Death Battle IV: The Source Material Loses

[Keltest]

Yeah that was an interesting twist, though I had heard about the avatar thing before. Though I guess to be more accurate none of his versions are actually gods, they are all like a single finger of the true darkseid poking through into various realities, or a shadow. Just a fragment of his true might (Which still punch on supermans tier) It honestly reminded me of a sort of retcon to an old mmo I played where we fought gods and killed them on raids and such then later on in future expansions we learned "Of course you didnt kill a god you simpleton, did you really think all it takes to kill a god is a dozen +3 sword of fire? Those were their avatars. Now you are breaching the true planes of the gods. Good luck, you're gonna need it."

Would that be Everquest by chance? Because I remember that raid. Good times.

[The Jack]

I think 4th and 5th dimensional beings are in it for god status. If Darkseid is an essential aspect of the universe or whatever, he is surely a god by any non monotheist definition.

[Reddish Mage]

Oh, hey, it's that time of the week again? Time flies...


So with the recent success of Spiderverse, maybe we will get something fancy like a Spider(wo)men battle Royale. But then they don't do team battles often. Maybe we'll instead get something related to video games, like some SSB picks they haven't used yet.

DeathBattle doesn’t do battle royals. There’s DBX though.

I believe Spider-gwen wins it.

I think 4th and 5th dimensional beings are in it for god status. If Darkseid is an essential aspect of the universe or whatever, he is surely a god by any non monotheist definition.

I don’t think it’s useful to label or define “god” for DeathBattle. You can look at DC or Marvel canon to see if anything useful comes from that label there. For Darkseid that being a “new god” means his real body is this giant thing in a universe that is normally in accessible to residents.

5th dimensional imps like Mxylptlwhatever and Batmite etc are clearly not gods by DC label. They also get beaten all the time.

“Mortal” superheroes like Superman, Doctor Strange, Phoenix, The Flash, not to mention villains like Magneto have at times acquired so much power as to be “god like” or even “god killers.” Meanwhile Thor, Ares etc get that label of “god” but don’t seem anymore powerful than the people surrounding him.

Then there’s Beerus, who I don’t think I can compare to anyone else without triggering old arguments.

“Gods” are all over the map in terms of power and don’t necessarily share attributes like immortality, power over certain natural phrnomeona, reasonability over some aspect of the universe, identity with fundamental forces... that sort of things.

So we are left with a name that’s lost all meaning.

[Kato]

DeathBattle doesn’t do battle royals. There’s DBX though.

[...]



I don’t think it’s useful to label or define “god” for DeathBattle.

Huh? Pretty sure they did the Pokémon starter battle, though three is maybe a little low number for a Royale. But didn't they also do a turtles free for all? And I feel like something else I can't remember now.


God titles as power measurement are always lacking because there is no standard for what a god is. Some stories can't keep it straight within their own story...
But personally, I guess Darkseid is (pretty close to) a god by many definitions.

[Traab]

Would that be Everquest by chance? Because I remember that raid. Good times.

Heh yep. At least the later expansions made a bit more sense. "Ok, you have been obliterating avatars, slaughtering the most powerful mortal and immortal creatures on your planes, NOW you can face actual gods and give it your best shot!" In WoW they did a decent job of mostly avoiding the early god killing "Ok, this final raid boss for vanilla? Its the freaking EYE of an old God. Thats it. Good luck!" The power creep is still real but they clearly were holding back from blowing all their biggest names as raid bosses. Like, I could see it eventually happening, we get an old god expansion where all the nonstop interdimensional invasions and high tier catastrophes going on have awoken the old gods from their slumber. Not just a single body part, but the whole deal. Now we heroes have to locate their prisons and kill them before they can escape and destroy everything. Of course the cracks in their cells means they can still interact with the world to a limited extent. And its limited in that they cant one shot azeroth yet, so enjoy fighting through whatever insanity they create to get to them. But that is likely still some time away. We have barely managed to defeat the burning legion and its generals yet, forget about sargeras at full strength.

[Reddish Mage]

Speaking of video game power creep...you got to wonder where they are going to go after Diablo 3.

[Maryring]

They also did a TMNT Battle Royale.

[Reddish Mage]

When was the last time they did a battle royale on death battle proper?

[Traab]

Speaking of video game power creep...you got to wonder where they are going to go after Diablo 3.

Im voting the spirit of the earth, corrupted by the evil unleashed by the prime evil and/or humanity as a whole, has created avatars to cleanse the planet of the disease of humanity, etc etc etc. After breaking the world stone, the sheer corruption of the prime evil, and just how awful the world becomes over the course of the games, it would make sense that the world itself fights back. And make even more sense that it would be a corruption of its power. So like an Avatar of Growth is the boss of act 1. Well because of the evil that "growth" is more cancerous. Its a horrible tumorous monster out to engulf the world in its creeping horror.

Another option could be going full god/devil. Up till now we have been fighting against angels and personifications of sin, its time to move up the ranks. This is OUR world, and the nephalim are tired of it being used as the battleground of both sides. It starts out as us against the forces of hell. The Devil has opened the gates and poured forth his armies in a final attempt to destroy heaven. For whatever reason he has to go through earth to get there and vice versa, its why earth is the battleground between them. We eventually march into hell, face down the devil, who looks like a living patch of darkness and shadow rather than a real form, kill him, and leave. When we get back to earth tyreal shows up with a dire warning, the forces of heaven are about to go on the march to go finish off hell and they are going to destroy earth as a threat to its power as they were able to do what heaven could not. Before he can explain all of it he is pulled away by an irresistible force (God). Upon taking a portal to heaven we are told to suck it up, its going to happen whether we like it or not, and thus the war in heaven takes place. In the end we confront "God" who is basically a vaguely humanoid being of light.

[Anteros]

I was going to say that the whole "fighting god" thing has been beaten to death by other games...but then I remembered we're talking about Blizzard. Taking other people's ideas and tropes and pretending they're original ideas is what they do best, so I could see them going that way.

[Keltest]

I was going to say that the whole "fighting god" thing has been beaten to death by other games...but then I remembered we're talking about Blizzard. Taking other people's ideas and tropes and pretending they're original ideas is what they do best, so I could see them going that way.

The diablo universe literally began with the "big good" and "big evil" beings killing each other. The High Heavens and Burning Hells are literally made out of their corpses.

Prime Evil diablo is as close to that as they could feasibly get without completely re-writing the entire lore.

[Dragonus45]

The diablo universe literally began with the "big good" and "big evil" beings killing each other. The High Heavens and Burning Hells are literally made out of their corpses.

Prime Evil diablo is as close to that as they could feasibly get without completely re-writing the entire lore.

Given what a cluster**** the plot of 3 was, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried.

[Traab]

The diablo universe literally began with the "big good" and "big evil" beings killing each other. The High Heavens and Burning Hells are literally made out of their corpses.

Prime Evil diablo is as close to that as they could feasibly get without completely re-writing the entire lore.

Ah see I didnt know that. Meh, it can still work. These are nigh omnipotent beings, even death isnt permanent to them. They are awakening and reclaiming their selves that have achieved sentience after they originally died. The war is about to restart and our realm is caught in the middle. Its up to the nephalim to make sure they stay dead this time. Toss in something new, let us choose which faction to go after first, which effects how earth looks when we get back, maybe even what skills we learn as we level up. Again, Tyreal warns us as iirc he stayed mortal but on the angel council right? So he wouldnt be effected as much by heaven waking up and trying to sublimate its parts. Could even introduce a similar one for the demonic side to give us that initial choice. Neither side wants to be reabsorbed after all. And going after one side first justifies the other side being harder as that realm had longer to reassert control.

[McNum]

So we have the contestants for the next battle:



Aquaman vs Namor. Biggest surprise there being that they didn't do that one yet, I guess.

I honestly don't know who'd win of those two. Gut feeling says Aquaman because he has a magic trident and Namor does not, but I just don't know these two well enough to make an informed call.

[Devonix]

So we have the contestants for the next battle:



Aquaman vs Namor. Biggest surprise there being that they didn't do that one yet, I guess.

I honestly don't know who'd win of those two. Gut feeling says Aquaman because he has a magic trident and Namor does not, but I just don't know these two well enough to make an informed call.

in terms of raw power Namor, But Aquaman is one of the most powerful Telepaths in DC as well as has acess to a lot of magic.

Prep time could make the fighting crazy since they can both pull out some world/reality shattering items from their kingdoms.

[Rynjin]

Namor can fly, so that may be one of the deciding factors.

[Devonix]

Namor can fly, so that may be one of the deciding factors.

Flight's helpful but Arthur's actually the one with the Advantage if they get into a Range battle.

[HolyDraconus]

Didn't namor literally tank a nuke in one of wolverine's backstories?

[Kato]

I heard somewhere at some point someone said Arthur is as strong as Clark, which would look bad for Namor. (?) But I don't really care either way in this one... I hardly know Namor and Arthur only slightly better. But my gut says Arthur, which might be very wrong.

[Devonix]

I heard somewhere at some point someone said Arthur is as strong as Clark, which would look bad for Namor. (?) But I don't really care either way in this one... I hardly know Namor and Arthur only slightly better. But my gut says Arthur, which might be very wrong.

Arthur's Strong, but Not up to the level of Kryptonians. He's not lifting any planets. Namor's far superior in Strength.

[Dragonus45]

So I remember a while back they started trying to boost Aquaman’s public perception after all the jokes about him. I wonder if hidden in that time period isn’t some over the top fact that will give this to him outright. Other then that I think Namor might have an edge.

[Rater202]

So we have the contestants for the next battle:



Aquaman vs Namor. Biggest surprise there being that they didn't do that one yet, I guess.

I honestly don't know who'd win of those two. Gut feeling says Aquaman because he has a magic trident and Namor does not, but I just don't know these two well enough to make an informed call.

If they use Namor's recent depictions in the current Avengers, Defenders, and Invaders runs, then Namor has planet-wide hydrokensisis on both the personal and Macrolevel.

Where the hell it came from has yet to be explained, though considering he's a Mutant in addition to being half-Atlantean(where all of his non-atlantean standard powers come from), it could be a Secondary Mutation.

On the other hand, Namor also has severe untreated PTSD from what happened in WWII and this is apparently in part responsible for his constant slipping in terms of character development. That psychological frailty could cost him.

[Prime32]

Wasn't there a crossover where Aquaman and Namor both tried to defeat each other by summoning fish for aid, but they all sided with Aquaman because Namor is an *******?

[Traab]

ITS TIME FOR A DEATH BATTLE!!!!!!!!!!!!

Spoiler: Waterboy versus waterboy..... FIGHT!

Show

Geez, as usual it comes down to two main factors, raw power or speed. Aquaman was given an absurd level of raw power and durability for holding off a continent shattering feat while namor who held up a freaking island is still a billion times weaker. I didnt see the end coming too be honest though, and they didnt really show the sheer gap between them until the AAR.

Spoiler: Next Time!

Show

Its Mega Man versus Mega Man versus mega Man versus Mega Man. My money is on astro boy.

[Kato]

As I said, I didn't have any stakes in the recent DB and the fight was... ok. So yeah. It happened.

I am plenty stoked for next time. I wonder how .exe will contribute, though...

[Rater202]

BeforeI watch the video: Does the fact that Namor currently has planet wide Macro-Hydrokinesis play into the fight at all?

[Forum Explorer]

BeforeI watch the video: Does the fact that Namor currently has planet wide Macro-Hydrokinesis play into the fight at all?

Not really. The ability to control water is mentioned but the scale isn't.

Spoiler: Aquaman vs Namor

Show

So once again the DC equivalent is more powerful. Color me unsurprised.

[Traab]

Not really. The ability to control water is mentioned but the scale isn't.

Spoiler: Aquaman vs Namor

Show

So once again the DC equivalent is more powerful. Color me unsurprised.

Yeah I dont even think it comes up in the fight except as pillars of water and I think even then thats mainly trident powers. And meh, dc is just going to always be stronger i guess, they just tend to rely on a higher tier of power for some reason. At this point im pretty sure the shorter list is dc characters that CANT directly blow up a continent or more.

[Rater202]

Spoiler

Show

Namor in a recent Avengers issue drowned several men by filling their prison cells with water flow from their toilets from halfway across the planet.

In Defenders #1, Namor subjugated a city of rebellious Atlanteans by moving hundreds of thousands of gallons of water asside, causing the atlanteans in question to fall to th ground and begin to air drown. This was a casual effort for Namor.

This is recent stuff, so if there's a long enough lead time I can accept passing it by, but this is the kind of thing that should be considered... Especially since they do, in fact, show pages from the recent Avengers, Defenders, and Invaders runs so they damn well should have known about it.

So yeah, this whole fight was basically useless because they flat out ignored Namor's strongest ability.

[Forum Explorer]

Spoiler

Show

Namor in a recent Avengers issue drowned several men by filling their prison cells with water flow from their toilets from halfway across the planet.

In Defenders #1, Namor subjugated a city of rebellious Atlanteans by moving hundreds of thousands of gallons of water asside, causing the atlanteans in question to fall to th ground and begin to air drown. This was a casual effort for Namor.

This is recent stuff, so if there's a long enough lead time I can accept passing it by, but this is the kind of thing that should be considered... Especially since they do, in fact, show pages from the recent Avengers, Defenders, and Invaders runs so they damn well should have known about it.

So yeah, this whole fight was basically useless because they flat out ignored Namor's strongest ability.

Spoiler

Show

Would it make a difference? Seriously, Aquaman can breath underwater and has his own hydrokinesis. The only way it would matter if he could bring more force then he could in person.