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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Explorer View Post
    The problem is, and this is a big one, the gods are real. As in, shards of Khaine inhabit every Craftworld. Khorne's will manifests to people. They are very much different beings. Skarband (a Bloodthirster of Khorne) and the Avatar even dueled to mutual destruction once. Khorne will order Eldar worlds to be despoiled. The Avatar will lead the charge against a manifestation of Khorne's daemons. And someone can't pray to Khaine to get Chaos boons.
    Just because they fight each other doesn't mean they're not the same god.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowy View Post
    Just because they fight each other doesn't mean they're not the same god.
    How about my other point? The gods can literally be seen. They've seen Khorne. They can see Khaine. They aren't the same guy.

    Also considering the opposing evidence is just 'they are both gods of war', I think that you need to provide a little bit more evidence considering that they do fight each other all the time. It's not definitive evidence, but it's another heap in the giant pile against the idea.
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  3. - Top - End - #243
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Explorer View Post
    How about my other point? The gods can literally be seen. They've seen Khorne. They can see Khaine. They aren't the same guy.
    That's assuming that gods are 100% immutable and can't change their shape and also that mere mortals can fully understand their true form instead of just drawing a personal picture inside their head to try to retain a shred of sanity when gazing at the mightiest entities from the warp.

    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Explorer View Post
    Also considering the opposing evidence is just 'they are both gods of war', I think that you need to provide a little bit more evidence considering that they do fight each other all the time. It's not definitive evidence, but it's another heap in the giant pile against the idea.
    It's freaking Khorne/Khaine. Fighting among themselves is part of their portfolio. Khan the Betrayer is called that for being a teamkiller bastard, and the god of war and violence always makes it pretty clear it doesn't matter where the blood flows as long as there's blood.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by deuterio12 View Post
    It's freaking Khorne/Khaine. Fighting among themselves is part of their portfolio. Khan the Betrayer is called that for being a teamkiller bastard, and the god of war and violence always makes it pretty clear it doesn't matter where the blood flows as long as there's blood.
    There's a difference between fighting yourself and fighting Amongst yourselves. This is like Kharn smacking himself in the face with a chainaxe. Also Khaine doesnt give a fig for blood and skulls. That's like half of Khornes portfolio right there.
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    when an imperial knight says it wants to stick you in a large arena in which to fight to the death, you can't exactly say no.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    I imagine that there are uncomfortable similarities between Khaine and Khorne, and that they possibly had very similar beginnings, or that one was born of the other. There are indications, such as the symbol of Khaine being very similar to the symbol for Khorne, and blood sacrifice being needed to summon his Avatar.

    For example, it's said that he took on the aspect of the Reaper when fighting the Nightbringer, giving all species, except the Orks, the fear of Death. This could also have begun, in part, disturbances in the Warp, leading to the creation of Khorne - the emotions in the War in Heaven could have played its part.

    There have been suggestions that when Slaanesh was born, and s/he came for Khaine, that Khorne intervened, claiming Khaine as his own by right. I'd argue that this implies that Khorne and Khaine have a close link, but are not exactly one and the same (but could very well have become so).

    The existence of the Avatar, being, essentially, a bound daemon, does, in my opinion, justify certain Radical practices by the Inquisition. It's not inconceivable that, through sacrifice, Avatars of the Emperor could be created. If the Avatar has less benign origins, well, it seems that bound daemons could be used reliably with the correct rituals. But probably not.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by bluntpencil View Post
    I imagine that there are uncomfortable similarities between Khaine and Khorne, and that they possibly had very similar beginnings, or that one was born of the other. There are indications, such as the symbol of Khaine being very similar to the symbol for Khorne, and blood sacrifice being needed to summon his Avatar.

    For example, it's said that he took on the aspect of the Reaper when fighting the Nightbringer, giving all species, except the Orks, the fear of Death. This could also have begun, in part, disturbances in the Warp, leading to the creation of Khorne - the emotions in the War in Heaven could have played its part.

    There have been suggestions that when Slaanesh was born, and s/he came for Khaine, that Khorne intervened, claiming Khaine as his own by right. I'd argue that this implies that Khorne and Khaine have a close link, but are not exactly one and the same (but could very well have become so).

    The existence of the Avatar, being, essentially, a bound daemon, does, in my opinion, justify certain Radical practices by the Inquisition. It's not inconceivable that, through sacrifice, Avatars of the Emperor could be created. If the Avatar has less benign origins, well, it seems that bound daemons could be used reliably with the correct rituals. But probably not.
    This all I can agree with. I'd like to think that when Khaine got his bloody hands, the first part of what would end up becoming Khorne came into existence. Would give an actual reason for his obsession with blood. And he could have tried to take Khaine as he is one of the few war gods that aren't Khorne in disguise. Or perhaps he just wanted someone to fight.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timble View Post
    when an imperial knight says it wants to stick you in a large arena in which to fight to the death, you can't exactly say no.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    On the 'fighting yourself' thing... I imagine stranger things have happened in 40K.

    I could see two Craftworlds falling out, or being tricked, and then fighting each other, and having their Avatars fight, for example. Khaine can favour both sides in war, surely?

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by bluntpencil View Post
    For example, it's said that he took on the aspect of the Reaper when fighting the Nightbringer, giving all species, except the Orks, the fear of Death.
    I believe that you have it the wrong way around; it's the Nightbringer who looks like the Reaper, and thus instilled a fear of death into the moral races by going around eating stars and ending civilisations.

    The existence of the Avatar, being, essentially, a bound daemon, does, in my opinion, justify certain Radical practices by the Inquisition. It's not inconceivable that, through sacrifice, Avatars of the Emperor could be created. If the Avatar has less benign origins, well, it seems that bound daemons could be used reliably with the correct rituals. But probably not.
    This is, of course, only if you assume that the Avatar is NOT a literal piece of a shattered God and occasionally stalks the material plane reaping souls... almost like a C'tan shard, in fact...

    Quote Originally Posted by bluntpencil
    I could see two Craftworlds falling out, or being tricked, and then fighting each other, and having their Avatars fight, for example. Khaine can favour both sides in war, surely?
    Khaine is dead; The only thing that he favours is oblivion.

    Assuming that he were alive, or in a position to hold an opinion however? He's still one of the Eldar Pantheon and does not have Khorne's "doesn't matter whence the blood flows" thing. Assuming that he's not a mythologically remembered Old One he'd probably be more in favour of Eldar killing other people rather than each other; if he IS an interpretation of an Old One, he definitely would prefer them not to be fighting each other.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by bluntpencil View Post
    I could see two Craftworlds falling out, or being tricked, and then fighting each other, and having their Avatars fight, for example. Khaine can favour both sides in war, surely?
    The Craftworlds' Farseers and step in, or the Harlequins do, and they say that Aeldari on Aeldari violence is NOT okay. Space Moses Asurmen rocks up out of the Webway, knowing where he's needed most, sees two Aeldari brandishing swords at each other and he's like "Is everyone frittata'd?" And just like that, the Craftworlds never fight. Why would Aeldari fight each other, EVER? Don't you know that there are HUMANS in the Galaxy? Let's join up and kill them.

    Shard of Khaine; Are you a Shard of Khaine?
    Shard of Khaine; Why yes, I am also a Shard of Khaine.
    Shard of Khaine; Did they Summon us to fight each other? This makes no sense, I'm going back to sleep.
    Shard of Khaine; We obliterated Exarches for this, you know. Why are our children so stupid?
    Shard of Khaine; Life is pointless. I hope all of them die.
    Shard of Khaine; See, you get it. What do we do now? I assume the mon'keigh all died out. That's why this is happening?
    Shard of Khaine; Nope. Did you know Necrons still exist?
    Shard of Khaine; WHAT!? THEN WHY ARE OUR CRAFTWORLDS FIGHTING EACH OTHER!?
    Shard of Khaine; I was gonna say. How did our Farseers screw up so badly?
    Shard of Khaine; Where is he I'm gonna-
    *Asurmen pops in and starts yelling at everyone.*
    Shard of Khaine; Oh, situation sorted. I'll go back to sleep.
    Shard of Khaine; There's our little buddy. He's got this. Asuryan picked a good kid.
    Last edited by Cheesegear; 2018-07-08 at 10:37 AM.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Khaines not dead! He's just uh...Sleeping!

    For real though. He's not dead. Just broken. The other eldar gods (excluding Clown and Nurgle wife. Their names are blanking on me for some reason) are dead. Khaines just sleeping in shattered form. Occasionally (when someone is sacrificed to create an avatar) Khaines sleeping consciousness bestows a statue (I believe) of Khaine with a fraction of his power so that he may smite the enemies of the Eldar. Or get wrecked by the main enemy of the week. Can't remember if this was canon or not but I think there's a dark Eldar cult dedicated to reuniting Khaine.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timble View Post
    when an imperial knight says it wants to stick you in a large arena in which to fight to the death, you can't exactly say no.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by Xenopax View Post
    For real though. He's not dead. Just broken.
    Like a C'Tan.

    Khaines just sleeping in shattered form.
    Like a C'Tan.

    Occasionally (when someone is sacrificed to create an avatar) Khaines sleeping consciousness bestows a statue (I believe) of Khaine with a fraction of his power so that he may smite the enemies of the Eldar.
    Like a C'Tan.

    Can't remember if this was canon or not but I think there's a dark Eldar cult dedicated to reuniting Khaine.
    Do you mean Incubi? If you mean an entire cult, then you may be getting your WHFB and 40K lore mixed up again.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Khaines sleeping consciousness bestows a statue (I believe) of Khaine with a fraction of his power
    Its not a statue of him. It is litterally a little piece of him, that when shattered and driven into the material universe, drifted towards the strongest concentrations of pure Eldars, the craftwords. There it slowly grew into the familiar metal statue, that can be awoken by an exarch sacrifice.

    Like a C'Tan.
    Or like the Emperor.

    Like a C'Tan.
    Except the C'Tan isnt sleeping.. they seems to be pretty restless in general.

    Like a C'Tan.
    Or like a Titan!
    Last edited by lord_khaine; 2018-07-08 at 02:59 PM.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    Its not a statue of him. It is litterally a little piece of him, that when shattered and driven into the material universe, drifted towards the strongest concentrations of pure Eldars, the craftwords. There it slowly grew into the familiar metal statue, that can be awoken by an exarch sacrifice.
    Or it's just another Wraith Construct, albeit one powered by the raw psychic energy of an entire Craftworld being funnelled into it, rather than a handful of soul stones. Translating Eldar into High Gothic is never without it's quirks; someone saying that the Avatar Statue "is" Khaine could be almost any kind of mistranslation or metaphor, or some obscure xenos parable that humanity isn't fully aware of.

    Or like the Emperor.
    Debatable. Is the Emperor 100%, completely and totally dead and the Golden Throne is doing all the work? Is his physical body still hanging in there, a few cells left to anchor his consciousness there? Is his body dead but his soul still intact, as much imprisoned by the Throne as sustained by it? Or something else? Each has different implications, and we'll likely never know which it is.

    Except the C'Tan isnt sleeping.. they seems to be pretty restless in general.
    The actual C'Tan ate stars and wiped out civilisations wholesale; they are absolutely dormant and all we're seeing now are tiny pieces of them broken off, like a daemon being a tiny part of the God.

    If the "adult" C'Tan were awaken, without the Old Ones to oppose them, it'd be as big and destructive as a new Hive Fleet awakening in any segmentum you cared to choose.

    Or like a Titan!
    Not really. Being wired into a Titan isn't instantly fatal, and Moderati are definitely capable of rational, non-war related conversation. Some of them, in smaller titans, can even be unplugged, and when they do die in their machine they leave a body behind. Whatever the Avatar does to the Young King is strictly mystical, rather than technological; even the Eldar admit that they don't know what actually happens in the throne room when it all goes down.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by Wraith View Post
    Not really. Being wired into a Titan isn't instantly fatal, and Moderati are definitely capable of rational, non-war related conversation. Some of them, in smaller titans, can even be unplugged, and when they do die in their machine they leave a body behind. Whatever the Avatar does to the Young King is strictly mystical, rather than technological; even the Eldar admit that they don't know what actually happens in the throne room when it all goes down.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by Brookshw View Post
    Good thoughts and TY (as well as to Voidhawk for his extensive reply).

    One comment on the genetic structures. As we saw during The Anphelion Project, creatures as lowly as an unspecified tunneling unit (I suspect either a ripper or ravager to be consistent with what we know they were experimenting on) has the capacity to begin restarting the hive without any external support/stimulus. This raises some questions about what type of support they really need, or at least how quickly they can revert to some other unspecified role.

    Anyway, the big reason I brought up The Anphelion Project was because from whatever the lowly creatures were, the Nids were eventually able to rebuild up to their biotitans (Hierophants). Subsequently the genetic knowledge each unit carries has to be pretty extensive.

    I vaguely recall some story about deathwatch catching a lictor or something and using it's genetic structure to engineer a hive strain specific toxin that killed off the strain/fleet (which resulted in tons of new nord queens being born after the death of the original). I don't recall the details but further evidence I think of individual creatures having a very broad spectrum of genetic info at their disposal.

    Kinda why the ending of Extermination is a big belly flop for the BA, sure, they trashed the solar system and planets, but the nids on the planet survived and will rebuild from just the lowly rippers (similar to Orks in some ways)
    The reason why the engineered biotoxin works so well is because within the same hive, every single 'nid has largely the same immune-system, inner organs and nervous system. Put simply, every single 'nid is build from the same kit (literally, the 'nid units are not evolutions but deliberate genetic constructs based upon the blueprints created by the norn queens) with varies attributes/organs either atrophied or hyper developed depending on the individual unit. So how does the biotoxin work? Simple, the bio toxin is not just one single poison/chemical, but a combination of many to affect as many 'nids in as many levels as possible. There is always a chance that through some random mutation (which do occur) some 'nids are immune or at least sufficiently resistant to survive, return and become the key to adaptation. However the chances of a unit surviving and the norn queen of revising the genetic make up of the 'nids shrink exponentially the greater the number of ways the spacebugs are being killed by the poisons.

    It took the Imperium years before it managed to develop and manufacture (more or less) universally applicable toxins the first time. In a twist of fate, the Dark Eldar could probably have solved that bio engineering problem within a few months if not weeks and the haemunculi would probably even have done so just for funzies.



    To another thing about Tyranids, fluff states that a hive fleet needs about 100 days to devour a living world to leaving a hollow husk. Personally, I think that is only possible if a planet is directly attacked by a large hive fleet which already had the mass of a small planetoid. [BTW that means that if a (splinter)fleet has a mass of a million times a trillion tons, is still less than 0,1% of Earth's mass. (Earth's mass = 5,972 × 10^24 kg)] If it is only a few bioships or so, it would likely take many years, if not decades to devour a world, but from then on, it would go much faster again. Luckily for the Imperium that means there is a window of opportunity to save worlds from 'nid infestation. (All of this is pretty much what happened in DoWII)

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    Or it's just another Wraith Construct, albeit one powered by the raw psychic energy of an entire Craftworld being funnelled into it, rather than a handful of soul stones. Translating Eldar into High Gothic is never without it's quirks; someone saying that the Avatar Statue "is" Khaine could be almost any kind of mistranslation or metaphor, or some obscure xenos parable that humanity isn't fully aware of.
    Except its very, very clearly not a wraith construct to anyone thats gotten to close to it. Besides litterally being on fire it among other things bleed. And are not made of wraith bone.
    Its also a detail i doubt have ever been translated into High Gothic. I doubt there are much more than a handful of humans who actually know what it is.

    Debatable. Is the Emperor 100%, completely and totally dead and the Golden Throne is doing all the work? Is his physical body still hanging in there, a few cells left to anchor his consciousness there? Is his body dead but his soul still intact, as much imprisoned by the Throne as sustained by it? Or something else? Each has different implications, and we'll likely never know which it is.
    But then its also like the emperor.

    The actual C'Tan ate stars and wiped out civilisations wholesale; they are absolutely dormant and all we're seeing now are tiny pieces of them broken off, like a daemon being a tiny part of the God.

    If the "adult" C'Tan were awaken, without the Old Ones to oppose them, it'd be as big and destructive as a new Hive Fleet awakening in any segmentum you cared to choose.
    Their fragments still need to be actively locked down and shackled to avoid them breaking free. Unlike an Avatar statue who dont do much besides getting warmer on its own.

    Not really. Being wired into a Titan isn't instantly fatal, and Moderati are definitely capable of rational, non-war related conversation. Some of them, in smaller titans, can even be unplugged, and when they do die in their machine they leave a body behind. Whatever the Avatar does to the Young King is strictly mystical, rather than technological; even the Eldar admit that they don't know what actually happens in the throne room when it all goes down.
    But it smite stuff thats smaller than itself. So like a Titan!
    thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by LeSwordfish View Post
    Tired: Celestine is a Greater Daemon of the emperor!
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    Except its very, very clearly not a wraith construct to anyone thats gotten to close to it. Besides litterally being on fire it among other things bleed. And are not made of wraith bone.
    Its also a detail i doubt have ever been translated into High Gothic. I doubt there are much more than a handful of humans who actually know what it is.
    "Very clearly not a wraith construct" is a somewhat subjective term, I feel. What does a wraith construct look like? At it's extremes, we could be comparing a wraithsword to a Craftworld; they're both wraith-constructs imbedded with an alien intelligence, but they're certainly don't look or act the same.

    And weird things bleeding or being on fire? Given the scope of possibilities that sufficient psychic powers can achieve, I don't think that's even in the top 100. The Avatar could very well be something other than an actual piece of dead God.

    I mean, remember; the Eldar race only fell 10,000 years ago, the same time that the Emperor rose to power. Who is to say that their records and mythology are not as spotty and steeped in barely remembered half-truths as the Imperiums? More so, maybe, if we consider how emotionally volatile the Eldar are, and how traumatic and confused that period of their history was.

    But then its also like the emperor.
    Only insofar as we - the readers - don't know for sure what they are, except for the apocryphal stories told by biased parties.

    Their fragments still need to be actively locked down and shackled to avoid them breaking free. Unlike an Avatar statue who dont do much besides getting warmer on its own.
    Ah, you specifically meant the shards. Fair enough. I feel that 40k needs to improve it's terminology so that I don't have to keep making that mistake.

    But it smite stuff thats smaller than itself. So like a Titan!
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Quote Originally Posted by Wraith View Post
    Who is to say that their records and mythology are not as spotty and steeped in barely remembered half-truths as the Imperiums?
    At least regarding The Fall onwards? Not spotty at all.
    The Aeldari - Asuryani, Drukhari and Harlequins alike - all have major players within their respective Factions who Were There. The Aeldari still have first-hand accounts of what happened during The Fall. The annoying thing, is that Vect was instrumental in Commorragh's rise after The Fall, but he's presented as an unreliable narrator.

    Contrasted to the Imperium. Nobody who was alive when The Emperor walked, is around to tell about it.
    - Guilliman is far too closed-lipped about it.
    - Cawl, conveniently, has had his own mind, wiped, several times. So even Cawl doesn't even know what he doesn't know anymore.

    More so, maybe, if we consider how emotionally volatile the Eldar are, and how traumatic and confused that period of their history was.
    Yeah. That Asurmen guy. The leader of his entire people after The Fall. He's extremely volatile, and emotionally unstable. Those are practically his signature personality traits.
    ...Oh wait. Turns out killing your own brother after he gets Possessed gives you PTSD, and all of your emotions just shut down after that.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    "Very clearly not a wraith construct" is a somewhat subjective term, I feel. What does a wraith construct look like? At it's extremes, we could be comparing a wraithsword to a Craftworld; they're both wraith-constructs imbedded with an alien intelligence, but they're certainly don't look or act the same.

    And weird things bleeding or being on fire? Given the scope of possibilities that sufficient psychic powers can achieve, I don't think that's even in the top 100. The Avatar could very well be something other than an actual piece of dead God.
    Hmm.. i dont think its that subjective at all. Wraithswords, Craftworlds, Wraithlords. They all have the unifying theme of being made out of Wraithbone. The Avatar isnt made out of wraithbone. Its a bit like having a sword, a oil tanker and a branch from a tree, then being asked what stands out.

    And yeah, fooling others into thinking its something specific should be pretty easy, even without using psychic powers. At least when your the second most advanced civilisation around. Its just not something there are any logic behind trying to trick people into believing. And the Eldars barely speak with others most of the time. Besides that, the people you really need to trick are millenia old alpha+ psykers, specialised in divination. As well as Bonesingers who build normal wraith constructs.

    Only insofar as we - the readers - don't know for sure what they are, except for the apocryphal stories told by biased parties.
    I think we are still talking about the shards/C'tan here? We do have several first hand accounts of them though, so i think that bit is pretty reliable as well.

    Yeah. That Asurmen guy. The leader of his entire people after The Fall. He's extremely volatile, and emotionally unstable. Those are practically his signature personality traits.
    ...Oh wait. Turns out killing your own brother after he gets Possessed gives you PTSD, and all of your emotions just shut down after that.
    Funny enough, as the grandfather of all aspect schools, Asurmen is the guy who laid the fundation for the path of the warrior. Including its teaching on how to selectively shut your emotions off.
    thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    Including its teaching on how to selectively shut your emotions off.
    Like I said, Asurmen is (in)famous for his wild and crazy emotions. Asurmen is so extremely emotionally volatile, and therefore definitely confused and foggy about what happened.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Last edited by Platinius; 2018-07-11 at 11:05 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John32 View Post
    It's still funny that the Dow3 shut down after less than a year.
    no support
    no content
    waste of money
    Really?? That blows, especially considering how much support 1 and 2 got after release.

    I really liked playing DoW2 online with friends. I used to do a lot of 2v2 online with a friend. Every so often, our double war boss strategy worked on somebody new or unprepared.

    That doesn’t even get into a lot of the neat things the first game started in the RTS genre (map control for resources, cover, squad based).
    Last edited by houlio; 2018-07-12 at 12:35 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by houlio View Post
    Really?? That blows, especially considering how much support 1 and 2 got after release.
    Because Dawn of War 1 and 2 was published by THQ. A company that actually gave a crap about the products it made.
    Dawn of War 3 is published by Sega - a garbage fire.

    That doesn’t even get into a lot of the neat things the first game started in the RTS genre (map control for resources, cover, squad based).
    Dawn of War 3 is a MOBA - because of course it is.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    Dawn of War 3 is published by Sega - a garbage fire.
    Space Marines allying w/ Orks? Only 3 races? DoW 3 is one of those games that made me reconsider my preorder policy.

    I did like the Ork music though.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Hi Guys! With the new Emperor TTS episode, I have a question, mainly about the table top game mechanics for the jokes and what the hell actually happened at the end? Who were those two beings at the end talking to the Ghost of Dominiq and what just happened at the end? I'm hoping you all could explain to someone who was totally lost by what occurred at the end of the episode.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverraptor View Post
    Hi Guys! With the new Emperor TTS episode, I have a question, mainly about the table top game mechanics for the jokes and what the hell actually happened at the end? Who were those two beings at the end talking to the Ghost of Dominiq and what just happened at the end? I'm hoping you all could explain to someone who was totally lost by what occurred at the end of the episode.
    The two beings were Saint Celestine and The Starchild. Fyod whatever his last name was became an incarnation (or vessel or something) of the Starchild.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Hi Guys! With the new Emperor TTS episode, I have a question, mainly about the table top game mechanics for the jokes and what the hell actually happened at the end? Who were those two beings at the end talking to the Ghost of Dominiq and what just happened at the end? I'm hoping you all could explain to someone who was totally lost by what occurred at the end of the episode.
    It ties in with the start. And how the emperor were explaining how he had cast off the part of himself that would have stopped him from doing what he needed to do, to forge his imperium.

    Later on we hear the Starchild talk about how events had turned Feydor into a catankerous (or however its spelled) old man on a throne. And how it would feel right at home.

    That makes it pretty clear that the Starchild is a piece of the Emperors soul. Likely a more humane side. And that it has been looking for a vessel to enter the material universe.
    thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Okay. Yeah, I wasn't sure if we were supposed to KNOW who the starchild was from regular lore and what-not, or if we were supposed to deduce what the star child was supposed to be. Knowing the Emperor from this series, everything seems to be going Just. As. Planned.
    Last edited by Silverraptor; 2018-07-13 at 10:22 AM.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XV: You Must Be THIS Tall To Witness The Grimdark

    Okay. Yeah, I wasn't sure if we were supposed to KNOW who the starchild was from regular lore and what-not, or if we were supposed to deduce what the star child was supposed to be. Knowing the Emperor from this series, everything seems to be going Just. As. Planned.
    I dont know. At the other hand he genuinly seemed unaware of the entire deal with his favorite attendant.
    And why he were suddenly missing
    thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar

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