Solo: I've got a pretty good feeling about this!

[Pex]

I vote for a reboot. Start over with Episode 7. The Thrawn trilogy would be nice but not necessary. I am quite willing to have a recast Luke, Leia, and Han.

[Peelee]

I vote for a reboot. Start over with Episode 7. The Thrawn trilogy would be nice but not necessary. I am quite willing to have a recast Luke, Leia, and Han.

I'm cool with this.

[Devonix]

Hey now, I survived the Prequels. You can survive this. we don't need a reboot. At the most they'd pull back on the anthology films about the old characters. That's what it's looking like.

[Zevox]

I vote for a reboot. Start over with Episode 7. The Thrawn trilogy would be nice but not necessary. I am quite willing to have a recast Luke, Leia, and Han.

I'd be significantly more interested in trying that than Episode 9 at this point, I'll give you that. Especially if they went with Thrawn.

Hey now, I survived the Prequels. You can survive this. we don't need a reboot. At the most they'd pull back on the anthology films about the old characters. That's what it's looking like.

That would be a pity. The anthology films are the ones that have been the stronger half of Disney's work with the series so far.

[Devonix]

I'd be significantly more interested in trying that than Episode 9 at this point, I'll give you that. Especially if they went with Thrawn.


That would be a pity. The anthology films are the ones that have been the stronger half of Disney's work with the series so far.

Since the anthology films are the ones performing weaker at the box office there's little reason for them to keep them, and reboot the ultra successful main series.

[Olinser]

I vote for a reboot. Start over with Episode 7. The Thrawn trilogy would be nice but not necessary. I am quite willing to have a recast Luke, Leia, and Han.

I disagree. Don't start with Thrawn and definitely don't recast the main characters.... YET. Go with the reboot but stay out of the main universe.

I say go with a solo movie for Mara Jade (heck you could even call it JADE) set after ROTJ.

Have it take place in the backwater of the Outer Rim with only tertiary references to the collapse of the Empire and the chaos that follows. No Rebellion, no Empire, no need for a grand story that links into everything. Just make a story about her scraping by and trying to survive in a region where there IS no authority and figure out what she's going to do. Then at the end of the movie, have a Stinger of her meeting up with Karrde.

Analyze that and then decide if you want to go the route of following the cannon or making your own trilogy. But this way the option is open for either way.

[Devonix]

I'd love for the anthology films to stick around. Just think that they'd be better served by steering away from the Rebels/Empire and focusing on other stuff in the galaxy.

[Mechalich]

A lot depends on Episode 9 - whether it's a smashing success (TFA), a middling success (TLJ), or a failure (Solo). At present the middle option seems most likely. Episode IX will probably once again underperform expectations but there's enough interest in seeing how this saga supposedly ends that it will have a draw, and while Abrams is unlikely to produce a movie that astounds, he is likely to produce one that is safe. There is also the question of whether or not a time-skip of some means (perhaps five to ten years) will be implemented between TLJ and Episode IX. This would normally be ridiculous, but considering where TLJ ended it may be appropriate. If there is such a timeskip they could produce additional Rey-centric films set in the interim.

Rather than a reboot - which would further divide an already balkanized fanbase - I'd suggest delving into Star Wars history. Making a KOTOR-era movie (which is not the same as making KOTOR into a film) or even a trilogy set in that era, is a strong option. The more medieval feel of that era plays into the Benioff and Weiss wheelhouse and would provide plenty of room to introduce new characters and new ship and weapon designs in the hope of bolstering the faltering merchandise market (so far the ST has precisely zero awesome-looking new ships, which is just embarrassing). Star Wars works best when there's a big galactic war going on, whether the main characters are fighting in that war or that war is simply the backdrop (the case in many excellent TCW episodes), but there's no need to get stuck on the Galactic Civil War. The Clones Wars has already shown other conflicts can work just fine.

[Olinser]

A lot depends on Episode 9 - whether it's a smashing success (TFA), a middling success (TLJ), or a failure (Solo). At present the middle option seems most likely. Episode IX will probably once again underperform expectations but there's enough interest in seeing how this saga supposedly ends that it will have a draw, and while Abrams is unlikely to produce a movie that astounds, he is likely to produce one that is safe. There is also the question of whether or not a time-skip of some means (perhaps five to ten years) will be implemented between TLJ and Episode IX. This would normally be ridiculous, but considering where TLJ ended it may be appropriate. If there is such a timeskip they could produce additional Rey-centric films set in the interim.

Rather than a reboot - which would further divide an already balkanized fanbase - I'd suggest delving into Star Wars history. Making a KOTOR-era movie (which is not the same as making KOTOR into a film) or even a trilogy set in that era, is a strong option. The more medieval feel of that era plays into the Benioff and Weiss wheelhouse and would provide plenty of room to introduce new characters and new ship and weapon designs in the hope of bolstering the faltering merchandise market (so far the ST has precisely zero awesome-looking new ships, which is just embarrassing). Star Wars works best when there's a big galactic war going on, whether the main characters are fighting in that war or that war is simply the backdrop (the case in many excellent TCW episodes), but there's no need to get stuck on the Galactic Civil War. The Clones Wars has already shown other conflicts can work just fine.

Eh, the problem with having films set before main films is that studios constantly feel the need to lay out exactly how what they are doing set up everything that happened in the main film. They can never just have a good prequel story about a Jedi fighting in the Great Sith War. No no no they have to have him/her retire to Tatooine at the end of the movie and find out that they changed their name to Skywalker. They can't have just a Mandalorian in the movie. No no no they have to be named Fett.

[Tyndmyr]

I disliked the movie. Spoileriffic rant to follow:

Spoiler

Show

Naming your robot character L337 is...ugh. Let dated memes die.

We did not need a background for why Solo is named Solo. Literally nobody asked for this.

Nobody, ever, said "****, we need more stuff from the prequels." Of all the bits of star wars lore out there, that's probably not the place to go to pull in a character. Particularly one lopped in half, and tossed into a reactor core. Death is wildly impermanent in these films, only losing a hand is forever. No, I don't care about the comics. The only worse decision would have been bringing back Jar Jar.

In fairness, reactor cores now appear to be quite safe, as a main character doesn't mind putting his face into an active one, and doing the equivalent of warboys blowing fuel into the engine, which makes a ship drive with all of the speeds.

Any secret society/criminal enterprise that brands their members has failed at everything.

Alright, so, remember how when people watched the Last Jedi, and were confused that suddenly the plot revolved around fuel, which Star Wars hadn't really given two craps about previously? Ended up seeming like a really hamfisted explanation for a tediously long chase scene? Did you, after watching that, think to yourself "Gee, I'd really like to have a film, made in the style of the prequels, focus on fuel and fuel production"?

No?

****. You're gonna have trouble with Solo.

One does wonder how, with one fuel refinery, and one fuel mining world, the entire galaxy is supplied, especially given that both such worlds are treated as out of the way povertytowns people rarely visit. The difficult is increased by the fact that the Unobtanium literally explodes if it's in a ship longer than some vaguely defined plot convenient time that is significantly shorter than the distance between these two worlds. Unless, of course, you do a kessel run shorter than anyone does. That's super convenient for Han, because we already know how that goes, but doesn't really explain...anything.

Most of the things in this film, you're going to know how they end before they even start. Not because the film explains plots heist style, because it doesn't. You usually have no idea why they're here, stealing this thing from...someone. Heists are not well laid out. No, you know what's gonna happen because they rely on very, very cliche things.

Remember how in every film with poker in it, you have a scene where the hero makes a lot of money, then foolishly bets it all on one hand, confidently reveals a hand he believes to be winning, celebrates, and then is taken aback by the other chap smugly revealing a better hand?

We have that scene. Twice. Once wasn't enough.

It's okay, though, because the first one doesn't actually matter. Despite betting stuff he doesn't have, and losing, nobody cares, and he gets what he wants anyways. Apparently scum and villainy really are good hearted sorts who don't expect you to pay up on lost bets, but will cheerfully pay up themselves, throwing in the soul of their robot girlfriend in the bargain!

No actual consequences are imposed on heroes for frank stupidity other than what they do to themselves. Seriously, the big bad has...a knife. Not like, a lightsaber-knife or force skills or something. He's just an elderly guy with a knife against a team of folks with an unreasonable amount of guns and explosives. He does have scars that glow red when he's pissed though, and he offs underlings for trivial things, that's how you know he's evil. Obviously he's going to forgive the heroes far greater failings though, because screw consequences.

Movie thinks human/robot relationships are edgy, and that Lando having capes is a hilarious joke....okay.

Lando at least is well cast. Han is not. He doesn't feel like the later character. In fairness to the actor, this is at least in part the screenwriters trying desperately to portray him as competent and spouting off all kinds of things. Comes across more geeky than roguish.

Yknow how the trailer indicated that he joined the imperial pilots, and got kicked out for shenanigans that went horribly awry? Sadly, those happen offscreen. Nobody wants to see anything involving a war in the stars here, folks. Best we skip that idea altogether.

It was nice of them to include a tribute to the career of Harrison Ford. Would have been better if they'd picked literally anything other than the Crystal Skull.

Possibly had more wookie on wookie moaning than the christmas special. Also, more wookie sexual objectification than anyone without a fursuit is probably comfortable with.

One of the most brilliant cinematic choices here was to comment on the state of the star wars universe with a five minute shot of watching everything circle the drain.

Given the complete and utter box office disaster that this movie is, it's a pretty safe bet they're NOT going to make more of this kind of Star Wars movie.

Sweet merciful Pazuzu, I hope not.

After this atrocity, I have absolutely no desire to watch Boba or whatever they're doing next.

Additionally, some new things are just laaaaame: The new bomber fighters in the movie clearly stink, compared to the faster fighters in the OT or the prequels. So who would want these slow impractical things to play with? Sure, someone, but also lots of people don't. LEGO has them, for example. Would be interesting how well these sell.

Eh, if there's one thing the Lucas/Disney empire has done well, it's the merchandising. The Last Jedi has problems, but it also gave us Porgs, which are infinitely saleable. Another Xwing is whatever outside of the appropriately named game, but Porgs and BB-8s are where it's at. The inclusion of an evil black BB-8 was definitely a straight up cash grab.

[Fyraltari]

Spoiler

Show

We did not need a background for why Solo is named Solo. Literally nobody asked for this.

Yeah that was dumb.

Nobody, ever, said "****, we need more stuff from the prequels." Of all the bits of star wars lore out there, that's probably not the place to go to pull in a character. Particularly one lopped in half, and tossed into a reactor core. Death is wildly impermanent in these films, only losing a hand is forever. No, I don't care about the comics. The only worse decision would have been bringing back Jar Jar.

He's been back for years now, but since I think it was dumb to bring him back anyways and he has no place in this movie too, I can see where you are coming from.
However he is, so far, the only character to have been brought back from death (excluding the ghosts who all show up in the movie they die in anyways). So really calling death "wildly impermanent in these films" is unfair.

In fairness, reactor cores now appear to be quite safe, as a main character doesn't mind putting his face into an active one, and doing the equivalent of warboys blowing fuel into the engine, which makes a ship drive with all of the speeds.

That's movie logic for you. But really that is entirely par the course for Star Wars.

Any secret society/criminal enterprise that brands their members has failed at everything.

I wish I was brave enough to insult the Russina Mafyia, American Cartels, Japanese Yakuzas and Chinese Tongs all at once. No, wait, I don't.

Alright, so, remember how when people watched the Last Jedi, and were confused that suddenly the plot revolved around fuel, which Star Wars hadn't really given two craps about previously? Ended up seeming like a really hamfisted explanation for a tediously long chase scene? Did you, after watching that, think to yourself "Gee, I'd really like to have a film, made in the style of the prequels, focus on fuel and fuel production"?

No?

****. You're gonna have trouble with Solo.

The movie is not about the fuel in anyway. The fuel is a McGuffin.

One does wonder how, with one fuel refinery, and one fuel mining world, the entire galaxy is supplied, especially given that both such worlds are treated as out of the way povertytowns people rarely visit. The difficult is increased by the fact that the Unobtanium literally explodes if it's in a ship longer than some vaguely defined plot convenient time that is significantly shorter than the distance between these two worlds. Unless, of course, you do a kessel run shorter than anyone does. That's super convenient for Han, because we already know how that goes, but doesn't really explain...anything.

That was something that puzzled the friend and went with and I, especially since it would be out-of-character for the Empire and the Republic to trust the Pykes with overseeing it and the Seperatists and Rebellion should be crippled without it. The best expalnation we came up with was that there is several kinds of HYPERFUEL and it is just Coaxium that is only found on Kessel. Also there are several raffinery mentionned in the film, they explicitly decide to go with the desaffected onethat's all.

It's okay, though, because the first one doesn't actually matter. Despite betting stuff he doesn't have, and losing, nobody cares, and he gets what he wants anyways. Apparently scum and villainy really are good hearted sorts who don't expect you to pay up on lost bets, but will cheerfully pay up themselves, throwing in the soul of their robot girlfriend in the bargain!

Lando really was never portrayed as scummy and villainous. Also "the soul of their robot girlfriend" either is gone forever or if itcould be rescued Lando has done it during the unspecified amount of timeit took Han and Chewie to track him down.

No actual consequences are imposed on heroes for frank stupidity other than what they do to themselves. Seriously, the big bad has...a knife. Not like, a lightsaber-knife or force skills or something. He's just an elderly guy with a knife against a team of folks with an unreasonable amount of guns and explosives. He does have scars that glow red when he's pissed though, and he offs underlings for trivial things, that's how you know he's evil. Obviously he's going to forgive the heroes far greater failings though, because screw consequences.

No, he is an elderly guy with a knife (clearly intended toforeshadow Maul by the way) with a commando team,you know the one Han had to trick into being away fighting the Cloud Riders?
Also he nevers off any underling. We only ever see him kill one person and that's an Imperial Governor (a business partner/bribee most likely). We are not given his reasons to do so.

Lando at least is well cast. Han is not. He doesn't feel like the later character.

He does at the end. Because that's the point of the movie: it's about how Han became Han.

Yknow how the trailer indicated that he joined the imperial pilots, and got kicked out for shenanigans that went horribly awry? Sadly, those happen offscreen.

Yeah that was cut along with Tag and Bink's cameo (unless you think they are the two troopers that throw him to Chewie).

Nobody wants to see anything involving a war in the stars here, folks. Best we skip that idea altogether.

I dunno, I found the war sequence muchmore interesting that another space battle. More unique-looking as well, with the trench warfare going on (really what does it say about WWI when the evil fictionnal empire of doom gives its troops larger and cleaner trenches than the real ones?)

It was nice of them to include a tribute to the career of Harrison Ford. Would have been better if they'd picked literally anything other than the Crystal Skull.

Yeah that was dumb.

Possibly had more wookie on wookie moaning than the christmas special. Also, more wookie sexual objectification than anyone without a fursuit is probably comfortable with.

I have not a bloody clue what you are talking about.

Eh, if there's one thing the Lucas/Disney empire has done well, it's the merchandising. The Last Jedi has problems, but it also gave us Porgs, which are infinitely saleable. Another Xwing is whatever outside of the appropriately named game, but Porgs and BB-8s are where it's at. The inclusion of an evil black BB-8 was definitely a straight up cash grab.

Oh yeah, the merchandising has always been SW's bread and butter.

[Peelee]

Spoiler

Show

Nobody, ever, said "****, we need more stuff from the prequels." Of all the bits of star wars lore out there, that's probably not the place to go to pull in a character. Particularly one lopped in half, and tossed into a reactor core. Death is wildly impermanent in these films, only losing a hand is forever. No, I don't care about the comics. The only worse decision would have been bringing back Jar Jar.

Spoiler

Show

I can understand not caring about the comics. Or The Clone Wars cartoon. Or the Rebels cartoon. Regardless of whether you care or not, though, Maul has been canonically alive for a while now. Sure, it's stupid. But if they can use him better than Ep. I did, more power to 'em. I do agree that shoehorning him into the end without otherwise showing that or how he's survived in any of the movies was absolutely a mistake, and his existence as the head of Red Dawn is the only reason Not-Black-Sun Red Dawn isn't just Black Sun, which IMO would have been way better.

Spoiler

Show

In fairness, reactor cores now appear to be quite safe, as a main character doesn't mind putting his face into an active one, and doing the equivalent of warboys blowing fuel into the engine, which makes a ship drive with all of the speeds.

Spoiler

Show

Reactor cores have always been safe, so long as nobody is shooting missiles into them.

Spoiler

Show

Any secret society/criminal enterprise that brands their members has failed at everything.

Spoiler

Show

Agreed. I thought she was a slave at first, since that made way more sense

Spoiler

Show

It's okay, though, because the first one doesn't actually matter. Despite betting stuff he doesn't have, and losing, nobody cares, and he gets what he wants anyways. Apparently scum and villainy really are good hearted sorts who don't expect you to pay up on lost bets, but will cheerfully pay up themselves, throwing in the soul of their robot girlfriend in the bargain!

Spoiler

Show

Qi'ra all but tells Lando that there is no ship, but they still give him a hefty cut. That he agrees to this can be taken that he sees it as both payment for his services and ship, and what Han had tried to bet with. Sure, that's a weak as hell argument,
but it's a way for that to make sense. As for the next time they played, Han didn't try to pretend he had anything he didn't,
and also if Lando didn't pay up Han could have openly exposed his cheating device to everyone else, who I imagine would be more than a little upset at losing large amount of money to Lando. Giving up the Falcon and surviving is better than welching and dying.

Spoiler

Show

No actual consequences are imposed on heroes for frank stupidity other than what they do to themselves. Seriously, the big bad has...a knife. Not like, a lightsaber-knife or force skills or something. He's just an elderly guy with a knife against a team of folks with an unreasonable amount of guns and explosives. He does have scars that glow red when he's pissed though, and he offs underlings for trivial things, that's how you know he's evil. Obviously he's going to forgive the heroes far greater failings though, because screw consequences.

Spoiler

Show

The guy who trained Qi'ra in Teras Kasi, and who thus is established as being proficient in it himself? So dude likes a blade over a gun. It's stupid, but not monumentally so, especially in his own stronghold when he believes there are no other weapons and even when one does appear, it's a single pistol.

Also, he killed the Imperial governor for an unknown thing. We don't know how trivial it was because we only see his death.
He's also more than willing to kill the heroes because they owe him something they cannot produce, until they offer a way to produce it. If they fail to produce it, he will kill them. That's not stupidity, that's economic.

Spoiler

Show

Yknow how the trailer indicated that he joined the imperial pilots, and got kicked out for shenanigans that went horribly awry? Sadly, those happen offscreen. Nobody wants to see anything involving a war in the stars here, folks. Best we skip that idea altogether.

Spoiler

Show

Oh god yes. I was pissed when they skipped right to the mudball battle.

Spoiler

Show

Also, more wookie sexual objectification than anyone without a fursuit is probably comfortable with.

Spoiler

Show

......what? I think you may be reading your own thing into the movie there, because I have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

Also, Wookiee. 2 E's.

[Frozen_Feet]

Any secret society/criminal enterprise that brands their members has failed at everything.

... That bit's directly inspired by real secret societies and criminal gangs doing exactly that. Now, some (like Yakuza) have since given up the practice, but historically tattoos, brands and other shows of membership and status have been the norm.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Tyndmyr

Spoiler

Show

Also, more wookie sexual objectification than anyone without a fursuit is probably comfortable with.

Spoiler

Show

I think there's a general consensus that this is your thing alone.

Because I, too, have absolutely no idea where you're getting this from.

[Lord Raziere]

....I liked the film........thought it explained and told the story and everything well.........even if I expected all the deaths and betrayal from the start.....cause it um, lived up to those expectations.....thats all I got.

[Bohandas]

If the Space Fagin lady and her enforcers were both the same species why did the enforcers only have two arms? Thalidomide?

(speaking of which, is it just me or would Thalidomide make a good name for a planet?)

[Fyraltari]

If the Space Fagin lady and her enforcers were both the same species why did the enforcers only have two arms? Thalidomide?

(speaking of which, is it just me or would Thalidomide make a good name for a planet?)

Either before and after state of metamorphosis or just very strong sexual dimorphism. Or both.

[Bohandas]

Does anybody else find it odd that airport security under the fascist Palpatine regime is apparently less intrusive than it is in a real airport? They weren't even making people take their shoes off.

... That bit's directly inspired by real secret societies and criminal gangs doing exactly that. Now, some (like Yakuza) have since given up the practice, but historically tattoos, brands and other shows of membership and status have been the norm.

I thought the Yakuza's old thing was amputated fingertips. That's a lot more sensible because it's plausibly deniable. There's lots of legitimate ways that you could lose a finger.

[Tyndmyr]

Spoiler

Show

He's been back for years now, but since I think it was dumb to bring him back anyways and he has no place in this movie too, I can see where you are coming from.
However he is, so far, the only character to have been brought back from death (excluding the ghosts who all show up in the movie they die in anyways). So really calling death "wildly impermanent in these films" is unfair.

Ah, my bad on framing this poorly. I should have framed this as "important characters don't really die". I suppose the worst example would be the inclusion of young anakin as a force ghost in the remastered Return as a means of retconning everything together. Star Wars in general seems to have a very strong sense of mowing down tons of faceless mooks, and all heroes gettin' through increasingly implausible stuff. But it's not really resurrection in many cases.

Rogue One'd be an exception here.

The movie is not about the fuel in anyway. The fuel is a McGuffin.

Yeah, the fuel is mostly Macguffin, but fuel gets an awful lot of attention, and mostly it feels like it was unnecessarily shoehorned in. It feels like the reason they picked fuel, instead of any other heist that would probably make a lot more sense, is to try to justify episode 8.

That was something that puzzled the friend and went with and I, especially since it would be out-of-character for the Empire and the Republic to trust the Pykes with overseeing it and the Seperatists and Rebellion should be crippled without it. The best expalnation we came up with was that there is several kinds of HYPERFUEL and it is just Coaxium that is only found on Kessel. Also there are several raffinery mentionned in the film, they explicitly decide to go with the desaffected onethat's all.

Yeah, you can kind of justify it with a bunch of other stuff, but the film itself doesn't justify it at all.

And, even if many kinds of fuel exist, why would you have a mining place further from the refinery than a ship can normally travel without going boom? It doesn't make sense.

Lando really was never portrayed as scummy and villainous. Also "the soul of their robot girlfriend" either is gone forever or if itcould be rescued Lando has done it during the unspecified amount of timeit took Han and Chewie to track him down.

The type of droid brains matches the type of brains found in the Millennium Falcon henceforth. This subplot is essentially an explanation for why the Millennium Falcon has these attributes. Which, again, is a pointless backstory for a small point that nobody really asked for, I think.

But in the process it makes Lando appear far, far more callous.

And anyways, it makes no sense to have them gamble everything to try to get the ship, lose the gamble, and then get the result anyways. Zero stakes.

No, he is an elderly guy with a knife (clearly intended toforeshadow Maul by the way) with a commando team,you know the one Han had to trick into being away fighting the Cloud Riders?
Also he nevers off any underling. We only ever see him kill one person and that's an Imperial Governor (a business partner/bribee most likely). We are not given his reasons to do so.

Yeah. That's what makes him one note, and not much of a threat. He has a team of guys with guns. That's...not an extremely scary threat in the Star Wars universe. The only time we see them do anything, they get owned. There's really no good reason why everyone's scared of him.

I dunno, I found the war sequence muchmore interesting that another space battle. More unique-looking as well, with the trench warfare going on (really what does it say about WWI when the evil fictionnal empire of doom gives its troops larger and cleaner trenches than the real ones?)

The Warhammer 40k section of the movie was by far the best part, yes. I don't hate the land battle. I just am slightly bothered that in a movie titled Star Wars, they skipped over the actual space battle part. If you're explaining how Han became Han, him learning to be a pilot, getting into trouble and getting kicked out sound...important. More character development in the part they skipped over than the rest of the film. Plus, space pew pew.

Don't think the comparison of sci fi to WW1 says much of anything about WW1, though. They're very different universes.

I have not a bloody clue what you are talking about.

You missed the innuendo involving wookies? Bits like "You’ll never ever have a deeper sleep, than curled on up on a Wookiee’s lap. "

... That bit's directly inspired by real secret societies and criminal gangs doing exactly that. Now, some (like Yakuza) have since given up the practice, but historically tattoos, brands and other shows of membership and status have been the norm.

If you're doin' a historical piece, sure. Sci-fi, though...if you're trying to portray competence and what not, you want to go a bit more subtle, I think. If you're showing ownership via branding, because evil slavery or what not, cool. That works, and gives you a nice dark vibe. Overall, it didn't really work as Yakuza. We don't really see much of an organization. It's just a dude and some underlings on a ship.

....I liked the film........thought it explained and told the story and everything well.........even if I expected all the deaths and betrayal from the start.....cause it um, lived up to those expectations.....thats all I got.

Yeah, that's fair. The trailer pretty much showed you the main plot. I prefer when trailers don't do that, but it's a sadly common problem.

[Fyraltari]

I thought the Yakuza's old thing was amputated fingertips. That's a lot more sensible because it's plausibly deniable. There's lots of legitimate ways that you could lose a finger.

That didn't stop many gangs/cartels/the mafyia from using tatoos.

The reason being that those markers are not there as somekind of secret society identifiers, there are here to scream at the face of the world "I am part of [insert criminal organization]. Mess with me and die."

There are many real life groups who still use tatoos and can keep doing it because they have nothing to fear from the authorities, oftentimes because they are the authority.

The Empire doesn't give two craps about crushing crime: they hire bounty hunters and work with the Hutts and in this film we clearly see the Empire coming to the Pykes' rescue guns a-blazing and several Imperials at Drysden Vos' party (he even can murder an Imperial Governor with impunity) and that's without mentionning that

Spoiler

Show

Crimson Dawn was formed from a pirate crew that worked for the Empire.

What would these people have to fear from wearing tatoos?

[Lord Joeltion]

"You don't just Tango with Dryden Vos"

I think the phrase pretty much sums up all the issues I had with the movie. Which aren't few, but in retrospective, are mostly tied to a single major problem that runs throughout most Disney productions of the franchise I've encountered.

I finally got some time on my schedule to check this one out. I couldn't simply not to. It was a Star Wars movie. Doesn't matter how battered my inner critic feels, how ashamed my inner child would feel while watching it, obviously I won't stop watching SW films until my eyes fall from the sockets. Funny enough, I managed to avoid most (if not all) major spoilers of the film. I like checking my movies as unbiased as I can manage. I just knew a few inconsequential plot unrelated things

Spoiler: Or barely related

Show

-I knew beforehand the naming scene was going to be stupid, but I didn't know the details. I was surprised by how much stupider it was.
-I knew the scavengers were the good guys because of a certain game... but I was expecting to have greater impact on the plot way earlier.
-I knew L3's character and its motivations. I was expecting something a little less cliched and a way more subtle metaphor.

So far, I only really liked Rogue One. Yet I fear I won't like it as much if I check that one again (TLJ effect?). And no, it's not that I despised the new trilogy entirely. I enjoyed FA. I just can't unsee its major issues. I didn't enjoyed TLJ as much sure, well, I *almost* hated it; but I can't deny there were some cool scenes/ideas there. The problem is, that I can't unsee the obvious problems those movies have. Some are major, structural issues. Others are more subtle, like worldbuilding, the "boxe-in-a-box" thingie or simply the fact that obviously producers care more about execution and agenda*, rather than substance or other more art related factors.

The problem, I think, is that while flamboyantly entertaining these Dinsey movies seem to lack something to engage my Suspension of Disbelief for the whole duration of a film. And it's not as if I ever had much trouble with that. I can watch DKR, Man of Steel, Dark Crystal, The Muppets on Treasure Island and Dragonheart with the same fascination a 8-yrs old kid would. I'm not nitpicky, specially not while watching a film. I can mess around Rambo's ludicrousness AFTER watching the film, but never during. Hell, the other day I put the TV and there was American Reunion, I just sat there sipping my tea before bed because I simply felt like it. And I laughed. It was engaging enough. But I digress.

I wouldn't say Solo is a bad movie. It's probably not worse than TLJ who is, under my category, worse than Attack of the Clones**. But it FELT worse. Even when I was hiding my face or laughing nervously with my GF during TLJ, I never felt truly compelled about leaving the theater. I had that feeling during Solo. Not once. Not just at the end. I was hating myself for forcing me to sit through the whole movie. That made the overall experience worse, in retrospective.

I repeat: Han Solo is not a bad movie. It's packed with action. Dialogue is sometimes good, even if kinda predictable. Plot it meh, but that's fair for an action flick anyway. Acting is not outstanding, but then again, it's better than average so, there's that. Barring certain poor choices, quality is good enough. Yet it's not a good movie, otherwise so much people wouldn't complain and more people would defend it on the internet (like FA/TLJ***). There is nothing truly good to say about it, because there is nothing that truly shines amid the supersaturated marked we have now. It's mediocre; and that is worse than bad. Because it turns a less engaging movie into an "I-dont-care-anymore" movie. It shot my Suspension of Disbelief dead, right on the spot. I could certainly applaud such a feat. It takes a special kind of movie to do that. Problem being: it's a Star Wars Story. It should've taken my SoD hostage from the beginning like a Liam Neeson's relative/pet/neighbour.

Instead, I had all the time of the world to pick up every single flaw and examine it, not for what it was (the proverbial hand of the puppeteer, if you want) but for what it is on a vacuum: "weird piece of script"; "a strong female character... so original, if I was from the 80's"; "stupid joke"; "blatant metaphor not even well executed"; "oh, another cameo, yay"; "easter egg nºidontcare"; "WOW, that's friggin Maul"; "wait, wasn't he... oh right"; "I wonder what were they talking about during the last 15 min of movie while I was checking all the background easter eggs...". That is probably not a fair way to judge a film.

So, there's that. I'm probably not worthy enough to judge the movie. At least not better than those who watched it weeks ago and posted a more thorough critique some days ago. I don't know if the SW bandwagon has lost all its (hyper)fuel or if Disney has milked the cow dry yet. I don't think it can be that simple. I only know I couldn't relate to this movie, not even once (except for certain Chewie scenes) and my SoD never got any resting time. I'm sorry, I couldn't even enjoy it enough to hate it or to rant (much) about it. It wasn't bittersweet. It didn't even tasted like nostalgia. It was bland. Like a Simpson's episode from the current season.

*No, not "the Agenda"; I mean the "agenda to rebrand SW under Disney's conceptualization of the market", a.k.a: we play it safe.
**AoC got lots of bonus points throughout the years, specially after watching Clone Wars. Paint me biased
***Not saying those are good either. But they do have truly good chunks/ideas that are probably worthy enough to bring up on a debate.

Spoiler: Ok, little rant

Show

Why is Chewie always treated like that? Why has he to be the buttmonkey of the plot? Why can't he have any agency and/or any real impact on any of the movies he appears? EVEN R2 AND 3PO DID SOMETHING TO FURTHER THE PLOT EVENTUALLY.

Wookiees aren't supposed to be flesh eating monsters, those are Ewoks! (that was the joke, actually). Wookiess are a proud, kinda sophisticated spacefaring race of furry warriors who, yeah, are prone to rage, but they aren't GODDAMNED SAVAGES! I get the Empire regarding Chewie as one, but why the heck would Chewbacca, Prince of all Baccas ever play along with the empire!?!?!? WHAT THE HECK DISNEY

Also, he could have at least had the chance to do something actually useful, but no, STUPID NEW FLAMBOYANT SHE-ROBOT had to stole him the spotlight and practically solve the subplot that was naturally his, on a single push of the buttons. Sure, he got to take down a few guards, but that was obvious handwaving from the Writers who suddenly remembered that they ALREADY HAD a character who happened to be an ACTUAL slave from an ACTUALLY EVIL Empire, and WHOSE RACE is a better metaphor for whatever they were supposed to say in the subtext of a stupid Fembot whose only reason to exist was to offer some sort of fake "originality" by means of gendering a "species" that doesn't even need to be binary puntotallyintended in the first place!

DAMNYOUDISNEY AND YOUR ANTI-ALIEN POLICY IN THE MOVIES

Rant over... *breath* *breath* *breath* *faints*

[Darth Ultron]

I saw Solo...and, er, well it was Ok. Mostly it was just a random Han Solo Adventure, that they added the 'history' we knew in randomly.

The film could have been so much better...more like a Space version of any Scoundrel Movie, but they did not go there.

Spoiler: So

Show

They have the chance here to DO Solo background and history....and just jump to ''oh he is Han already"

Solo joining the Space Navy really would have been nice to see. And this would have been a great set up for his character. The Empire is very By-The-Book and Solo is not. We could have seen him rebel against this and escape.

A Train Robbery? Solo Firefly?

Oh the main character plays Space Poker...never seen that in a movie before...yawn

A doomed driod? Yawn, never seen that before....

The ending was sort of ok, with the double and triple and more crosses....but really everyone playing attention knew they were oncoming.

Maul? Sigh...just could not leave him dead?

Han and Chewy bond a bit fast.

Woody does make a great space con guy...but he really does not full that ''mentor'' role...he is just kind of there.

The Female, er, she was ok...but needed a bit more screen time and story.

Lando on the other hand was great...maybe we could get a Lando movie?

[Frozen_Feet]

I thought the Yakuza's old thing was amputated fingertips. That's a lot more sensible because it's plausibly deniable. There's lots of legitimate ways that you could lose a finger.

Losing your finger was usually a punishment and something you could dodge if you were high-ranking enough. (Nowadays it's usually considered more convenient to just pay wads of cash to the offended party.)

Yakuza were equally known for a particular type of tattoos. Note, however, that tattoos had just as much plausible deniability; the practice started with firemen and other legitimate professions. It's only after the government outlawed them that they began strongly associated with criminality, and consequently they also became less popular with Yakuza. (A lot of Yakuzas still take tattoos, but typically only in places which are covered by their business suits.)

Something to remember: tattoos are symbols. They are only conspicuous to people who know the meaning. The tattoo in the movie probably looks more conspicuous than it is because the movie puts effort into making the meaning clear and we don't really see how the surrounding culture observes tattoos. Also, it might actually be a slave brand as some have suggested. (Meaning that, like with amputated fingers above, it's not given the high-ranking members have one; the boss has a ring instead.)

[Fyraltari]

Spoiler

Show

Ah, my bad on framing this poorly.

No Problem.

Spoiler: Tyndmyr

Show

I should have framed this as "important characters don't really die". I suppose the worst example would be the inclusion of young anakin as a force ghost in the remastered Return as a means of retconning everything together. Star Wars in general seems to have a very strong sense of mowing down tons of faceless mooks, and all heroes gettin' through increasingly implausible stuff. But it's not really resurrection in many cases.

Rogue One'd be an exception here.

True but that's hardly a SW only problem.

Yeah, the fuel is mostly Macguffin, but fuel gets an awful lot of attention, and mostly it feels like it was unnecessarily shoehorned in. It feels like the reason they picked fuel, instead of any other heist that would probably make a lot more sense, is to try to justify episode 8.

*Shruggs* Considering they were doing the Kessel Run we should count our blessings they weren't smuggling drugs spice.

Yeah, you can kind of justify it with a bunch of other stuff, but the film itself doesn't justify it at all.

Amovie doesn't have to justify its worldbuilding. That's why there is an EU. ESBdidn't justify why the Empire was using walkers instead of wheeled-vehicules or speeders because nobody cares.

And, even if many kinds of fuel exist, why would you have a mining place further from the refinery than a ship can normally travel without going boom? It doesn't make sense.

You don't get to choose where you mines are. But really having the refinery on another planet in itself only makes sense if, like Star Wars, you forget that planets are big.

The type of droid brains matches the type of brains found in the Millennium Falcon henceforth. This subplot is essentially an explanation for why the Millennium Falcon has these attributes. Which, again, is a pointless backstory for a small point that nobody really asked for, I think.
But in the process it makes Lando appear far, far more callous.

I don't know what you are talking about but really "explanations no-one asked for" sounds too much like Star Wars for me not to assume you are right on this one.

Spoiler

Show

And anyways, it makes no sense to have them gamble everything to try to get the ship, lose the gamble, and then get the result anyways. Zero stakes.

I guess this was some kind of fake-out "this is where he gets the Falcon"? 'twas dumb, yes.

Yeah. That's what makes him one note, and not much of a threat. He has a team of guys with guns. That's...not an extremely scary threat in the Star Wars universe. The only time we see them do anything, they get owned. There's really no good reason why everyone's scared of him.

You mean apart from not being Jedi? Bit really they are less frightened of him than of his organization, and knowing who runs it that makes sense.

The Warhammer 40k section of the movie was by far the best part, yes. I don't hate the land battle. I just am slightly bothered that in a movie titled Star Wars, they skipped over the actual space battle part. If you're explaining how Han became Han, him learning to be a pilot, getting into trouble and getting kicked out sound...important. More character development in the part they skipped over than the rest of the film. Plus, space pew pew.

Yeah.

Don't think the comparison of sci fi to WW1 says much of anything about WW1, though. They're very different universes.

'twas a joke. I don't need Star Wars to know what to think of WWI.

You missed the innuendo involving wookies? Bits like "You’ll never ever have a deeper sleep, than curled on up on a Wookiee’s lap. "

I have no memory of this.
Doesn't sound worse than "I'd rather kiss a wokiee. -I can arrange that! You could use a good kiss!"

Lord Joeltion, don't apologize because you don't like a movie.

Why is Chewie always treated like that? Why has he to be the buttmonkey of the plot? Why can't he have any agency and/or any real impact on any of the movies he appears? EVEN R2 AND 3PO DID SOMETHING TO FURTHER THE PLOT EVENTUALLY.

R2 and 3PO were based on the peasants from Hidden Fortress, Chewie was based on Indiana, Lucas' dog that sits on the copilot seat of his car. That's why. He was originally Han Solo's "dog" (his loyal companion). Since he can't talk and existed as a satellite for another character people (writers) forget he is supposed to be one in his own right. I hear he has a comic, though.

Wookiees aren't supposed to be flesh eating monsters, those are Ewoks! (that was the joke, actually). Wookiess are a proud, kinda sophisticated spacefaring race of furry warriors who, yeah, are prone to rage, but they aren't GODDAMNED SAVAGES! I get the Empire regarding Chewie as one, but why the heck would Chewbacca, Prince of all Baccas ever play along with the empire!?!?!? WHAT THE HECK DISNEY

You spent however long stuck in a cage in the ground and we'll see how long it takes you to stop being picky about your food (especially when said food seemsto be Imperials, the people who occupy your homeland).

They have the chance here to DO Solo background and history....and just jump to ''oh he is Han already"

No they don't. It tkaes him the whole film to become Han Solo from a New Hope.

Solo joining the Space Navy really would have been nice to see. And this would have been a great set up for his character. The Empire is very By-The-Book and Solo is not. We could have seen him rebel against this and escape.
[...]
Han and Chewy bond a bit fast.

If I remember correctly in Legends, Han defected by freeing Wookiee slaves which is how he met Chewbacca. Better backstory than "we escaped together" if you ask me. (which you didn't)

The Female

This is a tangent but, does thissound more condescending than "the girl" or "the woman" to native english speakers too, or is it a translation thing?

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Fyraltari
This is a tangent but, does thissound more condescending than "the girl" or "the woman" to native english speakers too, or is it a translation thing?

I didn’t hear it that way. Just a generic term for the female lead.

As for Solo Firefly…have you seen Firefly? If not, your confusion is understandable.

Originally Posted by Fyraltari
If I remember correctly in Legends, Han defected by freeing Wookie[e] slaves which is how he met Chewbacca.

There have been versions of this going all the way back to the Han Solo novels from the late 70s, which sadly no one seems to remember anymore.

In those novels Han always refused to have anything to do with slavery, in particular smuggling any.

[Fyraltari]

I didn’t hear it that way. Just a generic term for the female lead.

Okay so a translation thing, allright.

As for Solo Firefly…have you seen Firefly? If not, your confusion is understandable.

I haven't. What confusion?
The confusion about my confusionon how their is no confusion?

[Peelee]

Okay so a translation thing, allright.

Native speaker, and I felt the same way you did. Don't hear "female" much outside of clinical or bureaucratic context. Outside those, maybe as a modifier it doesn't sound off (like female doctor, for instance), but as a standalone it sounds weird, IMO. this may be because I've seen way too much incel stuff, I'll admit.

Also, the Firefly link is thin. Train jobs are a common trope when trains exist. Are they not allowed to do anything Firefly did?

Oh, also...

Last edited by Fyraltari; Today at*04:50 PM.* Reason:Wookieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

This pleases me.

[Rodin]

Okay so a translation thing, allright.


I haven't. What confusion?
The confusion about my confusionon how their is no confusion?

Because Firefly is a Sci-Fi show which features a train robbery, and Solo is also a Sci-Fi movie that features a train robbery.

There is absolutely nothing similar about said train robberies, so I don't really get the comparison myself. Robbing a train while it's in motion is a classic setup dating back decades and it's really only the Sci-Fi element (using a flying spaceship instead of horses to carry the loot away) that makes the comparison happen at all.

[Bohandas]

Personally that portion of the movie reminded me more of the Guardians of the Galaxy series

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Peelee
Don't hear "female" much outside of clinical or bureaucratic context.

I’m a biologist, so I hear and use “female” all the time. For instance, the female box turtle I rescued from a road a couple of days ago, the female wood duck with ducklings I spotted this morning, etc.

Originally Posted by Peelee
…this may be because I've seen way too much incel stuff, I'll admit.

I have no idea what that adjective means.