cantrips and wizard specialization

[retaliation08]

I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Wizards begin knowing all cantrips, but does that stand if they are specialists with prohibited schools? Would the wizard still know the cantrips of their prohibited schools?

[Malimar]

Spells of the prohibited school or schools are not available to the wizard, and she can’t even cast such spells from scrolls or fire them from wands.

"Not available" implies to me not only that they can't cast them, but that they can't learn them nor start with them scribed in their spellbooks. (Inability to cast the spells from scrolls or wands seems to imply -- but does not make explicit -- that such spells are no longer even on the sor/wiz spell list for you.)

That's how I've always played it, too -- the cantrips from your forbidden schools don't take up spellbook space because you don't have them.

[KillianHawkeye]

I agree with Malimar.

In the general case, a Wizard begins with all the cantrips, yes. School specialization is an optional thing for Wizards to do, and it changes what's normal.

[Zaq]

Um, it's right there.

PHB pg. 57: "A wizard begins play with a spellbook containing all 0-level wizard spells (except those from her prohibited school or schools, if any; see School Specialization, page 57) plus three 1st-level spells of your choice."

Black and white. No prohibited cantrips in your book.

[retaliation08]

Um, it's right there.

PHB pg. 57: "A wizard begins play with a spellbook containing all 0-level wizard spells (except those from her prohibited school or schools, if any; see School Specialization, page 57) plus three 1st-level spells of your choice."

Black and white. No prohibited cantrips in your book.

Thanks I didn't see that in the SRD.