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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    GreenSorcererElf

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    So, pick a language in the real world for what your npc says.
    Type what you want your npc to say into google translate.
    Translate it to picked language.
    Translate it back to english.
    Say that.
    Allow linguist to get real response.

  2. - Top - End - #32
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    Segev's Avatar

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    One way to use a linguist that doesn't require him to be gatekeeper of the translations is to have there be interesting facts about the structure of the language. Just because all the PCs understood what was said doesn't mean they got the transliterative puns, cultural references, or even subtle nuances. A simplistic version of it would be the alien saying, "Have a nice day," and the guy who's actually a linguist recognizing that the word-choice could also mean "May the Sun follow you to your death." In context, it usually means the positive well-wishing for this culture, but the tone and tenor of the body language, combined with some expression details that he knows due to his expertise in xenocommunication, makes him worried that this alien was being "clever" and either cursing at them subtly, or worse, suggesting there was a fiery doom in their near future.

    More subtly, it can help with identifying cultural connections. It might be possible to determine that this new race is actually an off-shoot of a set of religious colonists who left a different race ages ago after a schism, but it's detectable because the word choices and linguistic structures are reminiscent of that other race's better-known branch.

  3. - Top - End - #33
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    Telok's Avatar

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    So in Stargrinder there are a few things to keep in mind.

    First there's the culture skill. It's your knowledge(people, places, history, society, geography, economics, etc.) skill at the usual one rank per level. And apparently it gives a language per rank. So characters get race + common + int bonus + culture ranks languages. People get lots of languages.

    Second there's the "ignore language" stuff. Telepathy is pretty common, the tech is generally cheap, spells to skip the issue are low level and long lasting. Plus if you use the official settings/adventures any npc/group that doesn't automatically speak common has some kind of bypass available. It's like environment hazards, they included them but they're so trivial to ignore that you have to change rules to make them matter.

    Third is that almost nothing mechanically depends on language except the social skills and some envoy tricks, and I think there might be one feat that has anything to do with language at all. Everyone is roughly equal in combat as long as they take the dr = bab feat, have an 18+ attack stat, and take weapon focus plus the feats to get better than basic melee & pistols (if they need to).

    So the guy's "I translate words" isn't relevant. But it's such a minor and optional aspect of the game that it's not a big deal. Especially since he couldn't really spend too much in character resources on it.

  4. - Top - End - #34
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    RogueGuy

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    I think it's interesting that everyone's basically explaining the character role arc of Daniel Jackson in response to this thread. Started out as on board as a translator. As the story progressed and they found more and more cultures speaking english, Daniel started taking more of an anthropological role. Studying the cultures and their laws and taking a most diplomatic role.

    Language influences thought. The words available to your language are the concepts you can use to think. A translator knows more than just how sentences are put together and what words mean, they understand the ways and limits that a person can think in.

    I would recommend allowing him to gain a bonus on Sense Motive, Diplomacy, and Intimidate checks when talking to someone he shares a language with, even if the universal translator is making them speak the same language anyway. He understands people at a more intrinsic level than his allies can.
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  5. - Top - End - #35

    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlasSniperman View Post
    I think it's interesting that everyone's basically explaining the character role arc of Daniel Jackson in response to this thread.
    Also, in both a TV show or a RPG, doing the whole ''interpreting unknown languages is a huge waste of time. "

    It's really bad enough for a DM, to say in English-"OK, the orc is speaking in Ork, so no one can under stand the orc except Bob's character". Then the DM says, in English "Me orc will attack as you are good guys" and all the other players have to pretend they did not hear that...and just sit there. Then Bob will turn to the other players and have ''his character translate what the orc said" that everyone already heard.

    It's worse if the game has a check, where Bob needs to roll like a 10, with a +22 modifier.

    This is why both TV shows and RPGs just skip it.

  6. - Top - End - #36
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    The Fury's Avatar

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    I don't agree that the existence of universal translators would necessarily mean that no one would bother to learn languages. I mean, there are universal translators in the Star Trek universe, and they conveniently allow our heroes to speak to aliens from both the Delta and Gamma quadrants in order to make the plot go. People, or rather folks from Starfleet, still take the time to learn different languages, though it's to help sell how enlightened they are. And in fairness, learning a different language is useful for developing a broader perspective and could be useful in diplomatic situations in ways that a universal translator wouldn't.

    I'm not sure how relevant this would be in Starfinder or how willing players would be to spend skill points on something that just implies a character trait, but hey.

  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Telok's Avatar

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    Because it's pazio's starfinder for this instance here's the language/culture skill

    Culture (Int; Trained Only)
    You are a student of the vast number of known cultures in the galaxy, and you have a deep and rich understanding of the undercurrents of cultures and language in general. Each time you take a rank in Culture, you learn to speak and read a new language. See Languages for a list of common languages.
    The uses of the skill are recall knowledge (DCs easy:5, average:15, and difficult:20 to 30) and decipher writing (DCs simple:20, standard:25, and "intricate exotic or old":30)

    Characters speak Common, their racial language, their homeworld language, and their Int bonus in additional languages. There's a 475 credit potion (costs about the same as a first level rifle or sword) that gives +2 on diplomacy/bluff and allows the user to comprehend any one language heard within the last ten minutes, effect lasts an hour. Comprehend Languages is a first level spell that covers all languages in all forms for 10 minutes per caster level (including computer languages), it can also be picked up as a level/3 times a day ability for a feat at fifth level. Share Language is a first level spell that shares with another person three of your languages for 24 hours. Both spells can be bought in potion form too.

  8. - Top - End - #38
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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    Who is at fault isn't really relevant. At some point, there was a breakdown in communication. There are a few ways to prevent it in the future. One, vet character concepts in the future. Even if you can't go through the whole build process with them, before someone officially joins your game, you should know what they plan to make. And get verbal confirmation they understand any peculiarities of your setting or houserules. I don't think this was your fault and this player doesn't attend much, but if only to save yourself the headache in the future, I'd at least try to know the basic idea before letting a character join your game
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  9. - Top - End - #39
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    GreenSorcererElf

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    Quote Originally Posted by Luccan View Post
    Who is at fault isn't really relevant. At some point, there was a breakdown in communication. There are a few ways to prevent it in the future. One, vet character concepts in the future. Even if you can't go through the whole build process with them, before someone officially joins your game, you should know what they plan to make. And get verbal confirmation they understand any peculiarities of your setting or houserules. I don't think this was your fault and this player doesn't attend much, but if only to save yourself the headache in the future, I'd at least try to know the basic idea before letting a character join your game
    Agreed. Playing the blame game after the fact isn't likely to hel. Future prevention is more important a focus.

  10. - Top - End - #40
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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    Quote Originally Posted by Calthropstu View Post
    Agreed. Playing the blame game after the fact isn't likely to hel. Future prevention is more important a focus.
    Which is why it's useful to determine whether the player screwed up by not paying attention when the GM was making mouth-noises at him, or the GM screwed up by making insufficient mouth-noises at the player.
    A player who knew all of this going in, and still bitched about his 'terp being invalid as a concept, is much different from a player who didn't.
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  11. - Top - End - #41
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    You have a translator PC and a universal translation device, clearly what you could do is combine the two to make the tool more powerful.

    Say that the universal translator is mostly programmed with known and modern languages in mind, so when you stumble across primitive or new civilizations or ancient ruins, the translator no longer works, and the translator gets to work deciphering the language, updating the software for everyone to allow them to interact with things normally, but it's all thanks to his efforts and know-how that they are able to do this.

  12. - Top - End - #42
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    I dont know, if I were one of the other players I might get annoyed so to speak if my compass and map broke the moment someone took ranks in survival. Particularly if he then failed to show up for a session and we got lost.
    Last edited by awa; 2018-08-08 at 07:16 AM.

  13. - Top - End - #43
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    Quote Originally Posted by awa View Post
    I dont know, if I were one of the other players I might get annoyed so to speak if my compass and map broke the moment someone took ranks in survival. Particularly if he then failed to show up for a session and we got lost.
    There's more to survival than figuring out what direction north is. And survival can also make full use of a compass better than someone without survival.

  14. - Top - End - #44
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    True survival is a better skill then speak language, because speak language doesn't have any of that, so we are basically taking a device that perfectly solved the problem before and adding weakness that never previously existed because now someone took a skill.
    Last edited by awa; 2018-08-09 at 09:06 AM.

  15. - Top - End - #45
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    HalflingPirate

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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    The way these translators work, they are able to translate a number of spoken languages that the Republic has never been exposed to. They can't translate Spirit Folk, the language of outsiders, but alien languages are normally within the limits of the translator. This translator is actually a form of advanced magitech.

    So, person A speaks Ysoki and person B speaks Rawbhain.

    For the sake of argument, neither speaks common, but one of them is equipped with the UT, in this case the Ysoki.

    So, when the Ysoki speaks, the rawbhain hears rawbhain. When the rawbhain speaks to the ysoki, the ysoki hears ysoki.

  16. - Top - End - #46
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: If the GM makes it clear that a certain feature exists in their setting...

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeySage View Post
    This translator is actually a form of advanced magitech.
    For when technobabble and magababble fall short use both.

    Actually if any form of telepathy, especially ones that allow the communication of more raw concepts instead of words, it is not actually that far fetched. At least not in addition to that. In fact if you assume the level of variation in aliens and languages you might see in, say, Star Trek you could probably spin quite a reasonable explanation with known languages, some soft brain scanning (or projecting with three different languages in the room), reverse engineering details based on biology and smart computer figuring out how to combine them.

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