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  1. - Top - End - #61
    Ogre in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelb_Panthera View Post
    Ahh there it is.
    Damn!
    Quote Originally Posted by Deeds View Post
    Caster backstories require a reason as to why they can cast spells. Wizards study hard to learn spells. Sorcerers often learn of their powers and then hone them through traveling. Clerics use piety to find the gift of spells through the gods or their ideals. Druids shun deodorant until a riding dog appears and they learn Entangle.
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  2. - Top - End - #62
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Ok, so... summing up:

    Lvl: 6
    Race: Human
    Alignement: CG/NG
    Class: Duskblade


    ABILITY SCORES
    STR 17
    DEX 10
    CON 14
    INT 14
    WIS 8
    CHA 8

    FEATS
    Must have: Power Attack (PHBI), Arcane Strike (CW)
    Should consider:
    - Spell Penetration (PHBI), Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Spiked Chain (PHBI), Combat Expertise (PHBI), Improved Trip (PHBI), Toughness (PHBI)
    - Steadfast Determination (PHBII)
    - Mobile Spellcasting (CAd), Leap Attack (CAd)
    - Obtain Familiar (CAr), Energy Substitution: Acid (CAr), Precocious Apprentice: Heroics/Burning Sword (CAr)
    - Spellcasting Prodigy (PGtF, must be level 1), Luck of Heroes (PGtF, must be level 1), Mercantile Background (PGtF, must be level 1, don't know if my DM will allow it)
    - Arcane Disciple? (I really like this one, though with low Wisdom it'd be pointless) (CD)
    - Improved Toughness (CW), Close Quarters Fighting (CW), Improved Familiar (CW)
    I'd like to but can't have: Knowledge Devotion (CC)

    Which 4 would you choose for level 6?

    SKILLS
    Concentration
    Jump? (Leap Attack?)
    Knowledge (?) (no Knowledge Devotion, remember)
    Listen?
    Sense Motive? (it's a class skill, and I like it for role playing)
    Spellcraft?
    Spot?
    Tumble?

    EQUIPMENT
    Armor: Breastplate (+1, if I can afford it, as Mithral Full Plate Armor won't be possible for now)
    Shield: Buckler? Light Shield? Heavy Shield? None?
    Weapon: Greatsword? Longsword? Glaive? Guisarme? Spiked chain?
    Items: ?

    Anything else?
    Last edited by Dhoule; 2018-04-27 at 07:45 PM.

  3. - Top - End - #63
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    ...Shield: Buckler? Light Shield? Heavy Shield? None?
    Weapon: Greatsword? Longsword? Glaive? Guisarme? Spiked chain?...
    You'll need a free hand for casting spells with a somatic component. That means wielding a weapon in one hand and shield in another is generally not going to be a good option. However, if you have a two-handed weapon you can let go with one hand to cast and then return the hand to the weapon as a free action. So unless you can get yourself one of those shields that will magically hover next to you on their own without being held (I can't remember the name but with limited source books they might not be an option), I'd recommend a two-handed weapon. You'll do more damage and can even look into things like Reach.

    • Spiked chain is a great two-handed reach weapon in 3.5 because it can also be used against adjacent foes, but it costs an exotic weapon feat.
    • Glaive is a great two-handed reach weapon that doesn't require an extra feat, but leaves you without a way to attack adjacent foes. Pick up something like armor spikes to handle those up-close situations.
    • Greatsword is a good two handed weapon that lacks reach, but deals plenty of damage.
    • Quarterstaff is another option that can give you more attacks instead of more damage per attack - if you go this route you would generally replace Power Attack with Two Weapon Fighting and up your Dexterity.
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  4. - Top - End - #64
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by BowStreetRunner View Post
    You'll need a free hand for casting spells with a somatic component. That means wielding a weapon in one hand and shield in another is generally not going to be a good option. However, if you have a two-handed weapon you can let go with one hand to cast and then return the hand to the weapon as a free action. So unless you can get yourself one of those shields that will magically hover next to you on their own without being held (I can't remember the name but with limited source books they might not be an option), I'd recommend a two-handed weapon. You'll do more damage and can even look into things like Reach.

    • Spiked chain is a great two-handed reach weapon in 3.5 because it can also be used against adjacent foes, but it costs an exotic weapon feat.
    • Glaive is a great two-handed reach weapon that doesn't require an extra feat, but leaves you without a way to attack adjacent foes. Pick up something like armor spikes to handle those up-close situations.
    • Greatsword is a good two handed weapon that lacks reach, but deals plenty of damage.
    • Quarterstaff is another option that can give you more attacks instead of more damage per attack - if you go this route you would generally replace Power Attack with Two Weapon Fighting and up your Dexterity.
    Animated Shield is on the SRD so I assume it's in the DMG.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deeds View Post
    Caster backstories require a reason as to why they can cast spells. Wizards study hard to learn spells. Sorcerers often learn of their powers and then hone them through traveling. Clerics use piety to find the gift of spells through the gods or their ideals. Druids shun deodorant until a riding dog appears and they learn Entangle.
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Fel View Post
    Zom, my imaginary hat is off to you. *Horns? *What horns? *It's just an unusual hairstyle.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venger View Post
    There are certain advantages to a game being as badly written as 3.5.

  5. - Top - End - #65
    Colossus in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by BowStreetRunner View Post
    You'll need a free hand for casting spells with a somatic component. That means wielding a weapon in one hand and shield in another is generally not going to be a good option. However, if you have a two-handed weapon you can let go with one hand to cast and then return the hand to the weapon as a free action. So unless you can get yourself one of those shields that will magically hover next to you on their own without being held (I can't remember the name but with limited source books they might not be an option), I'd recommend a two-handed weapon. You'll do more damage and can even look into things like Reach.

    • Spiked chain is a great two-handed reach weapon in 3.5 because it can also be used against adjacent foes, but it costs an exotic weapon feat.
    • Glaive is a great two-handed reach weapon that doesn't require an extra feat, but leaves you without a way to attack adjacent foes. Pick up something like armor spikes to handle those up-close situations.
    • Greatsword is a good two handed weapon that lacks reach, but deals plenty of damage.
    • Quarterstaff is another option that can give you more attacks instead of more damage per attack - if you go this route you would generally replace Power Attack with Two Weapon Fighting and up your Dexterity.
    Guisarme is my go-to for a two-handed weapon. Reach, tripable, reliable 5 damage (2d4 is better than 1d8) and some other minor benefits. You can just 5' step to attack adjacent in a number of cases, or drop it and draw a backup weapon which you can combine with a move action thanks to having over +1 BAB, and thanks to Arcane Channeling, you don't even lose much in terms of contributions there.

    For non-reach weapons, Falchion is up there with Greatsword. Against crit vulnerable enemies if you have decent flat damage bonuses (like Arcane Strike, Power Attack and Knowledge Devotion), it'll average much more damage than Greatsword. Of course, the crit is useless against enemies like Undead, Elementals, Constructs, Plants, Oozes and some specific creatures (and anyone warded against crits like higher level casters or anyone with Fortifications armor) without jumping through humps that are generally not worth jumping through, so its utility is very campaign dependent. A campaign heavy on arcane casters (and thus Constructs, Undead and Elementals) or divine casters (and thus Undead), or Fey/Plants, or Undead, would be rather unfavourable for the Falchion but otherwise it's a solid pick.


    And yeah, for shields your options are Buckler (with Improved Buckler Defense) but you lack the feats and the spells to make it decent, or Animated Shield which is kind of a no-brainer down the line. You could also use the arcane spell "Shield", potentially Quickened eventually, which is probably your best option for the moment, except that you'd need to access it somehow. Once you get Animated Shield and have a party member able to cast Magic Vestment +3 (so caster level 12), it might be a reasonable investment.
    Last edited by Eldariel; 2018-04-28 at 06:14 AM.
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  6. - Top - End - #66
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Yeah, many of our enemies until now have been undead and immune to crits. And we can see the shadows of the Red wizards behind everything that's happening. So not sure about relaying in crits.

  7. - Top - End - #67
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    So... Once more, nothing else about which 4 feats should I pick?

  8. - Top - End - #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    So... Once more, nothing else about which 4 feats should I pick?
    Without high DEX you aren't going to be able to build an effective AoO tripper, so spiked chain and improved trip are probably out. (If you had high DEX then you would take Combat Reflexes, Combat Expertise, Improved Trip, and Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Spike Chain to set up an area of control around you where opponents would have a hard time moving.)

    Spell Penetration (and Greater Spell Penetration) are heavily dependent on what your DM throws at you. If you run into creatures with high spell resistance, often you are going to wish you had both of these (for a total of +4). The rest of the time it's not going to matter much. An alternative is to avoid using spells directly on such opponents. Arcane Strike allows you to turn spells that would be useless against such opponents into a bonus on attack and damage against them. Or just look for spells on your list that have an entry of 'Spell Resistance: No'. I'd only take these if my DM used lots of these creatures and then I'd take both.

    Taking a familiar is something I'd avoid until you've had a bit more experience with the game. I've found it tends to be a liability for many inexperienced players and often an overlooked and underutilized asset for most others. While there are players who know how to use familiars to devastating effect, I'm not one of them myself and won't go recommending it to you.

    Of all the feats you are considering, I'd choose these: Arcane Strike is awesome on a Duskblade to begin with. Power Attack is good by itself and with Arcane Strike even better. Mobile Spell-casting is good and with your Arcane Channeling ability even better. Leap Attack on top of Power Attack, Arcane Strike, and Mobile Spell-casting can make for a truly lethal combination.

    EDIT:

    This is how your Duskblade can turn Leap Attack into leaping death. This assumes a build with Arcane Strike, Power Attack, Mobile Spellcasting, Leap Attack, 8 ranks in Jump, and 9 ranks in Concentration. You have STR 17 which gives +3 to attack and damage. You also have CON 14 which gives +2 to concentration checks. At level 6 you can cast 2nd level spells.

    This is all going to occur on the surprise round, when you are restricted from taking a full round action but can still make a charge attack.

    As you enter combat you are going to 'quick cast' the spell Jump to gain a +20 enhancement bonus on Jump checks for 6 minutes - long enough to last the entire combat.

    With Mobile Spellcasting you make a DC 21 check to cast Shocking Grasp (5d6 electricity damage and +3 to attack if the opponent is wearing metal armor) AND move up to 30 ft AND arcane channel the shocking grasp at the same time. You need to roll a 10, so as long as you aren't in a threatened space you should be able to just 'take 10' and succeed automatically.

    You are going to sacrifice a spell to Arcane Strike (1st level for +1 attack and +1d4 damage, or 2nd level for +2 attack and +2d4 damage). With Power Attack you can also subtract some of your attack bonus to raise your damage bonus by double that amount. If you are targeting an opponent in metal armor (+3 from Shocking Grasp) and sacrificing a 2nd level spell (+2) to Arcane Strike you will have a total +14 attack bonus with your STR and BAB, so even the max of -6 attack and +6 damage would still leave you with a +8 attack bonus. Pump up your damage by whatever amount feels comfortable to you right now depending on what you think you will need to overcome the opponent's AC.

    With the Leap Attack feat you are going to combine a jump with a charge against your opponent. You currently have a Jump of +32 (9 ranks, 3 STR, +20 spell) so can standing long jump up to 15 feet without even factoring in your roll! Taking 10 that's a 20 foot standing long jump. You only need to cover at least 10 feat, so that's not a problem. Plus you ignore rough terrain in the squares you jump over. This doubles your normal bonus power attack damage and you are going to use a two handed sword so you will triple the extra damage from Power Attack.

    So let's just say you are attacking an opponent in metal armor, take a -4 from power attack and sacrifice a 2nd level spell. Altogether you now have an attack bonus of +10 (+6 BAB, +3 STR, +2 Arcane Strike, +3 Shocking Grasp vs Metal Armor, -4 Power Attack), with a damage bonus of +27 (+3 STR, [+8 Power Attack x 3]= +24), +2d4, +5d6 electricity. That's 34-53 damage!
    Last edited by BowStreetRunner; 2018-05-01 at 09:22 AM.
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  9. - Top - End - #69
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Thanks! I'll pick those :)

    Btw, I asked him about his opinion on having a two-handed weapon and use Arcane channeling and, even though it's not his definitive answer, he doesn't agree with me about using one of your hands as a free action to cast the spell on the weapon.

    Do you know if this is stated in any book? Which one?
    Last edited by Dhoule; 2018-05-01 at 11:44 AM.

  10. - Top - End - #70
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Thanks! I'll pick those :)

    Btw, I asked him about his opinion on having a two-handed weapon and use Arcane channeling and, even though it's not his definitive answer, he doesn't agree with me about using one of your hands as a free action to cast the spell on the weapon.

    Do you know if this is stated in any book? Which one?
    If he maintains tgis position, Still Spell removes somatic components?

    Improved Initiative?

  11. - Top - End - #71
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Thanks! I'll pick those :)

    Btw, I asked him about his opinion on having a two-handed weapon and use Arcane channeling and, even though it's not his definitive answer, he doesn't agree with me about using one of your hands as a free action to cast the spell on the weapon.

    Do you know if this is stated in any book? Which one?
    Although the rules don't mention it, letting go of a two-handed weapon with one hand or putting a free hand back on the weapon is a free action for you.

    As a side note, Mobile Spellcasting allows you to cast a spell and move as a standard action. Arcane Chanelling allows you to use a standard action to cast a spell and deliver it through a weapon with a melee attack. Those are both different things and both require a standard action to activate. I do not believe these can be used together as advertised by BowStreetRunner.

    Quote Originally Posted by bean illus View Post
    If he maintains tgis position, Still Spell removes somatic components?
    Somatic Weaponry might be a better option, as it does not cost a higher spell slot.
    Last edited by DEMON; 2018-05-01 at 01:46 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buufreak View Post
    Cookie cutter racial cheese aside, we should probably keep an eye on the whole "Dwarf only" bit of the OP. But hey, that's just me. Everyone feel free to throw out more op tricks that are 100% topic irrelevant. :P

  12. - Top - End - #72
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Thanks! I'll pick those :)

    Do you know if this is stated in any book? Which one?
    This isn't spelled out in core, but similarly difficult actions (like dropping an item) are specified to be free actions. Bows are also two-handed weapons, and you can release a hand to draw arrows with no action cost.

    The Rules of the Game series of posts by Wizards did clarify this point:
    Although the rules don't mention it, letting go of a two-handed weapon with one hand or putting a free hand back on the weapon is a free action for you.
    Though most tables were already running it that way implicitly.

  13. - Top - End - #73
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Yeah... Still, what that website says is that letting go of a two-handed weapon with one hand or putting a free hand back on the weapon is a free action, BUT I'm not sure if that includes doing something with that hand. I'd like to think it does, as that's what I want, and need. But my DM might have a different opinion.

    Complete Mage wasn't published in Spain, so he might not accept Somatic Weaponry as an option (and not even the information from that website). Still spell would be a bad choice, I think. And, at that point, a one handed Long sword might be the best choice.
    Last edited by Dhoule; 2018-05-01 at 02:28 PM.

  14. - Top - End - #74
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Yeah... Still, what that website says is that letting go of a two-handed weapon with one hand or putting a free hand back on the weapon is a free action, BUT I'm not sure if that includes doing something with that hand. I'd like to think it does, as that's what I want, and need. But my DM might have a different opinion.
    If you're referring to casting a spell, it doesn't. But that particular something is covered via arcane channeling.

    So if your DM accepts this article and rules hand off - hand on as a free action, you should be good.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buufreak View Post
    Cookie cutter racial cheese aside, we should probably keep an eye on the whole "Dwarf only" bit of the OP. But hey, that's just me. Everyone feel free to throw out more op tricks that are 100% topic irrelevant. :P

  15. - Top - End - #75
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Hey there once more!

    After one month off, we're close to resume our campaign (our DM was busy with his studies). So I was trying to prepare everything for my new character, and now (yeah, now... ^^u) I've found that I can't use every spell of the Duskblade's list (!!!), but only the ones I've actually learned. And here I am again, looking for advice towards which spells should I pick. Some of them seem clear, but the other ones... Remember that there is a Chaotic Good Cleric and a Conjurer? (I think...?) Wizard in the party, so... It might be better to choose some spells they don't have an easy access to? I don't know, this is new to me.

    Level 0: with +2 INT mod I can learn 4, and there seems to be only 4, so no problem here.
    Level 1 (2 at level 1 + 3 from levels 2-4): Shocking grasp, True strike, Ray of enfeeblement, Chill touch? Swift expeditious retreat?, Obscuring mist? Resist energy?
    Level 2 (4 from level 5-8): Dimension hop, Touch of idiocy, Ghoul touch?, Scorching ray?, Swift invisivility?, Some of the enhancement spells (Bull, Cat...)?
    Level 3 (4 from level 9-12): Vampiric touch, Dispelling touch?, Doom scarabs?, Ray of exhaustion?, Greater magic weapon?, Any enhancement crown?

    From here onwards I'm at a complete loss.

    Level 4 (4 from level 13-16): Dimension door? Shout? Toxic weapon? Interposing hand? Dispel magic? Enervation?
    Level 5 (4 from level 17-20): Slashing dispel? Chain lightning? Clenched fist? Disintegrate? Waves of fatigue?

    Any help? Thanks!

  16. - Top - End - #76
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Hm... No one?

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    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Ouch.

    Well, I'll try with another question.

    I know increasing my INT with equipment won't give me more skill points per level. However, do they allow me to use spells I wouldn't be able to cast with my "natural" INT? That is... If I have 14 INT and an equipment that gives me +2 INT, would that let me cast level 5 spells or not?

  18. - Top - End - #78
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Yes, I'm pretty sure it would. Also, while in Pathfinder +Int items don't give you skillpoints they do come with built in skills. So if you slap on a headband of +4 int, you'll get two skills at maximum ranks. These skills are pre-built into the item however, so it can be useless if they overlap with your character. (which will only happen if you GM is a jerk.) Here are the rules.

  19. - Top - End - #79
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Thanks!

    One more question... In the spell list, there are some "touch" spells that aren't exactly "attacks", such as Resist energy, or Dimension Hop. Am I able to channel those spells even if I am the target, or one of them? How would I do that, should I attack myself? ^^u

  20. - Top - End - #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Thanks!

    One more question... In the spell list, there are some "touch" spells that aren't exactly "attacks", such as Resist energy, or Dimension Hop. Am I able to channel those spells even if I am the target, or one of them? How would I do that, should I attack myself? ^^u
    You can channel them, sure, and you can target enemies with beneficial effects, and probably even attack yourself and allies. Rules on attacking general refer to an "opponent", but the rules aren't too clear on who gets to decide who or what is an opponent--I'd rule that each party in a rules-based transaction gets to decide whether they are ally or opponent to each party in that transaction, and unless a pair agrees they're allies, they are enemies (in other words, "ally" status must be mutual). Which--in the case of attacking yourself--means you can simply declare yourself an opponent for the purpose of attacking. I'd suggest dealing nonlethal damage when attacking allies.

    Although giving your enemies positional advantage through dimension hop is probably bad, some utility spells, such as plane shift, can be brutally effective when channeled (plane shift allows a Will save for a reason). Plus there's always dimension hop + greater anticipate teleportation, which lets you whisk enemies away for three rounds (assuming they decide to use the spell, which they presumably don't have to).
    Last edited by ExLibrisMortis; 2018-06-05 at 02:50 PM.
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Thanks!

    One more question... In the spell list, there are some "touch" spells that aren't exactly "attacks", such as Resist energy, or Dimension Hop. Am I able to channel those spells even if I am the target, or one of them? How would I do that, should I attack myself? ^^u
    Not sure why you would do this? Every spell you are able to cast can also just be cast like a normal spell. So just cast it.
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  22. - Top - End - #82
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    So wouldn't I be able to channel those spells and just "touch" me or my allies with my weapon, without attacking? Though the PHB2 explanation specifies I must attack. Firstly, the damage is resolved, and after that comes the spell. But still...

  23. - Top - End - #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by BowStreetRunner View Post
    Not sure why you would do this? Every spell you are able to cast can also just be cast like a normal spell. So just cast it.
    Yeah, but the idea would be to cast the spell (without using the "swift action" ability) and also attack. As an example... Let's say I'm level 13 and I channel Dimension hop on my weapon. First, I *touch* myself, and teleport to a good position, where I can attack two enemies. There, I attack the two of them, and teleport them away from me.

    Would that be possible?

  24. - Top - End - #84
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Yeah, but the idea would be to cast the spell (without using the "swift action" ability) and also attack. As an example... Let's say I'm level 13 and I channel Dimension hop on my weapon. First, I *touch* myself, and teleport to a good position, where I can attack two enemies. There, I attack the two of them, and teleport them away from me.

    Would that be possible?
    Without using Quick Cast? Probably not. If you Quick Cast Dimension Hop (which you wouldn't need to channel through your weapon anyway, just cast it on yourself) and then used your Standard Action to Channel another casting of Dimension Hop into an attack I think it could work. I'm not sure how you'd do it to two enemies though, unless you have some way to Full Attack Channel that I missed somewhere.

    Edit: Missed the level 13 part. Definitely seems like a check with your DM thing.
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  25. - Top - End - #85
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Let's say I'm level 13 and I channel Dimension hop on my weapon. First, I *touch* myself, and teleport to a good position, where I can attack two enemies. There, I attack the two of them, and teleport them away from me.

    Would that be possible?
    If your DM allows you to attack yourself, that will work, but you must attack yourself, not just touch (although it could be a melee touch attack that deals no damage--ask your DM).
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  26. - Top - End - #86
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Hey there once more!

    After one month off, we're close to resume our campaign (our DM was busy with his studies). So I was trying to prepare everything for my new character, and now (yeah, now... ^^u) I've found that I can't use every spell of the Duskblade's list (!!!), but only the ones I've actually learned. And here I am again, looking for advice towards which spells should I pick. Some of them seem clear, but the other ones... Remember that there is a Chaotic Good Cleric and a Conjurer? (I think...?) Wizard in the party, so... It might be better to choose some spells they don't have an easy access to? I don't know, this is new to me.

    Level 0: with +2 INT mod I can learn 4, and there seems to be only 4, so no problem here.
    Level 1 (2 at level 1 + 3 from levels 2-4): Shocking grasp, True strike, Ray of enfeeblement, Chill touch? Swift expeditious retreat?, Obscuring mist? Resist energy?
    Level 2 (4 from level 5-8): Dimension hop, Touch of idiocy, Ghoul touch?, Scorching ray?, Swift invisivility?, Some of the enhancement spells (Bull, Cat...)?
    Level 3 (4 from level 9-12): Vampiric touch, Dispelling touch?, Doom scarabs?, Ray of exhaustion?, Greater magic weapon?, Any enhancement crown?

    From here onwards I'm at a complete loss.

    Level 4 (4 from level 13-16): Dimension door? Shout? Toxic weapon? Interposing hand? Dispel magic? Enervation?
    Level 5 (4 from level 17-20): Slashing dispel? Chain lightning? Clenched fist? Disintegrate? Waves of fatigue?

    Any help? Thanks!
    Let's see now. Yeah, Cleric and Wizard can cover some stuff but you don't want to skip on overall utility with the idea that they can do it for you. You have a broad spells known list and a lot of spells per day so make use of those. Thus, things I'd consider absolute musts:
    1. Blade of Blood: The HP cost is no big deal for you so it's basically just +3d6 damage with a swift action. Not too bad at all. Resist Energy; it lasts long enough to go all day and getting Resist Energy 30 for all 5 types is pretty nice and it can be cast on allies. Yes, bigger casters can cast it too but they can't spare 5 slots for every party member, let alone recasting it after the duration expires.
    2. Swift Invisibility. This is the only form of invisibility you get access to innately. It's worth having, even if it lasts for only a round. You can combine it with Extend Spell and recasting (the fluff states the verbal component is a whisper so it shouldn't be too easily audible if going by it) for longer duration Invisibility as necessary. Swift Fly seems like a must as well, just so you have at least some way to fly under your own power no matter how restricted or poor (unless you use feats to get something like Phantom Steed/Shadow Conjuration). See Invisibility is likewise a must-have simply because the ability is too valuable not to have and you can't be relying on others for basic competence. It's no True Seeing but it's 100 times better than being foiled by Blink, unable to see Ethereal, cold to Invisibility, etc.
    3. Ray of Exhaustion. Another angle of attack, you could use the debuffs and against single opponents it has a brutal effect even on a successful save. Greater Magic Weapon is incredibly good but it's a spell your casters can realistically cast for you even for multiple weapons (arrows/bow are nice to have as well for instance). Keen Edge is probably a buff you have a harder time accessing from others so it might be one to pick up. Not a massive boost but nice to have, particularly if you fight with a Falchion or such.
    4. Dimension Door: more range than Dimension Hop, very convenient as a non-combat tool. Enervation: another axis of attack, you can just drain living enemies to 0 HD. One of the best debuffs in the game too.
    5. Disintegrate: Build your own dungeons, make holes anywhere, make enemies fall, obliterate undead, etc. This spell is superuseful to have and one of the few terraforming tools Duskblades get. Yeah, real casters get it first, blablabla, it's a very good option to have anyways.

    A couple of things you want to make sure you have:
    - Some way to dispel. Probably just Dispel Magic. You don't get Greater, which blows, but c'est la vie. Being able to interact with magic >>>> not being able to interact with magic and even basic Dispel can still disable magic items on high levels for instance; it's not useless to have an extra character capable of dispelling.
    - A spell to target Will-save, Fort-save and Ref-save. Disintegrate covers Fort-save (earlier on Ghoul Touch is fine), albeit poorly, and you could pick up Hold Monster to hit Will-save (failing once is enough for you to deliver Coup de Grace) with Color Spray as the stand-in for low levels. Sadly there's no good spell to hit Ref-saves on your list; Burning Hands or similar doesn't exactly cut it.
    - Ways to affect enemies resistant to everything. You're fine in this regard with plenty of no-save touch spells like Enervation and Ray of Exhaustion, and no save effects like Waves of Fatigue. Well, as fine as a Duskblade can be anyways.
    - Pick up one Bigby's spell. They're all pretty good and the higher level the more versatile. Definitely worth having, they open up your combat options a lot. Bigby's Clenched Fist is very versatile and a usable level 8 spell for Wizards so as a Duskblade, it's not a bad pick-up. It also makes you able to finally have a minion of sorts, if in a very limited manner.
    - One of the immediate action defenses is nice to have for when they come up. Deflect is not bad though Crown of Protection is also okay if you keep your headslot empty.
    - One blast spell is probably okay. Different elemental coverage is nice though you could always just pick up Energy Substitution as well. Either way, at least Chain Lightning is probably worth knowing. Soni

    As for stat buffs, they're good on lower levels but quickly grow obsolete as you want them all day from items. It's not bad to pick up Bull's Strength or Crown of Might at first though, and Fox's Cunning may have some utility as well.


    Ultimately I'd be looking at something like:
    1. Shocking Grasp, True Strike, Ray of Enfeeblement, Blade of Blood, Resist Energy
    2. Swift Invisibility, Swift Fly, See Invisibility, [Touch of Idiocy] (or Deflect if you can use Deflection-bonuses without overlapping)
    3. Vampiric Touch, Ray of Exhaustion, Keen Edge, [Doom Scarabs] (could also be Dispelling Touch, Crown of Might or Greater Magic Weapon; this slot isn't awfully important)
    4. Dimension Door, Dispel Magic, Enervation, [Channeled Pyroburst] (see above)
    5. Disintegrate, Bigby's, Hold Monster, [Chain Lightning] (or Waves of Fatigue)
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  27. - Top - End - #87
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldariel View Post
    Ultimately I'd be looking at something like:
    1. Shocking Grasp, True Strike, Ray of Enfeeblement, Blade of Blood, Resist Energy
    2. Swift Invisibility, Swift Fly, See Invisibility, [Touch of Idiocy] (or Deflect if you can use Deflection-bonuses without overlapping)
    3. Vampiric Touch, Ray of Exhaustion, Keen Edge, [Doom Scarabs] (could also be Dispelling Touch, Crown of Might or Greater Magic Weapon; this slot isn't awfully important)
    4. Dimension Door, Dispel Magic, Enervation, [Channeled Pyroburst] (see above)
    5. Disintegrate, Bigby's, Hold Monster, [Chain Lightning] (or Waves of Fatigue)
    Wow, thanks! I've read about which spells are the most useful, though I wanted more personal advice, taking into account our Wizard and Cleric. Some things surprised me:
    - Blade of blood seems to be one of the most hated ones, at least from what I've read here and there. However, the fact that you cast it as a swift action indeed helps.
    - No Dimension hop? I've seen it recommended as a must everywhere, I'd say.
    - No Chill touch? Would be nice against undead, wouldn't it? And we've encountered many of them, I think.
    - I think I can see the usefulness of Swift fly, Swift invisibility, or See invisibility. But picking them over Touch of idiocy or Ghoul touch? Really? I wouldn't had bet for that.

    Btw, I'm not forced to pick the highest level spells available, am I? That is... Can I get from level 14 to 15 and learn a level 1 spell, instead of a level 4 one?

    Also, I could try asking for Precocious apprentice feat... Would Wraithstrike be the best choice if he accepts?

  28. - Top - End - #88
    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Wow, thanks! I've read about which spells are the most useful, though I wanted more personal advice, taking into account our Wizard and Cleric. Some things surprised me:
    - Blade of blood seems to be one of the most hated ones, at least from what I've read here and there. However, the fact that you cast it as a swift action indeed helps.
    - No Dimension hop? I've seen it recommended as a must everywhere, I'd say.
    - No Chill touch? Would be nice against undead, wouldn't it? And we've encountered many of them, I think.
    - I think I can see the usefulness of Swift fly, Swift invisibility, or See invisibility. But picking them over Touch of idiocy or Ghoul touch? Really? I wouldn't had bet for that.

    Btw, I'm not forced to pick the highest level spells available, am I? That is... Can I get from level 14 to 15 and learn a level 1 spell, instead of a level 4 one?
    - Blade of Blood is nice because it's innately a swift action. You get a lot of temporary HP from Vampiric Touch and potentially Doom Scarabs anyways so you should have little trouble doubledipping with Blade and Arcane Channeling. Of course, you should keep in mind how loaded your swift actions are.
    - Yes, Dimension Hop is great and I'd keep it until I get Dimension Door but once you hit that point you might not need it as much anymore. Note that it's a better spell to Quicken than Dimension Door though so it's worth considering. If you have another source of Flight, you could drop e.g. Swift Fly for it. Swift Fly is more of a lower level spell.
    - Chill Touch is a Will-save, which is a good save for Undead (who tend to have a lot of HD for their CR) so while useful, it's not that amazing. At this point you have Disintegrate, which is the anti-undead spell. Keeping Chill Touch on lower levels is fine though.
    - Well, I figure you have enough channeling spells so I focused level 2 spell on utility. Touch of Idiocy is great on lower levels but higher up you probably just want to obliterate whomever you strike and focus on damage/hard CC. It has the "Mind-affecting"-tag, which makes it less amazing on level 20 than level 3. Ghoul Touch is great and potentially a keeper but paralysis is only so reliable a condition. If your save DCs are very high you might consider keeping it but remember that even with 36 Int, a level 2 spell only has a save DC of 25 on level 20 while full casters are slogging around DC32s, and Fort is the best-progressing save. I'd keep Ghoul Touch on lower levels but higher up it loses some of its luster.
    - No, you're not forced to pick the highest level spell but you'll permanently lose out on one higher level spell known if you don't. Thus I would pick them since higher level spe

    This would be a level 20 loadout. You can trade a spell every odd-numbered level as per:
    "Upon reaching 5th level, and at every subsequent odd-numbered level, you can choose to learn a new spell in place of one you already know. In effect, you lose access to the old spell in exchange for gaining the new one. The new spell?s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level spell you can cast. For instance, upon reaching 9th level, you could trade in a single 1st-level spell (two levels below the highest-level spell you can cast, which is 3rd) for a different 1st-level spell. You can swap only a single spell at any given level and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that you gain new spells known for the level."

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Also, I could try asking for Precocious apprentice feat... Would Wraithstrike be the best choice if he accepts?
    Wraithstrike is amazing, though you probably won't have trouble hitting if you go Arcane Strike + Knowledge Devotion. But then again, you can always Power Attack for full so it's probably still worth it. Heroics is another nice spell, to pick up Martial Study or other such utility. Hm, plenty of other options exist, of course. Arcane Disciple is a great way to add to your spells known if you have some Wis or Wis-boosting items, as are the various Bloodline feats (you're a spontaneous caster so you qualify).
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  29. - Top - End - #89
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldariel View Post
    - No, you're not forced to pick the highest level spell but you'll permanently lose out on one higher level spell known if you don't. Thus I would pick them since higher level spe
    Higher level spe...? Higher level spe WHAT? I need to know! xD

  30. - Top - End - #90
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    Default Re: Help building my first (second) character!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhoule View Post
    Higher level spe...? Higher level spe WHAT? I need to know! xD
    Lol, woops. "Higher level spells known are generally both, less available and more powerful so the tradeoff is rarely worth it."
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