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  1. - Top - End - #31
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingPirate

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    I am in luck, some what. My cohort is a level 10 Cleric of Desna, and a city which is home to a Temple of Sarenrae is 2 days away.
    If you run pathfinder, please check this thread out.
    http://tinyurl.com/IWJPFGR

  2. - Top - End - #32
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    HalflingRogueGuy

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post
    I already have an idea for dealing with the wizard's mortal employees: my own settlement is run by the guilds, and each year the guilds elect the Lord Mayor. My character is the current Lord Mayor, by virtue of being the founder. Once the settlement is built, there will be a Guild for almost everyone, and that includes the workers at the brothel.

    The mortal employees, by switching to my service, are directly improving their lives over what the wizard offers.
    You're the Lord Mayor and founder of the city? Just get the guild leaders together and use zoning laws and red tape to 'bureaucrat' his business to death.

    "Yeah, we just passed an ordnance, and brothels can't be located within 500 meters of a house of worship or school. And also, anyone serving alcohol has to be over 21, and also pay 75gp per year for an alcohol server's license from the settlement. Oh, and you'll need to make sure that those windows are at least 36 inches wide, and you have rope ladders for fire escapes on the third level, and...."
    Last edited by BreaktheStatue; 2018-06-13 at 03:50 AM.

  3. - Top - End - #33
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by BreaktheStatue View Post
    You're the Lord Mayor and founder of the city? Just get the guild leaders together and use zoning laws and red tape to 'bureaucrat' his business to death.

    "Yeah, we just passed an ordnance, and brothels can't be located within 500 meters of a house of worship or school. And also, anyone serving alcohol has to be over 21, and also pay 75gp per year for an alcohol server's license from the settlement. Oh, and you'll need to make sure that those windows are at least 36 inches wide, and you have rope ladders for fire escapes on the third level, and...."
    For all the blue text here, that's not a bad idea. Driving the business out of business might be near impossible, but making it obnoxious enough to stay that the wizard either packs up and leaves or does something drastic and stupid that provides an opportunity to deal with them more thoroughly seems like it might be a bit more possible.
    I would really like to see a game made by Obryn, Kurald Galain, and Knaight from these forums.

    I'm not joking one bit. I would buy the hell out of that.
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  4. - Top - End - #34
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    Brother Oni's Avatar

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by Knaight View Post
    For all the blue text here, that's not a bad idea. Driving the business out of business might be near impossible, but making it obnoxious enough to stay that the wizard either packs up and leaves or does something drastic and stupid that provides an opportunity to deal with them more thoroughly seems like it might be a bit more possible.
    Given that the OP is also setting up a competing business, he'll need to be careful not to hoist himself by his own petard when introducing all the new ordinances. If the DM is feeling mean, he might get dinged a few points front and back towards Lawful Evil.

  5. - Top - End - #35
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    HalflingPirate

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Problem is, this business is 6 hours down the road- any ordinances I pass wouldn't affect it. It's a problem because both the city and the brothel are built on a major trade route- thus they both get a lot of traffic from it. That's actually the whole reason i chose to set up the city where it is, so it would boom from the trade.
    If you run pathfinder, please check this thread out.
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  6. - Top - End - #36
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post
    Problem is, this business is 6 hours down the road- any ordinances I pass wouldn't affect it. It's a problem because both the city and the brothel are built on a major trade route- thus they both get a lot of traffic from it. That's actually the whole reason i chose to set up the city where it is, so it would boom from the trade.
    If it's 6 hours from civilization then it's probably safe to just kill them all and burn the house to the ground.
    Yar! I'm a signature virus, copy me into your signature!

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  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    I would think that a death brothel would be serving a pretty niche market. How does it stay in business? Just how depressing is life for most people in that world?
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxWilson View Post
    I've tallied up all the points for this thread, and consulted with the debate judges, and the verdict is clear: JoeJ wins the thread.

  8. - Top - End - #38
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeJ View Post
    I would think that a death brothel would be serving a pretty niche market. How does it stay in business? Just how depressing is life for most people in that world?
    Suicide brothel sounds better than the foreseeable real-life future:

    Spoiler
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  9. - Top - End - #39
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    HalflingRogueGuy

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post

    -snip-

    In addition to the Temple of Sharess I'm building in my settlement, I was thinking of setting up a similar business just, without the demons. My hope is to out compete with the wizard, both by having the establishment built in a convenient location within city walls, nearby to said Temple of Sharess, and by providing much better service. What else can I do to make this establishment more appealing than that of the wizard?
    Leverage your position as Lord Mayor and convince local business owners to subsidize your Legit Brothel. Offer services for like half the cost as Wizard Brothel. Convince the owners that if you can undercut Wizard Brothel and put it out of business, it'll benefit the town as a whole, bring in more business, etc.

  10. - Top - End - #40
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post
    Problem is, this business is 6 hours down the road- any ordinances I pass wouldn't affect it. It's a problem because both the city and the brothel are built on a major trade route- thus they both get a lot of traffic from it. That's actually the whole reason i chose to set up the city where it is, so it would boom from the trade.
    Given that D&D is built on the medieval standard that everybody walks or rides everywhere, 6 hours is at least a full day's travel. That's a long way to go to get your end away, so would primarily be the preserve of travellers using that route anyway and the citizens with access to magical travel, severely limiting its clientele base.

    As Mastikator said, at 6 hours away from the nearest major population centre, just kill everybody in the dead of night and make it look like a bandit attack or a paladin troop raid.
    Last edited by Brother Oni; 2018-06-14 at 10:02 AM.

  11. - Top - End - #41
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    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother Oni View Post
    As Mastikator said, at 6 hours away from the nearest major population centre, just kill everybody in the dead of night and make it look like a bandit attack or a paladin troop raid.
    The character is chaotic good, and I understand that the GM has already ruled that simply killing the wizard would be considered an evil act. Murdering everybody (wizard, servants, customers, etc.) would no doubt be even less acceptable.
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxWilson View Post
    I've tallied up all the points for this thread, and consulted with the debate judges, and the verdict is clear: JoeJ wins the thread.

  12. - Top - End - #42
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    HalflingPirate

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    That's why I'm trying to out compete with him. The Temple of Sharess is, among other things, going to be aimed at tackling the issues that would drive someone to visit that wizard's brothel. I figure, of all deities, she'd be the most appropriate- and that's why i'm having my own built right next to her temple.
    If you run pathfinder, please check this thread out.
    http://tinyurl.com/IWJPFGR

  13. - Top - End - #43
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post
    That's why I'm trying to out compete with him. The Temple of Sharess is, among other things, going to be aimed at tackling the issues that would drive someone to visit that wizard's brothel. I figure, of all deities, she'd be the most appropriate- and that's why i'm having my own built right next to her temple.
    Naming the place ought to be fun.

    Broth-El.

    Slut-lestials.

    Stairway to Heaven.

    Straight & Narrow Pole Dancing.

    Hooters (now with genuine Owl Archons).

    The Man-Date of Heaven (now with genuine Solars).

  14. - Top - End - #44
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    Naming the place ought to be fun.

    Broth-El.

    Slut-lestials.

    Stairway to Heaven.

    Straight & Narrow Pole Dancing.

    Hooters (now with genuine Owl Archons).

    The Man-Date of Heaven (now with genuine Solars).
    Why do you mention two lawful good creatures when it is supposed to be next to a chaotic good temple?(it is not incompatible but I wonder why)

  15. - Top - End - #45
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by noob View Post
    Why do you mention two lawful good creatures when it is supposed to be next to a chaotic good temple?(it is not incompatible but I wonder why)
    Solars are any Good, please look this stuff up before trying to nit-pick.

    Owl Archons are forced to work as prostitutes by the Chaotic owner out of spite, because f--- the Law.

  16. - Top - End - #46
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    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    Solars are any Good, please look this stuff up before trying to nit-pick.
    The OP didn't say what game this is, but the discussion of alignment strongly suggests D&D. The D&D Monster Manual lists solars as Lawful Good.
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxWilson View Post
    I've tallied up all the points for this thread, and consulted with the debate judges, and the verdict is clear: JoeJ wins the thread.

  17. - Top - End - #47
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeJ View Post
    The OP didn't say what game this is, but the discussion of alignment strongly suggests D&D.
    Correct.

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeJ View Post
    The D&D Monster Manual lists solars as Lawful Good.
    Incorrect.

    Citation: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/angel.htm#angelSolar

    Since there's no edition specified, I'm picking one arbitrarily, and specifically one where noob's negative nitpicking is wrong.

  18. - Top - End - #48
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post
    So my gm seems convinced that if I tried to murder or ruin this wizard, that would be an evil act. That the wizard's worst crime is assisted suicide. I'm trying to explain that that doesn't really matter. I'm trying to persuade him that I would be morally justified to do either, in a setting where morality is objective.

    The biggest problem is that, well, everyone knows he employs demons. His business was apparently approved by the King, and the local lords.
    sounds like you should kill the king and rule the kingdom...

    i mean cmon.

    "hey good king, i'm hiring these DEMONS to kill my clients okay? cool. ttyl"

    and the kings cool with this? if you don't like the employee you speak to the manager.

    go to the king, and use your chaotic goodness to propose to take care of this issue and if he's like "no, he's fine!" then by golly you have a whole can of worms to deal with friend.

  19. - Top - End - #49
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    The current version of the MM, however, begins the stat block with: "Solar. Large celestial, lawful good." (Monster Manual p. 18).

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    Since there's no edition specified, I'm picking one arbitrarily, and specifically one where noob's negative nitpicking is wrong.
    So anybody could just as fairly pick an edition where your negative nitpicking is wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxWilson View Post
    I've tallied up all the points for this thread, and consulted with the debate judges, and the verdict is clear: JoeJ wins the thread.

  20. - Top - End - #50
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post
    They know, a lot of the clients go there to die. And of course, their souls are destroyed so they don't even get an afterlife.
    nevermind don't kill the king, just say to your DM

    "oh... well my character finds this sad... then heads out of town to go find SANE people"

    then you DM can let that go... and you haven't provoked the evil wizard in any way. you've merely moved on looking for greener pastures.

    don't fix what aint broke no matter how weird it is.

  21. - Top - End - #51
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeJ View Post
    So anybody could just as fairly pick an edition where your negative nitpicking is wrong.
    JoeJ, I had actually made a bunch of jokes, which could have taken the discussion somewhere fun.

    Instead, someone tried to nitpick them, and here you are for some reason supporting the thread-crapping nitpicker.

    Correcting the nitpicker isn't identical to nitpicking -- you're just trying to use my words, instead of having any thought yourself.

    Congrats, you've sucked some possible fun out of the thread, and you've supported some brainless nitpicking over either being on-topic, or being fun.


    Additionally, you're wrong. In the absence of an edition, all editions are valid -- so you can't support the claim that Solars are always Lawful Good, since some editions have some of them non-Lawful. "All x are y" is contradicted by a single example, which I've provided.

    I think you might have been mislead, since you're not usually someone I associate with this sort of poor quality thinking.

  22. - Top - End - #52
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    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    JoeJ, I had actually made a bunch of jokes, which could have taken the discussion somewhere fun.

    Instead, someone tried to nitpick them, and here you are for some reason supporting the thread-crapping nitpicker.

    Correcting the nitpicker isn't identical to nitpicking -- you're just trying to use my words, instead of having any thought yourself.

    Congrats, you've sucked some possible fun out of the thread, and you've supported some brainless nitpicking over either being on-topic, or being fun.


    Additionally, you're wrong. In the absence of an edition, all editions are valid -- so you can't support the claim that Solars are always Lawful Good, since some editions have some of them non-Lawful. "All x are y" is contradicted by a single example, which I've provided.
    I didn't say that all X are Y, but that X in the current edition are Y.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    I think you might have been mislead, since you're not usually someone I associate with this sort of poor quality thinking.
    Your jokes were funny. But your response to noob to "please look this stuff up" seemed pretty harsh, considering that noob might well be unfamiliar with editions prior to 5e and very possibly did look that stuff up. Couldn't you have just explained that in 3.x solars can be of any good alignment?
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxWilson View Post
    I've tallied up all the points for this thread, and consulted with the debate judges, and the verdict is clear: JoeJ wins the thread.

  23. - Top - End - #53
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeJ View Post
    I didn't say that all X are Y, but that X in the current edition are Y.
    Solars occur in several editions of D&D, and all editions of D&D are relevant in this forum. If you a discussion which is limited to 5e Solars, you'd want to visit threads in the 5e subforum, which is not where we are.

    5e Solars are always LG.
    3e Solars are any good.

    Are all Solars LG? No, because not all Solars are 5e Solars.

    This really shouldn't be new information for anyone.


    Quote Originally Posted by JoeJ View Post
    Your jokes were funny. But your response to noob to "please look this stuff up" seemed pretty harsh, considering that noob might well be unfamiliar with editions prior to 5e and very possibly did look that stuff up. Couldn't you have just explained that in 3.x solars can be of any good alignment?
    Probably because I saw that post as an attempt to derail the funny into exactly this sort of crappy downward spiral of corrections and defenses. One which you've been instrumental in digging, and which really isn't much fun for me.

    It sounds like you're doing this because you're offended on someone else's behalf. Is that accurate?

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    HalflingPirate

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Well this got outta control. o.O I did specifically try to avoid naming the edition, though. The setting borrows deities from multiple other settings- Sharess from FR, for example. And given my gm, probably at least one Dark Souls deity thrown in. He's a bit of a fan.

    That said, I can't really move the city, since it was built on a very important location, where a major river meets the road on a trade route. Boats can be sent down stream to expand trade from there. My character started out as a merchant and got rich from it. Even founding the city was part of his mercantile work.
    If you run pathfinder, please check this thread out.
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    TeChameleon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Is there any reason why the consecrate-the-evil-brothel scheme wouldn't work? Once the succubi are out of the equation, well... no offense to your DM, but this evil wizard sounds like he is spectacularly bad at running a brothel. No supernatural sluts, no evil-wizard-brothel... and even if he manages to stay in business somehow (DM fiat?), if he's not killing people, who cares?

    ... although thinking about it, it might be worth ganking him for his hat alone- a pimp wizard would have to have a blindingly magnificent(?) hat.

  26. - Top - End - #56
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    I am sorry nifft that I did something that made you believe I wanted to start an annoying discussion about alignment.
    I only told it was weird to summon a lawful good creature just next to a chaotic good temple but alignment works at your table the way it works so if at your table it is fine then you can carry on.
    Last edited by noob; 2018-06-16 at 04:07 AM.

  27. - Top - End - #57
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    HalflingRogueGuy

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Let your dogs pee in his black rose garden. Send kobolds sappers to undermine the foundation of his brothel. Use illusions and charms to embarrass him publicly. Get the wizard to attack you.

    Seriously, it sounds like your DM either has a long game planned for this guy, or he's a ****. Either way, have some fun with it along the way.

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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    The suggestions in this thread are just plain weird to me for the situation. The DM is claiming that killing someone who is directly responsible for several murders is an evil act, but no one has any problem with the chaotic player character not only being mayor but using particularly lawful methods to run the murderer out of town. If it were my call, neither method is particularly good or evil, one is chaotic and one is lawful.

  29. - Top - End - #59
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    Default Re: Ideas for putting an establishment run by an evil wizard out of business?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    It sounds like you're doing this because you're offended on someone else's behalf. Is that accurate?
    Yes, that's accurate. I saw noob's post as being a simple question that somebody who is new to D&D (as their screen name suggests) might reasonable ask, and that's precisely the kind of person I don't want to see driven off.
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxWilson View Post
    I've tallied up all the points for this thread, and consulted with the debate judges, and the verdict is clear: JoeJ wins the thread.

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