is just not going to get very far, as there's not much you can point back to as being 'the accurate definition'. Trying to use it in a more descriptivist manner is also likely to get awkward since it's often used in a way that carries positive connotations (e.g. as shorthand for "darker than other stories in its genre but smart about it") and because there isn't really one usage of it that is common enough that you can call it the 'conventional one'.
Basically, it doesn't really 'mean' anything inherently.

As such there's really not much to be gained by asking 'what makes [x] a deconstruction?' because we don't really have a clear idea of what a 'deconstruction' is supposed to be in the first place. So getting too involved in that is getting into one of the least useful types of semantics arguments.

Well, drawing from my endless lurking heritage on tvtropes, the closest thing to a definition for deconstruction is "applying a trope/cliche/ect with unusually realistic origins or consequences. " or "following a trope to it's logical conclusion. " it reapplies the idea in a new way that goes contrary to the usual use of that metafictional more.

It's purpose is to identify why a medium or idea has become stagnant, repetitive or derivative, and to show that that stagnant viewpoint is not the only way to look at it.

For instance, Tarquin is a deconstruction of the story-savviness the other characters in OOTS show. Believing you are the star of a comic (even if you're right or half right) leads to sophism and then sociopathy very quickly, and even if you are right about everyone else being pawns in a story, it's not necessarily your story.

Likewise, The Incredibles and the No capes! rule: it shows how impractical the capes can be and that you don't need one for a good superhero costume. Though that's hardly the only way the incredibles is deconstructive (ex.Mr. incredible retiring due to all the blame for the collateral damage. )

Though of course even that definition is nebulous. Maybe the term itself needs the deconstructive treatment?

NGE is often called a deconstruction but kinda isn't. Deconstruction is merely a way to show that alternative presentations are possible within a genre*, which fundamentally requires a certain level of orthodoxy in presentation in that genre. Mecha shows never really had that, and had gone to darker places with negative psychological and physical consequences for protagonists before (O hai Ideon)-

Dang, ninja'd. With less words no less.

[Rysto]

Do Amazon exclusives that don't get a dub immediately ever get a dub? Have any Amazon exclusives that started out without a dub eventually gotten one?

Do we count the Sentai-licensed content here? Amazon had that exclusively last year and some of it is getting dubbed (although Hi-Dive seems to be getting most of that content now, so it's not exclusive anymore).

Does Amazon even hold the BD rights? I was under the impression that they only had the streaming rights. For example, I'd expect Pony Canyon to be distributing Yuki Yuna S2.

[gomipile]

To my tastes, Darling in the Franxx is getting really good as of episode 15. I don't have much to say about episodes 13,14, and 15 that feels original to me right now, so no spoilers today.

[Mx.Silver]

Well, drawing from my endless lurking heritage on tvtropes, the closest thing to a definition for deconstruction is "applying a trope/cliche/ect with unusually realistic origins or consequences. " or "following a trope to it's logical conclusion. " it reapplies the idea in a new way that goes contrary to the usual use of that metafictional more.

It's purpose is to identify why a medium or idea has become stagnant, repetitive or derivative, and to show that that stagnant viewpoint is not the only way to look at it.

For instance, Tarquin is a deconstruction of the story-savviness the other characters in OOTS show. Believing you are the star of a comic (even if you're right or half right) leads to sophism and then sociopathy very quickly, and even if you are right about everyone else being pawns in a story, it's not necessarily your story.

Likewise, The Incredibles and the No capes! rule: it shows how impractical the capes can be and that you don't need one for a good superhero costume. Though that's hardly the only way the incredibles is deconstructive (ex.Mr. incredible retiring due to all the blame for the collateral damage. )

Though of course even that definition is nebulous. Maybe the term itself needs the deconstructive treatment?

TVTropes is honestly what I'd have pointed-to as an exhibit in why it lacks any real meaning, since the users of the site will apply it to basically anything even vaguely self-aware (because, again, it has positive connotations as a term and the site has historically had an issue with positivity bias*). Hence why its definition is so nebulous.
Heck, your example of Tarquin fits neither "applying a trope/cliche/ect with unusually realistic origins or consequences" nor "following a trope to it's logical conclusion" very well, given that his undoing is him misidentifying who the story's protagonist is while the heroes don't, and doesn't fit any commentary on a wider usage of a narrative conceit because this is pretty much only a different aspect of a theme of the specific comic. Yet neither the site nor you would have had any hesitation in citing this as a 'deconstruction'.

Because 'deconstruction' does not have a specific classificatory meaning when it comes to works of fiction, and at this point I don't think it's possible to devise a meaningful, coherent one that encompasses everything it's currently applied to. Not that I think there'd be any real point in doing so to begin with.

That's the crux of my point: arguing about whether a work of fiction is a 'deconstruction' is spending time on a fundamentally unsolvable semantics arguement, rather than spending said time actually talking about the work itself.
And also online nerd culture has enough of a fixation on these kind of cul-de-sacs as it is without inviting even more of them


*right down to the site's redefinition of 'trope' as to be a value neutral/vaguely positive term, rather than using its established meaning (which is a negative one).

[GloatingSwine]

TV Tropes is best ignored on the whole anyway.

Like back in the day when it was mostly a competition to see who could be the most snarky and creative in naming and describing things it was fine, but when they tried to be Srs it fell on its arse because it confuses the process of dismantling something and labelling all the pieces with understanding how it works.

[Doorhandle]

To my tastes, Darling in the Franxx is getting really good as of episode 15. I don't have much to say about episodes 13,14, and 15 that feels original to me right now, so no spoilers today.

I just caught up with it: agreed.

Spoiler: Spoilers in the Franxx

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Though it's almost disappointing that there are tiny human bodies in the Klaxxosaur cores; I fear the plot twist that was amazing in attack-on-titan is about to become a predictable trend.

Also, I feel no sadness at the plantation being crushed by the flabby babylike hand of Klaxxsaur-God. To be fair, that is a much because big scenes of devastation like that don't really tug the heartstrings because there's no face to them, no-one to empathise with, as much as it is because I found the whole scenario hilarious.

it confuses the process of dismantling something and labelling all the pieces with understanding how it works.

I won't contest that, but don't you need to do the former before you achieve the latter? Like, if you don't know about the internal workings of a toaster, all you can say is what it does, not how it does it.

[gomipile]

I just caught up with it: agreed.

Spoiler: Spoilers in the Franxx

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Though it's almost disappointing that there are tiny human bodies in the Klaxxosaur cores; I fear the plot twist that was amazing in attack-on-titan is about to become a predictable trend.

Also, I feel no sadness at the plantation being crushed by the flabby babylike hand of Klaxxsaur-God. To be fair, that is a much because big scenes of devastation like that don't really tug the heartstrings because there's no face to them, no-one to empathise with, as much as it is because I found the whole scenario hilarious.

Spoiler: Darling in the Franxx episode 15 and before

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Well, it feels like they're doing something different with this plot twist, at least. It may be the same tool, but it's being used to make a different story.

I think we'll find out that the Klaxosaurs are, or at least represent, a truer form of humanity than APE and the plantations' population do.

I suspect the resolution of the series will be a lot like that of Demolition Man, and I don't think that's a bad thing:


Hiro: Whoa, Whoa. I'm gonna tell you what you're gonna do:

Hiro: [to APE representative] Why don't you get a little dirty?

Hiro: [to Klaxosaur leader] You a lot clean.

Hiro: And somewhere in the middle... I don't know. You'll figure it out.

Goro: F***in' A!

Hiro: [impressed] Well put.

[GloatingSwine]

I won't contest that, but don't you need to do the former before you achieve the latter? Like, if you don't know about the internal workings of a toaster, all you can say is what it does, not how it does it.

If you take a toaster to bits the first thing it does is stop toasting bread.

You have to understand how the bits work together to understand the device, just labelling them in isolation helps less than you think.

[Doorhandle]

Spoiler: Darling in the Franxx episode 15 and before

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Well, it feels like they're doing something different with this plot twist, at least. It may be the same tool, but it's being used to make a different story.

I think we'll find out that the Klaxosaurs are, or at least represent, a truer form of humanity than APE and the plantations' population do.

I suspect the resolution of the series will be a lot like that of Demolition Man, and I don't think that's a bad thing:


Hiro: Whoa, Whoa. I'm gonna tell you what you're gonna do:

Hiro: [to APE representative] Why don't you get a little dirty?

Hiro: [to Klaxosaur leader] You a lot clean.

Hiro: And somewhere in the middle... I don't know. You'll figure it out.


Goro: F***in' A!

Hiro: [impressed] Well put.

If that's how the series actually ends, someone better make a meme out of that.

Also Lupin the Third the Fifth is shaping up to be pretty good. Also Cowboy Bebop, but everyone knew about that one already.
Something interesting i've noticed is that Lupin 3 can go into very dark territory, still remain a very cheery show and yet it never comes off as a tone breaker.

If you take a toaster to bits the first thing it does is stop toasting bread.

You have to understand how the bits work together to understand the device, just labelling them in isolation helps less than you think.

Excellent point.

[BWR]

Also Lupin the Third the Fifth is shaping up to be pretty good. Also Cowboy Bebop, but everyone knew about that one already.
Something interesting i've noticed is that Lupin 3 can go into very dark territory, still remain a very cherry show and yet it never comes off as a tone breaker.

"I'm a thief; sometimes I steal lives."
The original manga and the early anime episodes based on it were generally of a darker tone than what became common. This is one of the few cases where I think the change works better than the original.

[LaZodiac]

All I know about the new Lupin series is that it heavily features The Internet, and Lupin is explicitly the type of person who would very much get deep into twitter and I really love that they did that. Also apparently deep-web weirdos have made a Twitter game about taking pictures with him in universe and that, too, is also fantastic and great.

So yeah I'd call that a hard, solid recommendation. Watch the show.

[endoperez]

Don't miss out on Hisone to Maso-tan if you can at all help it. So far it's the frontrunner for anime of the season for me. It probably won't dethrone SoraYori, but that would be a tall order anyways.

I was trying to find something decent, and wasn't really impressed by most things. I browsed through the thread looking for things I might have missed. I had missed Hisone to Maso-tan.

It's fun, it's good, and the drawing style is really unique. Mostly it's good-unique, although some of the simplifications are distracting - they might end up becoming charming as the show continues.

The premise is weird, and let's just say that it takes place in a military base, and it tries to give the impression of a modern military base. It does play loose with what people get away with, but even so, it's much more grounded than typical anime stuff.
It has an awkward young girl becoming a dragon pilot, with a weird combination of augmented reality / VR headset and an impressive feeling of flight, freedom in the sky, and speed. It has interesting takes on what it'd take to fly a dragon, and what it would take to hide a dragon, and somehow ended up at the most absurd, ridiculous solutions for both. The show still acts as if it all makes sense, which is both hilarious, but is still presented as something that's grounded and they're so far playing it straight, which just ends up adding to the humor. I don't know what they're going for - if it tries to make this a serious military drama, it might fail, but I can't really tell what it's trying to do from just the first episode, but that episode was really, really good.

And it has fantastic writing for the characters.

Good writing, unique and expressive art, surprising setup, lots of attention paid to both the mundane and fantastic details... Thanks for the recommendation, it's quite the find!

[Doorhandle]

All I know about the new Lupin series is that it heavily features The Internet, and Lupin is explicitly the type of person who would very much get deep into twitter and I really love that they did that. Also apparently deep-web weirdos have made a Twitter game about taking pictures with him in universe and that, too, is also fantastic and great.

So yeah I'd call that a hard, solid recommendation. Watch the show.

You're 100% correct, and it gets better :

Spoiler: How does Lupin escape the Lupin game?

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Easy: he starts using it as his own social media account! As the whole joy of the game is hunting down lupin, it stops being fun if he just tells you where he is, and so they just start leaving him alone!

Well, they do, not so much the assassins coming after him I guess.

Also, as of ep 4, Lupin's dead. As standard for Lupin, dramatic tension is maintained by figuring out how he's getting out of this, rather than if he'll get out of it.

[Weimann]

I have a tendency to lean towards ease of watching. Short series, and even short episodes, are positive factors for me. And if you manage to make a short series good, it’s often really good.

In that vein, I was positively surprised by Aggretsuko, available on Netflix. It’s a comedy about the grind of Japanese office work, made in a Hello Kittyesque style. The main character, Retsuko, hates her job and releases her frustration by belting death metal karaoke in the evenings. The characters are cliches, but delightfully satiric ones, and Retsuko is pretty dang relatable as a main character. If you got Netflix it’s definitely worth checking out, and the whole show is 2.5 hours, so, y’know, why not?

[Doorhandle]

I have a tendency to lean towards ease of watching. Short series, and even short episodes, are positive factors for me. And if you manage to make a short series good, it’s often really good.

In that vein, I was positively surprised by Aggretsuko, available on Netflix. It’s a comedy about the grind of Japanese office work, made in a Hello Kittyesque style. The main character, Retsuko, hates her job and releases her frustration by belting death metal karaoke in the evenings. The characters are cliches, but delightfully satiric ones, and Retsuko is pretty dang relatable as a main character. If you got Netflix it’s definitely worth checking out, and the whole show is 2.5 hours, so, y’know, why not?

Dammit, now I have to get netflix. I already have two streaming subscriptions!

ALso, updates on darling with the Franxx...their aren't any, they're doing a playback special instead. Just when it was getting good(er!)

[Pendulous]

Dammit, now I have to get netflix. I already have two streaming subscriptions!

I have four, and Amazon is tempting me with Wotaku. But I don't wanna pay just to watch that show.

[Chromascope3D]

I binged through it last night. At ten 15 minute episodes, it's an easy three hour watch. Fenneko is life. Make sure you watch the sub.

[Ravian]

Love me some Aggretsuko. However I'm having a bit of a quandry. I like many am a fan of Haida. However I'm engaged in a bit of an argument about whether he's a "nice guy" character played straight or subverted. I hope this doesn't get too controversial.

Spoiler: Netflix Series spoilers

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I'm generally of the opinion that what separates him from those more dangerous characters is the fact that he respects Retsuko's feelings and doesn't lash out at her when she starts dating Resasuke instead, and along with his own admission that most of his feelings for her were rooted in his own idealization of her rather than anything that could legitimately be called true love.

However the point that has been made is that from what we can see, it still seems like Haida and Retsuko will get together after his confession. (Whether it is or not, it's still clearly implied by the dialogue and atmosphere.) This kind of brings me to the Quandry, even if Haida doesn't behave like a "Nice Guy" by all accounts it appears that he's been rewarded for being nice and patient with Retsuko. Within that framework though, doesn't that kind of still encourage "Nice Guy" Behaviors? After all, most "Nice Guys" don't just think that they're a jerk that's just secretly being nice, I'm sure they legitimately believe that they're just being a nice person, just like Haida. The problems emerge when reality doesn't match up with expectations.

Now to be clear again, I'm not accusing Haida of being a "Nice Guy", it's clear in the story that while he did some of the same tactics early on (doing favors and pining rather just being upfront with his feelings.) those tactics clearly didn't work out for him and he has no one but himself to blame. I guess I'm more just worried that the significance of the ending scene might go over people's heads, and they'll attribute Haida's success at asking Retsuko with those tactics, rather than the fact that he stopped playing around and just asked her straight up.

What do you guys think?

[Chromascope3D]

Love me some Aggretsuko. However I'm having a bit of a quandry. I like many am a fan of Haida. However I'm engaged in a bit of an argument about whether he's a "nice guy" character played straight or subverted. I hope this doesn't get too controversial.

Spoiler: Netflix Series spoilers

Show

I'm generally of the opinion that what separates him from those more dangerous characters is the fact that he respects Retsuko's feelings and doesn't lash out at her when she starts dating Resasuke instead, and along with his own admission that most of his feelings for her were rooted in his own idealization of her rather than anything that could legitimately be called true love.

However the point that has been made is that from what we can see, it still seems like Haida and Retsuko will get together after his confession. (Whether it is or not, it's still clearly implied by the dialogue and atmosphere.) This kind of brings me to the Quandry, even if Haida doesn't behave like a "Nice Guy" by all accounts it appears that he's been rewarded for being nice and patient with Retsuko. Within that framework though, doesn't that kind of still encourage "Nice Guy" Behaviors? After all, most "Nice Guys" don't just think that they're a jerk that's just secretly being nice, I'm sure they legitimately believe that they're just being a nice person, just like Haida. The problems emerge when reality doesn't match up with expectations.

Now to be clear again, I'm not accusing Haida of being a "Nice Guy", it's clear in the story that while he did some of the same tactics early on (doing favors and pining rather just being upfront with his feelings.) those tactics clearly didn't work out for him and he has no one but himself to blame. I guess I'm more just worried that the significance of the ending scene might go over people's heads, and they'll attribute Haida's success at asking Retsuko with those tactics, rather than the fact that he stopped playing around and just asked her straight up.

What do you guys think?

Spoiler

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I dunno if all of his kindness early on was due to a crush on Retsuko. I don't think it's explicitly shown that he has a crush on her until she brings up the question of marriage. It's entirely possible that he didn't view her in that light until that specific point, after which it becomes all he thinks about.

[Ibrinar]

Spoiler

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I don't know that story but imo that comes down to two question one of the preliminary. What are the concrete problems with "nice guys"? Does the character have these problems?

My opinion: Being nice to someone you are attracted to is not the problem. (Also many "nice guys" aren't actually all that nice.) Being nice mainly because you are attracted to them is an aspect of the problem but being nicer to your crush is pretty normal. Having expectations of them because you are nice and then being bitter or angry about them choosing someone else or even just not choosing you is what the problem is. "doing favors and pining rather just being upfront with his feelings" is not an effective tactic but it also isn't inherently problematic without the parts where "nice guys" become *******s because they didn't get rewards after collecting enough favor tokens. Considering someone a "nice guy" just because of that is not very nice.

[Kato]

I haven't gotten to Aggretsuko yet but I'm watching Daisuki K right now and I'm surprised how entertained I am. I mean, it is quite straight up my alley, slice of life with a bit of weirdness, but it actually gets me to laugh loudly which I do rarely. I'm close to finishing and probably pick up the office animals afterwards.

[Doorhandle]

Lupin the third the fifth: ep 6 was an...interesting return to pink jacket times. Not where Lupin is best in my opinion, which is surprising because I generally like how it's a heist thriller that occasionally breaks out into looney-tunes antics.
7 on the other hand is a return to the form of part 4, which is to say "art heists and conspiracy," which naturally pleases me.

Franxx: haven't seen the very latest, but i've seen ep 16. A quiet episode, except for the new intro filled with so much foreshadowing it's almost pitch black, and the massive spoilers in the last 5 seconds of the episode. Also, gomipile's predictions are beginning to sound more and more accurate, which is hilarious.

[BWR]

Lupin the third the fifth: ep 6 was an...interesting return to pink jacket times. Not where Lupin is best in my opinion, which is surprising because I generally like how it's a heist thriller that occasionally breaks out into looney-tunes antics.
7 on the other hand is a return to the form of part 4, which is to say "art heists and conspiracy," which naturally pleases me.

I'll agree that Pink Jacket isn't the best Lupin, but they are still fun. I hadn't caught the preview for the episode so was entirely unprepared for it, and loved it.

[Doorhandle]

I'll agree that Pink Jacket isn't the best Lupin, but they are still fun. I hadn't caught the preview for the episode so was entirely unprepared for it, and loved it.

Yeah, I try to avoid the previews for that reason. I have learned the joys of going in blind.

Spoiler: Spoilers the third!

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I wonder who this "Albert" is mentioned at the end of the last episode? PRobably the blond guy tinkering with the watch, but you never know...

[gomipile]

My Google-fu is failing me.

What's the name of the comedy manga wherein a woman with an eyepatch summons and binds a female demon, who spends at least several issues trying to get eyepatch-summoner to die do she can return home?


Edit: oops! I found a different way to find it without Google. It's Dropkick on My Devil!

[Weimann]

Love me some Aggretsuko. However I'm having a bit of a quandry. I like many am a fan of Haida. However I'm engaged in a bit of an argument about whether he's a "nice guy" character played straight or subverted. I hope this doesn't get too controversial.

Spoiler: Netflix Series spoilers

Show

I'm generally of the opinion that what separates him from those more dangerous characters is the fact that he respects Retsuko's feelings and doesn't lash out at her when she starts dating Resasuke instead, and along with his own admission that most of his feelings for her were rooted in his own idealization of her rather than anything that could legitimately be called true love.

However the point that has been made is that from what we can see, it still seems like Haida and Retsuko will get together after his confession. (Whether it is or not, it's still clearly implied by the dialogue and atmosphere.) This kind of brings me to the Quandry, even if Haida doesn't behave like a "Nice Guy" by all accounts it appears that he's been rewarded for being nice and patient with Retsuko. Within that framework though, doesn't that kind of still encourage "Nice Guy" Behaviors? After all, most "Nice Guys" don't just think that they're a jerk that's just secretly being nice, I'm sure they legitimately believe that they're just being a nice person, just like Haida. The problems emerge when reality doesn't match up with expectations.

Now to be clear again, I'm not accusing Haida of being a "Nice Guy", it's clear in the story that while he did some of the same tactics early on (doing favors and pining rather just being upfront with his feelings.) those tactics clearly didn't work out for him and he has no one but himself to blame. I guess I'm more just worried that the significance of the ending scene might go over people's heads, and they'll attribute Haida's success at asking Retsuko with those tactics, rather than the fact that he stopped playing around and just asked her straight up.

What do you guys think?

Spoiler

Show

Well. No. Not really.

To begin with, "nice guy" is a negatively charged term. Being a "nice guy" isn't actually about being nice. It's about feeling inadequate to live up to society's social standards (which, for the record, I completely sympathise with). They then try to justify their own worth by making up a set of qualities they (supposedly) possess instead, and resenting those around them for not recognising them. This way, incels lie.

Haida might have done some favours for Retsuko with ulterior motives, but he never lapses into resentment or entitlement. It's also very clear throughout the series that Retsuko is in no way moved by his efforts; in fact, she's not even ignoring him, she's probably never even thought about them as advances. The ineffectiveness of Haida's methods are repeatedly laid bare.

Of course, that doesn't really safe guard the interpretation at the end, because that turn of events corresponds very well to the "nice guy" worldview: the "nice guy" gets ignored until their object of desire realises they were the right choice all along. But that's far from saying that "all accounts" of the show turns out that interpretation. In fact, only a few, very incomplete accounts seem to imply that. Everyone will make their own interpretation, but the better evidence from the source material that is presented, the stronger that interpretation becomes. A "nice guy Haida" interpretation is only supported by very cherrypicked evidence, and should be easy to argue.

[lord_khaine]

OPM

Spoiler

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So, that was a rather interesting discription of how you raise a monster to the top class.
Am i the only one who though there were some strange paralels between what Gyoro explained.
And what Saitama when though in his training?

What do people think Gauro will become?
Anti-hero or final boss?

[Kato]

OPM

Spoiler

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So, that was a rather interesting discription of how you raise a monster to the top class.
Am i the only one who though there were some strange paralels between what Gyoro explained.
And what Saitama when though in his training?

What do people think Gauro will become?
Anti-hero or final boss?

I'm only vaguely aware of what happens in the original story but I think if they follow it... Neither. Or not much of the latter.
Also, there really aren't many parallels between Garou and Saitama, except the "overcoming limits", which Garou does gradually and with hard work and Saitama did by ignoring the limits exist. It wasn't a struggle or hard work or anything for him.


Also, saw Aggretsuko. It was fun and I wouldn't have minded more episodes but it took me like 5 episodes to get invested and if they had not been short I don't think I would have stuck with it. I liked the show well enough but maybe because I was never in such a situation I guess it didn't connect with me the way it does with other people.

Started watching Fate Apocrypha because Netflix, though. I'm just two episodes in and not really invested yet but... I'll give it a little longer.

[Doorhandle]

OPM

Spoiler

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So, that was a rather interesting discription of how you raise a monster to the top class.
Am i the only one who though there were some strange paralels between what Gyoro explained.
And what Saitama when though in his training?

What do people think Gauro will become?
Anti-hero or final boss?

Spoiler: Spoilers for OPM, namely from the webcomic which is ahead of the Manga and anime

Show

I'm hoping anti-hero, considering his eventual defeat...though I guess that means he's the arc's final boss first. No clue if he'll even reappear, but I hope so.
Plus, it's not like the high-rank heros don't deserve a bit of a beating.

Spoiler: Other anime: Specifically Lupin III part 5 and Franxx

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Lupin Za Thirdo: So Lupin just got rekt. Honestly surprised he wasn't wearing a bulletproof vest...maybe he just forgot about his plot armour?
Kinda hoping he was genuinely surprised for once, but I think i would actually feel better with him thinking his way out of it.

Franxx: Haven't watched episode 19 yet, but It's about the enigmatic Dr. Franxx himself, so i'm looking forward to it.
edit: Well, that was something.
Between the environmental impoverishment, the banality of their existance and the ageing/literally immortal population, I can't help but feel this episode was a commentary on modern cultural trends/statistics.
Anyone getting Geth-quarians vibes with the whole clone-soldiers thing? Like, APE doesn't want them having relationships because it makes them feel guilt at endlessly ending them to the deaths? I don't think that's the direction the plot is going however.

[deuterio12]

Spoiler: Other anime: Specifically Lupin III part 5 and Franxx

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Franxx: Haven't watched episode 19 yet, but It's about the enigmatic Dr. Franxx himself, so i'm looking forward to it.
edit: Well, that was something.
Between the environmental impoverishment, the banality of their existance and the ageing/literally immortal population, I can't help but feel this episode was a commentary on modern cultural trends/statistics.
Anyone getting Geth-quarians vibes with the whole clone-soldiers thing? Like, APE doesn't want them having relationships because it makes them feel guilt at endlessly ending them to the deaths? I don't think that's the direction the plot is going however.

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I think APE doesn't want their clone soldiers having relationships because then they mayrefuse to be sent to their deaths. Like "My loved one is in danger, screw the mission I'm saving them!". In particular if they end up loving somebody from another mecha pair. Same sex relationships would be particularly problematic since we've seen only male+female can pull off the mecha driving. Either way I really doubt APE feels guilty about anything since they were sending the mobile fortress cities into suicide attacks a few episodes ago.

Still my question is why the klangsaur queen goes "stop attacking my people" when it seems like the klangsaurs were the ones starting the attacks. Maybe all the magma drilling was affecting them? And we still have no idea what that giant hand was.